New A31p BIOS posted

[jsalb]

A new BIOS, v. 1.12, filename 1GET40WW, has been posted for the A31 and A31p on the IBM website. The release notes state that new version "Correct wrong message when POST Diagnostics Boot".

Previous versions of the A31p BIOS have been comparatively permissive regarding wireless LAN mini-pci upgrades. For example, no error messages is displayed regarding too many Ethernet adapters, subsequent to application of the 1802.com patch.

I am not eager to break my currently stable wireless upgrade, which is the Intel 2200bg mini-pci.

If anyone succumbs to the widespread and irresistable impulse to fix what isn't broke, and installs the new BIOS, please report detailed results here (with wireless card and system model and configuration).

Thanks.

[gregpilot]

Previous versions of the A31p BIOS have been comparatively permissive regarding wireless LAN mini-pci upgrades. For example, no error messages is displayed regarding too many Ethernet adapters, subsequent to application of the 1802.com patch.

Huh? As you can see from many posts here, I believe the A31p bios has *not* been permissive here. A few of us here are hopefully going to find a way to modify the approved devices list so we do not get the 01C9 error for "too many ethernet controllers".

Are you saying IBM listened to us and posted such a bios? I am sorry if I am skeptical, their support is better than most, but I would be very surprised if this new bios corrects this "error", which from IBM's perspective is not an error at all.

I might give it a try....I can always downgrade.

GM

[a31pguy]

No change as far as I can tell.

[jsalb]

gregpilot :I haven't yet flashed the latest BIOS; I was asking if anyone else had, out of concern that IBM might have further restricted wireless choices. In my own A31p, the IBM 802.11a/b/g II does not trigger the "too many controllers" error message after applying the 1802.com patch, while the same card installed in the T30 does trigger that message after the patch. The Intel 2200bg card doesn't trigger the controller message in either the A31p or the T30 after the 1802.com patch is applied. What has your own experience been?

In any case, IBM's policy regarding add-on wireless cards is thoroughly deplorable.

a31pguy: When you say no change in the BIOS, which wireless card are you using, and did you apply the 1802.com patch beforehand?

[JHEM]

In any case, IBM's policy regarding add-on wireless cards is thoroughly deplorable.

Jeez, I get so sick of reading this complaint.

If you have a problem with IBM's implementation of internal WiFi cards, take it up with the FCC and the rest of the alphabet soup of international regulatory agencies that require Thinkpads meet RF emission standards with the cards installed by TESTING!

Now we'll all sit back and wait for you to tell us how IBM could have tested cards that weren't even designed, let alone built, when the laptops were released.

Want universal commonality in WiFi cards? Use a PC card.

Regards,

James

[a31pguy]

Currently I'm using the stock card. But to double check - I popped in the a/b/g mini-pci card II to check. There is no change in the behavior of the BIOS in regards to either the operation of the card or the warning message that pops up.

In regards to JHEM - he is totally correct - IBM had to certify the cards at the time with the FCC. I don't know if you remember the debate about A vs G. But the 5 Ghz spectrum is also used by US military radar systems. Interference in that spectrum was of some heavy debate. Which is why IBM BIOS supports only the cards they have tested - because testing is not cheap and the A31p is no longer in production. IBMs PC division isn't a cash cow for IBM to start off with - so they have no financial interest in supporting something they never promised to support in the first place. It really isn't something they should be banged on for.

It would up to us to modify our BIOS to gain the additional benefit of having an semi-embedded A/G wireless card using the internal antenna. Which of course comes at the cost of the internal modem.

Currently - until I can work out the BIOS issue I used a Linksys G card in the PC card slot - since I can't have my clients see a warning message on my laptop and expect them to have huge amount of trust in my technical skills as a programmer/security expert.


However, I am curious as to which card and BIOS you are using which doesn't have the warning show up. This might help in understanding which modules in the Phoenix 4.0 Version 6 code that needs to be modified.

No - I haven't used the patch yet. Since it didn't seem relevant to the message. But perhaps I should test it anyway.

But there is talk of opensourcing the BIOS tools at this point.

[jsalb]

JHEM: Sorry you're not feeling well; maybe you should try decaf.

The relevant issue is not whether IBM is required to test the cards _they_ manufacture for use in Thinkpads, while installed in the target machine. It's whether IBM is required by the FCC to prevent the use of third-party cards subsequent to sale of a laptop of their manufacture, which is what they do. I know of no other manufacturer that implements a BIOS lockout on 802.11 internal cards. Do you?

You clearly imply that the lockout is essentially forced on IBM by the FCC. Can you please provide a pointer to any regulation of the FCC or of any other country's regulatory agency, for that matter, that explicitly or implicitly requires IBM to lock out third party cards?

[a31pguy]

That I can't answer. But your point is well taken.

[JHEM]

JHEM: Sorry you're not feeling well; maybe you should try decaf.

Ah! Earth humour, how droll.

The relevant issue is not whether IBM is required to test the cards _they_ manufacture for use in Thinkpads, while installed in the target machine.

They are expected to test the machines with all of the cards the machine can have installed as it comes from the factory, not just the cards they manufacture, which are only rebadged ones from other manufacturers.

It's whether IBM is required by the FCC to prevent the use of third-party cards subsequent to sale of a laptop of their manufacture, which is what they do. I know of no other manufacturer that implements a BIOS lockout on 802.11 internal cards. Do you?

None that i'm aware of, but I only own Thinkpads. I would think the more important question is why don't other manufacturers implement similar restrictions on WiFi card swapping. Built to a lesser standard? Almost assuredly. Don't care that the machines can affect other devices in the 5GHz spectrum? That too probably.

You clearly imply that the lockout is essentially forced on IBM by the FCC. Can you please provide a pointer to any regulation of the FCC or of any other country's regulatory agency, for that matter, that explicitly or implicitly requires IBM to lock out third party cards?

The language for the certification contained in whatever portion of the CFR they're attempting to meet requires a listing of all of the equipment used during testing and subsequent certification. Changing any part of the certified equipment breaks the certification. QED.

Nor is it just the US FCC.

The fact that IBM overcame this problem by locking the BIOS is regrettable, but hardly calls for blanket condemnation. And I'll ask again, how would you have overcome this problem?

Regards,

James

[gregpilot]

James:

Jeez, I get so sick of reading this complaint.

I'm sure I speak for a lot of us here when I say I do not fault IBM for not supporting devices which were not on the market when the a31's were being made. Their product is good or we would not have purchased it. Please do not take it personally.

Do (did) you work for IBM?

However as Steve Gibson says "its *my* computer and if I want to mod the bios its my perogative (and risk)!

I purchased my a31p in June of 03, and am very happy with it. I do not want to purchase another laptop to be able to use the Atheros g card "plug and play".

We all appreciate your contributions here...ttyl

[JHEM]

Do (did) you work for IBM?

Nope and never did. Just a retired engineer/merchant Capt. who appreciates the elegance of the Thinkpad design.

We all appreciate your contributions here...ttyl

Thanks, and I appreciate all of our Forum members, even the gripers.

Keep your nose up in the turns Greg.

Regards,

James

[jsalb]

JHEM:

The language for the certification contained in whatever portion of the CFR they're attempting to meet requires a listing of all of the equipment used during testing and subsequent certification. Changing any part of the certified equipment breaks the certification. QED.

"QED"? No, "LOL". Your response begs the question. Precisely the point of contention is whether the statutory scheme, as currently implemented, requires IBM to lock out a 3d party card to prevent substitution after the original sale.

Just point to it, page and line.

[JHEM]

"QED"? No, "LOL". Your response begs the question. Precisely the point of contention is whether the statutory scheme, as currently implemented, requires IBM to lock out a 3d party card to prevent substitution after the original sale.

No one has made that contention other than you. I've already stated that IBM's implementation of a BIOS lockout in order to meet worldwide RF emission certifications, the US FCC among them, is regrettable.

But I can't understand your failure to grasp the concept that:

a) These certification requirements exist around the world.

b) The BIOS lockout is the method IBM chose to meet the "certification includes XXX parts and no others" portion of the regulations.

As to chapter and verse, I suggest you start with CFR 47 Part 15 for the US, then you can go on to check all of the other nation's regs for the certification requirements in their respective country. Pull your card and have a look at all of the certs that are listed on it if you want an idea of how many hurdles need to be cleared in order to meet the test requirements.

Regards,

James

[a31pguy]

Well after hearing about this - I can report that the Atheros a/b/g card model I doesn't work, the Intel B/G card does work without the error message and the new 1.12 BIOS. I suppose this is quite good news.