Thinkpads Forum

If someone was to buy one of these at Ebay auction and pay about $230 and the title of the auction and the description clearly stated a core2 processor (64bit) and was sent a core duo (32bit) processor, besides the option of refund, what difference in value would be reasonable.

I'm actually pretty upset because I even messaged them to ask them to check it's accurate, and they didn't make any corrections, now after taking 16 days to ship it to me, it's not as described. It does look like a nice tablet, so I wouldn't mind keeping it, and given no other option, I'd keep it before I took the loss of $30 shipping, plus another $15-20 to return it, and even if I do return it, I already bought some accessories for it, so I can't imagine a happy outcome unless they were to readjust the price since I was sent a lesser machine then advertised.

I just want some opinions on a dollar value difference to ask for if they aren't able to give me a similar unit with a core2.

Here is the item

http://www.ebay.com/itm/150668948132?ss ... 1556wt_910

Also note that they have an auction running for another of these also advertised as core2, as well as a buy it now for one advertised as core duo, so they obviously know the difference between the processors.

Can anyone tell me if a seller could ruin my perfect feedback as revenge if my only option is to leave him negative feedback? I'm definitely not going to be happy if I have to lose a large chunk of money in shipping because of their deceptive description, intentional or otherwise.

TuuS wrote: Can anyone tell me if a seller could ruin my perfect feedback as revenge if my only option is to leave him negative feedback? I'm definitely not going to be happy if I have to lose a large chunk of money in shipping because of their deceptive description, intentional or otherwise.

You don't have to worry about that. Ebay's feedback system is pretty one-sided in favor of the buyer. The current rule is that a seller which chooses to leave feedback may only choose Positive. There is no Neutral or Negative option. However, what a seller may try to do is leave Positive feedback with a negative remark in the comment section or a read between the lines positive sounding comment with some hidden negative meaning in an attempt to get back at you. If that happens just do a search in the Help page concerning negative feedback. There's an option there to email Ebay customer care concerning a violation of Feedback guidelines and they will quickly remove the comment (leaving the Positive rating but comment section with some message saying "this comment has been removed"- so the seller will have given you a +1 Positive without intending to). They also give the seller a warning for doing that and send you a consoling, sympathetic email saying that is a violation of their policy.

This happened to me sometime last year. I left a negative feedback for a seller (as a last resort and after very bad conduct from him), and he tried to retaliate by leaving me, the buyer, a Positive Feedback with a negative message in the comment section. That's how Ebay dealt with the situation in my case at the time, but their procedure may have changed slightly, although I doubt it. You see, the reason for their one-sided Feedback system is not because they care so much about you as a buyer, but they are a greedy company and will make policy adjustments in their own best interest. And this encourages shopping with impunity (without fear of consequence such as negative Feedback even if completely deserved because of non-payment, damaging and returning goods or switching parts on purpose, and all kinds of other scams which a twisted mind could conceive). The more $ people spend the more $ Ebay makes. So I always warn people about shopping on Ebay, and taking precautions as a buyer. But I also warn sellers that Ebay is filled with buyers who are scammers, so buyer beware, and seller also beware.

Anyway, in your case, you wish to leave negative feedback for the seller because you feel you have a legitimate grievance, item was not completely as described, and they have not made an honest, good-faith effort to remedy the situation or clean up their act (as you mention- in their other listings). So you wish to leave negative feedback to warn others about this company. Be assured, if you do so, they will not be able to retaliate through the feedback system. However, if you ship merchandise back to them they could potentially retaliate by taking a long time, dragging their feet in issuing a refund, charging excessive re-stocking fees, or, if exchanging an item, sending an item in even worse condition if they were so inclined. These scenarios are all very unlikely, but possible, especially on Ebay ("The Wild West", as I call it- where anything goes and lawlessness sometimes prevails). Anyway, the point is just watch your back, as a seller could find other ways to retaliate besides the Feedback system, which Ebay has rigged in favor of the buyer.

In any case, they probably won't do any of the above, even try a sneaky Negative comment veiled as a Positive Feedback. They'll probably just curse to themselves when they read your Negative feedback comment.

Daniel,
the little YP in NYC.
"We had pizza in the Lion's Den "

If you had just bothered to look in the HMM (page 34), you would have seen that the CPU speed 1.66GHz corresponds to the L2400 Core Duo.
Duo is very close to Due, meaning Two (a.k.a. 2).
And most people know it's a jungle out there on eBay, with people screwing/misinforming the unknowing layman buyer.
Intel made a stupid mistake by calling the CPUs Core Duo and Core 2 Duo.
You made the mistake of not correctly asking what CPU exactly is included.
Either way, you should have eBay protection, including the shipping, if you manage to push through a claim of "not as described".

Also, numerous people have mentioned in numerous posts, that one should buy on this forum rather than on FleeceBay, unless you know what you are doing!

Actually I did ask them to confirm it was a core2, and they obviously know the difference, or they wouldn't have another auction labeled as core duo, but anyway, I get the point that I could have done a lot of research and proved that the stats didn't match, but they are the one that has the computer to check, it would take only a few seconds to confirm a cpu, and I would have had to message them to get model numbers etc if I was going to research it.

Regarding feedback, in the old days it was customary to return negative feedback if it was left, so no one gave honest evaluations. I heard they stopped that, but wasn't sure.

As for this computer,it's probably not a bad buy as it is, but I specifically wanted a 64bit processor, and this is a company that sells computers regularly, if they can't be bothered to correct an ad even when asked to confirm, then they should be willing to absorb the shipping costs, send me a core2 model, or as a last resort, deal with neg feedback.

I've actually found most ebay sellers to be very good about returns or problems. I've had very few problems with hundreds of purchases and never had to resort to negative feedback.

One thing I'm unsure of is if they are willing to do a partail refund due to sending a lesser the described unit, I'm not sure what price would be fair. I'd guess that a core2 duo would sell $50 higher then a core duo, but that's just a wild guess, I've not followed the prices of these tablet/convertibles at all.

Thanks

One thing to do before buying is to ask for the model type. After receiving the model type enter it in Lenovo's "Quick Path" search. The CPUs on the X-series are soldered to the motherboard so if "Quick Path" shows the ThinkPad was assembled with a CoreDuo then it will most likely be a CoreDuo. Using Ebays messaging service is also a good way of providing a sort of documentation that the seller assured you something that was not true if you choose to start a dispute.

Personally I would also ask the seller to enter BIOS and to give me the first seven digits of what the "system unit serial number" displays. The digits are the model type the motherboard is associated with.

Good luck to you.

Thanks emerald girl.

I've bought several T61 models, and I've always researched them to make sure they have good GPUs, but with this one it was just a purchase on a whim. It wasn't lot of money and I just wanted a cheap tablet. When I messaged the seller, it was less then 24hours from close, so I didn't even ask for a reply, just told him to please check if this really is a core2 because I didn't even realize they made the X60 with a core2. I don't recall if he replied or not, but as far as I'm concerned, I wasn't required to confirm what he advertised was true or not, but the fact that I asked gave him the chance to correct a mistake, which he didn't take, so I have no sympathy and if I do return it, I'm not willing to incur shipping cost either way.

As far as I'm concerned, it's not a bad computer and I'll just keep it if he isn't willing to make up for his false claims. I'm a reasonable person, I just want either a core2 tablet, or some form of compensation for taking a machine that is less then advertised, or as a last resort, to get out of the deal losing nothing more then a spiked blood pressure.

By reading his return policy, it would cost me $50-60 to return it (shipping both ways), and maybe even restock fees, but thats crazy, it wasn't what was described, so he should accept responsibility for it. I'm pretty certain it was done intentionally, but I'll give them the benefit of the doubt.

ps. If I do try to renegotiate the price, I don't really have any facts to base it's lesser value on though. It's obviously worth significantly less then a core2 unit, but I can't prove if it's $100 or $20 less. I'm guessing 50ish, but it's only a guess.

Stop calling such a CPU Core 2, which is only a group name.
What you want and should specify is Core 2 Duo or C2D.

RealBlackStuff wrote:Stop calling such a CPU Core 2, which is only a group name.
What you want and should specify is Core 2 Duo or C2D.

I used the group name because that is what the seller used. They have yet to reply, so I'll give them till tuesday.

My x60 tablet is a Core Duo (Yonah, 32 bit) 1.83. It came out before the C2D.

The idiot replied and said he would have his tech guy who does the listing reply to me. He later replied and said....

Please note that the i2400 intel is a dual core or a core duo aka core2 CPU- not a core2 duo. It supprots 64bit architecture, but the 945 video is only 64mb so it will not handle a 64bit oprating system. We loaded a 64bit XP Pro and it works fine, but not win7.

First of all, it's a L2400 not an I2400, and "core 2" is a trademark for an optional CPU, so he had no right to use it that way.

The Intel 945 video chipset has nothing at all to do with being able to run a 64bit OS, that chip cannot run any 64bit OS, he's just full of crap and needs to be called out on this.

In my reply, I stated that the "Core 2" that he advertised this as having comes in a 1, 2 and 4 core version, but I suspect I'm not going to get anything but a headache from this seller, so I'm inclined to just post a warning in the feedback. It's not a bad computer, but I would have liked to bid on it as a core duo, not a core 2.

Just return the machine...and be done with them...you can do better than that, definitely.

All that you'll be out is the return shipping.

My $0.02 only...

According to their return policy, I'd be out the $30 to ship to me, another 20ish to ship it back, then I'd get merchandise credit towards buying another misrepresented item.

I could do a paypal dispute, which I might end up doing, but if they make me go through that, then I'm really gonna be [censored].

I think I would be doing every ebay user a big favor if I posted some feedback, but I'm going to give them one last chance to make some kind of offer. I've never had to resort to feedback before, and only once have ever had any kind of dispute.

Open up the PayPal dispute, and if that doesn't work start a chargeback with your CC company...you *did* pay with a CC-backed PayPal, right?

Their policies have *no* bearing to what will happen in real life. I've found that out the hard way and that's why I'm off feebay for good, amongst other things...

I'm not saying that you should abuse the current policies like some of my past buyers have. Heck, no.

What I AM saying is that you should use them, since you've been misled into buying an item that didn't match the description...

My $0.02 only...

They've offered me $20 credit/refund.

That seems pretty lame, but it's better then nothing. I realize I could force them to take it back and get my shipping back, but it could take upto 90days to run the full dispute and I'll still be out the money to ship it back, and for the battery and sleeve I purchased elseswhere.

Hopefully they will have learned their lesson, and considering it comes with a docking station and original carrying case, it probably wasn't even a bad price for what it is, but I really do wish I had gotten a core2 model.

I really just want to forget about these idiots, it's just not worth getting upset over, but I mist say that $20 offer does sound kinda insulting... won't even buy a good meal these days lol

Your $$$ your call...

That being said, you could use the battery and sleeve with any X6xT that you eventually end up buying...and feebay is full of them.

Good luck with whatever course of action you choose to take.

TuuS wrote:it could take upto 90days to run the full dispute and I'll still be out the money to ship it back

In my experience it only takes a couple weeks to complete the dispute process with eBay/Paypal including shipping. I would suggest sending the laptop back via the Post Office using Parcel Post. It takes a week to get there, but it should be fairly inexpensive on a light tablet, like less than $10. You can also get confirmation using Parcel Post, which ebay/Paypal require when sending an item back in a dispute.

The only time I've ever had to do any dispute was many years ago and was over a fake collector's item "sword". The guy charged me $100 to ship it parcel post (cost $6 to ship back).

After nearly the full 90days (89 to be exact), paypal told me I needed a notarized letter from an expert that the sword was fake, and was given 10days to get it... (try finding a sword expert AND get a notarized letter that quick). I eventually got a letter and was given a full refund. Then when the return address the seller supplied to paypal turned out to be bogus, the post office returned the sword to me.

By the way, it's not only a Pakistan knock-off, it's also rusty.

Other then that one issue, I've never had a problem that I couldn't easily resolve with an ebay seller. This seller either has idiots working for him, or is one himself, I won't speculate on that, but he offered to try to find me a core2 model to swap, and if not, to up his offer to $25. I'm just going to take what I can and be done with it.