Thinkpads Forum

I have been debating about a laptop for law school. I am used to dell but the new latitude's just don't seem so good. Macbook is ideal for all I am looking for except price. With the educational discount, I can get the t400 starting at $599. I question how "thinkpad" like the keyboard is due to the reviews, even with the updated bracing. I also do not like that it is plastic, like my old dell inspiron 8000, and has flex around the palm rests. But my old inspiron was just fine, so I imagine the t400 will be good too. I understand the t400s will be coming out, but it will likely be far more than the $599 starting price for this model. Can anyone comment on the value and investment of the t400 for light gaming, lots of word processing, internet usage for the next three years? (I am sure the comments will be very positive, but I am just not sure if I should wait to see what comes out in the next few months - of course then I will likely not be able to get as good a system for this price!

ohioan wrote:I have been debating about a laptop for law school. I am used to dell but the new latitude's just don't seem so good. Macbook is ideal for all I am looking for except price. With the educational discount, I can get the t400 starting at $599. I question how "thinkpad" like the keyboard is due to the reviews, even with the updated bracing. I also do not like that it is plastic, like my old dell inspiron 8000, and has flex around the palm rests. But my old inspiron was just fine, so I imagine the t400 will be good too. I understand the t400s will be coming out, but it will likely be far more than the $599 starting price for this model. Can anyone comment on the value and investment of the t400 for light gaming, lots of word processing, internet usage for the next three years? (I am sure the comments will be very positive, but I am just not sure if I should wait to see what comes out in the next few months - of course then I will likely not be able to get as good a system for this price!

I have MacBooks, MacBook Pro's, the latest MacBook Pro (1 week old) , and lots of ThinkPads. I've been customers of both brands for years..... bottom line? You cannot go wrong with the T400 at the current super low prices. And that's not because it's not a great computer it's simply because Lenovo is being smart and pricing very competitively in a bad economy. Apple (until this latest price reduction) has always been stubborn and held out for maximum profit per machine. It's just one of the reasons they only have a small sliver market share. Save your eyes and buy the ThinkPad. The glossy displays on the current Apple laptops are nearly useless and very hard on your eyes, from massive reflection. If you buy a T400 it will do everything you want and more, and you will find it's really high quality with better overall functionality than the mac. I've used ThinkPads for my mission critical daily work for over a decade and never had one let me down or develop problems of any significance. Hard to beat a record like that. Macs are for play and light work, ThinkPads will get it all done.

Cheers...

I was concentrating on the t400 because of the weight, size, and price. The laptops I had been thinking about are the hp dv3510nr (BestBuy blue label) and Macbook, in addition to this one. All weighing under 5lbs. Are there any thinkpads that I should consider other than the t400?

ohioan wrote:I was concentrating on the t400 because of the weight, size, and price. The laptops I had been thinking about are the hp dv3510nr (BestBuy blue label) and Macbook, in addition to this one. All weighing under 5lbs. Are there any thinkpads that I should consider other than the t400?

For the purpose you outlined, the T400 will serve you very well. With current pricing being as low as it is, you are getting a tremendous amount of value and a computer of very high quality. One that will last you for years. It is far and away the best choice as I see it.

Cheers...

I've played some older games on my T400 such as Ghost Recon and Rainbow Six 3, and they run VERY well. I have a discrete GPU.

When buying an Apple computer, understand you are paying a hefty premium for OS X and Apple design. Is it worth it? I think so, but many don't. But you can't go wrong with a T400 for what you are looking for in a computer and if you want to save money.

I felt a little silly asking the question because I knew that this is really a no brainer. I was not sure if the t400 was the best of all thinkpads for me, but clearly it is given my criteria.

Now the only question left is what upgrades to make.
I am trying to find out if windows xp pro will utilize the full 3 or 4 gb of ddr3 if I upgrade it.

I think a 160gb hard drive is sufficient, but to keep cost down, I was not planning to upgrade that.

Lenovo changed the price overnight so that the led is now an additional charge, but I think that is a necessary upgrade for me. However, since I don't plan to use it outside nor do I need a webcam, I was just going for the simple LED upgrade.

Any suggestions on what kind of warranty I should get?

As for the wifi, I was going to upgrade to the 5300 as I hear it is significantly better than the 5100.

Since I do not do heavy gaming, and will only be watching a lecture or webinar at most, I do not think I need to upgrade to the discrete graphics.

I was not going to upgrade the battery, rather was going to order the optical drive battery module. This way, with the 4 cell and the module, I should get close to 8 hours of battery usage if necessary without adding as much weight from the 6 or 9 cell.

Lastly, I was not going to upgrade to the media card reader because it seems the blank card to fill the empty express card slot allows flex. Without the card reader, there is apparently less flex....does anyone know if this is true.

You have all been very helpful, and after this round of discussion on the upgrades, I will be ready to order my system. Please feel free to correct any of my misunderstandings and make any recommendations you can.

I think XP Pro can only take advantage of about 3-3.5GB of RAM or so. I'm sure you can do a search here for more accurate opinions.

ohioan wrote:I felt a little silly asking the question because I knew that this is really a no brainer. I was not sure if the t400 was the best of all thinkpads for me, but clearly it is given my criteria.

Now the only question left is what upgrades to make.
I am trying to find out if windows xp pro will utilize the full 3 or 4 gb of ddr3 if I upgrade it.

I think a 160gb hard drive is sufficient, but to keep cost down, I was not planning to upgrade that.

I have chosen to upgrade my thinkpad myself, it is fairly easy and is outlined in the manual. The price for a nice 320 gb 7200 rpm HDD and 4 gb of ddr3 ram was the same as the price of upgrading the ram to 4 gb. A bonus is that the warranty will not be broken, so if you are a bit adventurous, then I will recomend that you upgrade it yourself. Here is a video so you can see what it takes to install the ram, which is the hardest to do: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DC7E1TcdETE

ohioan wrote: Lenovo changed the price overnight so that the led is now an additional charge, but I think that is a necessary upgrade for me. However, since I don't plan to use it outside nor do I need a webcam, I was just going for the simple LED upgrade.

The LED back light is used to get a better battery life, It is not an upgrade you will be able to notice in day to day life, but that is my opinion from seeing the difference.

ohioan wrote: Any suggestions on what kind of warranty I should get?

I just went with the normal 3 year warranty, but this really depends on how valuable your laptop is, and how much money you are willing to use to keep it going.

ohioan wrote: As for the wifi, I was going to upgrade to the 5300 as I hear it is significantly better than the 5100.

It is an okay upgrade, but it isn't that noticeable, my old laptop with 5100 never stutters when I use it on the wifi hotspots. 5100 is also designed to handle 50 mb/s

Hey man,

I am going off to law school this fall myself, and have been shopping around for the past couple months. Here is my experience:

I have had a Thinkpad T41 for the past 5 years and it is rock solid. I have loved this machine. Like you though, I was concerned about the keyboard problems I heard about with the T400/500, and started looking elsewhere.

I discovered that if I purchased my law school's "recommended laptop" (a dell latitude) the on-campus IT support people were trained and authorized to do warranty repairs on-site. This, got me very interested in getting a latitude, but I just kept hearing problematic things about the new latitudes that got me discouraged. I visited with a first year law student last week and he said no one at my school really goes out of there way to purchase the recommended laptop and that I was better off just getting whatever I thought was best for me and within my budget.

With that said, I looked around some more and decided that my experience was just too good with the Thinkpad to pass up. When I had a problem (rare), the support was outstanding. Most importantly of all though, I found out that in late June the new "Thinkpad T400s" (s=slim) is coming out. This laptop is already getting stellar review, and comes with some pretty impressive specs. For more info, just google "Thinkpad t400s." You can also look at some of the posts in the T400s thread. Most importantly of all though, it has a completely redesigned keyboard, and returns to the solid plate backing of the older model (=no flexing).

As of today, it is expected that the T400s will be available in America next Tuesday (June 23rd). You can already find it on the lenovo website for some Southeast Asian countries like Singapore.

Lenovo has already confirmed that the Windows 7 upgrade option will start June 26 (free upgrade from Vista when Windows 7 comes out in October), so I am going to wait the extra three days for the free Windows 7 upgrade.

Hope this helps. Good luck in 1L! Where are you going to law school?

I saw the info on the t400s too, but I would bet that it will be well above the $700 price of the t400 I am thinking about after all the upgrades are done. It'll take some time for the reviews of it to post too, and I wanted to finalize my laptop before the end of the month.

I have used mostly dell, and I thought they were adequate, but the reports on the new latitudes have just been awful. It's not worth the risk to me (eventhough you can return it at no charge and get full refund, unlike lenovo)

I am debating between schools, Chicago-kent or Cincinnati.

Cheers

Very true on the price. My guess is that, with a 3 year warranty, you are look at roughly $2k for the T400s. Although, with all the upgrades I would have got for the T400 to make it a comparable machine, I personally would have been in that ballpark anyway.

Good call on the academic discount, I should look into that...

While exact pricing for US T400s models has yet to be released, I will take an educated guess based on past history and say that the difference between comparably equipped T400 and T400s models, will place the "S" about $800 to $1,000 more, at a bare minimum.

Cheers...

archer6 wrote:While exact pricing for US T400s models has yet to be released, I will take an educated guess based on past history and say that the difference between comparably equipped T400 and T400s models, will place the "S" about $800 to $1,000 more, at a bare minimum.

Cheers...

Ouch. Had two T400's ordered about 10 days ago now I see the 400s and almost wish I waited. (interesting keyboard changes) Didn't realize the price bump was going to be that much. (got some pretty beefy 400's though, excited to see how the SSD's help)

I stopped by my local microcenter store today which I know had the t400 previously. Today they did not and they said that it has been discontinued and they are not getting more in. I thought this was strange as I would not have thought Lenovo is stopping production on the t400, but if the store is not going to carry it, then I think they will likely ge the 400s. What I am wondering is how low lenovo will sell the t400 before discontinuing it from the website. Any thoughts?

This microcenter had two models, the r500 and the w500. The keyboard on the w500 had significant flex while on the r500 it was solid. I actually like typing on my dell keyboard better than the lenovo, but I just don't think I can risk going with the dell when the new latitudes are known to have problems. So, depending on the price of the new 400s, I think I am either going to order it or the t400.

FWIW, I just got a new T400 Monday, and I couldn't possibly love it more, and I don't regret for a moment not waiting for the T400s. I tend to think a lot of the excitement is more due to newness than actual improvement.

As for flex, I can find none anywhere - it's just as solid and well-put together as my T23 (whose keyboard is very squishy) and T41P, except a little lift/give under the keyboard's left letters. Lenovo took care of that overnight, after I mentioned it in passing to tech support (I had only called because I screwed up my R & R disks, which they also took care of overnight.)

Like others here, I've been blown away with Lenovo's service on that and a very minor question about my warranty. I got calls from them 4 days in a row, just to confirm these things and make sure all was well.

In comparison, I also have an Optima (business line) Dell tower, and Dell's service cannot compare to Lenovo, IMO.

As for the configuration:

I chose to go with Vista Business 64, which I *love*. (You can always go back to XP if you don't - they offer the restore disks to be in XPpro when you select Vista Business.)

I got the CCFL display, which is both richly vivid in color, and bright enough that I seldom use the higher setting. I've read several people say the lifetime and battery savings of LCD is negligible.

I got the Express Card Slot & 7-1 Media Card Reader, and I find no flexing over it... (I just re-checked, and guess if I cram down on it right there, it gives a little, but who does that? I guess a lot of people do, looking for 'problems".)

I went with the 5300 wifi, as I saw quite a few people with glitchy 5100s. And I got 2GB ram in one stick, adding a 2GB crucial stick I got from Newegg. I agree with the others about getting another disk yourself.

I would recommend that you do some research before you choose the optical-drive battery... my understanding is that they don't get you as much as regular batteries do, and have other disadvantages related to the fact that they are drained first.

I also got a 2 year warranty with accident protection, just for peace of mind.

In sum, I say go for it! I don't think one can find a better deal right now, and it'll be a long time before the T400s are as reasonably priced, where you'll get as much bang for your buck. I expect you'll pay a premium for the T400s newness factor... and you won't have the advantage of seeing how they hold up after a year of being out.

DeAnna wrote:FWIW, I just got a new T400 Monday, and I couldn't possibly love it more, and I don't regret for a moment not waiting for the T400s. I tend to think a lot of the excitement is more due to newness than actual improvement.

That's great to hear DeAnna. Yeah, the newness then that feeling when you buy then find out the next thing is coming soon. I like some of the changes that I've read about, but not enough to pay a premium price.

DeAnna wrote:FWIW, I just got a new T400 Monday, and I couldn't possibly love it more, and I don't regret for a moment not waiting for the T400s. I tend to think a lot of the excitement is more due to newness than actual improvement.

As for flex, I can find none anywhere - it's just as solid and well-put together as my T23 (whose keyboard is very squishy) and T41P, except a little lift/give under the keyboard's left letters. Lenovo took care of that overnight, after I mentioned it in passing to tech support (I had only called because I screwed up my R & R disks, which they also took care of overnight.)

i'm a little confused by your post. You said that the keyboard is like your t23 and that the t23 is very squishy...so are you saying that the t400 keyboard feels squishy to you? or were you not referencing the t400 keyboard at all, only making a comparison of the chasis flex (or lack thereof) between the two?

ohioan wrote:i'm a little confused by your post. You said that the keyboard is like your t23 and that the t23 is very squishy...so are you saying that the t400 keyboard feels squishy to you? or were you not referencing the t400 keyboard at all, only making a comparison of the chasis flex (or lack thereof) between the two?

I'm sorry.. I was referencing the overall solidity and workmanship of the T23 vs the T400 in terms of things like flexing palm rests, hinges, lid, etc... i.e., My T400 is every bit as well-built and solid a package as the T23 (and my T41p) overall.

In terms of the keyboard, my T23's keyboard was quite squishy, and that was a machine built in what some seem to think were the glory days of IBM. My T41p is like typing on a brick, and the T400 had a little softness on the left.

It's notable that I merely mentioned that to Lenovo (at the end of the SOS call about the rescue disks I screwed up, when he asked if everything else was fine), and they surprised me with a call the next day to ask about it... and even though I told them it wasn't anything really bothersome, they sent me a T6x keyboard overnight. It was a breeze to install, and the only flex now is if i jam down on it like an ape.

I honestly can't say enough about the quality of my T400 or the Lenovo service. I'm going to try though, because in the weeks prior to my purchase, I was stressed-out with misgivings by the FUD posts I read, and I'd like to add a little balance to the phenomenon of happy customers remaining silent while unhappy ones complain loudly.

idxman01 wrote: That's great to hear DeAnna. Yeah, the newness then that feeling when you buy then find out the next thing is coming soon. I like some of the changes that I've read about, but not enough to pay a premium price.

Exactly. : )

DeAnna,

Please do keep us posted. I would definitely like to know what you think. I have never owned a thinkpad, as I was satisfied with Dell. But now, the only Dell laptop I have any interest in is a vostro, and I think the t400 is a much better option. I still don't know about the t400 vs. t400s - that will depend on price. There is a very nice video on Lenovo's website about the t400s. It will have a very good led screen wxga+ i think. However, unless the price is "reasonable" for me, I will be getting a t400. I hope they send me the t6x keyboard too!

NEW LAPTOP TODAY!

I'm so excited, I just ordered a Thinkpad T400s.

Specs: 2.53 GHz, 6 GB Ram, 128 GB SSD, DVD-RW, Vista Business 64 (w/ Win 7 Pro upgrade, Bluetooth, 5 in 1 card reader, 2.0 mp camera, 4 year warranty, LoJack

Ship expected July 7th.

It cost me an arm and a leg, but I think it will be worth it for law school. YAY!