Keyboard Compatibility Chart

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rxblitzrx · #1 Post by **rxblitzrx** » Sat Aug 30, 2008 2:54 pm

I figure we can start a thread to show which keyboards will fit the T400 / T500. This is what I've seen so far:

T60 NMB

T61 NMB ??? (can someone confirm?)

Post more.

wswartzendruber · #2 Post by **wswartzendruber** » Sat Aug 30, 2008 6:33 pm

I believe all T60 keyboards will fit (includes Chicony and ALPS).

Here are the part numbers for the three T60 keyboards:

39T7118 - ALPS
39T7178 - Chicony
39T0958 - NMB

And the same for the T61:

42T3209 - ALPS
42T3273 - Chicony
42T3143 - NMB

These are for U.S. English only, and may be order from IBM's maintenance parts ordering page. Note that the T60 parts do not seem to be listed anymore. For more part numbers, consult the T61/R61 Hardware Maintenance Manual. There you can also find keyboards for other languages; all keyboard part numbers are listed on PDF page 226 of the June 2008 edition.

The NMB models are regarded as having the highest quality, but are also the most rare.

EDIT: Added T61 part numbers.
EDIT: Added link for IBM retail parts order and T61/R61 Hardware Maintenance Manual.

NathanA · #3 Post by **NathanA** » Sat Aug 30, 2008 10:53 pm

Again, all T/R/Z6x and T/R4xx/5xx keyboards are all interchangeable with each other; see here. The T60 keyboard is the same as the R60 keyboard is the same as the Z60/61 keyboard (right down to the FRU number), and the T61 keyboard is the same as the R61 keyboard (again, exact same FRU...compare the T61 maintenance manual to the R61...it lists the same part number), and a T60 keyboard can be installed in a Z61 and an R61 keyboard can be installed in a T60 and a T500 keyboard can be installed in an R61, or whatever combination you can dream up.

They are all basically the same model. The only differences I can find are that the T and R 61's keyboard has a slightly different Windows Logo key than before (has a faint circle around the logo), and then of course the T and R 400/500 keyboards apparently have less metal on the bottom in order to reduce weight and bulk (to the detriment of stability, according to those who have had a chance to use one). And then, naturally within each variant there are three different manufacturers making each model (Alps, Chicony, NMB), so there are three part numbers each for each "generation" for a total of 9 parts (3 for T/R/Z60&Z61, 3 for T/R61, and 3 for T/R400/500), and on top of that sometimes the FRU number changes within each "generation" to account for minor changes (what the differences are between FRUs in the same "generation" is only known to Lenovo).

All part numbers are available within the Hardware Maintenance Manuals for each line/generation of ThinkPad computers.

All of the mounting screw holes in all of the above keyboards are all in the same spots, and the connector on the end of the ribbon cable is the same on all of them.

I will ask again since no one has really answered my question, but is there a reason why everyone is so fixated on getting the T/R60 keyboards as replacements for their T/R400/500 instead of a T/R61 keyboard? Is there something better about the T60 NMB than the T61 NMB? I'm pretty sure not, and I'd be willing to wager that the T61 NMB is easier to find!! (Could be wrong on that last point, though.)

-- Nathan

wswartzendruber · #4 Post by **wswartzendruber** » Sat Aug 30, 2008 11:09 pm

NathanA wrote:Again, all T/R/Z6x and T/R4xx/5xx keyboards are all interchangeable with each other; see here. The T60 keyboard is the same as the R60 keyboard is the same as the Z60/61 keyboard (right down to the FRU number), and the T61 keyboard is the same as the R61 keyboard (again, exact same FRU...compare the T61 maintenance manual to the R61...it lists the same part number), and a T60 keyboard can be installed in a Z61 and an R61 keyboard can be installed in a T60 and a T500 keyboard can be installed in an R61, or whatever combination you can dream up.

They are all basically the same model. The only differences I can find are that the T and R 61's keyboard has a slightly different Windows Logo key than before (has a faint circle around the logo), and then of course the T and R 400/500 keyboards apparently have less metal on the bottom in order to reduce weight and bulk (to the detriment of stability, according to those who have had a chance to use one). And then, naturally within each variant there are three different manufacturers making each model (Alps, Chicony, NMB), so there are three part numbers each for each "generation" for a total of 9 parts (3 for T/R/Z60&Z61, 3 for T/R61, and 3 for T/R400/500), and on top of that sometimes the FRU number changes within each "generation" to account for minor changes (what the differences are between FRUs in the same "generation" is only known to Lenovo).

All part numbers are available within the Hardware Maintenance Manuals for each line/generation of ThinkPad computers.

All of the mounting screw holes in all of the above keyboards are all in the same spots, and the connector on the end of the ribbon cable is the same on all of them.

I will ask again since no one has really answered my question, but is there a reason why everyone is so fixated on getting the T/R60 keyboards as replacements for their T/R400/500 instead of a T/R61 keyboard? Is there something better about the T60 NMB than the T61 NMB? I'm pretty sure not, and I'd be willing to wager that the T61 NMB is easier to find!! (Could be wrong on that last point, though.)

-- Nathan

Not really. The whole T60 think started when Kevin (own6volvos) just happened to have one handy in his own machine.

rxblitzrx · #5 Post by **rxblitzrx** » Sun Aug 31, 2008 9:10 am

Well, I ordered using the part number listed in post 2 for NMB. Most likely the keyboard will get here before my new T400. As long as it's NMB, I don't really mind.

stephenaron · #6 Post by **stephenaron** » Sun Aug 31, 2008 5:53 pm

I ordered a T60 keyboard (like the one on my T60p) for my new coming T400....but i bet its not the coveted NMB keyboard. We shall see.

shaddix · #7 Post by **shaddix** » Sun Aug 31, 2008 7:11 pm

rxblitzrx wrote:Well, I ordered using the part number listed in post 2 for NMB. Most likely the keyboard will get here before my new T400. As long as it's NMB, I don't really mind.

where did you order from? I was looking at upgradebay and there are a bunch of other places but I can't find anyone selling the NMB part number.

rxblitzrx · #8 Post by **rxblitzrx** » Sun Aug 31, 2008 7:51 pm

shaddix wrote:
rxblitzrx wrote:Well, I ordered using the part number listed in post 2 for NMB. Most likely the keyboard will get here before my new T400. As long as it's NMB, I don't really mind.
where did you order from? I was looking at upgradebay and there are a bunch of other places but I can't find anyone selling the NMB part number.

check the second post in this thread. i used that part number on UpgradeBay.com and it came up in stock.

stephenaron · #9 Post by **stephenaron** » Sat Sep 06, 2008 11:01 pm

i ordered the NMB part number from Upgradebay.com and they sent me p/n 42T3109. It appears to be a keyboard that would fit a T61. Will that fit a T400?

wswartzendruber · #10 Post by **wswartzendruber** » Sun Sep 07, 2008 2:28 am

stephenaron wrote:i ordered the NMB part number from Upgradebay.com and they sent me p/n 42T3109. It appears to be a keyboard that would fit a T61. Will that fit a T400?

Yes.

kingweb · #11 Post by **kingweb** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 6:08 pm

Well, I ordered a NMB keyboard from upgradebay.com, and it just arrived. However, they sent me the Chicony version.
My T61 used the Chicony, and I was very pleased with it, and since I never tried the NMB version, I decided to keep the Chicony and not send it back to upgradebay.

But just beware for those of you ordering from upgradebay. They will send you the Chicony instead of the NMB.

Anyway, it is now installed in my T400, and wow, what a difference. I can slam on the keys if I want, and its like a brick wall.

wswartzendruber · #12 Post by **wswartzendruber** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 7:16 pm

kingweb wrote:Well, I ordered a NMB keyboard from upgradebay.com, and it just arrived. However, they sent me the Chicony version.
My T61 used the Chicony, and I was very pleased with it, and since I never tried the NMB version, I decided to keep the Chicony and not send it back to upgradebay.

But just beware for those of you ordering from upgradebay. They will send you the Chicony instead of the NMB.

Anyway, it is now installed in my T400, and wow, what a difference. I can slam on the keys if I want, and its like a brick wall.

Yeah, like I said, the NMBs are VERY hard to come by. It's good to hear about the T61 keyboard. I ordered a T61 NMB straight from IBM (not Lenovo).

rxblitzrx · #13 Post by **rxblitzrx** » Tue Sep 09, 2008 9:30 am

wswartzendruber wrote: Yeah, like I said, the NMBs are VERY hard to come by. It's good to hear about the T61 keyboard. I ordered a T61 NMB straight from IBM (not Lenovo).

Tips on how to get that NMB from IBM?

wswartzendruber · #14 Post by **wswartzendruber** » Tue Sep 09, 2008 10:30 am

rxblitzrx wrote:
wswartzendruber wrote: Yeah, like I said, the NMBs are VERY hard to come by. It's good to hear about the T61 keyboard. I ordered a T61 NMB straight from IBM (not Lenovo).

Tips on how to get that NMB from IBM?

When my keyboard order arrives, I'll let you guys know if it's really an NMB.

EDIT: Added IBM parts ordering link to the second post.

wswartzendruber · #15 Post by **wswartzendruber** » Tue Sep 09, 2008 4:10 pm

1. The keyboard I got from IBM was, in fact, an NMB.
2. This thing is awesome.
3. I'm in love.

kingweb · #16 Post by **kingweb** » Tue Sep 09, 2008 4:27 pm

Just for the hell of it, I opened up my Z61t to see which keyboard it has, and it was the ALPS version. It actually has a a little flex inside the z61t. Truthfully, I always liked my T61's keyboard better which happened to be Chicony.
While I had it open, I couldn't get over how much better built the Z is than the T. Too bad they stopped making them.

wswartzendruber · #17 Post by **wswartzendruber** » Tue Sep 09, 2008 5:10 pm

kingweb wrote:Just for the hell of it, I opened up my Z61t to see which keyboard it has, and it was the ALPS version. It actually has a a little flex inside the z61t. Truthfully, I always liked my T61's keyboard better which happened to be Chicony.
While I had it open, I couldn't get over how much better built the Z is than the T. Too bad they stopped making them.

Say WHAT? Why's the Z better built than the T?

kingweb · #18 Post by **kingweb** » Tue Sep 09, 2008 5:41 pm

Absolutely.
The Z has no flex in the plastic frame around the PC/express card. The Z feels solid like a tank when you hold it. It has a titanium lid instead of the plastic. You hold it in your hand, and it just feels more solid. The 14.1 inch Z is smaller than the 14.1 T. Centered Screen.
Features and functionality wise, they are the same. At least at the time when the Z was a current model, the T had give or take the same feature set. The Z's speakers were afwul though. You could turn up the volume on a set of headsets, and hear better with them lying on the table in front of you.

rxblitzrx · #19 Post by **rxblitzrx** » Wed Sep 10, 2008 2:05 pm

wswartzendruber wrote:
rxblitzrx wrote:
Tips on how to get that NMB from IBM?
When my keyboard order arrives, I'll let you guys know if it's really an NMB.

EDIT: Added IBM parts ordering link to the second post.

Good deal! thanks for the help!

wswartzendruber · #20 Post by **wswartzendruber** » Wed Sep 10, 2008 6:07 pm

rxblitzrx wrote:
wswartzendruber wrote: When my keyboard order arrives, I'll let you guys know if it's really an NMB.

EDIT: Added IBM parts ordering link to the second post.
Good deal! thanks for the help!

Eh, in case you missed it, it really was an NMB, and it really is awesome.

rxblitzrx · #21 Post by **rxblitzrx** » Wed Sep 10, 2008 10:12 pm

yeah, i saw the update. thanks for putting the part numbers up too. i'm in the process of trying to get another NMB for my T400. until then, i have a 8 month old NMB that i've got in it right now. ROCK SOLID BABY

morgandog · #22 Post by **morgandog** » Thu Sep 11, 2008 9:10 am

I've had a thinkpad for most of the last 10 years and I buy them for only 3 reasons, build quality, the trackpoint, and the keyboards. So I was very worried about his issue of keyboard flex.

I have to say that the keyboard on my T400 that just arrived isn't as bad as I thought it would be (but I already have a T61 keyboard here to swap). The flex is really only noticeable in the mid to upper right side (the delete key seems particularly bad). I'll still try the T61 keyboard, but if I never get around to popping it in, I won't be terribly dissapointed.

wswartzendruber · #23 Post by **wswartzendruber** » Thu Sep 11, 2008 11:23 am

Hmmm... Everybody's flex issues seem to be on the right side while mine or on the left.

Hey, do your keyboards bow up when you screw down the left side of the palmrest?

#24 Post by **underclocker** » Thu Sep 11, 2008 12:42 pm

Has anyone weighed the keyboards? How many grams were saved that caused this mess?

I can tell you that a 39T7118 - ALPS from a T60 weighs 160 grams or 5.6 oz.

tylerwylie · #25 Post by **tylerwylie** » Sat Sep 27, 2008 1:05 am

I'm thinking about grabbing this for my T61, the NMB one. Also thinking about moving from my Intel wireless card to an Atheros one. Decisions decisions...

dr_st · #26 Post by **dr_st** » Sat Sep 27, 2008 3:42 am

kingweb wrote:While I had it open, I couldn't get over how much better built the Z is than the T. Too bad they stopped making them.

I agree. The Z61t remains Lenovo's best 14.1" widescreen laptop to date, in terms of design and looks. It is so much smaller and lighter than the similar sized T61, that it is just amazing. You cannot help but wondering whether it is that good or just the T is that bad.

The T61 and subsequent T models beat the Z61t in terms of overall toughness, due to the continued development of the chassis and internal rollcages, but none of them feel as comfy and impressive as the Z61t.

And to think that the predecessor, Z60t, was considered an "almost-flop" in terms of chassis rigidity.

Suprisingly to some, the one thing I totally dislike on the Z is the Titanium lid. While it supposedly makes it stronger, I'd rather have the black over the silver every day.

Who knows, maybe one of these days (months/years) I will find my dream Z61t for cheap and add it to my collection of design masterpieces.

reforminded · #27 Post by **reforminded** » Sat Sep 27, 2008 3:05 pm

dr_st wrote:
And to think that the predecessor, Z60t, was considered an "almost-flop" in terms of chassis rigidity.

Suprisingly to some, the one thing I totally dislike on the Z is the Titanium lid. While it supposedly makes it stronger, I'd rather have the black over the silver every day.

Who knows, maybe one of these days (months/years) I will find my dream Z61t for cheap and add it to my collection of design masterpieces.

I find it very funny that you feel that way considering that I consider my z60 to be one of the stiffest chassis' I have ever encountered on a notebook and I absolutely love the titanium cover (which side by side is noticably stiffer than the black plastic). When I was ordering my t400 I found myself wishing they still offered a titanium lid.

dr_st · #28 Post by **dr_st** » Sat Sep 27, 2008 3:27 pm

reforminded wrote:I find it very funny that you feel that way considering that I consider my z60 to be one of the stiffest chassis' I have ever encountered on a notebook and I absolutely love the titanium cover (which side by side is noticably stiffer than the black plastic). When I was ordering my t400 I found myself wishing they still offered a titanium lid.

The general nature of complaints on the Z60t was not that they are flawed by design, but rather that there was an unusually high number of "lemons" - people complaining about flex here, flex there, lid does not sit plush, etc. Chassis-wise the Z60 and the Z61 are the same, as far as I know, so it's possibly the case that it just took some time to perfect the process.

Also, you have a Z60m, as it seems from your signature. I was specifically talking about the Z60t, which is a very different laptop.

My dislike of the titanium lid is from a pure style standpoint, no one denies that it makes the screen stronger.

We're going a tad off-topic here, though.

pointfielder · #29 Post by **pointfielder** » Tue Sep 30, 2008 12:29 pm

Will a T60/T61 NMB keyboard fit the W500 ?

wswartzendruber · #30 Post by **wswartzendruber** » Tue Sep 30, 2008 7:29 pm

pointfielder wrote:Will a T60/T61 NMB keyboard fit the W500 ?

I'd be willing to bet it will. In fact, I'd be willing to put a Benjamin Franklin on it.

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