Thinkpads Forum

So, the time has come to upgrade from my T61p, and it looks like I have some hard choices to make.

The W510 is finally out, and in many respects, its a bit....disappointing.
Video resolution has declined, weight is up a smidge, but more importantly, the choice of video adapter (FX880m) is LAME compared to the competition.

Laptop will be used for:
Work, VMWare workstation, scientific number crunching, and serious gaming. Only looking at 15" models.

My choices that I've seen in the market are:
Thinkpad W510 - Pro's (removeable HDD, and second HDD, Thinkpad quality, best keyboard, lightest weight. Con's - dim screen, Slow video, poor gaming performance from FX880m processor (Nvidia 240M equivalent).

HP Elitebook 8540W - Pro's (magnesium case, removable HDD, second HDD, near thinkpad weight. Significantly faster video with FX1800M ). Con's - about $200 more, slightly higher weight, lower battery life (8 cell, vs 9, higher power draw).

Dell Alienware M15x - Pro's (case, absolute fastest video (Nvidia 280M...almost 2x faster than FX880m, bright LED backlit screen). Con's (slightly higher price, lower quality, 2lbs heavier).

Macbook Pro - Epic fail...no core i7 option, extremely overpriced.

Have I missed any other's? Right now, I'm leaning towards the HP, although I'd have to find some way to hide the logo.....since I get Lenovo EPP pricing (and HP EPP through a friend).


I'm really saddened that Lenovo decided to go with the slowest video option...yet again, and the dimmest screen.

The screen on my W510 (FHD, 1920x1080) is so bright that I can't use it if turned up to 100% because it hurts my eyes after a while. I honestly believe you will be more than happy with the quality of the display.

Crunch wrote:They also have the best screens (the matt/anti-glare ones anyway)

I'm curious - have you had a chance to compare Macbook's 15.4" matte screens with the WSXGA+ 15.4" matte that has been used by Lenovo, HP, DELL and some others? The WSXGA+ is generally regarded as noticeably better than the other screens Lenovo uses.

dr_st wrote:I'm curious - have you had a chance to compare Macbook's 15.4" matte screens with the WSXGA+ 15.4" matte that has been used by Lenovo, HP, DELL and some others? The WSXGA+ is generally regarded as noticeably better than the other screens Lenovo uses.

Actually I did just that. I took my WSXGA+ 15.4" T500 and put it alongside my new 15.4" MacBook Pro (matte display) and compared the two. It was a very interesting experience and one I'm glad I took the time to do. While the Apple display is certainly brighter, it's not as clear and evenly lit, corner to corner, edge to edge as the ThinkPad. A non-scientific comparison, using a scale from one to ten, I would rate the brightness of the Mac at 10 and the ThinkPad at 8. As far as the fineness of fonts, menu items, and other on screen elements, the ThinkPad is far superior. Frankly I did not expect this, as although I noticed it to a degree when using the Mac, by setting them side by side the difference was even more noticeable.

Since the Mac is a 1440x900 resolution, and the ThinkPad is 1680 x 1050, the difference in clarity is very noticeable. Clean and crisp the display elements of the ThinkPad outshine the Macs hands down. Now I'm even more eager to take delivery of my new T510 as it will have the LED backlight, whereas my T500 is CCFL. Yet that said, I'm terribly disappointed that the 510 is 16:9, instead of 16:10 which is the common ground between the MBP and the T500. Finally during this comparison, I was reminded once again of just why I love the ThinkPad TrackPoint so much. The MBP has a great trackpad, the best I've ever used, but the lack of a TrackPoint is an odd feeling for this long time ThinkPad user.

Cheers...

Well..I won't touch anything less than full HD (1920x1080)..and I sure will miss 19x12. So, Macbook pro is out.
Dell/Alienware is too heavy, at 8+lbs.

So now its between the W510, and the HP 8540W. I get EPP pricing on both.
Unfortunately I know nothing about HP quality/service, etc..although I understand that the 8540W is considered a "business grade" rather than "consumer grade" laptop, so may be similar to Thinkpad.

The compelling thing about the HP is the available FX1800......

Proteus wrote:Well..I won't touch anything less than full HD (1920x1080)..and I sure will miss 19x12. So, Macbook pro is out.
Dell/Alienware is too heavy, at 8+lbs. So now its between the W510, and the HP 8540W. I get EPP pricing on both.
Unfortunately I know nothing about HP quality/service, etc..although I understand that the 8540W is considered a "business grade" rather than "consumer grade" laptop, so may be similar to Thinkpad.

This is the challenge we face, as the PC based (not mac) laptops become centered on 16:9 aspect ratio displays. I've not used this particular HP 8540W, but I have a friend who has one, and it's very heavy, thick, bulky and lacks a centered keyboard. Shifted to the left with a dedicated number pad to the right, it's a trend that even Sony has adopted in the new F series (replacement for FW). Personally I have no use for a dedicated number pad and strongly dislike the off centered keyboard and trackpad. Especially since I have a great preference for a TrackPoint as implemented on the ThinkPad lineup for all these years. Other brands which I have purchased for test purposes that do have a TrackPoint, I find lacking the fine adjustments and control that one has on with the ThinkPad TrackPoint. At the end of the day, if one must buy a widescreen, the 16:10 Hi Res display is the best in the 15.4" but now sadly a thing of the past with Lenovo.

archer6 wrote:Personally I have no use for a dedicated number pad and strongly dislike the off centered keyboard and trackpad.

I am generally with you on this, with one exception: gaming. On wider, larger 15.6"+ machines, a dedicated numpad can be a very nice thing to have for gaming. However, when typing, which is what we do more, especially on a laptop, the offset keyboard may pose an inconvenience. I don't know, cause I haven't actually tried, but when working with a desktop, I do find that I prefer to have my eyes centered on the screen, and so I shift the keyboard, depending on whether I am typing or gaming.

archer6 wrote:At the end of the day, if one must buy a widescreen, the 16:10 Hi Res display is the best in the 15.4" but now sadly a thing of the past with Lenovo.

It will soon be a thing of the past with everyone. If I've learned anything from past laptop/LCD trends, expect 15.4" 8:5 screens to be a thing of the past within 1-2 laptop generations.

Proteus wrote:Well..I won't touch anything less than full HD (1920x1080)..and I sure will miss 19x12. So, Macbook pro is out.

Then how about the 17" Macbook Pro? It weighs 6.6 lb which is actually lighter than many 15.4"/15.6" laptops, and the display bezel is quite thin so that the footprint of the laptop (0.98” x 15.47” x 10.51") is probably the smallest among 17-inchers. And WUXGA is far more comfortable to view on a 17" than a 15.4" screen.

archer6 wrote:I've not used this particular HP 8540W, but I have a friend who has one, and it's very heavy, thick, bulky

The majority of HP laptops that I have played with or read about are like that, which is why I have rarely been tempted to buy HP laptops. In addition, I have seen at least two recent large-scale polls showing that the reliabilty of HP laptops isn't so good. In general I don't trust these polls, but these two particular polls were done independently and both came to very similar conclusions.

How feasible would it be to upgrade the video chip on the W510?

Might be the easiest/bestest solution.