Extra ssd instead of Wiwan card t490s

[radiator]

Is it possibe to insert extra ssd disk into Wiwan port?If possitive what is the format (2242?) od the ssd and will it work witout extra settings/mods in bios/OS?

[RealBlackStuff]

Either get a proper 2242 M&B drive, or get a WD SN500 or SN520 in 2280 format and cut that down to 2242, as shown here.
My T480 has such a modified SN500.
2280 models are often cheaper than 2242, but not all 2280 can be cut down to size, so be warned.

[axur-delmeria]

According to this thread at the Thinkpad subreddit, support for WWAN SSDs on the T490s have been disabled in a BIOS update (only very old BIOS/UEFI versions allow it): https://www.reddit.com/r/thinkpad/comme ... d_upgrade/

[dandreye]

Hi All,

Any ideas if it'd work with T480s? If it would I could've added another 256GB SSD thereby avoiding a somwhat costly (~£100) main SSD upgrade, but it'd still be useful to know the right answer. I suppose it's a "no" because of the WWAN card whitelisting, and so would require BIOS modding the Middleton style?

Thanks in advance!

[RealBlackStuff]

Read my post above, T480/T480s both allow an extra WWAN-SSD.

[dandreye]

Read my post above, T480/T480s both allow an extra WWAN-SSD.

Oops sorry: don't know how I managed to miss it ) thank you!

[axur-delmeria]

Any ideas if it'd work with T480s?

It will definitely work.

https://www.reddit.com/r/thinkpad/comme ... d_success/

https://www.reddit.com/r/thinkpad/comme ... wwan_slot/

[dandreye]

It will definitely work.

@axur-delmeria, @RBS:
Thanks a lot for your replies! Btw do you happen to know if *all* T480s (at least the 20L7 and 20L8 models as I have 1 each) have just M-key w/o B-key in their WWAN slot? After reading it all and viewing some videos on YT I'm led to believe that that's the case, meaning that any NVMe SSD with M-key (no matter with B-key too or w/o it) that would mechanically fit into that slot, be it as is or through cutting it down to 2242 or extending it to 2242 would be fine. Btw thanks to Lenovo for not blocking it on this rare occasion

I now really feel a proud owner of a pair of T480s, in fact 3x by now after buying a touchscreen one a few days ago: no soldered-on RAM (well, just 1 out of 2) or WiFi cards or any other "beauties" seen in later T series models, and can even add another 256GB SSD sold at £15 apiece here

[axur-delmeria]

I have a T480s and have opened it up more than once. The WWAN slot is definitely B-key. This Kingspec SSD is known to work. The old WD SN520 and Toshiba RC100 also work.

Using M.2 2230 M-key SSDs with a short B+M to M-key adapter can be tricky, because most of these are straight-pin adapters (pin 1 to pin 1) with some of the M-key pins left unconnected because they're blocked by the B-key plastic. Problem is, some M-key SSDs expect a voltage rail in some of those pins, and won't power up if they're disconnected. You need to connect those pins to a voltage rail like this, or find an adapter that already has them connected. More details are in a deleted/archived post from the Thinkpad subreddit.

[dandreye]

I have a T480s and have opened it up more than once. The WWAN slot is definitely B-key.

Thank you for confirming it. Interestingly some claim theirs are different, e.g. the comment by kascadiac here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1JiESXkYF34 in response to casher8000.
Perhaps different T480s models have different keys? I'll open mine to be sure then.

Btw the imgur links no longer work for us here in the UK, referring here: https://help.imgur.com/hc/en-us/article ... ed-Kingdom .
But I think I'll be able to find all those parts anyway based on their description.

[axur-delmeria]

That video explicitly mentions that the T480s WWAN slot is B-key. Shame about not being able to access imgur.

It's hard to believe random comments on youtube especially when they don't even have links to photo evidence.

[dandreye]

That video explicitly mentions that the T480s WWAN slot is B-key.
...
It's hard to believe random comments on youtube especially when they don't even have links to photo evidence.

Generally yes, that particular comment by @kascadiac there just looked fairly convincing to me at first based on the language/wording.

Apparently the WWAN slots in two of my T480s (20L7 and 20L8) are B-key too. I'm somewhat hesitant about checking my new "touch" one for now: the seller put a warranty sticker on one of the lid screws saying their 1yr warranty will be void if it's undone.

Mad idea: why can I not just remove that B-key from their WWAN slot with a hot piece of metal? That slot will never see anything but an NVMe SSD if at all...

[axur-delmeria]

My T480s is a 20L8 with touchscreen. Has B-key WWAN slot.

[RealBlackStuff]

Why make it complicated when you can make it simple by getting the mentioned WD SN500/SN520?

[dandreye]

My T480s is a 20L8 with touchscreen. Has B-key WWAN slot.

So do both of mine. Hence wondering why can I not just remove that B-key from the WWAN slot to avoid being limited at the choice of NVMe SSDs?

Why make it complicated when you can make it simple by getting the mentioned WD SN500/SN520?

We don't look for easy ways Jokes aside, I just have several new 256GB Kioxia BG5 and BG6 SSDs lying around and doing nothing here (couldn't go by them selling at £15 apiece), so I'd just put one of them into each of my T480s and so double the storage size at no extra cost. Besides that I also read that the ones that would fit (like those WD SN500/SN520) were hard to find even dating back 5-6yrs when this topic came up (just looked up WD SN520 and found a few 256GB ones at ~£17, but they're 2280 and so would need sawing). So I thought removing the B-key from the WWAN slots would in fact be easier than anything else... Surprised this idea hasn't come up by now: guess I'm missing something?

[RealBlackStuff]

Nobody in their right mind voluntarily messes with laptop slots...

[dandreye]

Nobody in their right mind voluntarily messes with laptop slots...

Well after removing that Marvell SATA-PATA bridge chip in T43 making it "native SATA" I thought it's something quite normal for those on this forum... )

[axur-delmeria]

Well after removing that Marvell SATA-PATA bridge chip in T43 making it "native SATA" I thought it's something quite normal for those on this forum... )

In the end, that's your call to make. Personally, I'm more willing to mod an adapter (which can be cheaply replaced if I botch the soldering job) rather than risk an expensive system board. That said, the guy in one of your linked reddit posts actually removed the B-key slot connector and soldered in an M-key.

You probably don't need a hot metal rod to remove the plastic tab--a sharp hobby knife should be able to cut it.

[dandreye]

In the end, that's your call to make. Personally, I'm more willing to mod an adapter (which can be cheaply replaced if I botch the soldering job)

Agreed: I'll start with an adapter and keep the B-key my backup option. So my next goal is finding an adapter you described earlier (ideally a ready one that'd need no soldering).

Btw is it confirmed that there are only 2 PCIe lanes in the WWAN slot, hence half the speed?

[axur-delmeria]

Btw is it confirmed that there are only 2 PCIe lanes in the WWAN slot, hence half the speed?

T480s : main SSD: PCIe 3.0 x4; WWAN slot: PCIe 3.0 x1

Regular T480 : main SSD: PCIe 3.0 x2; WWAN slot: PCIe 3.0 x2

[dandreye]

T480s : main SSD: PCIe 3.0 x4; WWAN slot: PCIe 3.0 x1

Thank you. That's rather saddening, but even PCIe3x1 is still better than nothing. Wondering what max sequential and random speeds T480s owners are getting with it.

Done reading further stuff at the links shared above by now. Do I really have to mask "conflicting" pins 5 7 9 11 23 25 on any SSD (if plugged directly into the WWAN slot with the M-key removed or into one of those "key" adapters) as shown here? https://www.reddit.com/r/thinkpad/comme ... d_hacking/
Do I get it right that they need masking only on the SSDs that only have M-key alone shown there? E.g. some report just putting in a WD SN520 into the WWAN slot w/o doing anything else:
https://www.reddit.com/r/thinkpad/comme ... d_success/
Why do those B+M-key SSDs not get a conflict on those pins? Could it be that their pinout matches the B-key one rather than the M-key one? In fact a WD SN530 (which only has M-key) successfully used with a pin-to-pin adapter is reported here: https://web.archive.org/web/20250224013 ... atibility/ (based on https://www.reddit.com/r/thinkpad/comme ... king_2230/ )

I actually kinda like the idea with an adapter now, with that voltage rail for interop with any SSD. Just hope that the pie with it won't stick out too high. Unfortunately the adapter with the integrated voltage rail costs ~£50 in the only place I've seen it so far. For that money I'm definitely soldering it myself on a pin-to-pin one.

Update: just found a reasonably priced one looking same as the one with the voltage rail at a glance? https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005005218158216.html

[axur-delmeria]

PCIe 3.0 x1 bandwidth is around 900 megabytes/sec.

One possible problem with that kind of M.2 adapter is that it's a bit tall and the T480s bottom cover could hit the SSD.

The regular T480 being thicker has enough free space between the slot and bottom covr.

[dandreye]

PCIe 3.0 x1 bandwidth is around 900 megabytes/sec.

Well if that doesn't cap my current Kioxia BG5 SSD random read/write speeds in the main slot (~57/104MB/s resp.) once I move it to the WWAN slot I guess I'll be fine..

One possible problem with that kind of M.2 adapter is that it's a bit tall and the T480s bottom cover could hit the SSD. The regular T480 being thicker has enough free space between the slot and bottom covr.

Now putting in WD SN500/SN520 directly into the WWAN slot as proposed by @RBS looks like the easiest solution I'll probably still buy one of those adapters and give it a try though.

It'd still be great to better understand the whole theory behind masking those pins if possible, so that it's clear how to figure out which particular SSDs need it... One thing I definitely wouldn't like to risk is the motherboard and in fact even an SSD. Even though the only case of motherboard damage I've come across while reading about it all so far was when someone managed to insert his M-key SSD upside down somehow, seeing GND circuit of the slot meet a PCIe circuit of the SSD and vice versa doesn't look safe at all. In question are the "conflicting" circuits highlighted in red in the 1st picture here:
https://www.reddit.com/r/thinkpad/comme ... d_hacking/

[axur-delmeria]

It'd still be great to better understand the whole theory behind masking those pins if possible

The first image (with the B and M pinouts) of the reddit post is somewhat self-explanatory, in the sense that a B-key slot has different signals in those pins than what the M-key SSD expects (USB and GPIO signals in B-key, PCIe lanes in M-key).
It's a good idea to mask those pins, rather than guess/hope the SSD will figure out the offending pins aren't PCIe lanes.

[dandreye]

It's a good idea to mask those pins, rather than guess/hope the SSD will figure out the offending pins aren't PCIe lanes.

Exactly Thank you for confirming it.

Update: Ended up buying one of those adapters and a 256GB WD SN520 (2280 though: will need to drill and saw it). Will report back upon trying each of them.

[dandreye]

While awaiting my 2280 SN520 SSD from Ebay I've just noticed something in the middle of them all:
https://ibb.co/WNZ7Lc0c
Any ideas what it is and whether it can be removed when such SSD is cut down to the 2242 size?

[dcfbf]

That looks to be a data matrix code. It's ok to remove.

[RealBlackStuff]

Similar picture was printed on my 2280 WD SN500, no worries,

[dandreye]

Perfect: thank you!

[dandreye]

So the shortened SN520 is in and works: https://ibb.co/4n6bWsnf

Masking its pins turned out to be a job beyond my patience and eyesight, so I ended up plugging it in as is. Transfer mode is PCIe3x1 as expected. It's seen as the first disk though (e.g. Disk 1 in Minitool Partition Wizard, Disk 0 in CrystalDiskInfo). Just curious if their disk #s can be swapped around if desired?

Also I've seen it mentioned somewhere that there's no proper power management for an SSD in the WWAN slot, so it's always on. If it's confirmed is there a way to fix it so as to minimize power consumption when idle? Alternatively will disabling the SSD in DM help if I only use it on a rare occasion? smartclt says it doesn't support power states 3 and 4:

Supported Power States
St Op Max Active Idle RL RT WL WT Ent_Lat Ex_Lat
0 + 2.60W - - 0 0 0 0 0 0
1 + 2.60W - - 1 1 1 1 0 0
2 + 1.70W - - 2 2 2 2 0 0
3 - 0.0250W - - 3 3 3 3 5000 9000
4 - 0.0025W - - 4 4 4 4 5000 44000

But a different SSD in the main slot doesn't support them either... Also both SSDs show the same power states support and mapping in DM > Disk Drives > Properties > Details > Power Data:

Current power state:
D0

Power capabilities:
- 00000089
- PDCAP_D0_SUPPORTED
- PDCAP_D3_SUPPORTED
- PDCAP_WAKE_FROM_D3_SUPPORTED

Power state mappings:
S0 -> D0
S1 -> Unspecified
S2 -> Unspecified
S3 -> D3
S4 -> D3
S5 -> D3

Does it mean that my SN520 in the WWAN slot behaves "no worse" power wise vs the one in the main SSD slot?