new x300 really slow in booting up

[sputnik611]

when i first got my x300, a couple of months ago, it booted up as quickly as it was supposed to - definitely under a minute. now it has suddenly become really slow - it takes several minutes. It might have something to do with my wireless, but I'm not sure. that's the last thing to load on my task bar, and I have to wait a really long time for it. i uninstalled access connections, because it was causing me problems, but that didn't solve the boot-up issue. anyone have any ideas? thanks much

[Marin85]

What applications do you have installed (incl. the Lenovo ones)? As a first stop check out the startup items (run -> masconfig -> startup) to see what loads on windows startup. You may have some unneeded entries.

[sputnik611]

Below are all the checked startup items from msconfig. Any I can uncheck?
As far as applications, I have all the Lenovo Think Vantage stuff going, everything else that comes loaded onto the computer, and then MS Office 2007, AVG Free (could this be a/the culprit), Adobe, Blackberry Software, and a few other small things.
Thanks.

gnotify
scheduler proxy
TpShocks
TPOSDSVC
TPFNF7SP
jusched
smax4pnp
Smax4
PWRMGRTR
igfxpers
LPMGR
LPMLCHK
igfxtray
hkcmd
EzEjMnAp
DkIcon
cssauth
CameraApplication
BatLogEx
avgtray
apoint
Reader sl
RoxWatchTray9
ctfmon
msmgs
Windows Search

[Marin85]

Here a few to choose from

gnotify -> Gmail notifier
scheduler proxy -> (if I´m not wrong) the scheduler helper for all ThinkVantage Stuff (including System Update, Maintenance Manager, Rescue&Recovery etc)
DkIcon -> DiskKeeper tray icon (definitely not needed)
Reader sl -> Acrobat Reader (not really needed to start with windows)
RoxWatchTray9 -> Roxio Sonic solutions
msmgs -> Are you sure this is the name of the entry? Or the name is msmsgs

Basically, it´s up to you if you want them disabled. Please pay extra attention to the last one and report back. The last one would indicate the presence of malware. Since you have all the Lenovo preloaded stuff on your machine, maybe it´s time to start thinking what you don´t need of those applications and simply get rid of them. Instead of some of them one can use the windows ones (like EasyEject or Access Connections).

[sputnik611]

it's msmsgs. does that mean I have malware? what do I do about that?

in re the scheduler proxy - if I turn that off, does that mean i'm turning off all the thinkvantage stuff? I guess that's fine, as long as I can easily turn it on when I need it. thanks.

[Marin85]

it's msmsgs. does that mean I have malware? what do I do about that?

in re the scheduler proxy - if I turn that off, does that mean i'm turning off all the thinkvantage stuff? I guess that's fine, as long as I can easily turn it on when I need it. thanks.

Since it´s msmsgs (you had omitted one "s"), you don´t have to worry about it Regarding scheduler proxy, disabling it won´t disable the whole TVT stuff, but it will make some of it not work properly for certain tasks (depending on how the whole TVT stuff has been confugured), so I would rather leave the entry as it is. Try out the other stuff and see if it improves the situation. Looking forward to your reply,

Marin

[sputnik611]

Hey Marin - that didn't seem to make any difference. I timed the startup and it's 2 minutes and 40 seconds. Isn't that much slower than a new x300 is supposed to be? Any other ideas? Thanks.

[perplex]

Mine is quite slow too as I havn't done a clean install, but it's fine once everything is loaded up. I'm sure it's all the ThinkVantage software, but I hardly ever restart, maybe just once a fortnight due to Windows Update otherwise it's just set to sleep . I think I'll try a format this summer when I have time.

[Marin85]

Hey Marin - that didn't seem to make any difference. I timed the startup and it's 2 minutes and 40 seconds. Isn't that much slower than a new x300 is supposed to be? Any other ideas? Thanks.

I believe the best thing you can do is to perform a clean install of your preferred OS. I know that it is a bit of hassle and time-consuming. Alternatively, you may try getting rid of the Lenovo applications you don´t need, but applications like R&R and CSS will always slow down the boot process. The problem is the following: even if your machine has had excellent boot performance at the beginning, all updates from Lenovo (which sometimes don´t install properly, especially if you use System Update, or even sometimes fail to install) and M$ simply kill it, it´s almost a shame by how much the M$ updates kill the boot performance of windows (especially with XP, with Vista and Win 7 this thing seems to have improved dramatically)... Performing a clean installation won´t prevent this, but at least you will have got all sorts of interdependencies due to the Lenovo preload resolved, so the impact of the updates on the boot performance won´t be so great.

Just my 0.02$

Marin

[Thecla]

I have to say I've never managed to get my X300 to boot very quickly. I'm using Business Vista (as supplied, no clean reinstall) with about 8 startup items (Thinkvantage stuff plus an anti-virus updater), services mostly as they came with a few set to manual from automatic, and it takes not far off 2 mins to boot...

[Marin85]

My system (Hitachi 7K200, Win 7 x64) takes less to boot up... I think 2 min is way too much for any self-respecting SSD

[Thecla]

I think 2 min is way too much for any self-respecting SSD

So do I. But I haven't managed to get the boot time down from about 1:45 min to what I'd consider a satisfactory level despite messing around with startup programs and everything else. Not sure if it's Vista, Thinkvantage, Access Connections, Power Management, Dark Matter, or what. (It surely isn't poor SSD performance. )

[Marin85]

Not sure if it's Vista, Thinkvantage, Access Connections, Power Management, Dark Matter, or what.

Actually, it´s all of them adding up their share. That´s why I believe the easiest way to go is backing up your data, downloading all the needed drivers/applications and performing a clean install. Yes, it takes some time, but after that you are settled and ready to start work. I can imagine the impressive performance of SSDs makes the work with a computer much more comfortable and pleasant, which, additionally to the raw performance of SSDs, raises one´s productivity. Depending on OS and SSD model, there might be also some tweaks to be applied, SSDs are in general still not that mature.

[sputnik611]

If you take the time to do the clean install, though, will you still have the same slow-booting problem a month later, when you start getting updates, etc.? I thought that's what you said in your earlier message.

[Marin85]

Performing a clean installation won´t prevent this, but at least you will have got all sorts of interdependencies due to the Lenovo preload resolved, so the impact of the updates on the boot performance won´t be so great.

IMO, XP is the OS that is mostly affected by this "phenomenon", not only because it´s quite old, i.e. not so modern architecture as Vista plus tons of updates to apply, but also because with Vista M$ seems to have learned their lesson from the XP era quite well about all the patches etc. (well, I guess time will tell this, Vista SP2 is in preparation, so everything can be expected and I don´t exclude the possibility for Vista to become such an update soap opera as XP was/is). Also, I believe it´s the new architecture of Vista (including the new .Net framework, new implementation of COM etc) that allows significant reduction of the "damage" of the applied patches.

Anyway, here are a few reasons why a clean install should make a difference:
1. Lenovo preloaded image implies tons of changes to the original OS: changes to the registry, changes to the COM components, further changes to the basic system (mostly through CSS and R&R). The chance for something to go wrong even without updating probably raises exponentially, not to mention the updating process.
2. Even if the updates manage to install properly, by the same reason as above their proper work is questionable.
3. Lenovo preloaded image is simply slow (I know, there are forum members who would disagree, but to me this is a simple fact of my experience). Adding up the updates make the system even slower than that.
4. Now add all Lenovo updates to the picture, it´s a fact there are quite often versions of the Lenovo software that break the Lenovo-specific functions, let alone the work of windows
5. Having all this in mind, consider windows as an intelligent system that looks for and tries to verify its components, functions. After the whole system has been half-way messed up by 1-4, the intelligent windows simply needs some more time and resources to find and verify all its components...

As you see, it´s quite complex, and I´m pretty certain I could add a lot more this, but I´m just not in the right mood to do so now, and it will be boring for us all

Just my 0.02$

Marin

[sputnik611]

OK, we won't torture this subject any further. Thanks for all of your help. Much appreciated. I'll try a clean install as soon as I figure out how to do that. I'm sure there are threads on this board about it.

[Thecla]

Ok, just to continue the torture, I found a little VB script here:

http://www.vistax64.com/tutorials/15181 ... -time.html

that measures vista boot up time. It's a bit variable, but I typically get about 116 secs.

Edit: btw the startup processes I have enabled are the 8 lenovo items:

scheduler_proxy
ThinkVantage active protection
On screen display
ThinkPad Power manager
Presentation Director
Access Connections
Productivity Center
BLOG

plus

Sophus antivirus Autoupdate.

[Marin85]

Actually, 116s for all that Lenovo stuff loading on Vista startup shows IMO the excellent performance of the SSD (the same thing will probably take at least 3 min on my machine)

[Thecla]

Actually, 116s for all that Lenovo stuff loading on Vista startup shows IMO the excellent performance of the SSD (the same thing will probably take at least 3 min on my machine)

The strange thing is that the boot time doesn't seem to depend too much on what start up items I have enabled (though some things like the wireless connection and the power manager icons on the task bar appear after it's booted): it's pretty much the same time with no start up items enabled.

Because of this thread, I tried out the effect of a Registry cleaner (RegSeeker), dangerous though those can be. It found quite a bit of stuff (about 1300 items, most of which just comes right back after being deleted), and that does seem to have reduced the boot time to around 90 secs (with or without the lenovo startup items enabled).

I guess if the cleaner ends up corrupting my registry, I'll be able to reduce the boot time even further with a clean reinstall.

[Marin85]

Unfortunately, it´s not only the startup items in the configuration utility that affect the boot performance. Many applications add their services set to automatic start. And even if an application doesn´t have its own startup items or services, there are other, rather hidden, components of it that steal from the boot time (M$ sysinternals have some nice applications like autoruns that can show all the stuff loaded on startup). That actually reminds me that if one feels advanced enough, one can use the autoruns utility to disable quite a lot stuff from windows and thus create the *super-fast* windows...

It seems to me that you are looking for an excuse to perform a clean install... Or rather you know you are going to perform a clean install, so you have the freedom to experiment a little with your current setup.

Cheers,

Marin

[Deadreckoning]

Clean install! I just did a clean install and it is like night and day. My x300 was taking 5 minutes to resume from sleep as configured by Lenovo. I did a clean install using a Vista DVD (not the Lenovo disks) and I am very happy!

[Marin85]

Clean install! I just did a clean install and it is like night and day. My x300 was taking 5 minutes to resume from sleep as configured by Lenovo. I did a clean install using a Vista DVD (not the Lenovo disks) and I am very happy!

Oh, believe me, I can understand you! Congratulations on your new setup! One happy user more

[ssd_thinkpad]

I did a clean install using a Vista DVD (not the Lenovo disks) and I am very happy!

Did you use the windows serial number from the sticker on bottom of your thinkpad to install windows vista?

[Marin85]

Did you use the windows serial number from the sticker on bottom of your thinkpad to install windows vista?

The serial number from the sticker on the bottom of the ThinkPad cannot be used to install windows from a standard installation media.

[Deadreckoning]

I used a program to read the OEM serial number off my original x300 installation. It installed Vista business off a standard DVD, but now it will not activate (it wants me to call Microsoft).

[Marin85]

I used a program to read the OEM serial number off my original x300 installation. It installed Vista business off a standard DVD, but now it will not activate (it wants me to call Microsoft).

Have you read the Vista Clean Install sticky, especially the last post includes a link to a very useful guide. Using a keyfinder is just a part of the job I guess I have to make it more explicit...