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Screen quality issue on W520

W500/W510/W520 and W700/W701 Series
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Renz
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Screen quality issue on W520

#1 Post by Renz » Fri Oct 07, 2016 1:20 am

Heya

I just bought a W520 2nd hand, it's a beast but I have a few issues with some features such as the keyboard and the display unit that seems to have lowered in quality compared to older machines like my T410. Less resistance on the keys, it feels a bit s**t and the colours on the screen look really funny plus it is blurry at the recommended resolution.... they must be some cheap chinese parts no doubt

Is there a way I can replace these bits by some better quality ones from a particular brand?

I'm going to scrap my old keyboard and fit it on my W520 right off the bats but the screen is a no can do as the W520 has a 15.6".

Any advice welcome.

Thanks!

brchan
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Re: Screen quality issue on W520

#2 Post by brchan » Fri Oct 07, 2016 7:17 am

You probably got the 1366x768 screen which is very bad. The FHD 1080p screen is excellent and the part number is: B156HW01 v4. It must be v4 or v7 (glossy) to have the 95% gamut. Note that you will have to calibrate it or the colors will look over saturated, but there are plenty icc profiles around if you search.
Current Thinkpads: W530 (functional classic keyboard mod), X301, T61, T60, T43, A31p, T23, 600X, 770
Other: mk5 Toughbook cf-19, mk1 Toughbook cf-53

Renz
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Re: Screen quality issue on W520

#3 Post by Renz » Fri Oct 07, 2016 10:16 pm

Thanks for that.. I'll try to calibrate that original one from the advanced graphic card menu. where do you order these better quality models from? How to find out for sure of the one I have?

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Re: Screen quality issue on W520

#4 Post by RealBlackStuff » Sat Oct 08, 2016 3:32 am

To check your resolution instantly, go here: http://www.whatismyscreenresolution.com/
To check hardware: SIW or HWInfo
Still NOT a great day for a Guinness! (the Real Black Stuff).
Ireland is on FULL lockdown until Easter 2021!
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brchan
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Re: Screen quality issue on W520

#5 Post by brchan » Sat Oct 08, 2016 11:32 am

where do you order these better quality models from?
The marketplace here, or ebay. Just make sure that the seller explicitly states the model + version number and that it is a genuine part. Also look for matching pictures with the label.
Current Thinkpads: W530 (functional classic keyboard mod), X301, T61, T60, T43, A31p, T23, 600X, 770
Other: mk5 Toughbook cf-19, mk1 Toughbook cf-53

Renz
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Re: Screen quality issue on W520

#6 Post by Renz » Fri Oct 14, 2016 3:30 am

Ok so according to HWiNFO my monitor is a B156HW01 V4 ... Rendering does look saturated though just like you said. Do you guys know how to fix that since I looked up icc profiles and its a thing for paper photos...

Also, what model keyboard with heavy touch do you recommend? Is there such a thing or shall I scrap the one on the T410

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Re: Screen quality issue on W520

#7 Post by RealBlackStuff » Fri Oct 14, 2016 5:54 am

You seem to have the better screen already, just not properly calibrated.
See this: https://forums.lenovo.com/t5/ThinkPad-P ... d-p/710499

As for keyboards, any KB from T410/T510/W510/T420/T520/W520/X220 will fit.
45N2141 / 45N2106 Chicony
45N2036 / 45N2071 Alps
45N2211 / 45N2176 NMB
NMB is generally best liked, followed by Alps, then Chicony.
Still NOT a great day for a Guinness! (the Real Black Stuff).
Ireland is on FULL lockdown until Easter 2021!
Covid-19: Stay safe, so Mask it or Casket!

Renz
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Re: Screen quality issue on W520

#8 Post by Renz » Fri Oct 14, 2016 6:23 pm

wow toocan man, i'm well impressed :)

thanks to both

Renz
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Re: Screen quality issue on W520

#9 Post by Renz » Sat Oct 15, 2016 6:39 pm

RealBlackStuff wrote:You seem to have the better screen already, just not properly calibrated.
See this: https://forums.lenovo.com/t5/ThinkPad-P ... d-p/710499

As for keyboards, any KB from T410/T510/W510/T420/T520/W520/X220 will fit.
45N2141 / 45N2106 Chicony
45N2036 / 45N2071 Alps
45N2211 / 45N2176 NMB
NMB is generally best liked, followed by Alps, then Chicony.
Okay so I have ordered a 45N2176 NMB and played around with these colour profiles that were advertised on that thread and it does tackle the issue of the colour temperature, so that's a tick.

However, it does not balance out the problem with saturation at all.... the colours are just too poppy it's just ridiculous and it hurts my eyes. I have tried to lower the brightness down a bit and it better, but its not the brightness that needs to be changed its the the actual saturation ratio.

Do you know how to tune this parameter? Do I have to make my own ICC profile? I have looked around on how to get this done however there is a lack of information about that it seems.

I had a good dozen laptops throughout the years and Thinkpads are by far the best BUT I never experienced so many issues with a display that is supposed to be top of the shop, I just want to start working on my laptop rather than having to tune it during the time I could be productive instead :)

Anyway let us know if you guys can help further that would be excellent.

hhhd1
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Re: Screen quality issue on W520

#10 Post by hhhd1 » Sun Oct 16, 2016 1:32 pm

reduce the saturation in intel graphics settings.
===

Renz
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Re: Screen quality issue on W520

#11 Post by Renz » Fri Oct 28, 2016 3:28 am

Okay so here is my review about keyboards. I have ordered a 45N2211 / 45N2176 NMB and I reckon it's pure rubbish. Then ordered a 45N2036 / 45N2071 Alps since it's the one on the legendary T410 and bingo! Great feeling of quality. It's subtile compared to the NWB but I can tell the difference, the typing experience offers a better response and does not feel as spongy. The one that I just pulled out of my W520 was indeed a 45N2211 / 45N2176 NMB. Not sure why it is best liked, I repeat, to us it's rubbish, if you know a guy that wants one I'm happy to give it away, . I have been using laptops since 1997, my very first one was a Toshiba Satellite, the one with the trackball on the right side of the screen. That was quality stuff. No idea what these people has to say about that NWB keyboard. Anyway it's history to me, glad I moved on.

I am still frustrated with the saturation of the screen. When I try to change it in Nvidia CP, the slider won't do anything. So I'm still stuck with these flashy lights in my face, if anyone can help me there that would be awesome.

More to this, there are a lot of blurry elements that looks like a display size mismatch, I think this is the graphic card playing games by its own. First time I have this issue with a computer and I had a bloody stack of them. This W520 seems to have this great potential and is a candidate to become the best of all I ever had but at this stage it's just frustrations after frustrations, at least I'm glad I fix that keyboard issue at least.

Here are some photos of what irritates me on that display, not sure how it's going to look like on yours you will probably wont see nothing since yours if properly calibrated but anyhow:

Saturated colours: https://goo.gl/photos/ffEJ1UzmD4Bx8DDG9

Blurry bits (the smileys): https://goo.gl/photos/WAroxLmDxyWZdbSe7

brchan
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Re: Screen quality issue on W520

#12 Post by brchan » Fri Oct 28, 2016 8:54 am

Download and burn Linux Mint Debian to a usb or media device and 'live' boot from it. See if you get the same funky graphics.
Current Thinkpads: W530 (functional classic keyboard mod), X301, T61, T60, T43, A31p, T23, 600X, 770
Other: mk5 Toughbook cf-19, mk1 Toughbook cf-53

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Re: Screen quality issue on W520

#13 Post by hhhd1 » Fri Oct 28, 2016 3:30 pm

Renz wrote:I am still frustrated with the saturation of the screen. When I try to change it in Nvidia CP, the slider won't do anything.
hhhd1 wrote:reduce the saturation in intel graphics settings.
The screen is connected to intel graphics and not nvidia.
===

Renz
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Re: Screen quality issue on W520

#14 Post by Renz » Sun Oct 30, 2016 12:23 am

Driver conflict?

This makes full sense.

Arrrrhhhhhh...... who did this occur.... okay I'm having a look now if I can trick the system to use the correct driver

Renz
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Re: Screen quality issue on W520

#15 Post by Renz » Sun Oct 30, 2016 1:11 am

)*&%*^%#!!!! Lenovo syetem update should fix all that stuff automatically.... that is a really boring, all I want is to get to work!!

When I got the machine there was only intel graphics on it so I installed the latest nvidia one as per standard procedure

however

I remember skipping an error during the install and got side tracked................

Today I tried to uninstall and delete the intel driver but it remains there in the DM along with the nvidia driver. Not sure if I have seen windows running with 2 video drivers showing in the DM ever but I can be wrong there.

Anyway

I ended disabling the intel driver and the nvidia seemed to have taken over

But

Nvidia CP give me this error: NVIDIA Display settings are not available. You are not using a display attached to a NVIDIA GPU.

This is after 3 attempts to uninstall the nvidia driver and 3 reboot later.

Incorrect driver me think but it does not sound right.... I'm going back to nvidia website to make sure.

If I'm not back when you read these lines it is because I have curled back onto the intel driver to give myself some time to think.

Shoot us a line if you guys have more is store that could be of use for us.....

Renz
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Re: Screen quality issue on W520

#16 Post by Renz » Sun Oct 30, 2016 1:20 am

Okay... My last idea was to try to go back to how the computer was when I got it in order to start again that nvidia install and check out that error message. So I did uninstall/delete from the DM on the Nvidia driver then it disappeared from the list. I restarted and now its back again like the poenix

awesome!

hmmmmm

Renz
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Re: Screen quality issue on W520

#17 Post by Renz » Sun Oct 30, 2016 1:40 am

Okay very last update. Sorry guys for all the trouble...!

After insisting unistall + reboots + uninstall ALL the nvidia software from WinCP I eventually got back to scrap with the generic driver 1024x768 or somthing

Then I went to install the nvidia driver and it said that I need to install the intel driver first!!! (WTF!!)

Then windows update took over and said "all good just restart"

After a restart I looked into the DM and it seems like the 2 drivers are back and the nvidia CP seems to work (no more error message) however it seems to be a minimal version and it does not offer the full control only the 3D settings.

Next step is to turnoff windows update, uninstall everything again, if the system stays stable with the generic vga driver then will work my way up from there
Last edited by Renz on Sun Oct 30, 2016 3:26 am, edited 2 times in total.

Renz
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Re: Screen quality issue on W520

#18 Post by Renz » Sun Oct 30, 2016 2:32 am

Right. I'm done.

Can't find the HD Graphics driver manually for my setup that is a Intel Sandy Bridge-MB GT2+ - Integrated Graphics Controller [D2/J1/Q0] [Lenovo], the w2obg08us14 suggested by lenovo support does not even want to install itself.

Have tried the fancy "detect my product" and installed service bridge and apparently my product is a L61... hahahaha

I'm going to focus on something more productive for now and letting windows update run a muck at least I can work normally

• NVIDIA driver update for NVIDIA Quadro 2000M - Error 0x80248007

hhhd1
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Re: Screen quality issue on W520

#19 Post by hhhd1 » Sun Oct 30, 2016 3:31 pm

Your laptop does have 2 graphics adapters, it is supposed to be a 'feature', it is called the 'optimus mode'.

The main LCD is connected to the intel graphics,
All the external monitors connectors (DP, VGA,.. etc) are connected to the nvidia.

When running without external monitors connected, and without heavy graphics applications, the computer turn off the nvidia graphics automatically to save power and heat.

You can go to bios, and force nvidia to be disabled all the time, and effectively disablng external monitor support.
===

Renz
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Re: Screen quality issue on W520

#20 Post by Renz » Sun Oct 30, 2016 6:09 pm

Dear hhhd,

Thanks for your response. I guess this setup is a response to new market trends. I see.

So to go back to my issue, there is no driver conflict I take it. I use dual screens and the second one is a large Toshiba 50". This screen does not have any issues like the main display on the laptop. For example, the thread response window with the smileys on the side, they appear blurry on the main display and they look fine on the external, even though signal is only transmitted via analogue VGA port.

So the problem is indeed on the main display. And no matter what I do, I get some bits that does not like the rez and appears blurry and get flashy colours no matter what profile I choose. So I take it that this is why the NvidiaCP only control the secondary display. Therefore no way I can tweek the saturation. But then again, the saturation is only one issue, the other one being blurry bits.

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Re: Screen quality issue on W520

#21 Post by hhhd1 » Sun Oct 30, 2016 7:42 pm

try to right click on the desktop, in the menu that appears, see if there is intel graphics properties,
if not, install this:
https://downloadcenter.intel.com/downlo ... duct=81500
or this link
https://downloadcenter.intel.com/produc ... phics-3000
===

Renz
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Re: Screen quality issue on W520

#22 Post by Renz » Fri Nov 04, 2016 7:23 pm

Dear hhhd,

I have installed the driver you suggested. After a restart, the assessment tool failed. Then looked for the intel properties by right clicking but nothing there. Issue is still ongoing...

Here is a copy/paste of the driver version from the DM: 9.17.10.4229

Any further help welcome.

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Re: Screen quality issue on W520

#23 Post by hhhd1 » Fri Nov 04, 2016 9:08 pm

When you right click on the desktop, there should be an options named "Graphics Properties" , it should take you to the right option,
if it is not there, then there is something wrong here ...
===

Renz
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Re: Screen quality issue on W520

#24 Post by Renz » Sun Nov 06, 2016 12:42 am

Thanks for that. It worked.

Saturation was by default set to 160 for each colour channel, that's over the top, why would they deliver these machines with such a ridiculous setup.

Now 160 what, what sort of measurement units is that is still unclear... It seems like its more natural around 100 however some colour profile would help

Renz
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Re: Screen quality issue on W520

#25 Post by Renz » Sun Nov 06, 2016 2:44 am

Here is the custom preset I came up with, and it seems much better from default ICC profile

The hue was wrong in the first place, and that's a bit of a concern.

Brightness -5
Contrast 50 (original value)
Gamma 0.7
Hue 351
Saturation -36

Everything was wrong appart from the contrast. If you have the same setup (W520) try these and tell me. I'm starting a new thread from that, to see if I can gather some feedback from other W520 users.

NOTE: Colours are now corrected manually (still wondering what went wrong with the engineers that done the job, maybe they were overworked... anyway...) the issue of the blurry images still remains. Reminder: Images of a certain rez are not processed correctly by the Intel card. Here is an example https://twitter.com/ThinkpadsForum the toucan on the top of the page appears blurred up when scaled on this page. However when i view it in original def https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/59 ... kcrown.gif it displays normally....

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Re: Screen quality issue on W520

#26 Post by Renz » Fri Dec 23, 2016 1:18 am

ISSUE IS FINALLY SOLVED : The blurry bits were caused by the screen size scale in the display settings. When set to 100%, there are no issues. The blurry bits are actually a trade off when you have a high definition card on a small screen (actually the native one on the W520, cant get any bigger as its a laptop) and the native definition is that big that when scaled down the the actual size of the screen the characters looks like ants at 100% and you scale it to 150 to actually be able to see you icons and everything else, the blurry bits are what you get.

That's a pretty stupid way to design a system, this is idiocracy.

Oh well.. at least I still have that IBM feel with it appart from a few little engineering quirks

There you go, we have solved the mystery but the problem will remain forever unless I resign to leave my display at 1:1 (100%) and wear contact lenses.

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