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T420 Running Hot?

T400/410/420 and T500/510/520 series specific matters only
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gfuller
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T420 Running Hot?

#1 Post by gfuller » Sun Feb 25, 2018 4:19 am

I downloaded CPU-Z today on my T420 (daily driver.) I've never played with CPU-Z before, as I used to use Speccy on a desktop I had. (That is when Speccy wasn't being completely unstable or failing to load.)

One thing I noticed when exporting my computer specs to a HTML file from CPU-Z is my CPU temperature. It said that my CPU core temperature was 81 degrees Celsius. :eek:

This computer has run hot ever since I got it. And not just barely hot, it puts out hot enough air on the vents that holding your hand near it for too long (~30 seconds) will become extremely uncomfortable.

When I ran Speccy on my desktop, the highest temperature I think I saw was 55*C. I did a quick Google search for laptop CPU temp ranges and 70*C can be considered high.

Any thoughts or suggestions? Perhaps it is overdue for an internal cleaning, as I haven't cleaned it out since I purchased it two years ago when it was refurbished. The cooling system seems to be working as it is putting out fairly hot air from the vents, and the base pan barely gets hot.
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Re: T420 Running Hot?

#2 Post by RealBlackStuff » Sun Feb 25, 2018 4:58 am

Clean the fan and CPU and put on fresh Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut.
"Refurbished" usually means: remove HDD/SSD and then throw it on eBay.
It does NOT mean: checked and cleaned everything and replaced thermal paste!

Have a look at this craptop: https://www.ebay.com/itm/401497666178
In the description he even points out the dirt that he was too lazy to remove!
And he still had the gall to call it: Seller refurbished! Yeah, right! :evil:
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Re: T420 Running Hot?

#3 Post by gfuller » Sun Feb 25, 2018 6:07 am

RealBlackStuff wrote:
Sun Feb 25, 2018 4:58 am
Clean the fan and CPU and put on fresh Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut.
"Refurbished" usually means: remove HDD/SSD and then throw it on eBay.
It does NOT mean: checked and cleaned everything and replaced thermal paste!

Have a look at this craptop: https://www.ebay.com/itm/401497666178
In the description he even points out the dirt that he was too lazy to remove!
And he still had the gall to call it: Seller refurbished! Yeah, right! :evil:
I was thinking that it may also need a new coat of thermal paste.

I don't know when I'll do that - over Spring Break?
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Re: T420 Running Hot?

#4 Post by RealBlackStuff » Sun Feb 25, 2018 6:34 am

Huh? Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut IS thermal paste.

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Re: T420 Running Hot?

#5 Post by gfuller » Mon Feb 26, 2018 2:29 am

RealBlackStuff wrote:
Sun Feb 25, 2018 6:34 am
Huh? Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut IS thermal paste.
Sorry, I was saying that before you replied I thought it may have needed a new application of fresh thermal paste. :-)
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Re: T420 Running Hot?

#6 Post by Thinkpad4by3 » Mon Feb 26, 2018 10:15 am

gfuller wrote:
Mon Feb 26, 2018 2:29 am
RealBlackStuff wrote:
Sun Feb 25, 2018 6:34 am
Huh? Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut IS thermal paste.
Sorry, I was saying that before you replied I thought it may have needed a new application of fresh thermal paste. :-)
Do you really need Grizzly? I never deal with overheating CPUs on my 5 y/o tube of Arctic Silver 5. Even the W700 with its space heater Q9000 chip barely reaches 80C.
"Its not what screen ratio you have, it is what you do with it." -me

Now stop complaining and get back to work with your "wrongly configured" box of pixels.

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Re: T420 Running Hot?

#7 Post by RealBlackStuff » Mon Feb 26, 2018 10:31 am

Nowadays AS5 has been reduced to a mediocre (but not bad) thermal paste.
Unless you want to spend a fortune on liquid metal, the above mentioned Kryonaut is absolute top of the line.

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Re: T420 Running Hot?

#8 Post by Hans Gruber » Mon Feb 26, 2018 10:54 am

I am not saying Arctic Silver 5 is the best thermal paste on the market. It is the bleach of thermal paste. There are many thermal pastes that exceed it's performance but after two or three years people have been horrified to find a dried out crusty mess under their CPU's. With AR5, when you remove your cooler you find the same consistency as it was when originally applied.
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Re: T420 Running Hot?

#9 Post by Thinkpad4by3 » Mon Feb 26, 2018 1:11 pm

Ok, so it isnt the best. I have a bit of the tibe left and will buy some Kryonaut when I need some more for whatever.
"Its not what screen ratio you have, it is what you do with it." -me

Now stop complaining and get back to work with your "wrongly configured" box of pixels.

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Re: T420 Running Hot?

#10 Post by TPFanatic » Mon Feb 26, 2018 2:00 pm

AS5 is cheap, plentiful, and highly effective. Results will vary depending on how you apply it. Less is more when it comes to thermal paste. I've gotten good at applying the thinnest layers necessary and the laptops are cooling great.
lenovo T61 T7500, SXGA+, 8GB
lenovo T410s i5 520m, WXGA+, 4GB
lenovo T430 i5 3320m, FHD, 8GB
lenovo T500 P9700, WUXGA, 8GB
lenovo T520 i7 2760QM, FHD, 8GB



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Re: T420 Running Hot?

#11 Post by Thinkpad4by3 » Mon Feb 26, 2018 2:13 pm

TPFanatic wrote:
Mon Feb 26, 2018 2:00 pm
AS5 is cheap, plentiful, and highly effective. Results will vary depending on how you apply it. Less is more when it comes to thermal paste. I've gotten good at applying the thinnest layers necessary and the laptops are cooling great.
Pea sized drop for a mobile CPU?
"Its not what screen ratio you have, it is what you do with it." -me

Now stop complaining and get back to work with your "wrongly configured" box of pixels.

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Re: T420 Running Hot?

#12 Post by RealBlackStuff » Mon Feb 26, 2018 2:31 pm

Nope, grain of rice sized dollop, spread evenly.

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Re: T420 Running Hot?

#13 Post by Thinkpad4by3 » Mon Feb 26, 2018 3:21 pm

RealBlackStuff wrote:
Mon Feb 26, 2018 2:31 pm
Nope, grain of rice sized dollop, spread evenly.
I prefer the "use the CPU cooler to spread it" technique. Worked flawlessly over the half-dozen or so times I've done it. I checked my W700 heatsink when I had to replace it for the 2nd time and I found good coverage on both the CPU and GPU.
"Its not what screen ratio you have, it is what you do with it." -me

Now stop complaining and get back to work with your "wrongly configured" box of pixels.

-Thinkpad4by3, or 3:2, or 16:10, or 16:9, or 21:9.....or whatever.

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Re: T420 Running Hot?

#14 Post by jaspen-meyer » Mon Feb 26, 2018 6:14 pm

set aside an hour to replace the thermal paste and clean out the fan. All you need is a set of small phillips head screw drivers and the 'T420 Hardware maintaince manual'.
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Re: T420 Running Hot?

#15 Post by TPFanatic » Mon Feb 26, 2018 9:10 pm

Thinkpad4by3 wrote:
Mon Feb 26, 2018 3:21 pm
RealBlackStuff wrote:
Mon Feb 26, 2018 2:31 pm
Nope, grain of rice sized dollop, spread evenly.
I prefer the "use the CPU cooler to spread it" technique. Worked flawlessly over the half-dozen or so times I've done it. I checked my W700 heatsink when I had to replace it for the 2nd time and I found good coverage on both the CPU and GPU.
That does work with AS5 or better because they are good thermal paste, but ideally you want the least thermal paste between the die and the copper. The paste is only needed to ensure contact between the hard surfaces. My theory is less is more which means I'll put a small amount, spread it over with a credit card, scrape off excess, then stick on the heatsink. I'm getting pretty amazing temps doing this, better than the other way.
lenovo T61 T7500, SXGA+, 8GB
lenovo T410s i5 520m, WXGA+, 4GB
lenovo T430 i5 3320m, FHD, 8GB
lenovo T500 P9700, WUXGA, 8GB
lenovo T520 i7 2760QM, FHD, 8GB



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Re: T420 Running Hot?

#16 Post by Thinkpad4by3 » Mon Feb 26, 2018 9:19 pm

TPFanatic wrote:
Mon Feb 26, 2018 9:10 pm
That does work with AS5 or better because they are good thermal paste, but ideally you want the least thermal paste between the die and the copper. The paste is only needed to ensure contact between the hard surfaces. My theory is less is more which means I'll put a small amount, spread it over with a credit card, scrape off excess, then stick on the heatsink. I'm getting pretty amazing temps doing this, better than the other way.
Ain't nobody got time for that! :lol:

I found the spread to be thin though. Maybe everyone's perception of food sizes are different? Again, <80C on a Q9000. It can't be too badly applied.

Hey, there is always the 2003 AMD way, put very little (poor quality) thermal paste on the die and let it cook until the die permanently cements itself to the heatsink, creating easy flow for the heat.
"Its not what screen ratio you have, it is what you do with it." -me

Now stop complaining and get back to work with your "wrongly configured" box of pixels.

-Thinkpad4by3, or 3:2, or 16:10, or 16:9, or 21:9.....or whatever.

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Re: T420 Running Hot?

#17 Post by gfuller » Sun Mar 04, 2018 2:26 pm

Update: The T420 reached 91 degrees celsius last night. :eek: :eek:

Image

This begs me to ask the question: but doesn't Windows have a "overheating" notification? Shouldn't it notify you at 85*C, and automatically shut down at 95*C or so to prevent damage?

I know it'd be frustrating, but if your computer is running that hot you may need to know. The only reason I know it has been getting this warm is CPU-Z.
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Re: T420 Running Hot?

#18 Post by Thinkpad4by3 » Sun Mar 04, 2018 3:35 pm

Windows has NEVER had that.
"Its not what screen ratio you have, it is what you do with it." -me

Now stop complaining and get back to work with your "wrongly configured" box of pixels.

-Thinkpad4by3, or 3:2, or 16:10, or 16:9, or 21:9.....or whatever.

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Re: T420 Running Hot?

#19 Post by gfuller » Sun Mar 04, 2018 4:25 pm

Thinkpad4by3 wrote:
Sun Mar 04, 2018 3:35 pm
Windows has NEVER had that.
Hmm... I guess I'm thinking of something else. But I think it'd be a somewhat nice feature, at least to easily know what your CPU core temperature is in the task manager or another part of Windows, instead of having to use third-party tools.
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Re: T420 Running Hot?

#20 Post by Thinkpad4by3 » Sun Mar 04, 2018 5:18 pm

I have looked for a nice tool but haven't found one. Maybe I'll write something that shows you the temperature in the icon panel by the time and displays a bubble when it gets too hot. If it is popular enough I might do it.
"Its not what screen ratio you have, it is what you do with it." -me

Now stop complaining and get back to work with your "wrongly configured" box of pixels.

-Thinkpad4by3, or 3:2, or 16:10, or 16:9, or 21:9.....or whatever.

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Re: T420 Running Hot?

#21 Post by Hans Gruber » Sun Mar 04, 2018 5:30 pm

I use two razor blades when applying AR5. It's not surgical steel blades but my precision with the blade is second to none. Does the hand shake, of course but what do you expect?

I can attest that the T420s runs a bit warm. Not hot but warm but the performance of the Sandy Bridge CPU's are excellent.
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Re: T420 Running Hot?

#22 Post by Thinkpad4by3 » Sun Mar 04, 2018 5:56 pm

My T430s had the i7-3520M and a 840 Pro SSD. When you needed processing power, that thing DELIVERED! Sandy Bridge was great, Ivy just flew. Then Intel made haswell :x .
"Its not what screen ratio you have, it is what you do with it." -me

Now stop complaining and get back to work with your "wrongly configured" box of pixels.

-Thinkpad4by3, or 3:2, or 16:10, or 16:9, or 21:9.....or whatever.

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Re: T420 Running Hot?

#23 Post by Hans Gruber » Sun Mar 04, 2018 6:37 pm

My daily driver is one of two T430s models. One has the i7 and the other has the i5 processor.
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Re: T420 Running Hot?

#24 Post by shawross » Sun Mar 04, 2018 7:32 pm

gfuller wrote:This begs me to ask the question: but doesn't Windows have a "overheating" notification? Shouldn't it notify you at 85*C, and automatically shut down at 95*C or so to prevent damage?
Really this should be done in BIOS as not everyone runs Windows. For the X220 there is a advanced Bios which seems to offer this but I haven't run mine hot enough to test the feature yet. I think I have a warning at 75 degrees and a shutdown at 80 degrees.

We have been short changed in BIOS features probably to protect noobs from bricking their devices.
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Re: T420 Running Hot?

#25 Post by gfuller » Sun Mar 04, 2018 8:25 pm

shawross wrote:
Sun Mar 04, 2018 7:32 pm
gfuller wrote:This begs me to ask the question: but doesn't Windows have a "overheating" notification? Shouldn't it notify you at 85*C, and automatically shut down at 95*C or so to prevent damage?
Really this should be done in BIOS as not everyone runs Windows. For the X220 there is a advanced Bios which seems to offer this but I haven't run mine hot enough to test the feature yet. I think I have a warning at 75 degrees and a shutdown at 80 degrees.

We have been short changed in BIOS features probably to protect noobs from bricking their devices.
My thought is that something in BIOS would pass the temperature reading along to the operating system, and the operating system would determine when/how to shut down the system. So that it can be used in many different operating systems, etc.
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Re: T420 Running Hot?

#26 Post by Sweater Fish Deluxe » Sun Mar 04, 2018 9:33 pm

gfuller wrote:
Sun Mar 04, 2018 8:25 pm
My thought is that something in BIOS would pass the temperature reading along to the operating system, and the operating system would determine when/how to shut down the system. So that it can be used in many different operating systems, etc.
The whole thing is controlled by the BIOS. Intel chips from Sandy Bridge on (maybe earlier, too, I don't know?) are designed to throttle down at a certain temperature (usually either 95 or 97 degrees) and shut down at higher temps (100 or 105 degrees). There are hacked BIOSes available for the T420 with an advanced setting menu that allow you to change these thresholds. I've never seen fit to mess with them myself. In general they're not accessible settings because they're based on Intel's research and are CPU specific.

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Re: T420 Running Hot?

#27 Post by gfuller » Mon Mar 05, 2018 5:05 am

Sweater Fish Deluxe wrote:
Sun Mar 04, 2018 9:33 pm
gfuller wrote:
Sun Mar 04, 2018 8:25 pm
My thought is that something in BIOS would pass the temperature reading along to the operating system, and the operating system would determine when/how to shut down the system. So that it can be used in many different operating systems, etc.
The whole thing is controlled by the BIOS. Intel chips from Sandy Bridge on (maybe earlier, too, I don't know?) are designed to throttle down at a certain temperature (usually either 95 or 97 degrees) and shut down at higher temps (100 or 105 degrees). There are hacked BIOSes available for the T420 with an advanced setting menu that allow you to change these thresholds. I've never seen fit to mess with them myself. In general they're not accessible settings because they're based on Intel's research and are CPU specific.
I knew Intel had something to monitor the temperature, and if it was too hot at startup it would shut down. But I still think it'd be nice to have a features in Windows (perhaps in the task manager) that allows you to see your CPU temperature.

CPU-Z doesn't have a temperature read-out on my T42, so I'm guessing that the Pentium M (Dothan) didn't have the ability to monitor its internal core temp, or at least it doesn't allow CPU-Z to access it.
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Re: T420 Running Hot?

#28 Post by RealBlackStuff » Mon Mar 05, 2018 8:42 am

TPFan should do it on your T42.

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Re: T420 Running Hot?

#29 Post by shawross » Mon Mar 05, 2018 7:02 pm

CoreTemp is the best program that I have found for monitoring Temperature and other status. It can be minimized to the taskbar and is very light.

For noisy fans then TPFan is useful.
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Re: T420 Running Hot?

#30 Post by Thinkpad4by3 » Mon Mar 05, 2018 7:24 pm

+1 for CoreTemp.
"Its not what screen ratio you have, it is what you do with it." -me

Now stop complaining and get back to work with your "wrongly configured" box of pixels.

-Thinkpad4by3, or 3:2, or 16:10, or 16:9, or 21:9.....or whatever.

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