Thinkpads Forum

I have an X60 with the Atheros card and WWAN that has blazed my wrists for years... in thinking about an X61, has anyone had a chance to use the X61 and the X61S side by side and see which is cooler? The X61S should run cooler but I understand the X61 casing is built for the faster processor and might have better cooling... thanks in advance for any thoughts

Ajw

X60s

While I have not compared the X61 and The X61s, I have the X60s and the X61s. The X61s runs considerably cooler than the 60s. Considerably.

gmc wrote:The X61s runs considerably cooler than the 60s. Considerably.

This misleads! For identically-configured machines, all X61s machines run measurably hotter than their X60s counterparts, not cooler.

Perhaps your Wireless LAN or Wireless WAN are different between the machines, perhaps there are CPU speed and memory size differences between your machines, and those configuration differences are giving you a misleading impression of the native platform temperatures.

If one eliminates add-on hardware and compares just the motherboard temperatures for similar-speed CPUs, then the X61s is hotter than the X60s because of its chipset. Further, the fan on the X61s runs almost continuously, while the X60s is quiet almost always.

X60s cooler than X61s, agreed.

gunston wrote:X60s cooler than X61s, agreed.

That is odd, you would think that with a newer chipset/cpu the power requirements would lower and the X61s would be cooler.

Is the X61s a huge improvement over the older X31 in the temperature departmen? That is what I'm using now and considering the X61s...

x60s. I am not currently using an internal/mini PCI-e WWAN card with either my x61s or x60s, though. (x61s with WWAN comes with a second fan not available, afaik, in x60s.)

That is odd, you would think that with a newer chipset/cpu the power requirements would lower and the X61s would be cooler.

You would think that, but as we all know x61s also has less battery life and a 64bit-capable higher consumption cpu.

I've migrated from a CTO x61s to tselling's old x60s for portable/everyday use, fwiw. Wonderful machine and just enough battery life (>8hours) to justify the switch. Even the fingerprint reader on the x60s is in a better place -- easy to configure for a side brush of the left and right thumb, whereas x61s's fingerprint reader requires one move their hands off the keyboard.

You guys are all saying an x60s is a better laptop than the x61s?

But given the choice of an X60 or an X61s, which would you recommend? I have both right now, but I plan on selling one of them.

Rob

Rob wrote:You guys are all saying an x60s is a better laptop than the x61s?

But given the choice of an X60 or an X61s, which would you recommend? I have both right now, but I plan on selling one of them.

Rob

stick to X60s personally. eventhough i do have X60s and X61

gunston wrote:

Rob wrote:

What about X60 vs X61s? Those are the two I have in my possession right now.

Rob

Rob wrote:

gunston wrote:

in your current possession, always the "s" is better if you are a mobile use on the road and hoping for longer battery life and less heat dissipation.

ajwells,

I have the X60s, and the right wrist rest is the location of the WiFi card, as you seem to suggest. It's my one and only complaint about that computer. My daughter uses it now and she doesn't complain...maybe my hands are just too sensitive?

I have both an X61 and X61t, and neither of them has the same blazing hot wrist "problem" as the X60s does. Whatever the issue was, it seem to be resolved.

As to the overall thermal emission b/w the two it's hard to say. I see in this thread some suggest the X61 models emit more heat than the X60 models, but I'd need an experiment to verify it, because my hands can't tell the difference.

keruibo wrote:ajwells,
I have both an X61 and X61t, and neither of them has the same blazing hot wrist "problem" as the X60s does. Whatever the issue was, it seem to be resolved.

I have the X60s and the X61t and the T is definitely much cooler. Part of the change might be a different wireless card (unless you got the same one in both). In addition the T has a metal plate that is directly under the case, which may act as a heat shield to dissipate some of the heat.

As for your daughter, she may have less circulation in her appendages, making the heat a beneficial feature. I know I liked it in the winter but rued it in the summer.

Right now I've got two different TP X61s models I'm trying.

I'm not positive, but one of them seems to get much hotter than the other on the right palmrest. The difference is the hotter one has a 7200rpm drive vs. a 5400 rpm, the fingerprint reader, and a 4-cell vs. an 8-cell.

I don't know if any of those affect it. I think they both have the same wireless card.

Rob

smvp6459...ha ha, you're right she may enjoy that extra warmth . BTW I have the same experience with X61t...that's my "daily driver" and there is not noticable heat from the palmrest. I would say the X61 is even cooler--always the same as room air temp.

Rob, the HDD is unlikely, since it's position is further back under the keyboard. Fingerprint reader and 8-cells seem unlikely. FWIW all three of my X6x machines have 8-cells, fingerprint readers and 7200rpm drives...

When you say you're not positive about the difference, it gives me the feeling that you're detecting more subtle differences than I'm talking about(?) ... If you feel like a hershey's chocolate bar would quickly melt on the right wrist rest (but not on the left), that's the kind of heat I'm talking about with our X60s.

If I power up the WiFi in the X61 and start transferring a 2GB file over WiFi (just as a test), I can hear a fan startup in the front right wrist area...I believe that's why the wrist rest stays so much cooler than the X60s. Maybe the X61s you have doesn't have a fan, or has some other design difference, but FWIW that's my experience...X61 right/left wrist rest are both as cool as air temp.

First of all, if your right palm rest is uncomfortably hot then your wireless card does not have its power management activated. After my palm rest gets only slightly warm.

Its useless to compare hypothetical "identially-configured" machines. Right now, the x61 has already the penryn update (T8300 cpu, 45nm process) while the rest (old x61, x61s, x60, x60s) is using the older merom and yonah cores (65nm).

If you want to post your experiences, please tell if you have a new (penryn) or old (merom) x61. My penryn x61 runs comfortably cool for office tasks and gets reasonably hot while number-curnching....

ajwells wrote:has anyone had a chance to use the X61 and the X61S side by side and see which is cooler?

Yes I have a 7675 X61 and my wife has a 7668 X61s, and the X61s is definitely cooler.

The fan on the X61 runs most of the time. Neither of them get hot palmrests.

bananaman wrote:I have a 7675 X61 and my wife has a 7668 X61s, and the X61s is definitely cooler.

Both are merom-based, so as expected the low-voltage version in the x61s beats the normal-voltage Core 2 Duo in the x61 7675.

Did anybody compare a penryn x61 with a merom x61s? That would be interesting...

Volker wrote:

bananaman wrote:I have a 7675 X61 and my wife has a 7668 X61s, and the X61s is definitely cooler.

Both are merom-based, so as expected the low-voltage version in the x61s beats the normal-voltage Core 2 Duo in the x61 7675.

Did anybody compare a penryn x61 with a merom x61s? That would be interesting...

Nope. The X61 is Penryn-based, and the X61s is Merom-based. So I guess that answers your question!

Volker wrote:Did anybody compare a penryn x61 with a merom x61s?

Up to 35 Watts (T8300) vs. Up to 17 Watts (L7500).

bananaman: I lookd in the HMM and you are right, lenovo did not change the model number with the penryn upgrade, so a x61 7675 can be either merom or penryn-based.

EOMtp wrote:

Volker wrote:Did anybody compare a penryn x61 with a merom x61s?

Up to 35 Watts (T8300) vs. Up to 17 Watts (L7500).

TDP isn't a good metric unless you always run your cpu at 100%. The x61 needs more power at full load, but also finishes the computation faster and effectively spends more time in power-save mode.

Rob wrote:one has a 7200rpm drive vs. a 5400 rpm

this makes a HUGE difference in temps.

Volker wrote:TDP isn't a good metric unless you always run your cpu at 100%. The x61 needs more power at full load, but also finishes the computation faster and effectively spends more time in power-save mode.

Excellent point! Nonetheless, given the current process technologies of these chips, one can't go from 1.5GHz to 2.4GHz -- even in bursts -- without putting out somewhat more heat. My practical measure of the "annoyance index" is not based on temps but on how often the fan runs -- and in this department, the X61's fan runs almost always and the X60s's fan runs almost never.

The main component of the heat difference between the X61 and the X60s, with any processors, is not due primarily to the CPU but rather to the different chipsets. In this case, the X61 chipset and support circuitry is noticeably hotter than the X60 chipset, and no tweaking of CPU speeds mitigates that difference.

gongo2k1 wrote:

Rob wrote:one has a 7200rpm drive vs. a 5400 rpm

this makes a HUGE difference in temps.

Perhaps for some drives; but this makes zero difference for Hitachi drives under "normal" duty cycle.