New Battery 0 Cycles - How Do I Charge?

[EAkamai]

Ok, it looks like we finally have a real working battery now. Panasonic 9 cell w/ 0 cycles...

I'm NOT taking on the road until about a month from now. So i will be keeping laptop on the grid until then. It seemed to have about a 15 - 20% charge to begin with. Manufactured June 2010. In fact I don't have any problems removing it completely until that time. Or should I test it somehow first? Charge is up to 34% as I'm typing this now.

How should i charge and how should i set charging parameters? I really don't want to mess this one up.

THANKS

[EOMtp]

Set to start charging at 75% and stop charging at 98%. That way, the battery will never be "too low" when you need it, and you will not be "pumping it up" unnecessarily. [The Lenovo defaults of 98%/100% are inexcusably bad.]

[EAkamai]

Set to start charging at 75% and stop charging at 98%. That way, the battery will never be "too low" when you need it, and you will not be "pumping it up" unnecessarily.

Thanks for blazingly fast response So i set those parameters BEFORE it fully charges? 'Cause it's at 41% now. Are you saying it will charge all the way to 95% and it should stop using those parameters?

Thanks again so much for your help!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[EAkamai]

As i thought, in spite of setting the parameters as instructed, it went all the way to 100 % charge. How do I make it stay within the parameters I've set in the TPad Pwr Mgt software?
Also, as a new battery I've read (mostly on sites that sell these types of batteries) where it says to let the battery completely drain and then recharge (some say a number of times), but this just doesn't seem right.

Now that it's at 100% what do I do next?

Thanks Again for any help!

[EOMtp]

Also, as a new battery I've read (mostly on sites that sell these types of batteries) where it says to let the battery completely drain and then recharge (some say a number of times), but this just doesn't seem right.

Your are correct -- that advice is partially correct for NiCad and NiMH batteries, but is absolutely wrong for Li-Ion batteries. Li-Ion batteries can be recharged without adverse effects anytime after they deplete to circa 85%, and should not be discharged completely unless unavoidable.

After you shut down and restart your machine, the power manager settings should "stick". If they don't, then use the Power Manager to perform a battery gauge reset.

[EAkamai]

After you shut down and restart your machine, the power manager settings should "stick". If they don't, then use the Power Manager to perform a battery gauge reset.

Thanks so much EOMtp! What I did was shut down, yank AC adapter out, remove batt., then re-inserted batt., powered up WITHOUT the AC plugged in. After booting, i replugged AC and went to Battery Info where it shows remaining 94% and didn't look like it was charging. I believe the charging light flashes green when it's actually charging? Green is steady so guess that's the secret. I believe I had forgotten what I read from TTY. He already mentioned this trick - bleh - oldtimers disease or PTSD

When you wrote "Li-Ion batteries can be recharged without adverse effects anytime after they deplete to circa 85%..." does that mean setting the [bottom % charging threshold below 85% produces more wear and tear on the battery because it charges from BELOW your 85% amount? I've set mine to 75% - 95% but i intend to remove it until i go on the road in a month or two. But I've read *so many people* who prefer to set it from 20-25% bottom to 80-85% top. I realize that this is a hotly contested and debated subject. Please forgive me if I ask to pick your brain for your own opinion on the following:

1. If i want to leave it in the laptop yet STAY ON THE GRID (AC) what is best charging threshold to put it at. (% - %)?

2. What is the best way to store for a few months or more? Discharge to ?% and store how?

While I'm no stranger to IT, I have 'been in a cave' when it comes to newer laptop technology* and in spite of reading my okole (backside) off this past week about it, seem to still be about as dumb as a bag of wet hammers about all this. Just don't want to mess up this new battery, and allow it to last as long as possible.

* I actually have no problems completely disassembling & repairing them. It's only some of the newer technology like Li-Ion I need help with since we've never owned a laptop that even had that kind of battery until this one.

Thanks for your Great help!!

[BeeJayEmm]

Relax. I think maybe a deep breath is needed. You're not going to "mess up" your battery, no matter what you do. I use my ThinkPad 99% of the time on mains power, so I set my battery to start charging at 40% and stop at 50%. I have read that optimal storage condition is around 40% charge. When I know I'll need to use the laptop on battery, I charge to 90-95%. What prematurely shortens the battery's life is keeping it charged to 100% and leaving it in the ThinkPad, because heat, not speed, kills. If you want to store the battery outside the laptop for an extended period, charge it to 40% or just above and put it in a cool place. I know many suggest in the refrigerator but I have read that is not necessary nor more beneficial than any other cool place, such as a basement. Check its charge from time to time so it doesn't completely discharge, another condition that shortens battery life. If you begin needing to use the ThinkPad on battery more often, you might wish to employ Mr. Bolton's parameters from the other thread (80% low and 95% high). Now go and enjoy that new battery smell!

[TTY]

One problem - with the previous as well as with the new battery - seems to be, that your ThinkVantage Power Manager ignores the charge level thresholds that you have set. The reason for this could be your software installation in general - operating system and drivers. From previous post, i've got the impression that you wiped Vista from your disk and installed XP instead. The T61 online user's guide (Access Help) has instructions on how to install Windows XP, that guide is available as a download on Lenovo's support site. Have you followed these instructions? For instance, it tells us to install the Intel Chipset Software (Intel Chipset Support) and at what stage in the installation process. It tells us to install the drivers that are offered on Lenovo's support site. You have posted earlier that you didn't install the Lenovo System Interface Driver. Not installing drivers such as the Lenovo System Interface Driver or the Intel Chipset Software, could cause your power management not to work as intended. The Lenovo System Interface Driver is presently part of a drivers package called Hotkey Utility (Hotkey Features Integration). For the Intel Chipset Software (Intel Chipset Support), Intel recommends: "It is recommended that the Intel(R) Chipset Device Software be installed onto the target system prior to the installation of other drivers", so installing this software after most other drivers have been installed, is not a good idea. A non-functional power management could also shorten your new battery's life significantly.

[EAkamai]

One problem - with the previous as well as with the new battery - seems to be, that your ThinkVantage Power Manager ignores the charge level thresholds that you have set.

Aloha TTY! Actually I had forgotten what you wrote in another thread about the need to power on WITHOUT the AC plugged in after the thresholds were set. Once I was able to remember that everything stuck and is working like it's supposed to. I no longer have that problem.

As far as my XP install, I use a Custom install that I've spent literally years developing. I've used it not only on this laptop, but many others and it's is blazingly fast and solid. I use NLite and other tools and remove what I don't want or need and it's been an amazing and solid OS, once it's tuned and configured the way I need it to be. The only Thinkvantage software I've installed is the Power Management DRIVER (for ACPI support) and the Power Manager App. Now that I've figured out how to get the settings to stick (thanks to you) I don't see any problems with that anymore. I will look into what you have written as I really do hang onto every word you offer me. My thoughts in over 20 years of doing IT work is the less software the better, but I shall go back and re-read what you wrote. Maybe it will be important. Of course I do install the Intel Chipset driver(s) but what you called "Lenovo System Interface Driver" and "Hotkey Utility (Hotkey Features Integration)" I thought I researched and decided it wasn't necessary. Since you now mention it, I'll go back and re-check that.

It's amazing how hotly contested and debated these parameter settings/threshold options are. But there is absolutely no doubt that BeeJay is right... I need to relax, chill out and take a deep breath (or a nice cold Franciskaner http://www.franziskaner.com) as this new battery seems to be working and that's really all thats important now.
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There is only one more thing I'd like to know and I do feel it is important:
HOW DO YOU TEST A NEW BATTERY?! Because my old one SEEMS ok, until it runs down anywhere from 25 to 45 minutes where it SEEMS perfectly normal, but then BAM! Nothing. Completely drained in a flash. Re-setting the gauge takes about a day and a half. But i do plan to do it again for the old battery.

But as far as testing new one:
Does one need to actually run down a battery just to find out? Or is there a safer test that can be performed on these? Or is it simply a matter that we just use it and in the course of using it we find out whether or not all cells are working properly and it will last the way it is supposed to? What I normally do with all new warrantied hardware is try like heck to kill it within the warranty period. If it doesn't die, then all is well. Except I surely don't want to deliberately do that with this new battery.

Thanks for everything again...

[TTY]

I just took a look at the Hotkey Features page (which includes the Lenovo System Interface Driver) again, and i must admit that i saw nothing there, that would indicate that the System Interface Driver would have something to do with power management. My notion that the System Interface Driver would be a basic driver, that also might influence power management, probably stems from the past, when it wasn't integrated into the Hotkey Features, but was a rather undocumented download of its own. Also sorry to have asked the probably insulting question about the Intel Chipset Software, but from a distance, i had no way of seeing what was installed on your computer and what not.

Concerning the question about testing the battery, i suppose that if you are going to use the battery within the next few months anyhow, you'll probably notice soon enough if it should have any problems. If you right-click the ThinkVantage Power Manager's battery icon in the task bar, you can set it to display how much battery runtime is left, instead of showing the charge percentage. If you then run the computer on battery for a while, you can see if the time that is displayed there seems reasonable. The "battery time left" that's displayed there varies with actual power usage, so depending on processor load, hard disk activity and other factors, that number goes up as well as down. That's normal.

[EAkamai]

If you then run the computer on battery for a while, you can see if the time that is displayed there seems reasonable.

Yes, but this is exactly how the old one APPEARS to be ok. Then it just hits the wall. It may be within 20 minutes or it may go all the way to 45 minutes like it did right before It crashed dead. Ever since I mistakenly ran it all the way down it's been completely unreliable.

Like you say, I just need to use it to really know. Obviously this is the nature of the beast.
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I'm now trying to decide between getting a second one or getting the Ultrabay Battery III. Can anyone direct me to link(s) that describe any problems with these and/or whether or not they are worth the $$ compared to how much time they will add. When I hit the road, I'll need as much battery power as possible. I may end up literally in the 'boonies'. I just found out about these and read where you don't even need to shut the system down to add power. Just swap out your optical disk (or 2nd HDD) and you have instant power added to your system?

Very intriguing. Need to know about how long they last and are they Li-Ion the same way these main batteries are with the same concerns. Also, does the Thinkvantage PwrMgr control these as well? Charging thresholds etc...

After learning about the Ultrabay Battery I *should* be winding down on my much needed education here!

Thanks

[TTY]

These are Lenovo's figures on battery life:

6-cell: up to 5.7 hr; 9-cell: up to 8.6 hr; 9-cell plus Ultrabay battery: up to 10.1 hr

The Ultrabay battery is now called ThinkPad Battery 42 (3 cell bay). It is lithium-polymer technology, its capacity is 32 Wh. Here it's more expensive than the 9 cell battery. Its worldwide marketing part number is 57Y4536.

[EAkamai]

These are Lenovo's figures on battery life:

6-cell: up to 5.7 hr; 9-cell: up to 8.6 hr; 9-cell plus Ultrabay battery: up to 10.1 hr

The Ultrabay battery is now called ThinkPad Battery 42 (3 cell bay). It is lithium-polymer technology, its capacity is 32 Wh. Here it's more expensive than the 9 cell battery. Its worldwide marketing part number is 57Y4536.

Thanks TTY! $95 - $100 bucks on eBay - new and branded official Lenovo.

[BeeJayEmm]

F.Y.I.: If you use the Ultrabay battery, the ThinkPad will discharge it before discharging your main battery. See this thread.
I believe Power Manager will control the Ultrabay batt.

[EAkamai]

F.Y.I.: If you use the Ultrabay battery, the ThinkPad will discharge it before discharging your main battery. See this thread.
I believe Power Manager will control the Ultrabay batt.

Thanks very much BeeJay!

[EAkamai]

Can anyone confirm their experience(s) with

1. the Lenovo branded Sanyo 9 Cell (42T4619) ? Mfg Date is Aug 2010 - 0 Cycle count

2. the new Lenovo branded Sony Advanced Ultrabay Battery III (51J0508) ? Mfg Date is Jul 2010 - 0 Cycle count.

I've noticed the Full Charge Capacity on the Sanyo 9 Cell is larger than the Panasonic. It's a few months newer (mfg date). The Full Charge Capacity on the Sony Ultrabay is 31.32 Wh.

Thank you very much for any info!

EDIT: I just came across the Thread that deals with #1 above so please disregard that unless someone out there can actually recommend the Sanyo over the Panasonic which most prefer. Still want to know about #2 above.

[slpin]

Sorry for my less insightful reply. New lenovo battery fro
2 years ago (220 cycle counts). All I did was check the let think advantage optimize battery option. Seems to fair pretty well! Battery still at 39wph