Thinkpads Forum

Hi

Has anybody had any experience with this OEM 12-cell battery for X200/X201?
http://www.mini-laptop-accessories.com/ ... -6376.html
It is rated at 8800mAh (weighs 0.68 kg or 1.5 lb! ), which is not much more than the 9-cell 7800mAh from Lenovo (weighs 0.51 kg or 1.12 lb).

I was just wondering…

Edit: Oops... I just realized I posted in the wrong forum... Mod please move.

fem wrote: It is rated at 8800mAh (weighs 0.68 kg or 1.5 lb! ), which is not much more than the 9-cell 7800mAh from Lenovo (weighs 0.51 kg or 1.12 lb).

It is because cheap chinese cells have lower capacity than expensive Sanyo/Panasonic/Sony etc. lenovo uses in their original batteries.
I had an experience with chinese 6-cell batteries, and, despite their rating of 5200mAh (or 4800mAh for some more honest sellers/manufacturers), their actual capacity was about 3500mAh, about 1.5 times less than of original 6-cell one... so i doubt that with that 12-cell behemoth you will get more battery life time than with original lenovo 9-cell battery.

By the way, they say that Panasonic NCR18650 cells has the capacity of 2900mAh, so one could try to order that 12-cell behemoth, set of 12 panasonic cells and go through battery refill service with that battery and cells... that could result in 11800mAh battery, 51% more than original lenovo 9-cell battery capacity.

A recell service? If they recell a OEM battery, then they need to replace the OEM spec casing, and should have those available. That may not be possible on these aftermarket beyond-spec batteries. Plus, I suspect these 12-cells are a bit more flimsy to in casing quality to begin with, than the OEM 9-cell. To recell, and then attempt to use the same casing glued back together is probably impossible.

Radioguy wrote:A recell service? If they recell a OEM battery, then they need to replace the OEM spec casing

Why is that? And what is the difference then between "recell" and purchasing a new battery?
There in Moscow are refill services like http://li-ion.ru/ , they're disassembling the battery, replacing the cells and then assembling it together (btw, the prices are $20 for work + $7 for each cell). However i'm not sure whether such service will take the job of replacing battery cells with customer provided ones, and highest capacity cells they have in stock are 2200mAh (lenovo default ones are 2600).

penartur wrote:Why is that?

Because the casing is designed so as not to allow replacing the cells. To open it, you need to split the casing.

Radioguy wrote:Because the casing is designed so as not to allow replacing the cells. To open it, you need to split the casing.

http://www.li-ion.ru/recover.php
It says something like:

1. Usually, battery cases are made nonseparable, and case parts are either glued or fastened by latches. Because of that, one needs to know in-depth design of the specific battery.
...
6. Then we are gluing case parts together, using clamps for better fit of the parts.
...

(my english is very bad, but i believe it is better than google translate).
So it seems that battery recell services are already aware of that problem

I agree, recelling is possible. The guys at micropc talk did that for their old/dead vaio ux batteries. Cosmetic-wise, I guess you can come up with something nice, esp. on a mammoth battery like that 12-cell!

I bought a 12 cell battery (from China via ebay) for my X200- it was about $60

I ran the tests under the following conditions:
* Set power usage to about 15 watts in power manager, which made the display dimmer
* Screen and laptop on the entire time- no automatic screen shutoff or dimming, no computer going to sleep
* With WiFi testing, I had WiFi on the entire time
* With 3g testing (I did a do-it-yourself internal Spring 3g card installed under the keyboard, see posts elsewhere in this forum for details) the 3G was on the entire time- I think this is the equivalent of a cel phone being on a call the entire time.

RESULTS:
* With WiFi testing: about 8-10 hours of battery life
* With 3G testing: about 7-9 hours of battery life

Remember the figures above were with everything on for the entire 7-10 hours. This means with more normal conditions (screen dimming or screen shutoff, 3g not on the entire time, wifi not on the entire time) I'm getting usage of about 10-13 hours pretty easily, although I haven't measured that with the same precision as the above.

These are both pretty significant imporvements over the 9 cel that came with my thinkpad. I do agree with the comments in this thread about cheap chinese cells and am suspicious how long the above performance will hold up after as time goes on. But in any case the initial results are pretty strong. I travel alot and basically don't have to worry about finding a power plug in airports or anything- this extended battery feels like it just lasts forever.

rkforum wrote:I bought a 12 cell battery (from China via ebay) for my X200- it was about $60

I ran the tests under the following conditions:
* Set power usage to about 15 watts in power manager, which made the display dimmer
* Screen and laptop on the entire time- no automatic screen shutoff or dimming, no computer going to sleep
* With WiFi testing, I had WiFi on the entire time
* With 3g testing (I did a do-it-yourself internal Spring 3g card installed under the keyboard, see posts elsewhere in this forum for details) the 3G was on the entire time- I think this is the equivalent of a cel phone being on a call the entire time.

RESULTS:
* With WiFi testing: about 8-10 hours of battery life
* With 3G testing: about 7-9 hours of battery life

Remember the figures above were with everything on for the entire 7-10 hours. This means with more normal conditions (screen dimming or screen shutoff, 3g not on the entire time, wifi not on the entire time) I'm getting usage of about 10-13 hours pretty easily, although I haven't measured that with the same precision as the above.

These are both pretty significant imporvements over the 9 cel that came with my thinkpad. I do agree with the comments in this thread about cheap chinese cells and am suspicious how long the above performance will hold up after as time goes on. But in any case the initial results are pretty strong. I travel alot and basically don't have to worry about finding a power plug in airports or anything- this extended battery feels like it just lasts forever.

Can you tell us what Battery Capacity it shows after a full charge?

After I last charged it, If I hover on the battery icon, after it's fully charged, it showed "8:30 remaining".

In Power Manager, at the same time, it showed "9:35 remaining".

I notice this jumps around a bit, once immediately after I finished charging it, power manager showed "13:25 remaining". I did a full charge and recharge the first 5 times, perhaps the computer was trying to figure out the true duration. In any case, my actual usage fits what I posted above.

rkforum wrote:After I last charged it, If I hover on the battery icon, after it's fully charged, it showed "8:30 remaining".

In Power Manager, at the same time, it showed "9:35 remaining".

I notice this jumps around a bit, once immediately after I finished charging it, power manager showed "13:25 remaining". I did a full charge and recharge the first 5 times, perhaps the computer was trying to figure out the true duration. In any case, my actual usage fits what I posted above.

The computer was trying to figure out the actual power consumption
Time it shows is calculated by dividing the "Remaining Battery Capacity" by actual power consumption (which differs dependent on what are you doing at the moment).
Could you tell us what "Full Charge Capacity" does the PM show for that battery? It will tell us much more about the battery, compared to how long will your laptop work from a single charge or what remaining time shows the PM.

In power manager full charge capacity says "99.01wh"

rkforum wrote:In power manager full charge capacity says "99.01wh"

That means, 17% more than original 9-cell one... not such a big deal.
Had it came with 2600mAh cells lenovo uses, the capacity would have been 112.32Wh... and with panasonic 2900mAh it would have reached a massive 125.28Wh.

I don't dispute the calculations, but there's no doubt that I'm getting beyond a 17% improvement in usage then my 9 cel that came with the thinkpad. I'm seeing about a 30% improvement. This yields two possibilities:

1) My 9 cel battery is old/inefficient and doesn't have the capacity it used to *or*
2) The capacity of the new 12 cel battery in power manager is incorrect

In any case my 9 cell does not come close to a 10+ hour duration with the computer and screen being on the entire time.

Anyway, take it for what it is...I"m enjoying the battery's long duration but can't explain it any more than with my anectdotal experience.

rkforum wrote:I don't dispute the calculations, but there's no doubt that I'm getting beyond a 17% improvement in usage then my 9 cel that came with the thinkpad. I'm seeing about a 30% improvement. This yields two possibilities:

1) My 9 cel battery is old/inefficient and doesn't have the capacity it used to *or*
2) The capacity of the new 12 cel battery in power manager is incorrect

In any case my 9 cell does not come close to a 10+ hour duration with the computer and screen being on the entire time.

Anyway, take it for what it is...I"m enjoying the battery's long duration but can't explain it any more than with my anectdotal experience.

Likely it is the first case. Again, you can check the "full charge capacity" for your 9-cell battery; e.g. mine has its "Full charge capacity" 73.21Wh compared to 84.24Wh for brand new one.
Also, you should be ready to that cheap chinese cells to lost their capacity quickly. It is possible that capacity of that 12-cell battery will decrease to current capacity of your used 9-cell battery within a month or a two.

I'll monitor the 12 cel and report back any changes, I also have a suspicion that these chinese cells may degrade rather quickly...I'll report back in a month or so.

Update

Well I've had this 12 cel battery for about a month now and love it. I am very surprised that it hasn't "degraded" heavily yet- at full charge in the X200 power manager it shows anywhere from 95 to 99wh. I have basically been running it down everyday to about 5-10% and charging it over night. I am still getting 8-10 hours real use time out of it even when connected to Sprint WWAN the whole time.

I'll report back in another month but I've been pleasantly suprrised by the perfromance. It's been through about 30 charge cycles so far.

rkforum wrote:I have basically been running it down everyday to about 5-10% and charging it over night.

So why're you using that behemoth instead of 4-cell battery?

The biggest reason I use the big battery is the nature of my workdays/schedule. I often am travelling via plane (more often then not 1 day trips) so it's good to not have to worry about plugging in while waiting at the airport. In addition, I"m also 'in the field' alot, without access to power, which is a huge bonus.

There are also benefits in the house (e.g. never really worrying about plugging it in, I tend to carry my laptop around everywhere, but by far the biggest benefit is during travel.

Well, this is the last post I will put in about the 12 cell battery- after almost 3 months with the battery (it's the only battery I use)- my verdict is- IT'S GREAT! I'm sitting in an airplane on nearly my 7th hour of use and it says I've got over 2 hours left.

I am amazed but the cells have kept their charge. Battery manager sometimes shows a slight degradation, but on any given day the "full charge capacity" goes up or down a little.

I think one of the reasons is I have been practicing good battery habits- e.g. letting it run all the way down and charging it all the way up.

In any case, with Sprint WWAN on, I can get a good 7-9 hours- which is amazing considering the 3G is on for that entire period.. With WWAN turned off, I can get even more.

Anyway that is my experience. Take it any way you wish!

I'm responding to a post from 3 years ago concerning the 12 cell battery for the Lenovo x201. The post asked about the 12 cell battery. Well I paid for one from mini-laptop-accessories.com but after a week I contacted them and asked where's my battery. They responded that they don't have 12-cell any more. But they still have the web page for it. So they have advertised that they have a product that they don't. I'm trying to get Paypal to resolve this and get my money back.

Well, a day after opening claim through Paypal, mini-laptop-accessories quickly gave my refund. I love Paypal. What a beneficial thing for buyers and sellers.

12 core multi-core definitely better than 9 ~