WWAN: AT&T card

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Bashar · #1 Post by **Bashar** » Sat Mar 08, 2008 1:13 pm

does it the card that has GSM chip to install in? i heard this one would work on the rest of the world such as Kuwait

ajkula66 · #2 Post by **ajkula66** » Sat Mar 08, 2008 1:58 pm

That card will not work properly anywhere but in the U.S.

American GSM uses different frequency bands from Europe and rest of the world.

If it does work, it will be slow and with lots of flaws.

I don't know who has built the network you'll be using, but I very much doubt that it was Americans. Consult your local provider, you might be able to get away with a Vodafone card.

bananaman · #3 Post by **bananaman** » Sat Mar 08, 2008 2:58 pm

The WWAN card for the X300 is the Sierra Wireless MC8775 PCI Express MiniCard, which works worldwide. It's the same card as used in the X61. Why wouldn't it work worldwide in the X300? I think some versions are locked to a particular provider, but they work worldwide. I'm sure the wireless providers are happy to take your overseas data roaming money!

Perhaps someone with some hands on experience can chime in...

ajkula66 · #4 Post by **ajkula66** » Sat Mar 08, 2008 4:14 pm

OK, two things here:

Verizon card is CDMA-based and there is no unlocking there, like there's no unlocking CDMA cell phones.

AT&T card is GSM-based and can be unlocked to work on other GSM-based networks. However, the bands differ between USA and the rest of the world.

Vodafone cards used in EU are the only safe bet outside of USA, and the two above are the only safe bets within the USA.

One will likely be able to pick up signal outside of the card's intended area, but they will not work properly. FCC regulations made sure of that.

Take it from someone whose daily work for the past 8 years included building and maintenance of wireless networks across the tri-state area.

bananaman · #5 Post by **bananaman** » Sat Mar 08, 2008 5:14 pm

AT&T EDGE/GPRS roaming works fine in most GSM countries (as long as you can stomach the bill), the question is, does HSDPA?

Any HSDPA travelers out there?

ajkula66 · #6 Post by **ajkula66** » Sat Mar 08, 2008 7:25 pm

bananaman wrote:

AT&T EDGE/GPRS roaming works fine in most GSM countries

I guess it comes down to two things:

a) One's own definition of "working fine". Fact of the matter is that with an U.S. FCC-regulated GSM-based card you can only utilize two out of three European bands without hacking the card.
b) Density of towers in the given area: if there are enough of them, you will most likely not notice the third band missing.

bananaman · #7 Post by **bananaman** » Sat Mar 08, 2008 7:55 pm

ajkula66 wrote:a) One's own definition of "working fine". Fact of the matter is that with an U.S. FCC-regulated GSM-based card you can only utilize two out of three European bands without hacking the card.
b) Density of towers in the given area: if there are enough of them, you will most likely not notice the third band missing.

OK, let's figure this out, because this is useful for International travelers.

I have a quad band FCC-regulated Treo with AT&T which does EDGE/GPRS data fine throughout Europe. Why wouldn't a laptop with a wireless card do the same? And what about HSDPA/W-CDMA?

ajkula66 · #8 Post by **ajkula66** » Sat Mar 08, 2008 8:39 pm

You've answered two out of three of your own questions. And, if you look at my previous post, I've stated the conditions in which one would find such a device working acceptably.

As for your third question, I don't have a definite answer, but will tell you that the last time I've been to Europe a couple of years ago, the only country where my Verizon CDMA 2000 phone worked was UK, and it was nowhere near as good as it worked around here. CDMA is a purely American invention, since it's the cheapest network to build.

Mind you, we may want to start another topic, since none of this really relates to OP's situation and location, which is Kuwait.

#9 Post by **bill bolton** » Sat Mar 08, 2008 8:56 pm

bananaman wrote:I have a quad band FCC-regulated Treo with AT&T which does EDGE/GPRS data fine throughout Europe.

GSM EDGE is relatively easy to get working anywhere it is supported, provided you have band coverage on your device, but is relatively low speed for data connections.

3G connectivity is trickier, and covers more bands than the 4 common GSM ones, so your EDGE experience wont necessarily be repeated with 3G networks.

Cheers,

Bill B.

#10 Post by **bill bolton** » Sat Mar 08, 2008 9:08 pm

ajkula66 wrote:CDMA is a purely American invention, since it's the cheapest network to build.

A national CDMA mobile network was deployed in Australia in parallel with GSM networks. This was primarily to provide mobile phone services to rural areas after the original analogue mobile phone network was switched off, as it was difficult to provide adequate GSM coverage. The CDMA network has now, in turn, reached its use-by date and is due to switched off in April 2008.

The carrier that operates the CDMA network installed a new national coverage 3G network which they switched on at the end of 2006, and they have been migrating users off CDMA since then.

Cheers,

Bill

ajkula66 · #11 Post by **ajkula66** » Sat Mar 08, 2008 9:24 pm

bill bolton wrote:

A national CDMA mobile network was deployed in Australia in parallel with GSM networks

I stand corrected. Never have I known of this fact, and I'm employed in the telecommunications.

holdrege · #12 Post by **holdrege** » Sun Mar 09, 2008 12:51 am

Not to mention that CDMA is heavily used in Japan and Korea.

As for an AT&T EDGE card working in Kuwait, if it is tri-band or quad-band it will work fine. I haven't see one to know which bands it supports.

bananaman · #13 Post by **bananaman** » Sun Mar 09, 2008 7:15 am

The Sierra GSM card in the X300 (and X61) is designed for "seamless global roaming" - quad band EDGE/GPRS (850, 900, 1800, 1900 MHz) and tri-band HSDPA/UMTS (850, 1900, 2100 MHz).

It appears that the lower speed EDGE/GPRS is relatively easy to get working anywhere it is supported.

Anyone out there have actual experience roaming with this card, and HSDPA/UMTS? Can anyone report success using it in multiple countries?

Bashar · #14 Post by **Bashar** » Sun Mar 09, 2008 3:34 pm

So if i get it i just need to unlock it (if its locked) and get my SIM card into and it will work in Kuwait with no issues

because i did not see its possible to order it with vodafone card

ukchris · #15 Post by **ukchris** » Sun Mar 09, 2008 8:19 pm

A little off at a tangent but I'd always been reluctant to have a second airtime agreement for a WWAN card. I just found an app for my Windows Mobile phone that makes the phone act as a wireless access point, it hooks up the 3G connection then I can connect to the AP from my laptop / ipod etc and surf at broadband speed. Darned thing is awesome!!

No affiliation etc, program is called wmwifirouter

Chris.

bananaman · #16 Post by **bananaman** » Mon Mar 10, 2008 7:28 am

Bashar wrote:So if i get it i just need to unlock it (if its locked) and get my SIM card into and it will work in Kuwait with no issues

The question of how to arrive at an unlocked card is interesting. How to unlock it? The X300 hardware manual currently shows different FRU's for AT&T and Vodafone, which probably means they are locked (don't know for sure though). The X61 hardware manual lists more FRU's for the same card, including one which names no provider, so perhaps it is unlocked?

Anyhoo it would be great if someone who has actually got some hands on with these cards could chime in.

I'm going to buy an X300 with WWAN in the coming months. I'm actually a happy AT&T user, but I always buy unlocked hardware. I don't like being stranded where AT&T has no roaming agreement, but GSM coverage abounds.

beq · #17 Post by **beq** » Mon Mar 10, 2008 12:52 pm

I'd also like to find out about WWAN unlocking status.

Also there are currently no pre-configured X300 models (in the tabook) with an EDGE/HSPA WWAN, only EVDO WWAN. Can I buy the GSM WWAN card separately and replace the CDMA card myself?

bananaman · #18 Post by **bananaman** » Mon Mar 10, 2008 3:27 pm

You might want to try configuring a system with a GSM card by phone. People frequently report in ThinkPad forums that they can order options on the phone which are not in the online shop. The AT&T and Vodafone cards are in the hardware maintenance manual.

Bashar · #19 Post by **Bashar** » Wed Mar 12, 2008 6:26 pm

by any chance, anyone knows if the AT&T card support 7.2Mbps or 3.6Mbps?

beq · #20 Post by **beq** » Wed Mar 12, 2008 7:38 pm

Also does the AT&T GSM card for the X300 have satellite GPS capability? Sorry I know some others have asked this before, but I can't seem to find a thread with the answer?

beq · #21 Post by **beq** » Wed Mar 12, 2008 7:58 pm

bananaman wrote:You might want to try configuring a system with a GSM card by phone. People frequently report in ThinkPad forums that they can order options on the phone which are not in the online shop.

Alright I'll call and see if I can custom configure an X300 with options not available online yet (such as the 4965n Wi-Fi N card)...

SHoTTa35 · #22 Post by **SHoTTa35** » Wed Mar 12, 2008 10:01 pm

beq wrote:Also does the AT&T GSM card for the X300 have satellite GPS capability? Sorry I know some others have asked this before, but I can't seem to find a thread with the answer?

No WWAN card has GPS functions... GSM might use triagulation to get an approximate location but that's that. GPS on the X300 is from a GPS chip on the motherboard which is what it uses.

craigg · #23 Post by **craigg** » Wed Mar 12, 2008 11:27 pm

It's possible that you're wrong Shotta35. GPS is part of the WAN card and not the mother board. Some EVDO cards already support GPSone. This would explain why Lenovo is currently only offering GPS with the Verizon EVDO card. I have a Motorola Q phone that has full GPS already. There is also an HSDPA card available with GPS but it's probably not yet available at Lenovo. Here is a link to the various embedded WAN cards offered by Sierra Wireless. Click here for more details:

http://www.sierrawireless.com/product/e ... rison.aspx#

gpsOne is a position location technology developed by SnapTrack, a subsidiary of Qualcomm. GpsOne is an A-GPS technology, meaning it uses GPS satellites in conjunction with land-based stations (towers) to determine a phone?s location.

Phones with gpsOne can receive raw signals directly from GPS satellites, but require a live connection to a network-based location server to do so. The location server helps the phone find the correct satellites. The location server also processes the raw signals and makes the final calculations that determine location.

gpsOne is integrated into most Qualcomm CDMA chipsets, and is the position location technology used by most CDMA carriers.

SHoTTa35 wrote:
beq wrote:Also does the AT&T GSM card for the X300 have satellite GPS capability? Sorry I know some others have asked this before, but I can't seem to find a thread with the answer?
No WWAN card has GPS functions... GSM might use triagulation to get an approximate location but that's that. GPS on the X300 is from a GPS chip on the motherboard which is what it uses.

ajkula66 · #24 Post by **ajkula66** » Thu Mar 13, 2008 11:04 am

Agreed with what craigg wrote, 1000%.

Bashar · #25 Post by **Bashar** » Thu Mar 13, 2008 2:26 pm

Bashar wrote:by any chance, anyone knows if the AT&T card support 7.2Mbps or 3.6Mbps?

anyone?

craigg · #26 Post by **craigg** » Thu Mar 13, 2008 2:36 pm

At present Lenovo does not offer an AT&T WAN option for the X300, at least not here in the USA. Sierra Wireless does make a HSUPA card (MC8785V) that does offer 7.2mbps which should work in the X300 but you would need to install it yourself.

Bashar · #27 Post by **Bashar** » Thu Mar 13, 2008 3:21 pm

craigg wrote:At present Lenovo does not offer an AT&T WAN option for the X300, at least not here in the USA. Sierra Wireless does make a HSUPA card (MC8785V) that does offer 7.2mbps which should work in the X300 but you would need to install it yourself.

are you sure? i noticed they do offer AT&T WAN option at lenovo.com

craigg · #28 Post by **craigg** » Thu Mar 13, 2008 3:44 pm

I notice they just added that option online yet as you can see the units are not yet shipping and the delay is most likely more than a month. There are no preconfigured units available in the channel so unless you install it yourself you're at the mercy of Lenovo.

craigg · #29 Post by **craigg** » Thu Mar 13, 2008 4:10 pm

I can confirm that GPS is on the WAN card. The X300 uses the Sierra Wireless MC5725 EVDO card with the NMEA device on COM 6.

SHoTTa35 wrote:No WWAN card has GPS functions... GSM might use triagulation to get an approximate location but that's that. GPS on the X300 is from a GPS chip on the motherboard which is what it uses.

craigg · #30 Post by **craigg** » Thu Mar 13, 2008 4:22 pm

Another interesting observation for those looking for AT&T WAN is that Lenovo has preloaded all the drivers for both AT&T and Verizon activation on my X300. This should make it extremely easy to install as all you need is to pop the pci express mini card in the slot and then follow the automated activation process.

WWAN: AT&T card

WWAN: AT&T card

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