Thinkpads Forum

I recently bought a brand new X200, within the first few weeks the hard drive failed. Not exactly thrilled, although full credit to lenovo for providing a replacement quickly.

However literally the next day, while streaming video with the machine on a stand well away from me - the soundcard just cut out. Did all the usual driver checks / diagnostics - nothing.

So I sent it off to lenovo in Colchester (UK) to be repaired, however I've been told that the engineer has determined the cause to be 'liquid ingress' and therefore is not covered under warranty.

It's never even left my apartment and been secured in a stand well off the table the whole time - in short there is no way liquid has been anywhere near this machine or in any humid conditions - at least not when under my possession.

I'm trying to get pictures of the water damage to see what the lovely people of these forums think.

I can't believe i've paid the best part of £1000 for such a piece of crap, I paid extra for the 3 year warranty specifically to avoid this as I now rely on this computer for my work (audio and video). I've owned a half a dozen thinkpads before this - ironically all of them second hand and none of them have had any problems - my 600E is still running to this day!

There is no repair cost quoted - If I request a quote I then have to pay a £70 'Problem Determination Fee' (determined the problem myself, thankyou very much lenovo!!) and even the 'standard charge' of £200 is going to be hard to come by at the moment (!). Seeing as the entire MOBO will probably have to be replaced, i'm sure it will be at least twice as much

I'm extremely dissapointed, though until I see some pictures I guess I still have to be open to the possibility of indoor weather phenomena.

Any experiences / advice would be much appreciated

J

Appeal and escalate if needed. If you know there has been no "liquid ingress" while in your possession, don't agree to pay a penny.

My experience with Lenovo UK has been... well to heck with the summary: I think they suck.*

Be insistent: if you know you did nothing wrong, then simply stand your ground. Eventually you will 1) wind up with someone sympathetic to your claim 2) piss off enough people that it becomes easier for them to approve the repair than keep arguing with you.

*My US support experience through IBM, on the other hand, has been nothing short of flawless, which leads me to believe that this is an issue with Lenovo's non-US support rather than a company-wide support failing.

Firstly, thanks to those who have replied, a quick follow up - they've sent me some photos of the damage:

http://img403.imageshack.us/i/cimg2148.jpg/

http://img819.imageshack.us/i/cimg2176.jpg/

So it does seem as though there has been some damage to the machine (still non the wiser to how or when) - I've asked them how much it's going to cost to repair - I'm guessing the entire motherboard needs replacing. But in order to find out I have to pay an £80 'Problem Determination' fee!! I kind of object to being held ransom like this.....

So the question is, does anyone with experience know how much such a repair is going to cost?! since it's just the soundcard which is faulty - i'm not going to pay near the full cost of a new laptop when I can just buy a £10 USB sound interface and just try to live with it

Nightmare.

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Lenovo support is horrible, compared to IBM. I dropped my T60 and the bottom base and lid cover broke, but it had ThinkPlus warranty so they came and fixed it. The bad thing is that it took 30 days and the lid cover was bowed, so eventually the screen failed due to pressure but I alrady was out of warranty by then...

That's why I don't purchase new laptops: if I buy used with some mileage already, it's unlikely that something will suddenly break (as you have noticed). And the money I save should be plenty to fix things myself.

Legend66 wrote:So the question is, does anyone with experience know how much such a repair is going to cost?! since it's just the soundcard which is faulty - i'm not going to pay near the full cost of a new laptop when I can just buy a £10 USB sound interface and just try to live with it

Sorry to hear about the "liquid ingress".

I want to preface my comments with my Lenovo support experience. I've used Lenovo support several times per year since the first ThinkPads were produced. I have to say, that on the whole, IBM, and now, Lenovo support has been very fair. They often go above and beyond with their quickness to replaced damaged parts, like keyboards, hard drives, optical drives, etc. They answer the phone quickly and ship almost everything overnight.

I, too, have been surprised by water damage. However, I've been sent photos, like you, and I certainly do not think IBM or Lenovo is planting damage to avoid warranty requests (not that anyone has suggested that).

Please consider all this when comparing Lenovo to any other laptop manufacturer.

All that being said, their out-of-warranty options are abysmal. The work they do is fine, but the pricing is completely off the charts and not comprehensible.

A friend just had their cracked T410s LCD replaced and it was $700 (in the U.S.) I doubt an X200 motherboard would be less. Your best bet is a local repair shop, or if you can do the work, to buy a motherboard from a forum member or via eBay. At this point, the low end for a self repair is probably in the $300 range.

Alternately, buying a used X200 and combining the best parts from both, then selling the left over may be the most cost effective, as used X200's are in the $500 range (at least in the U.S.)

or, maybe cheaper, buy a broken x200 (cracked LCD or something), make sure the motherboard is fine and replace your motherboard.

mikemex wrote:Lenovo support is horrible, compared to IBM.

Aren't thinkpads being serviced by IBM?

underclocker wrote:All that being said, their out-of-warranty options are abysmal. The work they do is fine, but the pricing is completely off the charts and not comprehensible.

A friend just had their cracked T410s LCD replaced and it was $700 (in the U.S.) I doubt an X200 motherboard would be less. Your best bet is a local repair shop, or if you can do the work, to buy a motherboard from a forum member or via eBay. At this point, the low end for a self repair is probably in the $300 range.

I've purchased an used X200 on ebay in June 2009, with 1 year warranty until October 2010. However, it died on September 2009 (=won't turn on; LED indicators are just flashing up for a couple of seconds and then fade away). Unfortunately, it was model type 7454, and this was the first time i've discovered that international lenovo warranty doesn't mean worldwide (after that case i'm always doing the check, and so far i haven't seen another model type which is not being serviced in Russia).
For a first time, i've thought that this is mistake (all other model types sold in US have their warranty valid in Russia, just not 7454), and came to IBM service, pretending i don't know anything about model numbers, limited international warranty and such. They took off the laptop for diagnostics, and then told me that: they cannot fix 7454 for free because IBM/Lenovo HQ won't provide required parts for 7454; the problem is that motherboard is dead, and needs replacement, and out-of-warranty replacement costs $1800 (at the time, brand new X200 could be easily locally purchased for $1400); and i must pay $70 for out-of-warranty diagnostics. Oh, and, by the way, they "diagnosed" it for two weeks.
Then, i came to another third-party repair service, which also fixes laptop parts (instead of only replacing these with brand-new FRUs, as official lenovo services do), and they diagnosed laptop for free, saying that the root of the problem is that, due of overheat, south bridge "unsoldered" from the motherboard (that is, problem is caused by manufacturer fault). They tried to fix the problem with their methods (except for completely resoldering that BGA chip), but all attempts failed. That took a single day (i've gave them laptop on morning, and collected it back on the same evening), and i didn't pay a penny (and, in case of successful repair, it would cost $100 - compare that to official service demands!)
Of course, after that third-party repair service, motherboard was damaged enough for laptop to ultimately became out-of-service due to unauthorized access and modification of internals. However, i've contacted a friend of mine who lives in USA, and send him the laptop for him to send it as in-warranty item to Lenovo USA. Surprisingly, lenovo didn't asked a question, and in a couple of weeks, the motherboard was replaced by new one, completely free.

PS: Looking at the pictures provided by OP, i fear that there actually might happen a "Liquid ingress". Even if it is foolishly to assume Lenovo had deliberately put some liquid on it to avoid expensive in-warranty repair, it could easily be unintentionally done by some not-so-bright serviceman. I fear that now that laptop may have other problems, not only audio missing (e.g. it may not turn on at all).

PPS: Oh yes, and another IBM service experience. We had several R61i purchased in russia, and one of these died with the very same symptoms as my X200 (won't turn on, although led indicators are flashing up for a while). I've took it to the same IBM service, they said that motherboard died, and replaced it in a couple of weeks.

I had a T43 that was reported buy Lenovo Service as water damaged. It had a red LCD and was sent in twice for the same problem for warranty repair. Both times they had the unit for more than six weeks and returned it when I refused to pay the repair estimate of almost $800. Why would I pay that amount when it cost me less then $200? The forum members suggested a new display. I bought one on eBay for $19, installed the display, and it is still working today after two years of operation.

I found out that they had written on the back of the diplay (you would never know it unless you took the screen apart) "water damage". They wanted to replace the motherboard...the MB was working fine. It needed a new display and that should have been covered by warranty. It appears once it is sent in twice for the same problem...there is no way they will fix it. I tried escalating which did not work. They changed contractors not long after that. As for the repair...replacing the LCD for $19 made me feel very good and I learned a lot from the process.

Personnaly...I would find another X200 and part the water damaged unit out or sell it on eBay. Sorry for your bad luck.

We're having the exact same problem. Brand new x201 (4 cycles on the battery) that had issues with the video which I traced to a conflict with the Intel GMA graphics driver (if I delete this and use a generic VGA driver the problem disappears). Anyway, Lenovo tech support first told me that the hard drive had failed and sent a new drive which I fitted and re-installed the system but the problem persisted so I was asked to send the machine in for repair. We sent it in for a repair that was started last Wednesday but suddenly on Monday the tracking system said the job was on hold and I should contact Lenovo. I did only to be told that the machine had liquid ingression and from the photos they have sent that is definitely the case but I nor anyone else here has never had fluid near the machine let alone spilled any which has created a crazy scenario where I can't prove that I haven't spilled anything but equally can't prove that the company that make the repairs have.

I would be willing to take an oath, lie detector or any test in order to prove that I'm telling the truth but it's all fallen on deaf ears and it looks like I've sent away a machine with a simple driver conflict and am getting a broken machine back with the insinuation being that I'm a liar. I refuse to even have a quote let alone be held to ransom with a repair and I'm going to have an independent expert to make a report with a view to taking it to small claims court.

My company currently have a T420, T420s and three x201's and over the last six years we've bought over 50 high end ThinkPads but I will never spend another penny with them.

Would anyone else that has sent a Lenovo product to their Colchester service centre only to be told it has liquid ingression when they know the machine didn't before it was sent for repair please get in contact with me or post your story here.

you probably would get more help if you post on forum.lenovo.com

I bought a new X201 direct from Lenovo once.
It arrived in a crushed box.
It took almost a month to get a refund, they only did it eventually as I got my credit card company to recover the money it was nearly £2k.
Not a fan of thier support etc!
Did you buy it with a credit card? - in which case it should be insured.

The issue could be moisture is misinterpreted as a spilled drink.

I don't think it's moisture but from the photos they've sent it doesn't look like fluid, these are the photos they've sent.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/69448681@N05/

The substance on the palm rest looks like grease or similar because it's thick and the lines are very acute rather than flooded which you would expect from a fluid, there's also a lot of dust and debris in the photo which looks like whoever is fixing it has been eating biscuits or something, certainly not using a clean room!

It's ultra frustrating, they don't keep you informed on what's happening, I sent two e-mails yesterday and have yet to get a reply to either. Like I say, lesson learned.

365 wrote:I don't think it's moisture but from the photos they've sent it doesn't look like fluid, these are the photos they've sent.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/69448681@N05/

The substance on the palm rest looks like grease or similar because it's thick and the lines are very acute rather than flooded which you would expect from a fluid, there's also a lot of dust and debris in the photo which looks like whoever is fixing it has been eating biscuits or something, certainly not using a clean room!

It's ultra frustrating, they don't keep you informed on what's happening, I sent two e-mails yesterday and have yet to get a reply to either. Like I say, lesson learned.

Unless you can prove it -- would be difficult for them to admit fault. Do you have any eyewitnesses on the condition pre-submission for service? You should, however, make a big stink about it and go after them hard.