Thinkpads Forum

My trusty old TP 770x is about to be thrown in the garbage. I sure am gonna miss it.

Why? Well, it is now a useless piece of black plastic that won't boot anymore. After years of faithful service, the only thing it can do now is beep twice as it displays the dreaded 161 & 163 POST error codes, a stupid flying duck mouse pointer (which is amusing for about 10 seconds) which lets you click on either OK or CANCEL, then a big ERROR screen with an arrow pointing to some sort of open book thingy.

Yes, I know 161 means a flat backup battery. Yes, I replaced it. Twice. Brand new CR2025s, with a measured voltage of 3.19V. But still it won't boot.

IBM's solution? According to the HMM, replace the system board. WTF??

I can't believe a pissy little $4 battery, which was designed to be replaced, can render a perfectly working system into a piece of junk.

IBM, shame on you. Although I admit its a rather ingenious way of forcing you to buy a new laptop.

-chuzz

After replacing the CMOS battery your job is not finished. You have indicated that you have read the HMM, however you have not explicitly stated in your post that you have also reset the date and time (or attempted to but could not). That needs to be done before the laptop is usable again.

Assuming for the moment that you not tried to set the date and time, you can do this by holding down the F1 key while powering up the system. This allows you to access the Easy Setup (BIOS) utility. In there you can set the system date and time and then restart the computer. If you have tried this procedure already but have seen an icon which looks like a padlock, then your computer has a power-on password and/or a supervisor password. You will need to enter the correct password(s) before you can access the BIOS.

If you have successfully accessed the BIOS, entered the date and time and are STILL getting 161/163 errors, then the problem IS most likely on the motherboard and was not caused by a dead backup battery. Which makes me wonder... what is the voltage on the ORIGINAL battery you had in there?

chuzzwassa wrote:My trusty old TP 770x is about to be thrown in the garbage. I sure am gonna miss it.

hey..!
put it in the mail..
i'll take it..

chuzzwassa wrote: Why? Well, it is now a useless piece of black plastic that won't boot anymore. After years of faithful service, the only thing it can do now is beep twice as it displays the dreaded 161 & 163 POST error codes

hmmm..
first you say After years of faithful service...

then

chuzzwassa wrote: IBM, shame on you. Although I admit its a rather ingenious way of forcing you to buy a new laptop.

well, wait a minute..
which is it..?
faithful service or an ibm conspiracy..?

perhaps entropy or product improvement at intel is an ibm conspiracy..?

please cut the meaningless hyperbole' and just ask an honest question without venting..

The 161 POST error does not go away. Pressing the F1 key does nothing.

This is what happens when I turn it on, with or without holding F1:

064960 KB OK
161
163

<beep><beep>

Then the screen clears and it shows a lock icon. I press Enter and it says OK.

Then the screen clears again and it shows an ERROR screen with the stupid flying duck and two buttons labled OK and Cancel. Clicking either one results in a similar ERROR screen with the arrow pointing to the open book thingy.

Pressing F1 immediately after pressing Enter at the lock icon still does not drop into BIOS setup.

Anyone need some 770x spare parts?

-chuzz

BillMorrow wrote:please cut the meaningless hyperbole' and just ask an honest question without venting..

Sorry about the venting Bill, but I really did need to get it off my chest

The question(s) are:

- Why won't it recognise the new CMOS battery?
- Why won't it drop into BIOS setup?
- Why is there a flying duck on the screen

-chuzz

chuzzwassa wrote:<snip> Then the screen clears and it shows a lock icon. I press Enter and it says OK.

Send it my way if you don't want it... you have either a power-on password (easily cleared) or a supervisor password (that you need to remember). Pressing enter will do NOTHING except give you a rather cryptic message that you should be checking your owner's manual.

chuzzwassa wrote:- Why won't it recognise the new CMOS battery?
- Why won't it drop into BIOS setup?
- Why is there a flying duck on the screen

1) I believe that the system is working as it was designed to.
2) You said it yourself: "a lock icon".
3) That's Easy Setup's mouse (okay, bird) pointer. It was designed that way.

P.S. Bill: I think I'll call "dibs" on this as I was the first to respond

P.P.S. I really hate to be harsh, but I think this is a case of PEBKAC.

rkawakami wrote:
P.P.S. I really hate to be harsh, but I think this is a case of PEBKAC.

Ray,

Just to learn what does PEBKAC means?

cmarti wrote:Just to learn what does PEBKAC means?

As this is getting OT, answer via PM.

rkawakami wrote:

cmarti wrote:Just to learn what does PEBKAC means?

As this is getting OT, answer via PM.

Ok.

rkawakami wrote: 1) I believe that the system is working as it was designed to.

Designed to continually display 161 & 163 error after replacing the CMOS battery?

rkawakami wrote: 2) You said it yourself: "a lock icon".

As I said, I press Enter and it says OK.

I think this may be where the problem lies?

I never set any password. The lock icon only apeared after the battery was replaced.

rkawakami wrote: 3) That's Easy Setup's mouse (okay, bird) pointer. It was designed that way.

If the thing HAS gone into <cough>Easy Setup<cough> then why wont it let me set the date and time?

rkawakami wrote: P.P.S. I really hate to be harsh, but I think this is a case of PEBKAC. :)

No PEBKAC here, and no offense taken. I've been using computers for a LONG time, probably since before you were born. My PS/2 Model-90 is sitting in the corner humming away nicely.

Fixing a 161 error should be as simple as replacing the CMOS battery, which I have done.

Do you think if I short the jumpers at J13, the lock icon might go away?

-chuzz

ps. Why doesn't quoting work as it should?

chuzzwassa wrote:I think this may be where the problem lies?

I never set any password. The lock icon only apeared after the battery was replaced.

Then what you have here is a supervisor (BIOS) password. I'm going to assume that you bought this system used since it seems like you are not aware on how this works. The Thinkpads have three different password systems used to protect the laptop:

1) A power-up password (which you didn't have otherwise you would be constantly entering it each time you turned the system on).

2) A supervisor, or BIOS, password. This one does not show itself unless you attempt to access the BIOS (holding F1 on power up) OR the CMOS battery has been removed/gone dead/etc.

3) A hard disk password. Normally it is the same as the supervisor password but can be different if the user takes additional steps to change it after the supervisor password has been set.

chuzzwassa wrote:If the thing HAS gone into <cough>Easy Setup<cough> then why wont it let me set the date and time?

That's the whole point, it HASN'T really gone into Easy Setup. When the lock icon is displayed, the system expects to see the correct password entered there. Pressing the 'enter' key by itself will always show you the 'open book' screen.

chuzzwassa wrote:No PEBKAC here, and no offense taken. I've been using computers for a LONG time, probably since before you were born. My PS/2 Model-90 is sitting in the corner humming away nicely.

Possibly, but when I first started using computers it was on a ASR33 teletype terminal accessing a dial-up timeshare BASIC system. That progressed to an IBM mainframe (370 I think) using punched cards as input. So, I've been around...

chuzzwassa wrote:Do you think if I short the jumpers at J13, the lock icon might go away?

I'm not familiar enough with the 770X, but if you are referring to the disabling of the power-on password, then I don't believe that this is your solution. You can try it however, as it won't hurt; I believe you have a supervisor password.

chuzzwassa wrote:ps. Why doesn't quoting work as it should?

Can't seem to format this so it shows up like I want... so here's the long way of explaining:

open square bracket.. quote="name of person you are quoting"... close square bracket... Quoted text... open square bracket... /quote... close square bracket

Everything except the "..." is what you need.

(edit: I don't use the 'quote' button provided above the message area... I simply type them in manually)

(edit2: Or maybe you need to turn BBCode mode ON in your profile)

Note from Moderator: I fixed his profile for him just now.

chuzzwassa..

we are all working from memory here..

i DO have a 770Z sitting on my knees just now..

it has been on the shelf for YEARS..
it is in near perfect condition..
of course the main battery is kaput..
BUT
when i plug it in, it comes up with the same errors you get..

the little bird (do NOT say anything nasty about birds, please ) flaps when i move the cursor..
(this is a hiold over from the days when programmers were less serious and more playful)
ok, i click "OK" and i am presented with a time and date screen..
i enter the date and time (any will do) and then i can proceed to boot..
well, theres the rub..
i sold that 5gig drive LONG ago..
but i DO have a 770 (the first version on this workhorse) and i can slide that drive in this if need be..
or shove a 20gig drive i have from one of my transnotes and restore the original OS..
which i will do if asked..

point is, you should go to the time and date screen, NOT the password screen..

so, clear your power on password by shorting the two pins..
(read those directions closely and follow them closely)

then pull the HDD..
and see if you can get the time and date screen..

meanwhile i am charging these ancient batteries i have here for this old tank and its brother the 770..

rkawakami wrote:Possibly, but when I first started using computers it was on a ASR33 teletype terminal accessing a dial-up timeshare BASIC system. That progressed to an IBM mainframe (370 I think) using punched cards as input. So, I've been around...

Good grief - you're as old as me, Bill and James! (Not that that's a bad thing...) My first was a Honeywell 8200.

Anyway, back to the problem at hand, chuzzwazza, the 770X went out of production in 1999. Ray and Bill have narrowed down your problem. Take a deep breath, and try what they've suggested.

Firstly, thanks very very much for all your help and suggestions. Especially rkawakami. I really do apreciate it. Its forums like these that keep oldies like us from going insane.

rkawakami wrote:2) A supervisor, or BIOS, password. This one does not show itself unless you attempt to access the BIOS (holding F1 on power up) OR the CMOS battery has been removed/gone dead/etc.

Ok, it seems that somehow a supervisor password has been set due to the CMOS battery being replaced. This doesn't make sense, but I'll accept that it happened.

The thing that makes even less sense is when you press Enter at the lock icon, it says OK, implying that things are, well, OK, when in fact it won't let you do anything other make a duck flap its wings. No offense to birds of any kind intended, Bill

MODERATOR EDIT: Removed link to webpage that gives instructions on how to bypass the password, per forum rules and site owner's request.

I'll let you know how it goes.

-chuzz

ps. My very first computer was a PDP-11/20 with an ASR/33 Teletype console. It had papertape reader and punch. Man, that was a long time ago...

A ting to try is take away your RAM I had a simular problem with a 600E

a link to a webpage with instructions to bypass which password.. ?

removing the poweron password is a well known procedure..

it can be found in the HMM..

removing the supervisor password is another thing..
AFAIK the password chip needs to be desoldered and replaced with a clear password chip..

regardless, i find it very strange that a password should suddenly appear..
just for fun and not that it will make much difference, have you tried a hardware reset.. ?
i.e. pressed the reset button..?
all thinkpads had those up through the 770..

Bill,

It was a link to Ray's page about how to remove the Supervisor password.

And for clarification, I was referring to Ray as the site owner for the link....not you as the owner of this site.

Yeah, Ray has an excellent tutorial on how to go about recovering the supervisor password, although not for the faint hearted.

How did the supervisor password get there in the first place? There are three possibilities:

1/ There was a password set by the previous owner, and I just never knew about it because I never had reason to go into the Easy Setup BIOS until now.

2/ At one stage I attached a disk drive that has a password on it, and it got transfered into the TP's EEPROM.

3/ Under-voltage from the flat CMOS battery caused a random password to be set.

What I *do* know now is that when you press Enter at the lock icon and it says OK, it is in fact NOT ok, and you are not actually in the Easy Setup BIOS.

I have taken the TP completely apart and am looking at the system board. I expect it to be back up and running by the end of the week.

-chuzz

Wow! Replying to myself after 5.5 years...

I forget exactly what happened back then, but I soldered the wires to the motherboard, built the circuit to read the eeprom, and did all the other stuff in the article, and it all worked. The laptop has been running (constantly) ever since, and is *still* on my desk and in use right now! Its been running FreeBSD/Xorg/Xfce4 flawlessly for years. I use it mostly for IRC and tailing logfiles in x-terms and sometimes web-surfing, although Firefox is pretty slow even without Java. Of course, it always runs on AC as the battery is no good anymore ("0%" constantly flashes on the LCD).

Not bad for a teen-age laptop!

CPU: Pentium II/Pentium II Xeon/Celeron (297.79-MHz 686-class CPU)
Origin = "GenuineIntel" Id = 0x652 Family = 6 Model = 5 Stepping = 2
Features=0x183f9ff<FPU,VME,DE,PSE,TSC,MSR,PAE,MCE,CX8,SEP,MTRR,PGE,MCA,CMOV,PAT,PSE36,MMX,FXSR>
real memory = 268238848 (255 MB)

hahaha. nice one. i have 4 770s and 2 have good batteries. i still have an original boxed 770 with all the bits stil inside.

my pride and joy