Thinkpads Forum

I want to buy another thinkpad besides mine t60. Trying to decide if to stay with t series or buy a W series.
I need reliable machine for at least 3 years that will be also an upgrade from my t60.
Also, does t510/w510 are by far better then t500/w500? I know that they use Intel i series but what about other specs? Main things that matter are speed, screen and realibility.
Thank you for helping.

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T500 and W500 are basically the same laptop. Same for T510 and W510.

The differences is that the W offer higher-end configurations. They will typically have a more powerful GPU (although I think W500/T500 use the same one, just rebadged), more powerful CPUs (although high-end T configurations can sometimes match), and higher resolutions screens. I think among the preconfigured units, only W series had WUXGA/FHD LCDs, but in customized-to-order units you can get that on a T.

One difference is that W510 has quad-core Core i7 CPU options, and these have better memory controllers, which can address more RAM, so you can have double the RAM compared to a T510 (16GB vs 8GB).

Reliability-wise, they should be the same, except that higher-end quad-core W510 will run hotter, which may affect long-term survival rate, and can also cause throttling and performance drop. There have been a couple of threads here recently talking about how the stock cooling system of the W510 is sometimes inadequate, with tips on improving it.

Screen-wise, there is one big difference between 500 and 510 series - the 500 are 8:5 (16:10) LCDs, with available resolutions of 1280x800 (WXGA), 1680x1050 (WSXGA+) and 1920x1200 (WUXGA). The 510 use 16:9 screens and resolution options are 1366x768 (HD), 1600x900 (HD+) and 1920x1080 (FHD).

So the simplest way to look at this tradeoff is that with 510 you gain performance, but lose some screen space.

The W510/T510 will have a significant advantage in performance because of the newer core i cpus vs the core 2 duos in the T500/W500. Also, the hinges in the W510/T510 will not become loose like the older generation, and the T500/W500 left hinge is known for snapping the LCD rollcage overtime from poor design. The advantages the W500/T500 have are increased screen real estate, cooler operating temps, better case materials, indicator lights, and a real clamshell design for keeping dust and objects from getting into the keyboard area while the lid is closed. IMO the W510/T510 will be more reliable in the long and faster. The cooling issue can be solved by using better thermal paste (ex. arctic silver 5).

The W500, being a workstation, was more likely to be stressed 24/7 than a T500, making GPU failure more likely. (the GPU on the W500 and T500 do die sometimes, I had a dead W500 myself) So between the two I'd prefer the T500 with ATI and just upgrade the parts as needed. (for example WUXGA, T9000 series CPU etc.)

Or you could just go with the W510. Though you won't have any switchable graphics then. On the plus side though the FHD display offers some decent colors compared to the crappy WUXGA in the W500.

I just picked up the most powerful of the W500 family last week, a 4062-4HU, after reading this thread.

I will say I am very impressed with the smooth and cool performance of the W500. My unit has 8GB of RAM and the 512MB video specs so everything runs smoothly as expected.

The W500 is also one of the coolest running computers I have ever used. I haven't even heard the fan come on in the week I've used it for mainly document work and light internet browsing. No matter how hard I try It just never gets hot.

With the praise out of the way I will add to what everyone else has said:

About the W500's Left Hinge:

The W500 infamous hinge issue is not really an issue with the hinges but an issue with the way the magnesium cage attached to the hinges. The thin attachment points on the left hinge area are the weakest part of cage. Either the base cage or the lid cage breaks there if the hinges don't go first.

After dissecting my W500 unit I saw that the hinge itself is much tougher than the cage at that point so the cage is much more likely to break BEFORE the hinge.

My W500 has a loose left hinge and upon dissection I realized the hinge was perfectly fine and it was the base cage that cracked and separated so the remaining cage attached to the hinge was just hanging loose in place above the fan grill vents making the pivot extremely floppy and loose.

That said the cage is not that hard to replace if you follow the repair manual with a basic micro screw driver and attention to detail. I already ordered a new cage ($15 shipped) and expect it to take an hour or so to replace.


About the W500 dim display:

The W500 Thinkpads have very dim displays compared to other Thinkpads. In my case my old SXGA T61 is way brighter than the newer W500.

Also from what I hear the W510/W520 FHD and HD displays will be much brighter.

On my W500 I noticed it right out of the box so I did some research on replacing it with a brighter panel but the dimness is an inherent
trait of all the W500 Thinkpads and all its plug and play replacement panels (with the lower res W500 displays faring slightly better/brighter).

After a few days with it I actually decided I like the dimmer display panel since most of what I do is word documents. With the W500 my eye balls don't sore up the way they can when working on other screens for long hours.

I don't do media video stuff on any of my Thinkpads (I have a PS4, HDTV units and a Samsung Note Pro 12.2 Tablet for gaming, Netflix, YouTube and other media activities) so if you are specifically buying a Thinkpad for media duties where screen brightness is vital to the experience stay far away from any W500.

I was curious so I tested out some media stuff on my W500 and found YouTube videos and Netflix movies still show clear and bright 'enough' since 'Movie Mode' on any modern HDTV tends to dim the brightness to enhance the effect. But when looking at pictures and images you will feel the screen should be brighter (especially if you are already used to viewing images on hi res display smart phones, Tablets or Retina iPads.) On images whites tend to look dull ivory instead of sharp bright white. That would be my only complaint.

As for the statement that the W in the 500 means these were abused workstations I have to somewhat disagree. Or at least I will say many used W500 ship with Port Replicators and Low Cycle Batteries meaning they were attached to Monitors and External Keyboards for a majority of their early life.

My W500 came attached to a Port Replicator, had a brand new oil/dust free palm rest/keyboard/touch pad area and a battery cycle count of 42. The refurbisher that sold it claimed it was pretty much only opened up by an IT department to update software and install programs.

So basically if you see a W500 on eBay with a Port Rep and an immaculate interior and you want a W500 I would pursue that unit. I wouldn't mess with a T500 unit this late in the game since you would likely be the third or forth owner of a something originally owned by or handed down to a College or High School kid where it was taken around and abused.

I lucked out since unknown to me at the time of purchase my unit was shipped with a fresh install of Win 7, Office 2007 Pro and the original ThinkVantage Software that only needed to be updated.

If you work A LOT on word documents (Attorney or Writer) and you do basic web browsing and online research indoors then the W500 will suit your needs. However, If you lug your machine outdoors to work in the sun or do a lot of photo and image browsing/editing don't get the W500.

Delmarco wrote:As for the statement that the W in the 500 means these were abused workstations I have to disagree. Or at least I will say many used W500 ship with Port Replicators and Low Cycle Batteries meaning they were attached to Monitors and External Keyboards for a majority of their early life.

It might still have been abused. After all, it might still have been used for 24/7 rendering, making the GPU a weak point. Of course not all W500's are abused, I had one that was working as well.

As for the display, I installed the SHARP LQ154M1LW02. It was new, so it still had the full brightness, which according to the colorimeter was about 250 nits and thus just as bright the the LED FHD display of the W510/W520. I can highly recommend it. With the SHARP display I could easily use it outdoors in the sunlight.

Delmarco wrote:The W500 Thinkpads have very dim displays compared to other Thinkpads. In my case my old SXGA T61 is way brighter than the newer W500.

Also from what I hear the W510/W520 FHD and HD displays will be much brighter.

After a few days with it I actually decided I like the dimmer display panel since most of what I do is word documents and my eyes hurt way less than when working on other screens after a few hours on it.

Don't forget the extra 230K of pixels and extra inch of vertical space on the W500 makes a difference versus its successors.

I currently own two W520's and three different W500 models (2 x WUXGA, 1 x WSXGA+). And I've briefly had two W510's too.

I agree that the W500 (in either resolution) is *much* easier on the eyes than the W510/W520 (in either resolution) for web browsing or working with text documents for any extended period (over an hour).

If you get a good W500 panel (varies by manufacturer and I suppose age/use), it should actually be brighter than your T61 sxga+ panel, which, according to the Systems Reference book is 150 nits, compared to 175-200 nits for the W500. A compelling difference is the contrast ratio which improved from 200:1 for the T61 to 500:1 for W500/510/520. All my W500's are clearly sharper and brighter than my T60 SXGA+ (non Flexview) panel, though I did have one very dim W500 panel which I replaced.

Sadly, none of my W500/W510/W520 panels have been as pleasing as the IBM FlexView panels on my T42 thru T60 were.

There are two different WUXGA displays used in the W500. A LG and a Samsung. The LG reaches 220 nits when new (measured with X-Rite) and the Samsung 170 nits when new. (according to spec sheet) The SHARP display beats both of them with 250 nits when new. (measured with X-Rite)

I have seen all three WUXGA displays and owned 2 SHARP displays. The SHARP is the best of the lot, with great colors and viewing angles and superb brightness. (contrast 400:1) The LG is good as well, but falls behind in terms of colors. (contrast 500:1) The Samsung is by far the worst with its grain effect, mediocre colors and low brightness. The only upside are the extremely low black levels and thus, great contrast. (600:1) Viewing angles are good as well.

Nevertheless, all three displays should much better than the T61 SXGA+.

SkiBunny wrote: Don't forget the extra 230K of pixels and extra inch of vertical space on the W500 makes a difference versus its successors.

^^^^^^^

This.

I got so spoiled by (LG) WUXGA panel in my T61 that I'm experiencing withdrawals with almost any 16:9 screen...I could possibly get used to FHD as found in current T440p/s models, but the keyboard/trackpoint setup on them is not something I could ever live with.

Sadly, none of my W500/W510/W520 panels have been as pleasing as the IBM FlexView panels on my T42 thru T60 were.

None of the newer LCDs - especially not the LED ones - are as easy on the eyes as FlexViews were. No ifs, ands or buts there.

Aurora wrote:There are two different WUXGA displays used in the W500. A LG and a Samsung. The LG reaches 220 nits when new (measured with X-Rite) and the Samsung 170 nits when new. (according to spec sheet) The SHARP display beats both of them with 250 nits when new. (measured with X-Rite)

I have seen all three WUXGA displays and owned 2 SHARP displays. The SHAPR is the best of the lot, with great colors and viewing angles and superb brightness. (contrast 400:1) The LG is good as well, but falls behind in terms of colors. (contrast 500:1) The Samsung is by far the worst with its grain effect, mediocre colors and low brightness. The only upside are the extremely low black levels and thus, great contrast. (600:1) Viewing angles are good as well.

Nevertheless, all three displays should much better than the T61 SXGA+.

You said somewhere the SHARP LQ154M1LW02 is not plug and play. If I were to get one what exactly would I need to do to get it to work? soldering? cutting? etc?

Delmarco wrote:You said somewhere the SHARP LQ154M1LW02 is not plug and play. If I were to get one what exactly would I need to do to get it to work? soldering? cutting? etc?

The SHARP has 4 metal brackets that need to be removed. Just carefully cut them off and you're good to go. Everything else is plug and play.

Aurora wrote:There are two different WUXGA displays used in the W500. A LG and a Samsung. The LG reaches 220 nits when new (measured with X-Rite) and the Samsung 170 nits when new. (according to spec sheet) The SHARP display beats both of them with 250 nits when new. (measured with X-Rite)

I have seen all three WUXGA displays and owned 2 SHARP displays. The SHARP is the best of the lot, with great colors and viewing angles and superb brightness. (contrast 400:1) The LG is good as well, but falls behind in terms of colors. (contrast 500:1) The Samsung is by far the worst with its grain effect, mediocre colors and low brightness. The only upside are the extremely low black levels and thus, great contrast. (600:1) Viewing angles are good as well.

Nevertheless, all three displays should much better than the T61 SXGA+.

I think that LG display is a WXGA and not a WUXGA. I've been googling and searching and can only find the LG panels in WXGA and the Samsungs in the WUXGA.

I did find a couple of Sharp WUXGA displays but it definitely does not look plug and play at all.

Delmarco wrote: I think that LG display is a WXGA and not a WUXGA. I've been googling and searching and can only find the LG panels in WXGA and the Samsungs in the WUXGA.

I did find a couple of Sharp WUXGA displays but it definitely does not look plug and play at all.

http://www.panelook.com/LP154WU1-TLA2_L ... _5636.html

Apart from the 4 metal brackets that need to be removed, the SHARP is pretty much plug and play. I recommend using a Dremel to remove the brackets.

Aurora wrote:

Delmarco wrote: I think that LG display is a WXGA and not a WUXGA. I've been googling and searching and can only find the LG panels in WXGA and the Samsungs in the WUXGA.

I did find a couple of Sharp WUXGA displays but it definitely does not look plug and play at all.

http://www.panelook.com/LP154WU1-TLA2_L ... _5636.html

Apart from the 4 metal brackets that need to be removed, the SHARP is pretty much plug and play. I recommend using a Dremel to remove the brackets.

Thanks so much. This is going on my to do list. The only DIY I have yet to do on a Thinkpad is an LCD swap. So excited.

To go back on what I said earlier the dim display is fine with me but I do wish the whites were whiter and not ivory-ish. So I would do the upgrade. Trying to decide between the Sharp and LG panel now.

mmmm...

In terms of colors, the SHARP is slightly warmer and more natural compared to the LG. I have color profiles for both displays, just send me a PM once you decide which panel you are getting.

^^^
I would be interested in your color profile for the W500 1920x1200 LG panel, please
Also if you have one for the samsung 1680x1050.
Thanks for helping out a girl who is not techie

I am interested in a color profile for my Lenovo W500 with display LG-Phillips 1920x1200. Thanks!

tudoranadi wrote:I am interested in a color profile for my Lenovo W500 with display LG-Phillips 1920x1200. Thanks!

Did you find the LG screen to be much brighter than the original Samsung one?

Delmarco wrote:

tudoranadi wrote:I am interested in a color profile for my Lenovo W500 with display LG-Phillips 1920x1200. Thanks!

Did you find the LG screen to be much brighter than the original Samsung one?

I heard is much brighter than any other display for W500. I cannot tell if it's true because i cannot make a comparison.

Delmarco wrote:
Did you find the LG screen to be much brighter than the original Samsung one?

Yes. It is significantly (30% or more) brighter, presuming both panels with healthy CCFLs.

Delmarco - are there more cages available from your source? I'm not finding*anything* close to $15 shipped for one...

I have three W500's, two sourced from one seller. One of them clearly has been used/abused. A pivot pin, part of the battery retention mechanism, molded to the bottom cover, had broken off, caused by someone "forcing the issue." Rather than return the laptop, I removed the bottom cover, drilled a hole precisely where the pin had been, and epoxied a similar-size screw in place.

None of the three laptops has the broken LCD frame issue. This suggests that, while the laptop may be intolerant of impact damage in that area, it doesn't happen spontaneously.

It is the coolest running laptop I've ever had, with the most silent fan, which hardly ever runs, and I love the 16:10 aspect ratio. It is the perfect writer's/researcher's laptop. It's still a usable software development platform. It is not a capable platform for hidef video content creation. The Core I7 CPUs have special block instructions to deal with that kind of data, and the Core 2 Duo does not. And the FireGL professional video, which may still be supported by AutoCad, is not supported by any video editing programs I am aware of.

So, depending upon the particular programs you use, there is a chance it may still provide GPU acceleration, but not a big one.

It is undeniably true that the WUXGA+ screen is dim. But for me, at least, the Samsung screen has these desirable features, which make up for it:
1. An exceptional black level for a TN panel.
2. An exceptional viewing angle, actually as good as an IPS from top-down and side. Only oblique bottom-up gives this TN panel away, compared to an IPS.
3. The colors are not vibrant, but the rendition is very well balanced. Many, most, or all Lenovo panels with LED backlights, and which are brighter, have leakage of the blue LED excitation wavelength. The resulting color gamut is extended in the blue, but not the other colors. Such a panel is useless for visual editing. I can get by with the dull but balanced Samsung panel.