Thinkpads Forum

Hello

I got myself a space X60 tablet motherboard that I would like to use as an "organ donor" for a special project : adding a 2nd mini PCIe to my current motherboard.

Has anyone tried this? The only thing missing seems to be the connector, which could be soldered with a heatgun. I'd like to use this secondary mini PCIe to put a WWAN module (mostly for the GPS function - but I could also get a standalone GPS module since the antenna might be a problem)

Alternatively, if anyone has a X60 tablet motherboard with both mini PCIe connectors, or a X60 tablet WWAN, I could be interested in a trade

Thanks for any help!

EDIT: the GPS mini PCIe seem to be USB only, so I guess it would work just fine in the WWAN port (where there is no PCI line) http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.ph ... 29#p727966

I have many experience with 3G modules. Yes most of them have GPS function. BUT I HAVE NO LUCK TO MAKE IT WORK ON STOCK ANTENNAS!!! So the main quest - find right aux antenna and place it at right place to make GPS work. I haven't try GPSonly modyles - may be they have better amplifiers???

The antenna will indeed be a problem. I plan to buy a dedicated antenna (ex: http://www.ebay.com/itm/1575-42MHz-3-5V ... 1242004264) and put it next to the HD. It looks small enough to fit.

If it doesn't fit, it will still go into the HD compartment - but I will be using instead mSATA ssd + an adapter instead

Yet at the moment I wonder whether the 2nd mini PCIe is fully populated besides the missing connector - ie whether the maker of the motherboard didn't try to save a few cents by also removing resistors, etc. from the motherboard when the 2nd mini PCIe port is not

Has anyone tried soldering a 2nd miniPCIe connector on the X60s motherboard to check if it works?

I have personally soldered a second miniPCIe connector to my X60 tablet motherboard and it works. It also needed standoffs to screw the card in. All parts were purchased new from DigiKey.

guylhem wrote:The antenna will indeed be a problem. I plan to buy a dedicated antenna (ex: http://www.ebay.com/itm/1575-42MHz-3-5V ... 1242004264) and put it next to the HD. It looks small enough to fit.

BAD THOUGHTS:
- common 3G modules are not ready for active GPS antennas. There is no power supplied to aux socket. It need to be injected somehow. I don't know for GPSonly modules.
- GPS antenna MUST see clear sky (see upwards). Placing it near HD (HardDisk?) makes it shielded by metal frame of keyboard.
- And more. In tablet mode any antenna placed in thinkpad's body will be completely shielded - upwards Mg screen lid, downwards - Mg chassis. Original aux antenna lives in screen lid having a chance to view the sky in tablet mode thru plastic screen bezel. But it is aligned perpendicular to the sky direction.

One thing that i can check (this week) is to connect main antenna (red wire) to aux. YES main antenna designed to work at different frequences. But it is completely open (unshielded) from 5 sides.

PS
One time i have soldered second miniPCIe on Samsung NC215. PCIex part were completely unworkable, but USB part have worked good right after soldering. Some soldering things (SMD decoupling) have been done near SIM slot. But for GPSonly modules it is not needed.

twistero wrote:I have personally soldered a second miniPCIe connector to my X60 tablet motherboard and it works. It also needed standoffs to screw the card in. All parts were purchased new from DigiKey.

Hello

Question about the soldering - for the mini PCIE port, did you use a hotgun or a soldering iron? (for such small parts I believe using soldering iron, and going back and forth on the connectors, without adding more soldering, should be sufficient)

For the mini PCIe connector, can you please tell which heigh? I see 4 different possible : 4.0mm, 5.2mm, 5.6mm, 9.2mm (unlikely) I believe it is 4.0 mm but I could be wrong.

For the standoffs, can you please confirm 670-2481-1-ND is the reference you ordered if it is 4.0 mm?
http://www.digikey.com/product-search/e ... t=NT1R3000

(I found some mini PCIE ports on ebay, but no standoff. too bad, digikey is much more expansive!)

Thanks!

Hello

Oops FryPpy, you are right about the shielding. I have to rethink my plans !

Basically, I see 2 ways:
- 1) using a dedicated GPS module, such as http://www.ebay.com/itm/U-blox-PCI-5S-G ... 0768204632

It says it supports active antennas - I would then just have to find where to put them. Under the plastic palmrest would be logical, like http://www.sportler2k3.com/x61s/install ... tennas.JPG, but they would not work in tablet mode

- 2) Using a normal WWAN solution to take advantage of its GPS capabilities (I even found a LCD clear plate on http://www.ebay.com/itm/IBM-Lenovo-Thin ... 1096382553 so I would see with a LED if it's working, cool!)

The Ericson F3507g, it is cheap (around $10 on ebay) and well supported by linux (http://www.thinkwiki.org/wiki/Ericsson_ ... and_Module) even it if may require some tricky firmware update (http://www.mydellmini.com/forum/3g-mobi ... 2mb-5.html) to be on the stable R1D16 firmware. It is not on the BIOS whitelist as reported by others, but that is not a problem since I'm not using the IBM bios.

However, this is a more complex mod, as it would require :
- installing 2 WWAN antennas
- installing a sim card reader next to the RAM slots (since most WWAN modules require a sim card to work)

For the first part, I am lucky since I have a 42W2535 (LCD rear cover assembly with IBM logo and "wireless WAN" capability according to the hardware manual, ie one can mount a WWAN antenna on top of it) to replace my broken LCD rear cover.

First problem : there are 2 different top antennas, depending on the wireless provider : 93P4364 for Verizon/Cingular or 93P4365 for Vodaphone. I though it was due to different frequencies, with the 93P4364 being the US version but based on http://www.thinkwiki.org/wiki/Sierra_Wi ... HSDPA_WWAN, I believe it might be due to the different antenna physical characteristics or configuration between main and aux (i.e. the GPS antenna would be on one or the other - but I'm not sure about that).

If anyone knows more about that, I'd be interested to know how these 2 antenna differ.

Second problem, I can't find any decently priced 93P4365 or 93P4364 (except on http://s.etao.com/cp/eDYxdDNnzOzP3w.html?tbpm=20140609 but I'm not sure how to order, and I believe a thinkvantage point might charge me an arm and a leg for that small plastic thing) I found a 93P4543 for the x60 non tablet, but as seen on the 2nd picture of http://ecoshop.biz/?action=2204 is is quite different : it was made to go on the side of the x61, see installation procedure on http://www.ecoshop.biz/?action=review-0259 and a comparison with a non-tablet x60 on http://www.abload.de/image.php?img=wwan03zx.jpg - totally different form factor !!)

I guess I could try a hacky solution, with some cheap WWAN antenna from ebay, then put that in the back of the screen as on http://www.ecoshop.biz/?action=review-0260, but I'm not sure that would work well in tablet mode either.

Alternatively, a 93P4388 T antenna (http://www.ebay.com/itm/WWAN-aux-cable- ... 0724504820) could go under the palm rest, as it is done on the X60s in http://i.ebayimg.com/t/IBM-Lenovo-X60s- ... Jw~~_3.JPG but likewise it would not work well in tablet model.

Third problem -I need to find which antenna is used for GPS in this Ericson F3507g module, to decide which configuration is better for GPS (cf swapping aux and main on http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.ph ... 62#p479881)

Fourth problem, soldering the sim card slot : I'm not sure if the motherboard is fully populated and just needs a sim card slot to be soldered (crossing my fingers or if it needs some special cables to link to the sim card reader. In the hardware manual, for my 6364-CTO (using a G4 wacom digitizer) I only see "LCD cable assembly with fingerprint reader for G4" (93P4361) - there is no LCD cable assembly with fingerprint reader, with wireless WAN, which is only available for the G5 (FRU 93P4509). I wonder if I may also need a Flexible flat cable for wireless WAN 93P4559 - I have no idea what these 2 cables would connect to, as from my understanding a WWAN port would only need 2 antennas and a sim card.

My best idea at the moment is a "mix" of all that:

- using a dedicated GPS module to avoid the sim card reader problem and the unknown cables (93P4559 and the G4 equivalent of 93P4509)

- using an active GPS antenna under the plastic palmrest - either the ebay one or the 93P4388 T antenna made for the X60s

- using an antenna on the top of the screen for clear sky in tablet mode : but I don't know which of 93P4364 or 93P4365 is better.

May I ask for your ideas/comments/suggestions ?

PS : for your idea of reusing the AUX wifi antenna for the MAIN wwan antenna, it will cause GPS problems, according to http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.ph ... view=print. The other interesting threads about antenn swap I've found is http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.php?p=481697)

guylhem wrote: Basically, I see 2 ways:
- 1) using a dedicated GPS module, such as http://www.ebay.com/itm/U-blox-PCI-5S-G ... 0768204632
It says it supports active antennas

Cool. I have tested AverMedia AVerTV Pilot's GPS module (it is U-blox based too) and it is worked well.
BTW you can use external USB GPS receivers. In some use cases it is more affordable way - eg in car compact GPS reciver / antenna.

guylhem wrote: The Ericson F3507g, it is cheap (around $10 on ebay) and well supported by linux (http://www.thinkwiki.org/wiki/Ericsson_ ... and_Module) even it if may require some tricky firmware update (http://www.mydellmini.com/forum/3g-mobi ... 2mb-5.html) to be on the stable R1D16 firmware. It is not on the BIOS whitelist as reported by others, but that is not a problem since I'm not using the IBM bios.

I have used Ericsson's modules: F3507g and F3607gw but Lenovo branded.
Good things:
- on T60 there is no need to use patched BIOS at all. Yes BIOS don't understand them and put them in disabled state. But with pn 20 taped out they can work well. I used driver and access connections from Lenovo site - Ok. RF switch doesn't work (pin 20 taped), but FnF5 works well (after installing AccessConnections). And more - when SIM card is not inserted these modules "turns off" GSM and GPS parts. This is energy efficient because other modules that i have tested on thinkpads (Gobi 2000 / Huawey EM770W / Some Sierras) need taping pin 20 too either with Middleton BIOS. Eg Middlton BIOS disable "unauthorized WWAN card" error, but don't provide means to operate these WWAN modules with RF switch (to switch them off).

WARNING USING F3507g WITHOUT SIM CARD PREVENT ACCESS TO GPS MODULE!!!!
Other modules can use GPS without SIM card (eg Huawey EM770W)

guylhem wrote: For the first part, I am lucky since I have a 42W2535 (LCD rear cover assembly with IBM logo and "wireless WAN" capability according to the hardware manual, ie one can mount a WWAN antenna on top of it) to replace my broken LCD rear cover.

See these photos (tablet lids) PIC WARNING:
http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/MTA2NFgxNjAw/ ... Y/$_57.JPG - lid can't accept WWAN antennas
http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/MTIwMFgxNjAw/ ... S/$_57.JPG - lid that can accept WWAN antennas, but haven't them
You can see plastic pad on top right edge - it can be swapped with main WWAN antenna. AUX antenna placed along right plastic edge down of WLAN antenna.

guylhem wrote: First problem : there are 2 different top antennas, depending on the wireless provider : 93P4364 for Verizon/Cingular or 93P4365 for Vodaphone. I though it was due to different frequencies, with the 93P4364 being the US version but based on http://www.thinkwiki.org/wiki/Sierra_Wi ... HSDPA_WWAN, I believe it might be due to the different antenna physical characteristics or configuration between main and aux (i.e. the GPS antenna would be on one or the other - but I'm not sure about that).

I dont know differences between these antenna kits. On my local forum there is some info that both kits works well for GSM / 3G. in my local network. But here is no info for GPS characteristics.

guylhem wrote: Second problem, I can't find any decently priced 93P4365 or 93P4364 (except on http://s.etao.com/cp/eDYxdDNnzOzP3w.html?tbpm=20140609 but I'm not sure how to order, and I believe a thinkvantage point might charge me an arm and a leg for that small plastic thing) I found a 93P4543 for the x60 non tablet, but as seen on the 2nd picture of http://ecoshop.biz/?action=2204 is is quite different : it was made to go on the side of the x61, see installation procedure on http://www.ecoshop.biz/?action=review-0259 and a comparison with a non-tablet x60 on http://www.abload.de/image.php?img=wwan03zx.jpg - totally different form factor !!)

1. Try ebay "X60 WWAN antenna" and find 1 in Germany but not so cheap) and your link to ecoshop (second image!!!)
2. Don't mess with X6x tablet main WWAN and X6x (notebook) main WWAN antennas!!!! X6x (notebook) antenna placed on right side and have retractable tail. X6x tablet antenna is a plastic dome placed on top edge.

guylhem wrote: I guess I could try a hacky solution, with some cheap WWAN antenna from ebay, then put that in the back of the screen as on http://www.ecoshop.biz/?action=review-0260, but I'm not sure that would work well in tablet mode either....

I don't try this way. Theoretically - this is bad solution. Very small holes (upwards to the top edge of lid) which antennas can use to transmit signals.
Other bad thing. TABLET ONLY. Wacom digitizer plaed on back of LCD module generates massive EMI. To reduce this all screens for WWAN enabled tablets are covered with aluminium foil. SO this antennas placed between 2 conductive surfaces (Mg lid and aluminium shielding on wacom).

guylhem wrote: Alternatively, a 93P4388 T antenna (http://www.ebay.com/itm/WWAN-aux-cable- ... 0724504820) could go under the palm rest, as it is done on the X60s in http://i.ebayimg.com/t/IBM-Lenovo-X60s- ... Jw~~_3.JPG but likewise it would not work well in tablet model.

Yes on X6x (notebooks) WWAN AUX antenna placed under palmrest. Yes trouble in tablet mode. And in nontablet mode - heat shielding (Cu plate) must be cleared on underside of palmrest.

guylhem wrote: Fourth problem, soldering the sim card slot : I'm not sure if the motherboard is fully populated and just needs a sim card slot to be soldered (crossing my fingers or if it needs some special cables to link to the sim card reader. In the hardware manual, for my 6364-CTO (using a G4 wacom digitizer) I only see "LCD cable assembly with fingerprint reader for G4" (93P4361) - there is no LCD cable assembly with fingerprint reader, with wireless WAN, which is only available for the G5 (FRU 93P4509). I wonder if I may also need a Flexible flat cable for wireless WAN 93P4559 - I have no idea what these 2 cables would connect to, as from my understanding a WWAN port would only need 2 antennas and a sim card.

I don't know differences between "LCD cable assemblies". May be additional shielding for WWAN. There is no additional wires for WWAN

guylhem wrote: PS : for your idea of reusing the AUX wifi antenna for the MAIN wwan antenna, it will cause GPS problems, according to http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.ph ... view=print. The other interesting threads about antenn swap I've found is http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.php?p=481697)

I thought about changing WWAN AUX and WWAN MAIN antennas on MMAN module. Yesterday i have tested this and no luck. But i have tested this in concrete jungles (in city). Currently i'm using Huawey EM770W, May be F3507g will be better in terms of GPS. I have choosen EM770W for tablet because it can make voice calls from internal microphone and speaker.

(deleted - useless)

Hello

x60 tablet main WWAN antenna - verkaufen aus ebay! Now I'll be waiting for it and crossing my fingers that it will work fine for the GPS.

My plan :
1) solder a simcard reader next to the ram slots

Edit1 : for the sim card reader, there is an interesting thread on http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.php?p=595025 that details which components are missing. Too bad the pics are now gone (

2) try it under linux + coreboot "bios" (no pin-20 taping required) and hope that everything for the simcard reader is populated, ie that the F3507g will work - if not, replace it by a EM770W

Edit2 : I got lucky and got myself a cheap EM770W on ebay! EM820U area also available, if someone has an experience with it, it might help other modders that can't find a EM770W

3) if neither of that work, replace the WWAN module with a GPS-only module

Edit 3 : For the wireless antenna, after checking the EM770W hardware manual, the main antenna must be as close as possible to the EM770W while the aux antenna must be as far as possible. This means 93P4364 or 93P4365 must be connected to aux, and considering how the 3 wifi antennas from 93P4363 cover nearly all the back of the screen, a t-shaped 93P4388 shall provide a good main for the EM770W. It might not be necessary to use a GPS only model, especially since the one I've found only have 1 antenna connector

Now does anyone have the proper references for the standoff and mini-PCIE port ? (and hopefully a x60-tablet compatible simcard reader?)
I believe the mini PCIe is 4mm but I'm not sure. I'd love to place an order ASAP.

Thanks


Edit 4 : since I could not get any advice, I tried to make educated guesses and ordered :
- 2 pcs DIY any Notebook Mini PCI-Express 4.0mm card Socket/Slot : http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 0771693243
One for the spare, one for the main mobo. 4.0 mm is a guess.

- Brass Standoff Spacer M2 Male x M2 Female - 4mm : http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 1217426935
If they don't work, I'll recycle the modem standoffs

- 5 pcs SIM Card Slot Connector Tray Socket Handset Mobile Phone DIY Push Type AK : http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 1221974164
That because the spacing seems ok.

Edit 5 : I purchased the wrong thinks!! see the photo tutorial and the list of parts to order on : http://thinkpad-forum.de/threads/87437- ... 60-und-X61!

I wish I had found this link earlier!!

Also, on http://www.elektroda.pl/rtvforum/viewto ... 05#8476905 the resistor R544 is mentioned to make the WWAN led work. Still trying to look for more information about that.

I am sorry for delay. I have moved to countryside at last weekends.
And i was impressed by my X61 (not s and not tablet) - T8300. It can work about 3 hour with WWAN turned on. Everywere - in car, in house, in forest, in field or near the river.... BUT NO SATELLITES have catched at all. NO GPS

Yes i have used EM770W. The main reason - it is only module that can do voice calls from notebook's microphone and speaker among all i have tested, Yes i using one SIM (contract) for my phone calls and mobile internet.

I don't help you with speks of needed parts for this mod because all my X61s (notebook and tablet) is WWAN ready.

About standoffs - when i was doing WWAn mod on samsung - a have used 2sided adhesive tape and it is worked
BTW this is only notebook (netbook) where GPS worked fine with 3G module. it was option GTM382 and antennas from T61 - RED for 3G main and GRAY (originally WLAN main) for 3G aux connector.

I think we can start other thread with question "Who have modded their old (T6x X6x Tx00) thinkpads for WWAN or GPS" to make a list of good modules and antennas which can make GPS function.

PS
EM770W can utilize AGPS function but i don't know any AGPS servers which i must to enter in Huawey GPS applet to make this work. I have tried "supl.google.com" but i don't know if it compatible with EM770W or have fixed issues with SSL certs.