T61 running W10 64bit -- Two problems (SOLVED!)

[Muse]

1. I've been getting BSODs. They are sporadic and without warning and seemingly out of nowhere. They started maybe 6 months ago and I've had a handful (maybe 5). I had a BSOD a few minutes ago and after the automatic restart, I looked in the system logs and Windows reports the error was a "bug check." A MEMORY.DMP file was created that's almost 500MB. I tried to open it with my text editor (metapad.exe), or Notepad, but access was denied.

2. When I take the machine out of sleep (S3), often the wifi is not restored and I have to run the network troubleshooter, which restarts the network adapter. Lately (the last couple days), I have to do this every time to get the adapter working. How can I fix this?

Do I have to reinstall Windows 10 to fix these things? I don't know if I have a backup.

System info:

Lenovo product ID 6465CTO
Lenovo ThinkPad T61
Intel Core 2 Duo @2.40GHz, T7700
Memory 4GB
640GB HD
VGA Intel 965 Express GMA X3100 128MB
Display WSXGA + TFT 15.4' resolution 1680x1050
Network Wireless Intel 4965 AGN

Edit (June 14, 2017) -- See the post in this thread dated June 14, 2017 for the details... I installed a different wifi card and both problems disappeared!

[Pokrzept]

1. Please check event logs located @ Control Panel/Administrative tools for further and more precise informations. Regarding *Pad apps - its capabilities are usually limited to small files, and you wont be able to open 500 MB *.dmp in it.
2. I may address the problem - it is Intels 4965 AGN driver, which is fairly bugged and cause this problem. The only solution for this problem is to replace WLAN card with a newer model. I may recommend you Intel 6200 or 6300. Purchase of the latter one is worthy only if your laptop is equipped with 3 antennas.

[Muse]

1. Please check event logs located @ Control Panel/Administrative tools for further and more precise informations. Regarding *Pad apps - its capabilities are usually limited to small files, and you wont be able to open 500 MB *.dmp in it.
2. I may address the problem - it is Intels 4965 AGN driver, which is fairly bugged and cause this problem. The only solution for this problem is to replace WLAN card with a newer model. I may recommend you Intel 6200 or 6300. Purchase of the latter one is worthy only if your laptop is equipped with 3 antennas.

What do you mean? Under Administrative Tools, there's Event Viewer, which is exactly where I went to find info on what is going on. "Bug Check" is what it says and the details suggest MEMORY.DMP. As I said, although that file is under 500MB, my text editors can't access the file (not that I think I can comprehend what's in it):
- - - -
+ System

- Provider

[ Name] Microsoft-Windows-WER-SystemErrorReporting
[ Guid] {ABCE23E7-DE45-4366-8631-84FA6C525952}
[ EventSourceName] BugCheck

- EventID 1001

[ Qualifiers] 16384

Version 0

Level 2

Task 0

Opcode 0

Keywords 0x80000000000000

- TimeCreated

[ SystemTime] 2017-02-22T09:02:26.708057300Z

EventRecordID 10249

Correlation

- Execution

[ ProcessID] 0
[ ThreadID] 0

Channel System

Computer PASSION

Security


- EventData

param1 0x000000d1 (0xffff818186f2c780, 0x0000000000000002, 0x0000000000000000, 0xfffff801100119d4)
param2 C:\WINDOWS\MEMORY.DMP
param3 b790cc79-cf38-48c9-b3b5-54f0eb1060c5

- - - -

[Muse]

Wow, I just had another BSOD, I was simply reading text on a website minding my business and POW! It displays info for 20-30 seconds and spontaneously reboots! This has to stop!

[RealBlackStuff]

Best stopped by dumping W10.
Go back to W7 or start learning Linux.

[TPFanatic]

1. Please check event logs located @ Control Panel/Administrative tools for further and more precise informations. Regarding *Pad apps - its capabilities are usually limited to small files, and you wont be able to open 500 MB *.dmp in it.
2. I may address the problem - it is Intels 4965 AGN driver, which is fairly bugged and cause this problem. The only solution for this problem is to replace WLAN card with a newer model. I may recommend you Intel 6200 or 6300. Purchase of the latter one is worthy only if your laptop is equipped with 3 antennas.

2. is your solution.

Advanced N-6205 is $4 on ebay, and 6300 is $6. Things are cheap. Or if you have any newer Thinkpads that don't need their cards, steal theirs. Intel 5100 from T500-era is good.

If you don't already have a WLAN whitelist BIOS (Middleton's is the best for T61), flash it first in a stable environment, so definitely not your current Windows 10.

[Muse]

Best stopped by dumping W10.
Go back to W7 or start learning Linux.

Could go back to W7. Linux won't work for me because I'm using a couple of apps that won't work in Linux. I seriously need those apps!

[Muse]

1. Please check event logs located @ Control Panel/Administrative tools for further and more precise informations. Regarding *Pad apps - its capabilities are usually limited to small files, and you wont be able to open 500 MB *.dmp in it.
2. I may address the problem - it is Intels 4965 AGN driver, which is fairly bugged and cause this problem. The only solution for this problem is to replace WLAN card with a newer model. I may recommend you Intel 6200 or 6300. Purchase of the latter one is worthy only if your laptop is equipped with 3 antennas.

2. is your solution.

Advanced N-6205 is $4 on ebay, and 6300 is $6. Things are cheap. Or if you have any newer Thinkpads that don't need their cards, steal theirs. Intel 5100 from T500-era is good.

If you don't already have a WLAN whitelist BIOS (Middleton's is the best for T61), flash it first in a stable environment, so definitely not your current Windows 10.

I'll buy another network card if the problem persists. At the moment, I have a workaround. I uninstalled the network card, but the problem remained. I then switched from the 2.4ghz band to the 5ghz band and the problem went away, at least the first two times I've brought the machine out of suspend, the 2nd time after at least 10 hours, so maybe I'm good... will see. I switched back to the 2.4ghz band a few months ago due to some issue that escapes my mind, but the 5ghz band seems to work on my T61, partly because it's only maybe 35' from my router.

The crashes, dunno. I ran sfc /scannow last night and Windows reported that it didn't find any problems to fix. I'm wondering if I have to restore a backup (if I can find one) or reinstall Win10. I'll reinstall if I have to.

In this thread from July http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.ph ... ead#unread I indicate that I'd just flashed the Middleton LENOVO 7LETC9WW (2.29 ) 03/18/2011 BIOS to the T61.

Thanks for the help!

[Muse]

So, I ordered a used Advanced N-6205 at Ebay, and it's on the way. When I install it, how can I get the correct driver installed for my T61? Will Windows 10 know where to find it and automatically configure it?

I got another BSOD a couple of days ago on this T61. I haven't done much troubleshooting on it, have been reading some threads. Some people have gone to great lengths to suss out the problem, just hair pulling stuff. I am wondering if a reinstall of Windows 10 would resolve the problem. I suppose it's a maybe, maybe not situation.

[kfzhu1229]

Try to reseat and clean the contact pins of the RAM sticks first things first and then run Windows Memory Diagnostic or Memtest86. I've gone through two of broken 512mb SDRAM sticks when I used Acer Translate 360 (identical to T23) with Windows Memory Diagnostic telling me problems found with either of those two sticks. FYI, if you found out that your machine will NEVER get a BSOD after a restart from BSOD while getting BSOD again after another shut off, it is 90% likely to be RAM failure.
Or you can just get 8GB and be done with the maximum upgrade as long as it is T61 not T60
As for the network adapter, a reseating and cleaning the golden pins always never hurt to try. It solved my same problem in a T43 and in a X220i.

[Muse]

Try to reseat and clean the contact pins of the RAM sticks first things first and then run Windows Memory Diagnostic or Memtest86. I've gone through two of broken 512mb SDRAM sticks when I used Acer Translate 360 (identical to T23) with Windows Memory Diagnostic telling me problems found with either of those two sticks. FYI, if you found out that your machine will NEVER get a BSOD after a restart from BSOD while getting BSOD again after another shut off, it is 90% likely to be RAM failure.
Or you can just get 8GB and be done with the maximum upgrade as long as it is T61 not T60
As for the network adapter, a reseating and cleaning the golden pins always never hurt to try. It solved my same problem in a T43 and in a X220i.

I reread that underlined sentence a few times and still can't wrap my head around it. Did you say it exactly as you meant? I'm really curious because it's been a pretty major problem. I don't leave the machine on a lot, usually put it into suspend when not in use, but I think I've had 1/2 dozen BSODs in the last 4-6 months or so. When it happens it's a shock, of course, anything I'm doing is lost.

Your idea of cleaning the pins of memory sticks or cards is very interesting. I may have done that once or twice but that's all. I have two other machines, both mid-tower systems, that have had problems with lockups or crash-to-POST. I ran memtest+ about a week ago on one of the machines... it crashed multiple times in a day or so. Memtest+ found two errors in each of 2 passes. I haven't pursued the problem yet. I think, based on what you're saying, that I should first off clean the contacts on the RAM sticks, maybe blow some compressed gas on the slots too, then reseat the RAM, run at least another pass with memtest+. I did some internet searching and saw recommendations to test sticks individually and at least 8 passes each! I think it may have said to do this in all the slots! That would take a really long time. The machine in question right now has 3 sticks and 3 slots. I think it might take me most of a week to do all that testing!

BTW, this T61 (which has been getting the BSODs and is running Windows 10 64bit) already has 8GB RAM in it.

[kfzhu1229]

And yea from my experience, the sticks with maximum capacity for the type are usually more prone to breaking. I have come through 1 broken 128mb PC66 stick, 1 broken 256mb PC100 stick, two broken 512mb PC133 SDRAM sticks, and 1 broken 1GB DDR stick. All of which either creates a bluescreen every other boot, and/or freezes the computer every other boot. Yea I REALLY think you should at least try cleaning & reseating the RAM sticks and WLAN card. Those are the stuff that never hurts to try. I don't think it is too necessary for you to spend THAT amount of time but if you REALLY want to say goodbye the stability issues ONCE AND FOR ALL, go right ahead.

[Muse]

1. Please check event logs located @ Control Panel/Administrative tools for further and more precise informations. Regarding *Pad apps - its capabilities are usually limited to small files, and you wont be able to open 500 MB *.dmp in it.
2. I may address the problem - it is Intels 4965 AGN driver, which is fairly bugged and cause this problem. The only solution for this problem is to replace WLAN card with a newer model. I may recommend you Intel 6200 or 6300. Purchase of the latter one is worthy only if your laptop is equipped with 3 antennas.

I got the impression from this that the 6205 would do, so I ordered that. Today, I tried installing it and found that my Intel 4965 AGN is a 3 antenna card and is almost double the length of the Intel Advanced 6205 I just received. I noticed a place where the shorter card is evidently supposed to go, but it requires much shorter screws than the Intel 4965 AGN uses and I don't have those screws so I can't install this 2 antenna card (I assume I'd use the two outside connectors for the shorter card, numbers 1 and 3.

So, lacking the screws I suppose I should order the 6300 or equivalent 3 antenna card, for which I assume my current 2 screws will fit. I'm still getting BSOD's, I haven't addressed that yet. Should reseat the RAM, maybe run memtest+.

[Cigarguy]

I would find out why it's crashing before ordering any replacement parts. What's the temp like? If temp is not the problem may start removing parts and see if it still crashes.

[RealBlackStuff]

For half-size wifi cards there are half-size brackets, such as: http://www.ebay.com/itm/231859656304

[Muse]

For half-size wifi cards there are half-size brackets, such as: http://www.ebay.com/itm/231859656304

Yeah, I saw some of those after posting... for around $2 shipped. Figured that would work. However, they are evidently for full slots. My T61 appears to have a full slot and a separate 1/2 slot. Only thing missing is a couple of screws and I could use the 6205 card I just got.

Here's a question: Since I have 3 antenna cables... is it worthwhile getting the 6300 3 antenna card or just use the 6205 card I just got with 2 antenna connections? I may actually have some screws, I realized this afternoon that I have a large collection of tiny screws and there's a fair chance I have what I need to mount the 6205.

I'm wondering if any of these cards come with the screws. Obviously, screws are needed.

[RealBlackStuff]

In every T61/T61p you can fit a full-size (or half-size + bracket) wifi card.
The half-size slot (if there at all) is for wireless USB, not for a regular wifi-card.

[Muse]

In every T61/T61p you can fit a full-size (or half-size + bracket) wifi card.
The half-size slot (if there at all) is for wireless USB, not for a regular wifi-card.

Oh! So I have to use the full size slot then and require the bracket... I'll order now. It's from China, but not hurries.

Question: Is it worth it to get the 6300 instead of the 6205 I just received? How likely is it to make a significant difference? Thanks for the help!

[RealBlackStuff]

Why don't you do a bit of searching on eBay?
Those brackets are available from many sellers, incl. USA.
Or read more postings on the forum...
Those wifi cards and their use have also been discussed all over the place...

[Muse]

Why don't you do a bit of searching on eBay?
Those brackets are available from many sellers, incl. USA.
Or read more postings on the forum...
Those wifi cards and their use have also been discussed all over the place...

I ordered a couple of those brackets from a NYC seller today, $1.87 and free shipping, should have by Tuesday. The great majority on ebay are from China and the ETA is late March to May 3. No way I want to wait until possibly May.

My question now is whether it's worth it for me to buy a 3 antenna card or stick with the 2 antenna Intel Advanced 6205 I just received (and won't be able to install until I get the bracket). If the benefit is minimal I'll just stick with the 6205. I'll try searching for more info. I did search today, but didn't find the info I want (as stated above in this post, OK with 2 antenna or spend another ~$8 for a 3 antenna).

[Cigarguy]

Can't go wrong with the 3 antenna 6300 or Atheros 9380. If you have a machine that only have 2 antennas, then no harm no foul. If you have a machine that takes 3, the extra antenna is a benefit. Seriously don't over think it. Can't go wrong either way.

[Muse]

Can't go wrong with the 3 antenna 6300 or Atheros 9380. If you have a machine that only have 2 antennas, then no harm no foul. If you have a machine that takes 3, the extra antenna is a benefit. Seriously don't over think it. Can't go wrong either way.

OK, thank you. I'll order a 3 antenna card. Was just wondering if it's a real advantage over a 2 antenna card, which I have just bought. Only paid $4.55 for that, so no big deal. Will see if I can return it, anyway. 6300 is mainly from China, so it's a wait, but no hurry situation.

I cleaned and reseated my RAM and Wifi card in this machine, will leave it on and see if it crashes. Also ran Memtest on the RAM for 8 hours, 5 passes, no errors.

[Cigarguy]

Assuming it's not just Windows 10 that is crashing on you, I would find out what's causing the crashes. If you're getting the same problem running a live Linux distro or Windows 7 then you can assume you got a hardware issue somewhere.

You might be having crashes due to CPU temp problems. Download HWMonitor and look closely at your CPU core temps. Idle should be around 40ish deg C. Under load it should not go higher than 90 deg C. Beyond 90 deg C you'll get instability. I use Prime95 to load the CPU.

Also test the RAM. I use Memtest86 from the Parted Magic boot disc and run it for about 8 passes (8-16 hours depending on the system). Typically bad RAM will produce a multitude of errors within the first minute or two.

Another good idea is to remove everything but the bare essentials. Remove the wifi card, WWAN (if any), modem, HDD, SSD, etc. Run only the essentials. Then install one component at a time and check to see if that is the issue.

[Muse]

So, I ordered an Intel 6300 (from China).

I haven't gotten any crashes on this T61 since cleaning the RAM sticks and the Intel 4965 AGN card and reinserting them. It's been around 12 hours, so I'm optimistic. Nothing certain, though, because I was getting the BSODs at a rate of about 1/month.

I have a question: I haven't installed the Intel Centrino Advanced-N 6205 WLAN 802.11A/B/G/N Wireless Card I just bought because it has only 2 antenna connections and my T61 will accommodate 3, therefore my ordering the Intel 6300. I set up a return for the 6205, but I'm wondering if I can keep it, if it will work in my 1953CTO T60, which has the original ThinkPad 11a/b/g Wi-Fi wireless LAN Mini-PCIe. Would the Intel 6205 work in it and be a worthwhile upgrade?

[kfzhu1229]

I haven't gotten any crashes on this T61 since cleaning the RAM sticks and the Intel 4965 AGN card and reinserting them. It's been around 12 hours, so I'm optimistic. Nothing certain, though, because I was getting the BSODs at a rate of about 1/month.

Don't forget to run diagnostics on the RAM sticks either by Windows Memory Diagnostic or Memtest86. At least run a full check several times once with both sticks on, that can be done when you are sleeping. (and you can even set the amount of times to infinity at that) As for Windows Memory Diagnostic, don't worry about missing the bubble (Windows 6.x) / push (Windows 10) notification about the no problems detected hint after it finishes the selected amount of checks and boot straight to Windows, as a big warning window appear instead if there are problems (I have encountered that before so I know for sure) and whether there is a problem or not, it will appear in event viewer anyways.

[Muse]

In every T61/T61p you can fit a full-size (or half-size + bracket) wifi card.
The half-size slot (if there at all) is for wireless USB, not for a regular wifi-card.

What is wireless USB? I looked it up and am still not clear. Does a card in that position allow you to use a USB wireless "dongle"? What is the advantage of that to having a "regular" wireless card in a Thinkpad?

[Muse]

I haven't gotten any crashes on this T61 since cleaning the RAM sticks and the Intel 4965 AGN card and reinserting them. It's been around 12 hours, so I'm optimistic. Nothing certain, though, because I was getting the BSODs at a rate of about 1/month.

Don't forget to run diagnostics on the RAM sticks either by Windows Memory Diagnostic or Memtest86. At least run a full check several times once with both sticks on, that can be done when you are sleeping. (and you can even set the amount of times to infinity at that) As for Windows Memory Diagnostic, don't worry about missing the bubble (Windows 6.x) / push (Windows 10) notification about the no problems detected hint after it finishes the selected amount of checks and boot straight to Windows, as a big warning window appear instead if there are problems (I have encountered that before so I know for sure) and whether there is a problem or not, it will appear in event viewer anyways.

I did run Memtest+ on the 2 sticks of current memory (2GB each), 5 passes a day or so ago. I didn't set anything in Memtest, just let it run as is, booting from CD... ver 4.3.7 IIRC, no errors reported, it was over 8 hours.

[Muse]

I'm wondring if I can replace the original Wifi card in one of my T60's (the one I'm typing on, 1953CTO): current wifi card is ThinkPad 11a/b/g Wi-Fi wireless LAN Mini-PCIe

Since I have now an unused Intel Centrino Advanced-N 6205 WLAN 802.11A/B/G/N Wireless Card (that I could return).

Is it possible to use this in my 1953CTO T60?

This T60's current BIOS is this: LENOVO 79ETE6WW (2.26 ) 04/01/2010

Does that BIOS have a whitelist that would prevent use of the Intel Advanced-N 6205?

If I install a modded BIOS that removes the whitelist, will the 6205 work in it?

I have an N router, but keep this T60 far enough from the router that 5GHz band may not work as well as the 2.4GHz band. But might it still be better to have the 6205 in it than the current 11a/b/g Wifi card?

[Muse]

Best stopped by dumping W10.
Go back to W7 or start learning Linux.

The problem of no network/internet connectivity when resuming Windows:

A support specialist at my ISP suggested unchecking an option for my adapter, the one for allowing Windows to turn off power to the adapter to save power when the machine is in suspend. Doing so has pretty much stopped that problem. I received my 6300, haven't installed it yet, probably will, but it's obviously not a priority now.

However, the T61 running Windows 10 64bit BSOD problem persists. I get them occasionally, and of course, they are a PITA.

My T60 running Win10 32bit has no such problem. I'm wondering if a reinstall of Win10 64 bit on this machine will stop the problem. I'm thinking yes because the machine didn't have this problem until quite a while after the installation of the OS. I ran memtest+ on the 4GB of RAM but see no errors after many passes.

[thinkpadcollection]

For your T61 with W10-64, get another set of memory sticks like micron, hynix, elpida 4GB 2x 2GB set and see what happens.

Cheers, thinkpadcollection