Thinkpads Forum

Just picked up a fairly nice W500 for a whopping $55.

Seems like a nice machine; I was surprised to find no fingerprint reader but I'll live.

A couple weird things are happening; perhaps someone has an idea or two.

The BIOS is sporadically changing from integrated graphics back to switchable graphics, It won't display anything once Windows 10 starts to boot if switchable graphics is enabled, and it works find with integrated graphics. Could the fact that it has Computrace enabled be relevant?

And when I hibernate, the moon light flashes forever - it never stops. I'm forced to force-power-down. Yet when I restart, it clearly has hibernated, for the machine comes back to life the way it was upon attempting the hibernation. I've disabled and re-enabled hibernation without affecting the issue.

Any insight would be welcome!

Art

Mmmm, Windows 10 and Switchable Graphics are a nono. There is neither a good ATI driver or a Switchable Graphics driver for Windows 10. Switchable Graphics itself requires Lenovo Power Manager which isn't 100% functional in 10 either.

The reason the BIOS keeps switching it back to [Switchable] is because of another option, OS Detection in the same pane. OS Detection for Switchable Graphics will automatically enable Switchable Graphics if you're running Vista or newer. After disabling OS Detection for Switchable Graphics, it will stop re-enabling itself.

I've done extensive testing of a T500 with Switchable Graphics running Windows 10 and they're just incompatible. You can run your laptop in Integrated only just fine but you lose Displayport output with in Switchable machines because the Displayport goes through the ATI chip. So for 100% functionality I recommend Windows 7.

Have fun with your W500, it's a laptop with quite a personality if I say so myself. In my opinion it's the last iteration of the classic "p" suffix workstation design because it's got the onFireGL and high power CPU crammed into such a thin (for its time) case.

TPFanatic wrote:After disabling OS Detection for Switchable Graphics, it will stop re-enabling itself.

Thanks - after posting the message I noticed that option and disabled it. And the machine rebooted without incident. So thanks for confirming that I did something right.

I'm happy with Windows 10, so if I lose a little bit of non-critical functionality due to the unsupported OS, I'll live. This installation was just a clone of my T500, and as expected it came up fine.

Art

TPFanatic said it all. main issue you have is trying to run any good Thinkpad with Win 10. you will never get to use over half the features as Win10 dont think you need to. ditch Win10 (not an easy quick task I know but doable) put Win7 64bit Ultra on and watch that TP fly. oh BTW may want to install TP fan control ini file 3rd party app to help keep it cool as W500s like to heat up when worked and factory cooling control wont catch it b4 it shuts down on overheat safty. mine does fine now also helps heats my bedroom hehe. Microsoft newer than Win7 disables most great IBM TP features so I disabled all newer MS products and have boycotted them since trying Win10 (Win8 plus). I will say however I am still going to add a W520 to my TP family as it is the last of the best in that long series of IBM greats b4 Lenovo tech changed all future laptops and eliminated many great features. and the W700 series was just too big with no added functions the W520 didnt offer really. the W5xx series where all power hogs though and used much more Watts doing all that workstation stuff and Graphics. I still use my T61 for most old easy usage and peripherals in 32bit. but the W5xx series are great for modern stuff and surfing/browsing/Graphics etc. even more than most new laptops for just a bit more size than those yet better than any desktops. unless needing far more than 2 HDDs or surround sound. also love the W500 display jack with an adapter to HDMI to use my huge flat screen TV for monitor to play videos and see things easier with my old Eyes ;^)

I forgot, but Windows 10 also has no PCMCIA support.

I believe in frequent backups at least monthly on an external hard drive or one in a swap bay from all my laptops using a 1-2 TB HDD so if anything happens to one laptop I have data still and can use any of my Thinkpads as spare until recovered for all my tasks including 3D printer. even though it would be terrible still not forever lost. can also use virtual multi OS on the TPs so like WinXP32bit, Win764bit plus like Linux or ? and use the most secure for web browsing.

n2ri wrote:I believe in frequent backups ...
can also use virtual multi OS on the TPs...

All my machines are backed up daily to Windows Home Server.

And I also use multi-boots; the R61 is W10 and W7, because of a program that will run only on 7 and below. The T500 is W10 and W8.1 for no particular reason. I decided to keep this new guy solely on W10.

Still baffled by the hibernation issue, which turns out to also affect sleep.

Art

TPFanatic wrote:I forgot, but Windows 10 also has no PCMCIA support.

nor many Thinkpad features like fingerprint reader, bluetooth, WIFI, tools, utilities, etc. its like MS owns your laptop and you are just their employee with permission to for limited use of it with only their signed apps which you pay for monthly even on same. and near zero offline use or even games. very boring also most data is in their cloud not your hard drive. but hey you can sync with your Cel/Tablet ;^P like ya couldnt with the old system? come on MS we know your games. IBM TPs have had more features than MS for decades. I tested Win10 on my W500 and dam near went crazy in just a week trying to do half what I could b4. thats when I found this site and searched all the 'How to remove Win10 completely' topics also had to get a new Win7 key as MS built in hacking software to shut you out of ever going back as they promise. it took me a month but I have been Win10/MS current free for over a year now and never looking back. I loaded allthe IBM addons I could on my W500 and it can out perform ANY new laptop running Win10 like they are on a tablet running DOS off an SD card and Im on a Raid server machine. LMAO

ArtShapiro wrote:

n2ri wrote:I believe in frequent backups ...
can also use virtual multi OS on the TPs...

All my machines are backed up daily to Windows Home Server.

And I also use multi-boots; the R61 is W10 and W7, because of a program that will run only on 7 and below. The T500 is W10 and W8.1 for no particular reason. I decided to keep this new guy solely on W10.

Still baffled by the hibernation issue, which turns out to also affect sleep.

Art

yes daily backups may be needed depending on usage. also duel backups/reboot disc copies after any updates or installs in case of issues or virus. but relying on their cloud makes my skin crawl.

yeah Win10 over rides any feature like that. it never allows you to 'shutdown' due to its feature of remote access by your other devices and Microsoft when they decide to invade your privacy even if your not around. read the guide but be prepared for shocks as you do. some times you have to remove battery power to stop them, even BIOS is "infected"/effected by Win10 ;^)

also if your Laptop has the Computrace feature in its Bios especially if you got it 2nd hand and never programed yourself as owner MS pretty much owns it now. its why I disabled it on mine even if it was not installed as one of the 1st offline/radios off things when I bought it. it was a great idea when new and IBM still operated the old Thinkvantage tools utility as a theft prevention due to it could shut down and disable the laptop upon reporting it stolen 1st time it came online. but now you just have to use 3rd party GPS type apps. 1st thing W10 does is flag your old OS Key as fake so it wont work anymore and if its an unsupported OS fat chance of finding a new one. thats why W10 is free (like 1st try of Drugs then your hooked to buy). most features require purchase/subscriptions to use or upgrade regularly.

n2ri wrote:

TPFanatic wrote:I forgot, but Windows 10 also has no PCMCIA support.

nor many Thinkpad features like fingerprint reader, bluetooth, WIFI, tools, utilities, etc. its like MS owns your laptop

That is patently absurd. If you don't like Windows 10, fine, but don't make ridiculous assertions like this.

Art

ArtShapiro wrote:

n2ri wrote: nor many Thinkpad features like fingerprint reader, bluetooth, WIFI, tools, utilities, etc. its like MS owns your laptop

That is patently absurd. If you don't like Windows 10, fine, but don't make ridiculous assertions like this.

Art

Agreed. The FPR, Bluetooth, and of course the Wifi all work on the TPs I've tried 10 on. And I figured out how to get the Hotkey Features Integration to work in 10, with the Communications Utility and EZEject Utility, while Fn+F2 and Fn+F5 do everything they're supposed to do.

The only hotkey I'm not using is Fn+F3 because I'm using Settings instead of Power Manager.

Win 10 isn't my preferred OS for the reasons I've already stated but it's certainly not as bad as some would make it seem.


Edit: You can see this post's advice about Computrace.
http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.php?t=114641

The switchable graphics are the only device that doesn't work on a W500 in Windows 10. Windows 10 also overheated the machine during installation and I had to elevate it on rails so air could circulate around it to keep it from a thermal shutdown. After installation it worked normally but I kept the switchable graphics on Intel. I used the July 2015 original release that still allowed Power Manager. Since installation, I haven't used it at all and am running Windows 7 ultimate on my W500. Windows 10 is the unused option on my boot menu.

Hey.

I'm here to say that today I tried ATI graphics in Windows 10 and, surprisingly for me, it worked.

First I went to the BIOS and set the graphics to "Dedicated", not Switchable and I kept OS Detection disabled.

After starting the computer and booting into Windows, the machine took its sweet time downloading and installing an ATI driver all by itself through, I presume, Windows Update while displaying a blank black screen for longest time. Then the display reappeared, in low res, and after awhile set itself to native resolution.

I can modify the brightness.

The driver seems to be from 2015, I didn't look at it much. I played a few games and it seems to work as well as it should.

So, ATI graphics by itself (not Switchable Graphics) seems to work in Windows 10.

Well, it's even weirder than I stated!

I tried a plain ol' "shut down", which is something I rarely do, and the same perpetually-flashing-moonlight occurred.

I don't know if I have a Windows issue or a hardware issue. Might try a quick jury-rigged Windows 7 installation when I have some time to experiment.

Art

ArtShapiro wrote:I don't know if I have a Windows issue or a hardware issue.

Your hardware's a ThinkPad; you have a Windows issue.

Windows 8 works nice on W500, never tried win10 on it but I guess it would be too heavy

iaeaix wrote:Windows 8 works nice on W500, never tried win10 on it but I guess it would be too heavy

But it works perfectly well on a T500; I had the reasonable assumption of success on the similar W series machine.

Art