Thinkpads Forum

Has anyone had any real experience with both T410 and L412? My sister is contemplating and it's hard to justify the extra T-series features when the L is so much cheaper - for the same price as a "stripper" T410i, you can get an L412 with Core-i5, three-year warranty, and 1366xwhatever screen, versus the T410 with Core-i3, 1280x768 screen, and one-year warranty. This seems like a superb deal to me, assuming the L-series runs in the same vein as did the R-series; as I recall, there was never any real agreement as to whether the R's were really all that much worse than the T's.

So does anyone have experience with both, or at least with the L? Is the T worth the extra ~$3-400 (if you factor in upgrades) for basically a rollcage? I'd like to hear especially from those with experience with the L-series, but of course all opinions are welcome...

I've not seen the L series. I think, just from what I've read, it's closer to the SL than the old R series. You could probably take the extra $300-400 the T costs and buy accidental coverage, which the T wouldn't have. Then perhaps you wouldn't need the better quality of the T series. You're not necessarily stuck with a L or T. There's R series still left in the outlet and on eBay if you're inclined to got that way.

The only differences I can see between the L and SL are matte screens and docking station connector. Other than that, it's the same low-end laptop, with the same bulky design, cheaper/heavier materials, plastic hinges, 6-row inferior-layout keyboard and even budget components such as Realtek LAN instead of Intel/Broadcom.

Nothing in common between the L and the R series, which was really very close to the T (probably why eventually got the axe - not enough differentiation).

That's not to say L-series are bad machines in their own niche. The docking connector is a nice touch, and is what the original SL models lacked. But it's no more "true" Thinkpad than the SL.

Has anyone actually used one, though?

I suppose the point here is moot - she bought the T. But I'd still be quite torn. The quality of the L may be an unknown quantity, but the three-year warranty was included. Thereby assured of at least three years of service, the higher-res screen, the i5 processor, and the rest of the kit were warming me towards the L.

j-dawg wrote:Has anyone had any real experience with both T410 and L412? My sister is contemplating and it's hard to justify the extra T-series features when the L is so much cheaper - for the same price as a "stripper" T410i, you can get an L412 with Core-i5, three-year warranty, and 1366xwhatever screen, versus the T410 with Core-i3, 1280x768 screen, and one-year warranty. This seems like a superb deal to me, assuming the L-series runs in the same vein as did the R-series; as I recall, there was never any real agreement as to whether the R's were really all that much worse than the T's.

So does anyone have experience with both, or at least with the L? Is the T worth the extra ~$3-400 (if you factor in upgrades) for basically a rollcage? I'd like to hear especially from those with experience with the L-series, but of course all opinions are welcome...

I have posted a short review of the L412: http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.php?f=46&t=89809.

I was hesitating between the L412 and the T410i. Because I don't need the rollcage, I have concluded that investing in the L412 would be wiser. Core i3 was enough as well, because I don't need the turbo boost. It runs really cool. After getting a Macbook, I wasn't so attracted by the thickness criteria, which means producing more heat in a smaller volume. Heat is the enemy of electronics. Size and weight of T/L series are overall in the same league. What you will miss is the thinklight, the latch, the rollcage.

By removing one panel on the back, you can easily upgrade the computer, for example changing the memory (2 slots), the HDD/SSD, the heat-pipe, the CPU mounted on the socket. There are two others small panels. I thought that the ultrabay was gone, but no it's still there too. Several ports around, including the port for docking station. The keyboard has less flex than the one on my R51 (which was already really good).

Just let me precise your post, screen resolutions are different. Basic native resolution of the L412 is 1366*768 (16/9 ratio), the one of the T410 is 1280*800 (16/10 ratio), that can be changed to 1440*900. Both are matte.

dr_st wrote:The only differences I can see between the L and SL are matte screens and docking station connector. Other than that, it's the same low-end laptop, with the same bulky design, cheaper/heavier materials, plastic hinges, 6-row inferior-layout keyboard and even budget components such as Realtek LAN instead of Intel/Broadcom.

Plastic hinges: no.
6-row inferior-layout keyboard: 6 keys are missing, not an entire row. The T-serie's keyboard is 6.3-row. Not a big deal, but could be for some people using a lot the missing keys.
Realtek LAN instead of Intel/Broadcom: no; I have the Intel Centrino Advanced-N 6200 AGN.

Danoc, I agree fully. I received my L412 last week and am quite pleased with it. I am having trouble adjusting to the new trackpad and the lack of a thinklight. Went with the i3 also and for the same reasons. I don't know if I under stand the phrase "not a true Thinkpad"? I'm not looking for an argument but can someone clarify this statement for me?

kge420 wrote:Danoc, I agree fully. I received my L412 last week and am quite pleased with it. I am having trouble adjusting to the new trackpad and the lack of a thinklight.

I was very annoyed by settings of the trackpad by default. Fortunately almost everything can be customized with the UltraNav drivers. Under Windows 7, go to Control Panel > Hardware & Sound > Mouse > UltraNav Tab > Settings and here you will find all the properties.

Just have to say that the two-finger scrolling isn't really well managed yet.

The L-series is about what you'd expect from a normal laptop. It's a fine line in that regard.

Just don't expect any of the features that earned ThinkPads their fame.

Danoc wrote:I was hesitating between the L412 and the T410i. Because I don't need the rollcage, I have concluded that investing in the L412 would be wiser.

Nobody "needs" the rollcage. It's a durability feature that one either wants to pay for or doesn't.

Danoc wrote:Plastic hinges: no.

You are right, apparently I was mistaken here. So (S)L series still have metal hinges.

Danoc wrote:6-row inferior-layout keyboard: 6 keys are missing, not an entire row. The T-serie's keyboard is 6.3-row. Not a big deal, but could be for some people using a lot the missing keys.

The Thinkpad keyboard layout is considered a classic. To many deviation from it makes a laptop no longer worth the Thinkpad name. Although I find such interpretation a bit extreme, I am one of the people that does appreciate the standard layout, and is one of the reasons why Thinkpads are my first choice among laptops, and why (S)L series cannot be in the same category as T/W/X for me.

Danoc wrote:Realtek LAN instead of Intel/Broadcom: no; I have the Intel Centrino Advanced-N 6200 AGN.

I was referring to wired LAN, not WiFi. (S)L have Realtek.

Danoc, I use this on my T40 and it works great. Tried it on my L412 and it is equally as great.
Running Win 7 btw.
http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.ph ... 5&start=90

Except for the layout is the keyboard construction very close to or the same at the T series?

TrailRunner wrote:Except for the layout is the keyboard construction very close to or the same at the T series?

IMO, nothing beats the ThinkPad kybd, no one even comes close. That is one reason I stick to ThinkPad. Just my 2¢

alofano wrote:IMO, nothing beats the ThinkPad kybd, no one even comes close. That is one reason I stick to ThinkPad. Just my 2¢

But how does the Thinkpad L/SL series keyboard compare with the Thinkpad T series keyboard?