Thinkpads Forum

I have to admit that I hate hearing about all the new awesome hardware coming out, as it gives me the upgrade bug really badly. So, here goes:

I've been considering selling my first-born(or just saving up like a madman and all that fun stuff) just to swing a W520. I currently have the machines I've listed in my sig. My usage profile is about 40% Internet and office apps, 25% 3D modeling apps(I've started using Poser on a hobby basis, but I may want to move up to more complex programs later on), and 35% gaming(mostly titles that are a few years old: Source games, Far Cry 2, Oblivion, MW1 and 2, etc, but I would love more graphics horsepower). I use my X200 when I'm out and about, but the vast majority of my home computing is done on my T500. Try as I might, I really enjoy having a high-res screen.

I've specced out a W520 that would make me happy for about $2300, though that's not including any docking hardware that I would need, so more like $2600-2700 after taxes and a dock. Nothing I do is incredibly CPU-intensive, so I'm wondering what I might be able to get away with on my T500.

What's drawing me to the T500(other than price) is the 16:10 aspect ratio. I could live with FHD, but putting a WUXGA panel in the T500 and having 120 more vertical pixels is pretty tempting, too. It also looks like an external Vidock solution might put the T500 fairly close to the W520 as far as graphics go. Not the most portable solution in the world but I use my T500 at home about 80% of the time, anyway. The internal HD3650 still has some punch to it, but I'm not sure how happy I'd be with it trying to run stuff like Metro 2033 and Crysis 2. I'd say with the WUXGA screen upgrade($100 or so?), Vidock($500), 8GB of RAM($80), and possibly bumping the CPU to a T9900($300?) I'm into it far less than a new W520.

Even if I'm buying new I'd prefer to stick to the ThinkPad brand. I do like to game a bit, but I'd rather make some sacrifices in performance to get something with a great keyboard(I type quite a bit), a Trackpoint(I don't like touchpads at all), and better durability than a typical consumer line notebook. Any opinions and advice would definitely be appreciated, as I'll admit I'm leaning more toward keeping the T500 going for a bit longer if at all possible.

I'd say if you need the processing power of the quad core, the W520 is the way to go. If not, then the T500 probably offers better value. That's my humble opinion anyway.

I have a T500 and I love it! Its my baby! But sometimes I wish I had gotten a W500 instead. You know, games...
To be fair, I got the T500 off ebay, for $599 with 3 year Lenovo warranty. A W500 would be around $800 or so a lot less than a W520.
If price is your concern, look at a W500 which has a more powerful GPU than the T500, not as expensive as a W520 and is in all other ways identical to the T500.
You can get a very good deal if you look carefully for one.
Good luck!

You can always overclock the HD3650

ARD wrote:I have a T500 and I love it! Its my baby! But sometimes I wish I had gotten a W500 instead. You know, games...
To be fair, I got the T500 off ebay, for $599 with 3 year Lenovo warranty. A W500 would be around $800 or so a lot less than a W520.
If price is your concern, look at a W500 which has a more powerful GPU than the T500, not as expensive as a W520 and is in all other ways identical to the T500.
You can get a very good deal if you look carefully for one.
Good luck!

Hm... I thought the FireGL V5700 in the W500 was pretty much identical to the T500's HD3650, except that the V5700 had 512MB of VRAM versus the 3650's 256MB? While it is a static benchmark both cards score about the same via 3DMark06, with a slight edge going to the HD3650. Is your experience different? I can see where the extra VRAM would help in some situations and where the pro drivers would help my 3D apps, but as I do more gaming than I'm using those(and my hobby isn't going to be my bread and butter anytime soon; I'm pretty much a complete novice at this point).

I really do like my T500 for a myriad of reasons.Being able to stuff up to 1.5TB of storage into a notebook is a really good thing, and this machine has pretty decent expansion ports and an integrated DisplayPort output for hooking up to my TV. The only things I'd really like to be able to do that it can't would be to play more demanding titles without scratching my head and wondering if I can get 'such and such' to even run and to get a higher-res screen for more efficient document work(which is possible as WUXGA panels are available). Taking into account I only paid $500 for these specs six months ago it's been a pretty good value for me.

Colonel, what sorts of utilities are you using to overclock your HD3470? I know a direct comparison between the 3470 and the 3650 are apples and oranges, but did overclocking provide a significant difference? I admittedly take back what I was talking about as far as non-native res gaming; I had no idea I was playing Far Cry 2 fairly enjoyably on mostly high(DX9) settings at 1440x900. Somehow a config file got shipped over when I was using Win7's easy transfer utility to copy all my docs from my old T400. I'd be happy if I can play some of the newer titles like Crysis 2(should be possible considering your experiences), Metro 2033, the upcoming Deus Ex title, Black Ops, and DNF on the 3650 without it choking.

The only tool I found worked was GPUTool: http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.php?f=45&t=94162
The 11.4 drivers are supposed to get better performance, so that's probably also a good idea. OC'ing isn't perfect due to the fluctuating voltage, but things are okay. I get 9.2 FPS in the GPUTool render on 11.4 instead of whatever was in the screenshot with 11.1a.

Overclocking helped with certain games more so than others, but performance boosts all around. Some games should have fan spun up to 64 to cope with the extra heat and prevent throttling. Undervolting the CPU helps too.

Heh. Crysis 2 was okay; got way too linear way too quickly.

I imagine any overclocking would need a change of thermal grease + external cooling system, as my T500 is already way too hot without overclocking (even with CPU undervolting) - the plastic between both speakers (under the display) seems to be bending already, not to mention the use of an external keyboard+mouse as the keyboard is too hot to use as well.

How hot does HWMonitor report your HD3650 under load? The HD3470 maxes out around 63C before overclocking and around 71C after, both of which are okay. I did indeed replace my thermal paste with MX-2 and do have my fan cranked up to 4500RPM when I overclock.

The HD3650 does get kinda toasty under pretty intense gaming, though for the most part it stays well-behaved. Highest reported temp I had was 87C whilst playing MW2 for an extended period of time with the T500 sitting flat on my desk. I purchased a cheapo notebook cooler after that. I've never had a problem with actual physical heat emissions from this system, although yes there are benefits from re-pasting the CPU/GPU. I may wait to do that until after I decide if a CPU upgrade is worth it or not.

At 87C, it's cutting it a bit close for overclocking. Probably want to swap out the thermal paste for something better like AS-5 or MX-3. Jamming the (not dust-clogged) fan up to max should help too.