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T470 ups and downs, new project, need advice

T430-T490, T530-T590 Series
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TinkerMan
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Location: Paris, France

T470 ups and downs, new project, need advice

#1 Post by TinkerMan » Wed Mar 08, 2023 10:50 am

Hello, so my sons X201 finally died, he was soo sad for weeks
I decided to buy him a newer thinkpad which can help him for at least 5 years or so, so I looked into T470, went on ebay and found one for 45 dollars, with no hdd/ssd, no ram, bought it, I also sent a DM to the seller asking him if its a functional laptop or is just for parts(so that I would know how to proceed with my project) , the guy said the laptop misses the hdd/ssd because it as a corporate laptop at his workplace, and they also reuse the PSU for other laptops and also kept the ram to upgrade some of the machines that they kept, but otherwise. it was just a fully functional machine provided all the missing components get replaced, which was fine by me.
laptop arrives, and with the exception of 2 nasty sticker marks, the rest of the laptop was impeccable, i cleaned the sticker marks , I installed ram, SSD and pluged in a slim tip charger i already had from my P1 gen 1, and .............nothing happened. well, actually something did happen, the start button flashed green 3 times, but thats it. it wont start.
what am I missing here?
any help will be greatly appreciated.
thanks
W530, 3840QM, 32GB, K2000M
P1, XEON 2176, 32GB ECC, P2000, IPS
X230, 3320M, 16GB, HD4000, IPS
T601F X9000, 8GB, X3100, UXGA FlexView 1600x1200
T61 14" 4:3, T9500, 8GB, NVS140M
T60 14" 4:3, T7600, 3GB, GMA950
P71, 7700HQ, 16GB, P600, IPS
T470 6300U
R61i, T430s
RIP: T43p, X201

RealBlackStuff
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Re: T470 ups and downs, new project, need advice

#2 Post by RealBlackStuff » Thu Mar 09, 2023 3:18 am

Remove all RAM, then try to boot.
If there is any life left in it, it should now beep 1-3-3-1.
Lovely day for a Guinness! (The Real Black Stuff)
Lenovo: X240, X250, T440p, T480, M900 Tiny.

PS: the old Boardroom website is still available on the Wayback Machine
.

axur-delmeria
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Re: T470 ups and downs, new project, need advice

#3 Post by axur-delmeria » Thu Mar 09, 2023 3:27 am

Does it have a battery?
Planned Purchase: T480s i5-8350 FHD Touch
Impulse Buy: Thinkpad not named for safety reasons :lol:
RIP: X220 4291-C91 X61 7676-A24 760XD-U9E :cry:

TinkerMan
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Posts: 230
Joined: Sun Jun 24, 2018 4:02 am
Location: Paris, France

Re: T470 ups and downs, new project, need advice

#4 Post by TinkerMan » Thu Mar 09, 2023 6:22 am

axur-delmeria wrote:
Thu Mar 09, 2023 3:27 am
Does it have a battery?
does it matter? the laptop was plugged in when I tried to boot it up
and yes, I tried both with and without the battery, but i have no idea if the battery is functional or not
W530, 3840QM, 32GB, K2000M
P1, XEON 2176, 32GB ECC, P2000, IPS
X230, 3320M, 16GB, HD4000, IPS
T601F X9000, 8GB, X3100, UXGA FlexView 1600x1200
T61 14" 4:3, T9500, 8GB, NVS140M
T60 14" 4:3, T7600, 3GB, GMA950
P71, 7700HQ, 16GB, P600, IPS
T470 6300U
R61i, T430s
RIP: T43p, X201

TinkerMan
Sophomore Member
Posts: 230
Joined: Sun Jun 24, 2018 4:02 am
Location: Paris, France

Re: T470 ups and downs, new project, need advice

#5 Post by TinkerMan » Thu Mar 09, 2023 6:43 am

RealBlackStuff wrote:
Thu Mar 09, 2023 3:18 am
Remove all RAM, then try to boot.
If there is any life left in it, it should now beep 1-3-3-1.


ok, I just did that, i didnt get a 1 3 3 1, i got a ...... chime, like an 8 bit music, for about 2 or 3 seconds
never heard this sound from any of my thinkpads, and boy do I have a lot of them
W530, 3840QM, 32GB, K2000M
P1, XEON 2176, 32GB ECC, P2000, IPS
X230, 3320M, 16GB, HD4000, IPS
T601F X9000, 8GB, X3100, UXGA FlexView 1600x1200
T61 14" 4:3, T9500, 8GB, NVS140M
T60 14" 4:3, T7600, 3GB, GMA950
P71, 7700HQ, 16GB, P600, IPS
T470 6300U
R61i, T430s
RIP: T43p, X201

axur-delmeria
Senior ThinkPadder
Senior ThinkPadder
Posts: 3810
Joined: Mon May 28, 2012 5:49 am
Location: Metro Manila, Philippines

Re: T470 ups and downs, new project, need advice

#6 Post by axur-delmeria » Thu Mar 09, 2023 6:49 am

TinkerMan wrote:
Thu Mar 09, 2023 6:22 am
does it matter? the laptop was plugged in when I tried to boot it up
and yes, I tried both with and without the battery, but i have no idea if the battery is functional or not
Yes, it matters. The T440 and later models have some odd quirks involving the internal battery, though TBH I only have limited experience with these newer models (I have yet to own a Thinkpad newer than the X220) so I can't speak with absolute certainty.
Planned Purchase: T480s i5-8350 FHD Touch
Impulse Buy: Thinkpad not named for safety reasons :lol:
RIP: X220 4291-C91 X61 7676-A24 760XD-U9E :cry:

TinkerMan
Sophomore Member
Posts: 230
Joined: Sun Jun 24, 2018 4:02 am
Location: Paris, France

Re: T470 ups and downs, new project, need advice

#7 Post by TinkerMan » Thu Mar 09, 2023 7:15 am

axur-delmeria wrote:
Thu Mar 09, 2023 6:49 am
TinkerMan wrote:
Thu Mar 09, 2023 6:22 am
does it matter? the laptop was plugged in when I tried to boot it up
and yes, I tried both with and without the battery, but i have no idea if the battery is functional or not
Yes, it matters. The T440 and later models have some odd quirks involving the internal battery, though TBH I only have limited experience with these newer models (I have yet to own a Thinkpad newer than the X220) so I can't speak with absolute certainty.
ooohh, I see, well, to be fair, its my first thinkpad which had the dual battery config
most of my laptops are retro style thinkpads, BUt i also own a P1 , but that one only has internal battery, and no external one, so yeah, my experience with these types is also limited, and its the first time i hear they have specific quirks, thanks for the heads up
W530, 3840QM, 32GB, K2000M
P1, XEON 2176, 32GB ECC, P2000, IPS
X230, 3320M, 16GB, HD4000, IPS
T601F X9000, 8GB, X3100, UXGA FlexView 1600x1200
T61 14" 4:3, T9500, 8GB, NVS140M
T60 14" 4:3, T7600, 3GB, GMA950
P71, 7700HQ, 16GB, P600, IPS
T470 6300U
R61i, T430s
RIP: T43p, X201

RealBlackStuff
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Location: Loch Garman, Éire

Re: T470 ups and downs, new project, need advice

#8 Post by RealBlackStuff » Thu Mar 09, 2023 8:29 am

Seems to be a known problem with T470.
Check this out: https://forums.lenovo.com/t5/ThinkPad-T ... -p/4151449
Lovely day for a Guinness! (The Real Black Stuff)
Lenovo: X240, X250, T440p, T480, M900 Tiny.

PS: the old Boardroom website is still available on the Wayback Machine
.

TinkerMan
Sophomore Member
Posts: 230
Joined: Sun Jun 24, 2018 4:02 am
Location: Paris, France

Re: T470 ups and downs, new project, need advice

#9 Post by TinkerMan » Fri Mar 10, 2023 7:40 am

RealBlackStuff wrote:
Thu Mar 09, 2023 8:29 am
Seems to be a known problem with T470.
Check this out: https://forums.lenovo.com/t5/ThinkPad-T ... -p/4151449
thanks alot, that explains it

anyway, i finally managed to make it work, unfortunately it has a faulty keyboard, so will have to change that
however I am a bit puzzled about the connectors on the mobo, does this laptop come with a m.2 sata interface or the m.2 nvme interface?
W530, 3840QM, 32GB, K2000M
P1, XEON 2176, 32GB ECC, P2000, IPS
X230, 3320M, 16GB, HD4000, IPS
T601F X9000, 8GB, X3100, UXGA FlexView 1600x1200
T61 14" 4:3, T9500, 8GB, NVS140M
T60 14" 4:3, T7600, 3GB, GMA950
P71, 7700HQ, 16GB, P600, IPS
T470 6300U
R61i, T430s
RIP: T43p, X201

axur-delmeria
Senior ThinkPadder
Senior ThinkPadder
Posts: 3810
Joined: Mon May 28, 2012 5:49 am
Location: Metro Manila, Philippines

Re: T470 ups and downs, new project, need advice

#10 Post by axur-delmeria » Fri Mar 10, 2023 10:33 am

The T470 supports M.2 NVMe SSDs as stated in the PSREF: https://psref.lenovo.com/syspool/Sys/PD ... 0_Spec.PDF
The M2. 2280 NVMe is mounted on a caddy which is installed on the HDD bay. It connects to the system board via a cable.

Its WWAN slot supports M.2 2242 SATA SSDs.
Planned Purchase: T480s i5-8350 FHD Touch
Impulse Buy: Thinkpad not named for safety reasons :lol:
RIP: X220 4291-C91 X61 7676-A24 760XD-U9E :cry:

TinkerMan
Sophomore Member
Posts: 230
Joined: Sun Jun 24, 2018 4:02 am
Location: Paris, France

Re: T470 ups and downs, new project, need advice

#11 Post by TinkerMan » Fri Mar 17, 2023 5:31 am

ok, so i made it work, I installed W10 pro on the sata 3 SSD and a linux distro on the M.2 sata 42mm SSD. I have some keys which dont work and the keyboard will get replaced soon, BUT my main question now is about the batteries, so I have a 6 cell external battery and the 3 cell internal one, the problem is the internal one, which supposedly should help me swapping the external one when its out of juice, well, the internal one is the first one to be used by the system, and the external one starts draining only after the first one hits 5%, so how da helll am I supposed to hot swap the external one when that one gets drained if the internal one is already drained? what am I missing, is there a way to set it up so the external battery drains first?
W530, 3840QM, 32GB, K2000M
P1, XEON 2176, 32GB ECC, P2000, IPS
X230, 3320M, 16GB, HD4000, IPS
T601F X9000, 8GB, X3100, UXGA FlexView 1600x1200
T61 14" 4:3, T9500, 8GB, NVS140M
T60 14" 4:3, T7600, 3GB, GMA950
P71, 7700HQ, 16GB, P600, IPS
T470 6300U
R61i, T430s
RIP: T43p, X201

RealBlackStuff
Admin Emeritus
Admin Emeritus
Posts: 23812
Joined: Mon Sep 18, 2006 5:17 am
Location: Loch Garman, Éire

Re: T470 ups and downs, new project, need advice

#12 Post by RealBlackStuff » Fri Mar 17, 2023 6:49 am

Keep the charger in when you swap batteries.
Lovely day for a Guinness! (The Real Black Stuff)
Lenovo: X240, X250, T440p, T480, M900 Tiny.

PS: the old Boardroom website is still available on the Wayback Machine
.

TinkerMan
Sophomore Member
Posts: 230
Joined: Sun Jun 24, 2018 4:02 am
Location: Paris, France

Re: T470 ups and downs, new project, need advice

#13 Post by TinkerMan » Fri Mar 17, 2023 9:51 am

RealBlackStuff wrote:
Fri Mar 17, 2023 6:49 am
Keep the charger in when you swap batteries.
ok, i got the joke, it means there is no way to get around this, but then why the hell did they market this laptop as having a swap-able battery on the go if you need a wall socket to perform this activity?
anyway, I am amazed that no one in the community created a custom bios which to perform the discharging of batteries first external and then internal. what the hell, we can create custom bios for using a W700 cpu inside a T61 ( X9000), but we cant create a bios for batteries usage?
W530, 3840QM, 32GB, K2000M
P1, XEON 2176, 32GB ECC, P2000, IPS
X230, 3320M, 16GB, HD4000, IPS
T601F X9000, 8GB, X3100, UXGA FlexView 1600x1200
T61 14" 4:3, T9500, 8GB, NVS140M
T60 14" 4:3, T7600, 3GB, GMA950
P71, 7700HQ, 16GB, P600, IPS
T470 6300U
R61i, T430s
RIP: T43p, X201

dr_st
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Re: T470 ups and downs, new project, need advice

#14 Post by dr_st » Tue Mar 21, 2023 8:37 am

TinkerMan wrote:
Fri Mar 17, 2023 5:31 am
well, the internal one is the first one to be used by the system, and the external one starts draining only after the first one hits 5%, so how da helll am I supposed to hot swap the external one when that one gets drained if the internal one is already drained? what am I missing, is there a way to set it up so the external battery drains first?
That's why it stops at 5%. The theory is that a 5% charge is enough to swap batteries.

AFAIR, when I last checked into it - there is no way to force the external to always drain first. The algorithm supposedly drains the battery with less wear first, so the order can change over time.
TinkerMan wrote:
Fri Mar 17, 2023 9:51 am
anyway, I am amazed that no one in the community created a custom bios which to perform the discharging of batteries first external and then internal. what the hell, we can create custom bios for using a W700 cpu inside a T61 ( X9000), but we cant create a bios for batteries usage?
I believe this functionality is not in BIOS, but in EC. In any case, the answer is that it probably did not bother enough people. The complexity/benefit tradeoff may not be very high, dunno.
Thinkpad 25 (20K7), T490 (20N3), Yoga 14 (20FY), T430s (IPS FHD + Classic Keyboard), X220 4291-4BG
X61 7673-V2V, T60 2007-QPG, T42 2373-F7G, X32 (IPS Screen), A31p w/ Ultrabay Numpad

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