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Is this how this is supposed to work? X1 carbon 6th gen

X1/X1-Carbon series specific matters only
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npschuma123
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Is this how this is supposed to work? X1 carbon 6th gen

#1 Post by npschuma123 » Thu Aug 16, 2018 8:12 pm

Hey all

So just got my new X1 carbon 6th generation and have to say I am confused by the Ctrl and Fn key functions... I know they can be swapped and activated in BIOS and have installed the OS software and updated it all through the Lenovo app but the way mine works now is that the Fn key only works for the keyboard backlight, Fn lock, and snipping tool and the Ctrl key activates all the F keys... if I do the Fn/Ctrl swap then it is the opposite of this with the Ctrl key activating the keyboard backlight, snipping tool, etc and the Fn key working with the F keys. If I use Fn lock, it does nothing when I push the F keys (just activates whatever F key function the OS uses like help dialog with F1).

This seems very unusual to me - I would think that the Fn key should activate all the features likel it has on every other ThinkPad I have owned - is this how it is supposed to work or is there something wrong?

Thanks!

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Re: Is this how this is supposed to work? X1 carbon 6th gen

#2 Post by RealBlackStuff » Fri Aug 17, 2018 1:19 am

Welcome to the Forum.

Most likely you can thank blame Micro$haft's W10 for that.
Maybe run Systemupdate if that still exists?

Run a recent Linux-Live from a USB-stick and see what happens there.
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w0qj
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Re: Is this how this is supposed to work? X1 carbon 6th gen

#3 Post by w0qj » Fri Aug 17, 2018 3:07 am

A very warm welcome to the forums!

The Fn key placement was decided by IBM, before the other PC makers even existed ;)
The ThinkPad laptops follow this tradition!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fn_key

"...ThinkPad computers with the Fn key as the lowest-left, making Control the second-from-left on the bottom row. This arrangement is currently unique to ThinkPads amongst all laptops shipped with Windows, but it is one that has been in place since the modern ThinkPad product line was introduced by IBM in 1992. IBM designers rationalised that since the Fn key was used to control features that in some cases had no other physical or software controls (for example, the ThinkLight keyboard-illumination lamp, which is switched only by the Fn+PgUp keys), the Fn key should have the more prominent position on the keyboard. Notably, IBM did not include Windows keys on any of their keyboards until 2006, which meant that though the left Control key was displaced by the Fn key, neither it nor the left Alt key needed to be made smaller. The inclusion of Windows keys on ThinkPad models from mid-2006 onwards was achieved mainly by shrinking the left Alt key, which means that ThinkPad keyboards now generally have larger left Control keys than those of many other manufacturers, and are unique in preserving on laptops the Control, Windows, and Alt key arrangement used on most desktop keyboards. Many laptops place the Fn key at a less convenient position (and with a smaller size) within the top row of functions keys F1 to F12 and other "multimedia" or manufacturer-specific device/power control key."
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Re: Is this how this is supposed to work? X1 carbon 6th gen

#4 Post by dr_st » Fri Aug 17, 2018 8:51 am

RealBlackStuff wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 1:19 am
Most likely you can thank blame Micro$haft's W10 for that.
I know you like to blame Micro$haft and Win10 for everything, but most of the time you are at least partially wrong. Here you are most likely 100% wrong, because the Fn key handling is done on purely a HW level via the embedded controller. It does not generate a scancode, and is not visible to the OS.

What the OP is more likely experiencing here is a BIOS bug. There is a similar bug around the Fn key lock in the TP25 BIOS, which I reported on at one point.
w0qj wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 3:07 am
The Fn key placement was decided by IBM, before the other PC makers even existed
Thanks to them, my brain is wired to expect Fn to be the leftmost key on laptop keyboard, while at the same time expecting Ctrl to be the left most on desktop keyboard. :lol:

I own a rare specimen of a non-IBM laptop with the Fn key is on the far left - the Compaq Evo N610c.

:mrgreen:
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npschuma123
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Re: Is this how this is supposed to work? X1 carbon 6th gen

#5 Post by npschuma123 » Mon Aug 20, 2018 2:28 pm

thanks for the replies - I am thinking more that this is a BIOS issue as well. As of now, it 'works' the way I would expect (Fn + F key and spacebar all activate the specified feature, presing the F key itself activates the normal F key feature) but to do this, I have the F key and Fn key function swap on (top row of keyboard supplies F1-F12 function) and the Fn lock on which, again, seems very odd. I will try to contact tech support or maybe just wait for a new BIOS update

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