X41 Tablet

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bhtooefr · #31 Post by **bhtooefr** » Mon Jun 06, 2005 4:58 pm

Intel's GMA900 uses main RAM. IIRC, it can use up to 64MB...

As for the X4 dock, I don't think it has DVI. However, you want it, because it holds the optical drive (that's the rule for the X series - the dock has the UltraBay).

ThinkNick wrote:Very interested! Want this for school this fall.

Gripes:
* wish it had a higher res screen (no pixel is too small! just bump up text/icon size!)
* wish it had some way of outputting to DVI

These are the options I'd likely get:
Any processor (perhaps ULV 1.2)
1GB RAM
40GB hdd
Max vid RAM (don't know IGMA 900 well - does it use main ram or have its own?)
8 cell
fingerprint reader
802.11a/b/g & bluetooth

No need for big hdd (sync at home), real fast proc, wimpy 4 cell, X4 dock (unless it has DVI), or weak mobile connectivity.

Hope this won't cost more than low $2000s.

beq · #32 Post by **beq** » Mon Jun 06, 2005 11:13 pm

Thanks for all the info. I saw the latest blurb about it from CNet too:

http://news.com.com/2102-1044_3-5734417.html (click on the photo to see links to their other recent articles and photos on the X41T)

Note that they say this tablet was designed by IBM (but obviously now will be supplied by Lenovo), so isn't that a good thing?

I'd ordered the X40 (and the T43) a few months ago in February. Now trying to find a way to offload my X40 to a family member so I can get this X41T

Besides the tablet function, I'd also like the fingerprint reader which my X40 does not have...

But I'd like to know what's the difference between the supposedly new X4 Dock for the X41T vs. the existing X4 UltraBase which I have for the X40?? And other than the new incompatible dock design, would the X41T just use all the same accessories as the X40/X41 series (including the batteries)?

bhtooefr · #33 Post by **bhtooefr** » Mon Jun 06, 2005 11:22 pm

AFAICT, when I search for "X4 dock" (no quotes, though), all I get is references to the UltraBase. I think they mean UltraBase for the X41T.

Somewhere, I saw the UltraBase X4 mentioned with the X41T... Also, everywhere says the "new UltraBase X4", even though it's not new... unless that means that they're modifying the design...

beq · #34 Post by **beq** » Mon Jun 06, 2005 11:28 pm

BTW with the X41T weighing 4lbs with the 8-cell battery, isn't this closer in weight to the older X30/X31 series? I never tried those, but am wondering if the increased weight will be noticeable to someone who's been using an X40/X41. Also, are the dimensions of the tablet close enough to the standard X40/X41 so that any tight-fitting cases made for the X40/X41 will fit the tablet as well?

P.S. I've also been wondering for a long time about the "IBM powered USB 2.0 port" on the X40 series -- can it be used with any 3rd-party USB peripherals? The reason I ask is that this special port seems to be physically smaller than normal (readily apparent since the port is placed next to the standard USB port), so that normal USB cables don't fit! At the same time this special port is larger than the standard mini USB port. This proprietary nature kinda limits its usefulness to me (I almost wish it's replaced with a standard FireWire port instead).

What kind of high-power output does this IBM powered port have anyways? Is it something like 5V 1A (instead of 500mA for standard USB)? Is there not a way to design a high-power output port that still uses standard USB port size?

Also, the description almost seems to imply that the normal-sized USB ports on the X40 aren't powered at all. Yet I've been able to bus-power my external 2.5" HDD directly from one of the X40's normal USB ports! Which is surprising in itself because this external drive's power requirement is right on the borderline, and most computers haven't been able to supply enough USB bus power for it (in which case I've had to use an external power cable).

beq · #35 Post by **beq** » Mon Jun 06, 2005 11:33 pm

bhtooefr wrote:AFAICT, when I search for "X4 dock" (no quotes, though), all I get is references to the UltraBase. I think they mean UltraBase for the X41T.

Somewhere, I saw the UltraBase X4 mentioned with the X41T... Also, everywhere says the "new UltraBase X4", even though it's not new... unless that means that they're modifying the design...

That would be good news, thanks for the info. I suppose we'll know for sure after June 14 when it will supposedly become available...

akao · #36 Post by **akao** » Tue Jun 07, 2005 1:41 am

I've now read and heard multiple times that the X41T is the thinnest and lightest ultraportable IBM has ever made.

How about the X40/X41? That's 2.7 lbs w/4-cell battery, and comes it at 1.06". Which is lighter than the 3.7 quoted for the tablet, and 1.14" thickness.

What am I missing?

ThinkNick · #37 Post by **ThinkNick** » Tue Jun 07, 2005 4:08 am

bhtooefr wrote:Intel's GMA900 uses main RAM. IIRC, it can use up to 64MB...

As for the X4 dock, I don't think it has DVI. However, you want it, because it holds the optical drive (that's the rule for the X series - the dock has the UltraBay).

Thanks for the response! Not too big a deal about integrated RAM... RAM is cheap, and more components only mean greater battery usage and more weight. Goes against the X design philosophy.

As far as the new X4 dock, I just don't see the purpose for it. Since it doesn't have DVI (the video shows the back), it has *exactly* the same features as the X4 ultrabase, except in a less portable form factor (i guess it could have a better security lock system, but no additional connections afaik). Why buy a dock if I can use an ultrabase as a dock, except when I really need that optical drive / 2nd hdd / 2nd battery with me? Maybe I'm missing something. Anyways, a new dock would have been a great opportunity to add DVI, and it kind of irks me that they're not acknowledging the usefulness of it (or the lack of usefulness of a 12" screen when docked and using kb/mouse). VGA on LCDs is really poor - i've made attempts at various resolutions on my Dell 2405FPW with little 'success'.

Well, no more ranting for me on the DVI issue

Still going to buy an x41t, just going to use it differently (without a dock or external kb/mouse/vid, just for sharing files) when I bring it home. Lenovo lost a dock sale

beq · #38 Post by **beq** » Tue Jun 07, 2005 4:34 am

Yeah I just saw some of the presentation/video, and it looks like the new X4 Dock is of the traditional large dock design, as opposed to the portable X4 UltraBase (the latter of which I carry often with my X40).

My question is, since the new X4 Dock is also supposed to be backward compatible with the normal X40/X41, why can't the existing X4 UltraBase also work with the X41T? They even said the X41T can take the same bottom-mount extended battery as the X40/X41 (the one that snaps to the bottom of the ThinkPad via the docking connector).

bhtooefr · #39 Post by **bhtooefr** » Tue Jun 07, 2005 3:39 pm

Let's settle the dock issue, right now. This is off of Lenovo's site, on the X41 Tablet page (emphasis removed (because copy and paste gets rid of it), and other emphasis added by me):

The optional ThinkPad X4 Dock gives you flexibility and expandability. Features include cable management, support for Ultrabay optical and storage options, speakers, a Kensington lock slot (supports optional cable lock) and a dedicated AC power adapter, also compatible with any X40 Series system or dock. The ThinkPad X4 UltraBase Dock with integrated keylock enables easy, one-step desktop expansion.

See? It's all OK... The UltraBase IS supported.

However, the ThinkPad X4 Dock IS an ugly, big dock. Let's ignore it

eigh · #40 Post by **eigh** » Tue Jun 07, 2005 3:42 pm

why does it seem taht the newer dock designed for the x41 tablet is bigger and frowned on?

i dont get it, why would they make the dock bigger?

bhtooefr · #41 Post by **bhtooefr** » Tue Jun 07, 2005 3:53 pm

Also, Lenovo's site lists a config for the X41T. 1869-5CU:

Pentium M 758 LV (1.5GHz)
12.1" XGA Screen
Intel GMA900
512MB RAM
40GB HDD
Integrated Gigabit
Modem
IPW 2200BG
Fingerprint Reader
ESS 2.0
XP Tablet 2005
3.6 lbs (Exactly 0.07lbs heavier than an X21 2662, according to IBM's site)
$1899

Interestingly, I went looking for X41 Regular configs with the same processor, and found this (2527-55U):

Pentium M 758 LV (1.5GHz)
12.1" XGA Screen
Intel GMA900
512MB RAM
40GB HDD
Integrated Gigabit
Modem
IPW 2915ABG (Better wireless)
Fingerprint Reader
ESS 2.0
XP Pro
3.27 lbs
$1899

Hmm... Interesting... You only have to drop to a BG wireless card from an ABG, and you've got a tablet for the exact same price...

beq · #42 Post by **beq** » Tue Jun 07, 2005 7:43 pm

Good to know about the dock/ultrabase...

Another thing, when do you guys think the full X41T model lineup will be added to TABook.pdf?

Also, does the fingerprint swipe look like it will be located at a inconvenient place or angle on this tablet? From the video I saw it's on the screen bezel instead of the palm rest like usual, plus it seems to be at a right angle...

roast · #43 Post by **roast** » Tue Jun 07, 2005 8:20 pm

bhtooefr wrote:Hmm... Interesting... You only have to drop to a BG wireless card from an ABG, and you've got a tablet for the exact same price...

And a lighter unit (by 0.33lbs).

bhtooefr · #44 Post by **bhtooefr** » Tue Jun 07, 2005 8:30 pm

beq wrote:Good to know about the dock/ultrabase...

Another thing, when do you guys think the full X41T model lineup will be added to TABook.pdf?

Also, does the fingerprint swipe look like it will be located at a inconvenient place or angle on this tablet? From the video I saw it's on the screen bezel instead of the palm rest like usual, plus it seems to be at a right angle...

Not a bad position... IF you're in tablet mode... except for that a finger will invariably hit the buttons when you're swiping, or you'll get a bad swipe...

#45 Post by **JaneL** » Fri Jun 10, 2005 3:47 pm

Thread edited by Moderator:

Deleted a bunch of squabbling posts. X Series. ThinkPads. Post about 'em, not about each other.

eigh · #46 Post by **eigh** » Tue Jun 21, 2005 4:19 am

back on topic.

i just looked in the newly released june tabook and im dissappointed that just about the only variation in hardware i saw listed for the x41 tablet, were 2 models offering a 60gb hd instead of the 40gb one.

i hope lenovo starts mixing it up soon.

dani · #47 Post by **dani** » Mon Jun 27, 2005 1:38 am

bhtooefr wrote:Hmm... Interesting... You only have to drop to a BG wireless card from an ABG, and you've got a tablet for the exact same price...

But the OS doesn't seem to be the same (XP Pro vs Tablet Edition 2005)

bhtooefr · #48 Post by **bhtooefr** » Mon Jun 27, 2005 3:17 pm

IIRC, Tablet 2005 is the same as XP Pro SP2 plus the necessary stuff for a Tablet.

Yotam · #49 Post by **Yotam** » Tue Jun 28, 2005 5:00 am

Lenovo added 2 new X41T models to the X Series Tablet models list.
Availability is still "Within 2-4 weeks".

I think I'll have a problem with the price for 1.5GB ram expansion. It costs 750$!

Had someone already reserveds one of these? Or maybe even got it?

ThinkNick · #50 Post by **ThinkNick** » Tue Jun 28, 2005 10:37 pm

Noticed the additions too... but they're expensive!

Only difference I see between 1869-5CU at $1899 (in express program) and 1866-6JU at $2449 (not in express) is A/B/G card and 8 cell battery - for $550 difference! Subtract the $49 for the 8 cell battery that is offered under 'customize' for 1869-5CU, and that A/B/G card winds up costing $500 (of course on ebay they're <$50).

Is this the kind of price difference to be expected in the express program? What is the eligibility like? Sorry if this has been covered before.

I'm in the immediate market for 1.5LV, 512MB, 8cell, ABG, 60 gig, which should be 1866-6TU (hopefully not at $2499 as listed on the website) or a few other 1866-6** configurations. Anybody else looking for this configuration?

Yotam · #51 Post by **Yotam** » Wed Jun 29, 2005 1:20 am

Only difference I see between 1869-5CU at $1899 (in express program) and 1866-6JU at $2449 (not in express) is A/B/G card and 8 cell battery - for $550 difference! Subtract the $49 for the 8 cell battery that is offered under 'customize' for 1869-5CU, and that A/B/G card winds up costing $500 (of course on ebay they're <$50).

You forgot a really important thing - Bluetooth. The 1866-6JU Includes it, while the base model doesn't.

I'm looking for the 1866-6TU (That listed as 1866-6SU in every other website selling this tablet) with 60GB HDD, 8 cell, ABG and BT. The price for it, everywhere, is around the $2499. some sites sells it in $2449. As I wrote before, the real problem is the memory upgrade price - $750 for 1.5GB. If I buy this model, with ext. CD-RW and 1GB ram, it will cost about $3000. Expensive

I'm not american but planning to come at August and buy it (here it will cost double). Maybe till then prices will get down?

Yotam · #52 Post by **Yotam** » Wed Jun 29, 2005 4:01 am

I tried to check the price for one unit of SoDIMM PC4200 1GB for the X41T. It uses, as I know, the same memory as X41.

In IBM site one unit of 1GB costs $255, and 512MB costs $98.

When I try to customize a notebook unit of X41 or X41T, the price for upgrading to 1.5GB is $750.

So what is the difference? Can't I buy a new X41T with the base 512MB, and add this 1GB SoDIMM 4200 1GB? It reduces the total price in $495!

Or maybe I don't know something about those thinkpads memory?

Porsche · #53 Post by **Porsche** » Wed Jun 29, 2005 7:26 am

That is because X41 Tablet has only 1 slot of memory. If you buy 1GB on your own, you will have to take the existing memory out and put in your new one.

Yotam · #54 Post by **Yotam** » Wed Jun 29, 2005 7:28 am

Porsche wrote:That is because X41 Tablet has only 1 slot of memory. If you buy 1GB on your own, you will have to take the existing memory out and put in your new one.

are you sure? isn't it an "on-board" 512MB + 1 free slot?

Look at this PDF, page 18. At "Memory" section:
256 or 512MB std / 1.28 to 1.53GB max(7) / PC2-4200 533MHz DDR2 (limited to 400MHz because of low voltage processor) / non-parity / CL4 / dual channel capable / std memory soldered to systemboard / one 200-pin SO-DIMM socket available

But footnote (7) says: (7) Maximum memory and hard disk drive capacity may require the replacement of standard component with largest supported component available.

bhtooefr · #55 Post by **bhtooefr** » Wed Jun 29, 2005 8:44 am

Whatever the base memory is (256 or 512) is soldered onto the motherboard. The fact that 1.5GB is the max (on a 512MB model) tells this, because if it WEREN'T soldered onto the mobo, it'd be at least 2GB max - they don't make 1.5GB SODIMMs, after all.

Porsche · #56 Post by **Porsche** » Wed Jun 29, 2005 9:47 am

I have decided to get a 60GB T41 Tablet, but I don't know the difference between 18666TU (just listed yesterday) and 18666SU? They are of the same price. The website is of no help; neither is Tabook, May edition. Does anyone know the difference between these two models?

Thanks.

Yotam · #57 Post by **Yotam** » Wed Jun 29, 2005 9:47 am

So how do you explain the $750 for 1.5gb in the customize page when 1gb sodimm (that fits to this computer) costs $255 (at ibm site)?

Yotam · #58 Post by **Yotam** » Wed Jun 29, 2005 9:49 am

I have decided to get a 60GB T41 Tablet, but I don't know the difference between 18666TU (just listed yesterday) and 18666SU? They are of the same price. The website is of no help; neither is Tabook, May edition. Does anyone know the difference between these two models?

There is no difference, as I see. The TU is not listed anywhere outside IBM site, not even in tabook, while the SU is not listed in IBM site. Might be a mistake?

southsails · #59 Post by **southsails** » Wed Jun 29, 2005 8:04 pm

Just ordered my 18695CU. Ship date is 7/20/05.

bollar · #60 Post by **bollar** » Wed Jun 29, 2005 10:22 pm

Yotam wrote:
I have decided to get a 60GB T41 Tablet, but I don't know the difference between 18666TU (just listed yesterday) and 18666SU? They are of the same price. The website is of no help; neither is Tabook, May edition. Does anyone know the difference between these two models?
There is no difference, as I see. The TU is not listed anywhere outside IBM site, not even in tabook, while the SU is not listed in IBM site. Might be a mistake?

According to the literature, the TU uses the IBM wireless chipset and the SU uses the Intel wireless chipset.

X41 Tablet

New X41T models listed on IBM/Lenovo site

So how do you explain the $750 for 1.5gb in the customize pa

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