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Help me salvage my lovely 600x (BIOS parity error 110)

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muffieMSX
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Help me salvage my lovely 600x (BIOS parity error 110)

#1 Post by muffieMSX » Fri Oct 30, 2020 7:04 am

https://i.redd.it/1b5drkq13ou51.jpg

I'm getting BIOS parity error 110. What have I already tried so far:

* Replaced CRC32 Bios Battery
* Removed replaceable Memory DIMMS (to try to see if the error was on one of the replaceable DIMMS)

Same behaviour so far.

I've read somewhere that it might be possible to disable internal memory using an hex editor embedded into BIOS. But, so far, I'm unable to reach it.

*PS* Here's a video of the Thinkpad in action just before the problem: https://youtu.be/2hTPicdlwo4

Thank you all in advance.
BR, HB.

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Re: Help me salvage my lovely 600x (BIOS parity error 110)

#2 Post by rkawakami » Fri Oct 30, 2020 11:56 am

Welcome to thinkpads.com!

If what you're asking is the procedure to enter into the BIOS editor, then this should help:

viewtopic.php?p=272313#p272313

Basically hit CTRL-D when inside the BIOS and the hex editor should pop up. Change byte 2B from 80 to 81, save, exit. I would have a memory diagnostic program on hand to test the system's memory, both built-in and on modules.
Ray Kawakami
X22 X24 X31 X41 X41T X60 X60s X61 X61s X200 X200s X300 X301 Z60m Z61t Z61p 560 560Z 600 600E 600X T21 T22 T23 T41 T60p T410 T420 T520 W500 W520 R50 A21p A22p A31 A31p
NOTE: All links to PC-Doctor software hosted by me are dead. Files removed 8/28/12 by manufacturer's demand.

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Re: Help me salvage my lovely 600x (BIOS parity error 110)

#3 Post by cadillacmike68 » Fri Oct 30, 2020 5:08 pm

MEMTEST86 can be put on a bootable FDD, CD or USB Good luck.
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muffieMSX
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Re: Help me salvage my lovely 600x (BIOS parity error 110)

#4 Post by muffieMSX » Fri Oct 30, 2020 10:08 pm

Well, thank you all for the support, but the problem seems to persist.
During boot I got
173 and then 163.
Then, inside a GUI (green, white and black colors with the duck as a mouse cursor) shows me ERRORs 173 & 163 again.
When I click OK, I'm prompted to change the date. Which, by the way, surprisingly is correctly set to 2020.
After I click OK again, that's when I see:

110
?????

and it got stuck there.

I'm unable to boot to a full BIOS and CTRL+D does not work while I'm inside the GUI.

Is there something I can try on this situation?

All the Best,
HB.

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Re: Help me salvage my lovely 600x (BIOS parity error 110)

#5 Post by rkawakami » Fri Oct 30, 2020 11:17 pm

The Hardware Maintenance Manual (HMM) for the 600X is here: https://thinkpads.com/support/hmm/hmm_pdf/09n8608.pdf (accessed via the HMM link at the top of each forum page).

Error 163 and 173 (page 19 of the HMM) usually means that the CMOS battery is dead or disconnected. That's the first thing to look at. Make sure that you are using the proper battery (FRU 02K6502) like in this photo: http://kawakami-ca.com/images/02k6572_0 ... 2k6715.jpg Verify that the polarity is correct as seen in the inset at the upper right of my photo. You should also verify that the voltage is correct (~3.0VDC). Verify that it's plugged in properly.

With a good backup battery, the 163 and 173 errors should go away. Let us know when you get to that point.
Ray Kawakami
X22 X24 X31 X41 X41T X60 X60s X61 X61s X200 X200s X300 X301 Z60m Z61t Z61p 560 560Z 600 600E 600X T21 T22 T23 T41 T60p T410 T420 T520 W500 W520 R50 A21p A22p A31 A31p
NOTE: All links to PC-Doctor software hosted by me are dead. Files removed 8/28/12 by manufacturer's demand.

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Re: Help me salvage my lovely 600x (BIOS parity error 110)

#6 Post by SMA » Sat Oct 31, 2020 9:16 am

Just a guess.

In BIOS Setup (the duck screen) click on INITIALIZE .

muffieMSX
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Re: Help me salvage my lovely 600x (BIOS parity error 110)

#7 Post by muffieMSX » Sat Oct 31, 2020 10:10 am

rkawakami wrote:
Fri Oct 30, 2020 11:17 pm
The Hardware Maintenance Manual (HMM) for the 600X is here: https://thinkpads.com/support/hmm/hmm_pdf/09n8608.pdf (accessed via the HMM link at the top of each forum page).

Error 163 and 173 (page 19 of the HMM) usually means that the CMOS battery is dead or disconnected. That's the first thing to look at. Make sure that you are using the proper battery (FRU 02K6502) like in this photo: http://kawakami-ca.com/images/02k6572_0 ... 2k6715.jpg Verify that the polarity is correct as seen in the inset at the upper right of my photo. You should also verify that the voltage is correct (~3.0VDC). Verify that it's plugged in properly.

With a good backup battery, the 163 and 173 errors should go away. Let us know when you get to that point.
Well, I don't have access to an original battery (hard to get around my area), but I have used the original connector and replaced the battery coin itself with some tape & pressure. I tested it with a multimeter and everything seems ok.
Fun fact is, even showing the CMOS errors (163 & 173), the date is also set correctly. Even leaving it outside charger for a long while.

I have also tried to invert the polarity, by manually changing the wires at the battery. Also retested it with a multimeter and it was ok. The behaviour (and errors) were the same. The only difference was that the date was not set correctly.

Those facts lead me to believe that the problem might be somewhere else. Unfortunately.

Do you see something else I might try before trying to find another battery?

All the Best,

muffieMSX
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Re: Help me salvage my lovely 600x (BIOS parity error 110)

#8 Post by muffieMSX » Sat Oct 31, 2020 10:12 am

SMA wrote:
Sat Oct 31, 2020 9:16 am
Just a guess.

In BIOS Setup (the duck screen) click on INITIALIZE .
Would love to try to get access to any other option during boot, but it seems like the only thing I can change is the date. There are absolutely no other options I can have access to. Is there any other keys I might need to press during boot or when inside the date change screen that I could try?

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Re: Help me salvage my lovely 600x (BIOS parity error 110)

#9 Post by kfzhu1229 » Sat Oct 31, 2020 3:21 pm

AFAIK while the battery on the 600 series is standard CR2032, the connector used on the 600 series is NOT the same as the connectors use on the likes of T2x and later.
Maybe you can try use alligator clips and clip on a brand new CR2032 on top of that aging CR2032 battery just to see if the error goes away.
Before this though, disconnect the BIOS battery and let the BIOS fully reset, and then plug the battery with that new CR2032 on top to see if those 2 errors go away.
Dell Lat CP MMX-233 64mb 40gb W2k
600 PII-266 416mb 40gb WXP
T23 PIII 1.13ghz 1gb W7
Precision M4300 X9000 8gb 160gb WUXGA Ultrasharp fp W10
T530i 15.6" i7 16gb fp W10
UXGA:
A30p PIII 1.2 1gb W7 (IDTech)
T43p 2.26 2gb fp W10 (Sharp)
Lat C840 P4-2.5 2gb 60gb W7 (Ultrasharp)

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Re: Help me salvage my lovely 600x (BIOS parity error 110)

#10 Post by rkawakami » Sun Nov 01, 2020 1:05 am

@muffieMSX I'm going to have to pull out one of my own 600X systems tomorrow and see if I can duplicate your problem. It's been several years since I used one and several more years before that when I had a CMOS battery go dead.
Ray Kawakami
X22 X24 X31 X41 X41T X60 X60s X61 X61s X200 X200s X300 X301 Z60m Z61t Z61p 560 560Z 600 600E 600X T21 T22 T23 T41 T60p T410 T420 T520 W500 W520 R50 A21p A22p A31 A31p
NOTE: All links to PC-Doctor software hosted by me are dead. Files removed 8/28/12 by manufacturer's demand.

muffieMSX
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Re: Help me salvage my lovely 600x (BIOS parity error 110)

#11 Post by muffieMSX » Sun Nov 01, 2020 11:24 am

Well, thank you all for everything.
Yesterday I decided to take it entirely apart.
I have noticed absolutely nothing wrong, loose or dirty that could indicate something out of normal.
When reassembling, I decided to turn it on without (what it looks like) the modem. It worked fine, but I highly doubt it was the main cause.
I still need to reattach it (I took the time to play some old DOS games on it), but I suppose the problem might be way more complex than a faulty card. Probably some cold-solder on a memory DIMM, which came back working due to all my movement on the board.

Anyway, thank you guys so far. I'll keep you guys posted on my investigation.

BR,
HB.

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Re: Help me salvage my lovely 600x (BIOS parity error 110)

#12 Post by rkawakami » Sun Nov 01, 2020 3:00 pm

I have seen a bad modem card in T21, T22 and T23 systems cause boot (power-on) problems but can't recall ever having operating problems with a 600X.

The 600X I pulled out gave me the 161/163 errors which is expected (bad CMOS battery). It's been several years since I played with it. I'll have to see if I can find a good 02K6502 battery around here...
Ray Kawakami
X22 X24 X31 X41 X41T X60 X60s X61 X61s X200 X200s X300 X301 Z60m Z61t Z61p 560 560Z 600 600E 600X T21 T22 T23 T41 T60p T410 T420 T520 W500 W520 R50 A21p A22p A31 A31p
NOTE: All links to PC-Doctor software hosted by me are dead. Files removed 8/28/12 by manufacturer's demand.

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Re: Help me salvage my lovely 600x (BIOS parity error 110)

#13 Post by kfzhu1229 » Sun Nov 01, 2020 5:12 pm

If the BIOS battery with that propietrary connector is too hard to find, you can always find a more common place CR2032 battery welded for T2x and later, cut the wires and solder the wires onto the connector of the dead CMOS battery. Heat shrink that joint and it's all good. This is exactly what the previous owner of my 600 did as I found out when I had to replace the battery again.
Dell Lat CP MMX-233 64mb 40gb W2k
600 PII-266 416mb 40gb WXP
T23 PIII 1.13ghz 1gb W7
Precision M4300 X9000 8gb 160gb WUXGA Ultrasharp fp W10
T530i 15.6" i7 16gb fp W10
UXGA:
A30p PIII 1.2 1gb W7 (IDTech)
T43p 2.26 2gb fp W10 (Sharp)
Lat C840 P4-2.5 2gb 60gb W7 (Ultrasharp)

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Re: Help me salvage my lovely 600x (BIOS parity error 110)

#14 Post by rkawakami » Sun Nov 01, 2020 6:44 pm

kfzhu1229 wrote:
Sun Nov 01, 2020 5:12 pm
If the BIOS battery with that propietrary connector is too hard to find, you can always find a more common place CR2032 battery welded for T2x and later, cut the wires and solder the wires onto the connector of the dead CMOS battery. Heat shrink that joint and it's all good. This is exactly what the previous owner of my 600 did as I found out when I had to replace the battery again.
Funny you should say that. Here's what I found when I opened up the 600X:

Image

FRU 02K6572, the CMOS battery for the T2x system with the connector for the 600 system replacing the original one. This one does not use heat-shrink tubing but instead has a couple of small pieces of duct tape wrapped around the soldered connections. I vaguely remember doing this when I didn't have the proper 02K6502 battery on hand; maybe 5-6 years ago. I have a bag with 7 02K6502 batteries that's dated 1/2018 so I probably bought 10-12 of them from eBay and used a few already.
Ray Kawakami
X22 X24 X31 X41 X41T X60 X60s X61 X61s X200 X200s X300 X301 Z60m Z61t Z61p 560 560Z 600 600E 600X T21 T22 T23 T41 T60p T410 T420 T520 W500 W520 R50 A21p A22p A31 A31p
NOTE: All links to PC-Doctor software hosted by me are dead. Files removed 8/28/12 by manufacturer's demand.

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Re: Help me salvage my lovely 600x (BIOS parity error 110)

#15 Post by kfzhu1229 » Sun Nov 01, 2020 7:20 pm

rkawakami wrote:
Sun Nov 01, 2020 6:44 pm
FRU 02K6572, the CMOS battery for the T2x system with the connector for the 600 system replacing the original one. This one does not use heat-shrink tubing but instead has a couple of small pieces of duct tape wrapped around the soldered connections. I vaguely remember doing this when I didn't have the proper 02K6502 battery on hand; maybe 5-6 years ago. I have a bag with 7 02K6502 batteries that's dated 1/2018 so I probably bought 10-12 of them from eBay and used a few already.
Well mine is sketchier than that. If you have a look at mine, I have just dewelded that replacement battery that's dead again, bought CR2032 battery, taped the weld together with foil tape, wrap it with heat shrink and electrical tape, and just shoved it in that corner. So I have the same soldered connections (it was originally only twisted together!) on top with that foil tape sketchy things. Well it works just fine so no complaints here, and only costs me 50 cents!
https://1drv.ms/u/s!At7-rt1KJ7WviPwqaEl ... Q?e=6kP6sw
Dell Lat CP MMX-233 64mb 40gb W2k
600 PII-266 416mb 40gb WXP
T23 PIII 1.13ghz 1gb W7
Precision M4300 X9000 8gb 160gb WUXGA Ultrasharp fp W10
T530i 15.6" i7 16gb fp W10
UXGA:
A30p PIII 1.2 1gb W7 (IDTech)
T43p 2.26 2gb fp W10 (Sharp)
Lat C840 P4-2.5 2gb 60gb W7 (Ultrasharp)

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Re: Help me salvage my lovely 600x (BIOS parity error 110)

#16 Post by rkawakami » Sun Nov 01, 2020 9:20 pm

Looked back through my old eBay emails. They were purchased 1/18/2018 in a group of 10 for $8.50 total (incl. shipping). So $0.85 apiece. A good deal since an single battery was probably going for at least double, maybe triple that, then. Current price for one on eBay starts at $6.15.
Ray Kawakami
X22 X24 X31 X41 X41T X60 X60s X61 X61s X200 X200s X300 X301 Z60m Z61t Z61p 560 560Z 600 600E 600X T21 T22 T23 T41 T60p T410 T420 T520 W500 W520 R50 A21p A22p A31 A31p
NOTE: All links to PC-Doctor software hosted by me are dead. Files removed 8/28/12 by manufacturer's demand.

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Re: Help me salvage my lovely 600x (BIOS parity error 110)

#17 Post by Rob Mayercik » Mon Nov 02, 2020 3:47 pm

When the OEM CMOS battery in my regular 600 died the first time, I peeled the wires of the cell and soldered them onto a generic CR2032 battery. Tricky to make them stick.

Did that a couple times, but started hearing stories about those button cells exploding from overheating during the solder process.

In looking for an alternative, a couple times I just used black electical tape to hold the wires to the battry, but then I discovered I had a couple rolls of 3M "copper foil tape" (basically a 1/4" strip of thick copper foil with adhesive on it, kinda like metal scotch tape) laying around, must have been something my Dad got from work once it "aged out", figuring it'd come in handy for his Amateur Radio projects, I guess). Couple little squares of that worked even better for "connecting" the wires, then a light layer of the electrical tape to insulate, works a treat.
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Re: Help me salvage my lovely 600x (BIOS parity error 110)

#18 Post by cadillacmike68 » Mon Nov 02, 2020 7:31 pm

Duct tape or electrical tape, whatever holds the connectors on to the battery sides. I would prefer a flash solder, but don't want to trash the battery right before installing it.
600, 600X
760LD FUBARd
T21 2647 T22 2647 1@ 1GHz SXGA+ 4 more; T23 2647 1@ 1.2GHz SXGA+ 3 more
T30 2366-88U 2GHz; 2366-83U 1.8G; 5@ 2366-LU0/66U; 2367-KU6 FUBARd
T41 T42 T43
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Re: Help me salvage my lovely 600x (BIOS parity error 110)

#19 Post by kfzhu1229 » Mon Nov 02, 2020 8:28 pm

Rob Mayercik wrote:
Mon Nov 02, 2020 3:47 pm
When the OEM CMOS battery in my regular 600 died the first time, I peeled the wires of the cell and soldered them onto a generic CR2032 battery. Tricky to make them stick.

Did that a couple times, but started hearing stories about those button cells exploding from overheating during the solder process.

In looking for an alternative, a couple times I just used black electical tape to hold the wires to the battry, but then I discovered I had a couple rolls of 3M "copper foil tape" (basically a 1/4" strip of thick copper foil with adhesive on it, kinda like metal scotch tape) laying around, must have been something my Dad got from work once it "aged out", figuring it'd come in handy for his Amateur Radio projects, I guess). Couple little squares of that worked even better for "connecting" the wires, then a light layer of the electrical tape to insulate, works a treat.
Well I have used foil tape instead. The adhesive is not electrically conductive so I have to work around that. I tape a strip of tape backwards horizontally across the welding pad, two strips on each side of the pad to hold that backwards tape down to make contact with the battery, and then I cover everything with a circle shaped foil tape. Heat shrinking everything together makes it all assembled together. It is not very durable if you pull on it though.
Later I replaced the strips of the tape with a drop of conductive ink from my circular scribe conductive pen. Works just about the same but is easier to apply.
Dell Lat CP MMX-233 64mb 40gb W2k
600 PII-266 416mb 40gb WXP
T23 PIII 1.13ghz 1gb W7
Precision M4300 X9000 8gb 160gb WUXGA Ultrasharp fp W10
T530i 15.6" i7 16gb fp W10
UXGA:
A30p PIII 1.2 1gb W7 (IDTech)
T43p 2.26 2gb fp W10 (Sharp)
Lat C840 P4-2.5 2gb 60gb W7 (Ultrasharp)

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