Anyone interested in a Dell :p

[ideal-pc]

Got an auction going for a mate on eBay with a rather special machine for a mate, wanna take a look: http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ... :MESELX:IT

Bit cheeky I know putting a Dell on a Thinkpad forum, but I have gone for the off topic stuff Gotta be honest i'd sooner have a Thinpad anyday though

[A31]

Awww...wicked . Why are you selling for £0.01 though? I take it that it was used in the armed forces??

[RealBlackStuff]

Just in case: since many forum members do not live in the UK, do you ship abroad?

[qviri]

Just in case: since many forum members do not live in the UK, do you ship abroad?

[A31]

Just in case: since many forum members do not live in the UK, do you ship abroad?

Are you thinking about buying, by any chance?

[RealBlackStuff]

Over my dead body!

[ideal-pc]

I'll post abroad for anybody on TP forums but not for anyone else!! & the 1 penny is just a starting price, it's brand new, not been used in the forces yet!!

[A31]

Now at £51 with ONLY 2 bids!!!! Your mate is going to make a bit of money with this!

[emeraldgirl08]

Awww...wicked . Why are you selling for £0.01 though? I take it that it was used in the armed forces??

Ha ha ha lol. Too funny

[ajkula66]

This will sell well...though I wouldn't trust a ToughBook by Dell...

[ideal-pc]

This will sell well...though I wouldn't trust a ToughBook by Dell...

Gotta be honest i'd sooner have a Thinpad anyday though

Hahahaha ajkula66 already beat ya to it though id sooner have a Lenovo

[Norway Pad]

Armed Forces? Where is the built in machine gun and the flame thrower?

Should I ever get a Dell (VERY unlikely to happen) it must be one of these. My wife worked as an IT specialist for the local Sheriffs office (Ada), and these were the laptops they used in their cars. And they survived the most amazing things, like going through a car wash stuck under the light bar, being dropped to the floor from 3 feet up, etc. They had opened one up, and the internals were packed in some kind of gel.

[thinkpad1]

I'd buy a Dell. Mostly because my experience with Thinkpads is all negative.

[pianowizard]

I'd buy a Dell. Mostly because my experience with Thinkpads is all negative.

Quite a few people on this forum like Dell -- see http://67.214.227.38/~thinkpad/forum/vi ... 58&t=59681

I swear by Dell's LCD monitors and desktops, and I think most of their laptops from the last five years have also been very good. Unfortunately, before around 2005, nearly all of their laptops were junks, which gave Dell such a notoriety that many people still avoid their products.

There are also people who have had bad luck with Dell's customer service, so they avoid buying from Dell even though the quality of their computers has gotten much better. I don't know if I just got lucky or not, but all of my experience with Dell's customer service has been highly satisfactory so far, better than my experience with IBM/Lenovo's service.

[thinkpad1]

Dell and IBM (Lenovo) have good older machines. I think my T41's problems is more software or OS related now although there is the GPU issue that people have and I hope I don't get it.

I've had bad luck wiith my Thinkpad and a lot probably created or influenced by me but I looked at the newer Thinkpads in a store once and only liked the W700 or W-series (forget the model) although the T400 there wasn't bad. I would consider either, probably, because they are recommended but I still favour Dell Latitudes since there seems to be more options.

The old Latitudes are supposed to be good, too, according to some people. I almost bought a D600 but glad I didn't since the ones above it have specs I prefer. The D630+ would be good, I think.

[emeraldgirl08]

I was interested in trying out a Dell D620 or D630- now that I have a T400 I don't see any reason to. That takes care of my "on-the-go-take-to-classes" laptop. It's a nice light (for me and I don't care two hoots about a netbook) manageable weight for me. I'd like to see the D820's fare.

The Vostro seems like a pretty rugged machine. It handles staying alive from my older sisters uses! This girl will use it while it's laying on the bed, she'll take it outside and put it on the ground, she dropped it once in front of us (she said she dropped it more times than that), and yet... it's still working for her. Makes me laugh The only thing about her Vostro is it's the 1720 model which is HUGE!

[Tasurinchi]

Over my dead body!

Oh come on! It's not so bad! And the good thing is when you see your Thinkpads again you are always amazed of the terrific good quality!

Mostly because my experience with Thinkpads is all negative

How many of them you have? More than one?

and I think most of their laptops from the last five years have also been very good

The old Latitudes are supposed to be good, too, according to some people. I almost bought a D600 but glad I didn't since the ones above it have specs I prefer. The D630+ would be good, I think.

I was interested in trying out a Dell D620 or D630

Oh boy... oh boy... Check my sig below to see which machine I got from work. The company I'm currently working for has Dell as worldwide notebook/desktop supplier. I have first hand experience with D610, D620, D630 & D420 machines.

They are all crap!

The ones above cannot be nearly compared to Thinkpads in terms of build quality. They are purely made of cheap plastic, the keyboard will easily bend if you apply pressure. The laptop lid does not perfectly close. The LCD front bezel can be easily pull out using your nails... and I can go on and on...

They DO work of course, I handle them quite carefully knowing they are not robust at all, but still in three years I had all the machines described above, and it's not because I bribed the IT guys to give me always the latest models, I got new ones because most of them had a broken HD after a while.

I used to work with a T30 in my previous company, not the prettiest of all TPs, but these Dells would not survive half of the treatment I gave my T30 back then.

Every time I read the infamous "X4x HDs are slow and difficult to change" I LMAO thinking about the D420s, which being Core2Duo machines still use the same type of 4200RPM PATA drives as the X4s!!! (I don't remember if the D430 has also PATA)

It's not that I hate Dells. At the end of the day I can work with them and their specs are not bad. But again, in terms of build quality, the old Thinkpads are a class of its own.

My 0.02 cents...

[pianowizard]

I have first hand experience with D610, D620, D630 & D420 machines. They are all crap! ... I used to work with a T30 in my previous company, not the prettiest of all TPs, but these Dells would not survive half of the treatment I gave my T30 back then.

I agree with you 100% regarding the Latitude D610. It feels soft and flexes wherever you touch it. It was one of the "junks" that I referred to above. But the Latitude line got much better starting with the D620. Still not as good as most high-end Thinkpads, but it's finally something that deserves to be labeled as a "business machine". Yes, the material does feel cheap, but most of the flexes present in previous Latitudes are gone -- the D620 and D630 actually feel sturdier than many Thinkpads (trust me on this, since I've owned 40+ Thinkpads). And remember that the D620 was sold for significantly (~30%, if I recall correctly) less than their Thinkpad counterparts, the T60 and T61. So it's understandable that the D620 and D630 are about 30% less well made -- you get what you pay for. In contrast, I can't say that about the D610 and most (though not all) of the older Latitudes, which cost 30% less than their competing Thinkpads but >80% worse in quality!

I have never seen a D420, but considering its being newer than the X4*, I suspect its 4200rpm HDD is faster than those used in the X4*. I once had an HP nc2400 (slightly newer than the X41 but older than the D420) which also used a 4200rpm HDD. Its HDD benchmark was about 50% higher than that of the X40, on a par with some of the 5400rpm HDDs I have benchmarked.

[ideal-pc]

Oh dear, seem to have stirred up quite a debate here

I do have to admit to owning a Dell XPS M1530, it was fine for a while but just over a year down the line & the left mouse button is broken, & yep, you got it, gotta take the whole thing apart to fix INCLUDING removing the LCD panel

On the other hand all the secondhand TP's I have had are trusty old machines & very easy to work on not to mention robust, I have used X24, X41, T30, T40, T41, T42, T43, & some of the T4xp series :p as well as R40, R41 etc etc had a T60 & worked on Transnotes & T400 too (very nice!). I have to say TP's are just soooooo robust! Take the Transnote for example, whats that 15 years old now? All it took were new CMOS batteries & it was up & running

Given the choice i'd pick a TP anyday!! Especially as the Dell has Vista on it, but don't get me started on that.....................................

[A31]

Hmmm - seems Dell's are hard to fix, like that silly ACER TravelMate 2501XC I tried repairing... Are only ThinkPads easy to repair??

[dr_st]

The DELL Latitude D series is nice, but does give you the feeling of cheap plastic. However, feeling aside, I share pianowizard's feelings: The later ones (D620/D630) should be quite OK. D600 is junk. My apartment mate had it. Paint peeled all over the corners, hinges broke (like totally snapped), and one of them apparently took out part of the frame, so when we installed the new hinge, it still was a bit loose. He ended up giving it to his mom and buying a new DELL Studio.

My much older Compaq Evo N610c (also a business laptop) fared much better than the Latitude D600. After 7+ years it still is up and running and physically in good shape. Trackpoint buttons were replaced, hard drive was replaced and battery is dead, but everything else is superb, including screen hinges that feel no worse than on day 1.

Parts for business-grade laptops from HP and DELL are easy to replace and almost as easy to come by as for Thinkpads. That's one difference between business machines and consumer machines.

[Tasurinchi]

But the Latitude line got much better starting with the D620. Still not as good as most high-end Thinkpads, ...
the D620 and D630 actually feel sturdier than many Thinkpads (trust me on this, since I've owned 40+ Thinkpads). And remember that the D620 was sold for significantly (~30%, if I recall correctly) less than their Thinkpad counterparts,

I agree that D620/630 series are much better that the D600/D610, but I cannot agree on the Dells being sturdier... at least not sturdier than the X3/X4/T3/T4 series.

Pricewise Dell was allways much competitive...

but considering its being newer than the X4*, I suspect its 4200rpm HDD is faster than those used in the X4*

For sure it is... What I was trying to say is that allthough many people complains on the "apparently" lack of possibilities to upgrade a X4* machine, there are still more modern laptops out there using 1.8 PATA disks and nobody seems to bother. The Dell D420/D430, the HP you have mentioned and even the first generation MacBook Air use that type of disk

D600 is junk. My apartment mate had it. Paint peeled all over the corners, hinges broke

You are describing one of the tables of our IT guys my friend

I forgot to mention that the D400 series also feel crappy. The paint peels as well. A horrible sight... D410 seemed better though...

[pianowizard]

I cannot agree on the Dells being sturdier... at least not sturdier than the X3/X4/T3/T4 series.

That's why I said the D620 and D630 are sturdier than "many", not "all", TPs. They are definitely not as sturdy as the X4* and T3*. The T4* only seems sturdy; we all know it has an astonishingly high failure rate (and so I handle my T43p like a baby). I am not familiar with the X3*and thus can't comment on it.

many people complains on the "apparently" lack of possibilities to upgrade a X4* machine, there are still more modern laptops out there using 1.8 PATA disks and nobody seems to bother.

If I recall correctly, there are two kinds of 1.8" HDDs. The X4* used the far more rare and expensive kind that's capped at 60GB, whereas the other brands use the more common type that's up to 120GB.

I forgot to mention that the D400 series also feel crappy. The paint peels as well. A horrible sight... D410 seemed better though...

All the D*00 and D*10 Latitudes were terrible. Dell put their acts together when designing the D*20 generation. At that time they were quickly losing their dominance in laptop sales -- HP surpassed them for the first time in a decade -- and so they were scrambling to remain competitive. Dell laptops have continued to improve since then, especially their Vostros (budget business line) and Studios (mid-priced consumer line). They still aren't the best laptops in the market, but considering their low prices, they are good values. IMO, on a "per dollar" basis, Dell's recent laptops are comparable in value to the Thinkpads (somewhat higher quality but also proportionately pricier) and the Macs (the best quality but also the priciest).

[Tasurinchi]

The X4* used the far more rare and expensive kind that's capped at 60GB, whereas the other brands use the more common type that's up to 120GB.

Yeah, they "used" Hitache drives that have an IDE connector (Probably the only available at that time? Or maybe IBM had a special deal with Hitachi...). Dells use the drives with ZIF connectors if I recall correctly.

(On a side note, nowadays you can plug any ZIF pata drive in a X4 using a ZIF Adapter... I'm using one of those myself with 80GB)

[A31]

Or maybe IBM had a special with Hitachi

You can no longer get IBM hard drvies, they are Hitachi hard drvies (like the one in my ThinkCentre) as IBM sold it's hard drive division to Hitachi in 2002 after the Desk Star 75GXP hard drive had been created and instantly got a bad reputation for being unreliable, this got it known as the "Death Star" due to frequently failing and taking your data with it - see here for more info - http://www.pcworld.com/article/125772-5 ... _time.html, at No.18 in the "25 worst tech products of all time"

[Tasurinchi]

You can no longer get IBM hard drvies

I know. Who wants anyhow the old 1.8 drives they were doing?

I used to have several 3.5" drives from IBM/Hitachi several years ago and was very happy with them...

this got it known as the "Death Star"

Luckily I've skipped that model

[A31]

Luckily I've skipped that model

Thankfully I did too, though lots of very unlucky and probably quite annyoed people didn't!!

[dr_st]

I have this (I think). Is that one of the death stars? Has been working for 8 years or so...

[A31]

I have this (I think). Is that one of the death stars? Has been working for 8 years or so...

If it's been going for 8 years, then no!! This isn't a Deathstar anyway - only the 60GXP and 75GXP drvies were considered "deathstars", yours is a 120GXP - which I don't believe was considered a "deathstar". The name of these HDD's though are a bit misleading as yours (dr_st) is called "120GXP" which makes you think "120GB in size", well actually, only 80GB in size... One of IBM's little naming tricks??

EDIT, I just got this off Wikipedia

The IBM Deskstar 75GXP (as well as several other models made around the same time) became infamous for their reportedly high failure rates, with less than a quarter of them lasting for more than six months into their warranties

So if your 120GXP was produced in/around year 2000, then it may well be a "death star". However, if yours has lasted 8 years while soome only lasted siz months, then you're doing well!!