Thinkpadders, do NOT Rejoice, WEEP and/or DESPAIR!

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Thinkpad4by3
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Re: Thinkpadders, do NOT Rejoice, WEEP and/or DESPAIR!

#1771 Post by Thinkpad4by3 » Mon Oct 09, 2017 6:21 pm

exTPfan wrote:
Mon Oct 09, 2017 5:56 pm
Of course, the narcissists would complain that there is no room for a selfie webcam, and the airheads would complain of the black bars on their videos, but they only make up 46.1% of the population.
When there is a will, there is a way:

Nobody complained too much when LG did this:

Image

Now we only have to deal with 23.8% of the population
Welcome to the jungle, we have FrankenPads
If you want it you're going to bleed, but that is the price to pay
And you're a very rare mobo, very hard to get
You can see the blinky lights, but you won't get them for free.

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Re: Thinkpadders, do NOT Rejoice, WEEP and/or DESPAIR!

#1772 Post by Ibthink » Mon Oct 09, 2017 6:28 pm

Thinkpad4by3 wrote:
Mon Oct 09, 2017 6:21 pm
Nobody complained too much when LG did this
How come everyone complains about this with Dells XPS 13? Literally one of the biggest complaints about that machine.
exTPfan wrote:
Mon Oct 09, 2017 5:56 pm
instead of the 14 inch 12.20x6.86 (16x9) screen they could have put in a 14.7 inch 12.23x8.15 (3x2) screen
That would look very awkward with big side-bezels and no bezels at all on the top or bottom. Its also doubtful a screen this tall can fit into the chassis at all.
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Re: Thinkpadders, do NOT Rejoice, WEEP and/or DESPAIR!

#1773 Post by exTPfan » Mon Oct 09, 2017 6:40 pm

@IBthink. What are you talking about? A 12.25x8.15 screen in a 13.35x9.15 computer would allow half-inch bezels on all sides. They could do that 10 year ago. Are you arguing they can't do it now?

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Re: Thinkpadders, do NOT Rejoice, WEEP and/or DESPAIR!

#1774 Post by Thinkpad4by3 » Mon Oct 09, 2017 6:45 pm

exTPfan wrote:@IBthink. What are you talking about? A 12.25x8.15 screen in a 13.35x9.15 computer would allow half-inch bezels on all sides. They could do that 10 year ago. Are you arguing they can't do it now?
99% of screens produces now have the driver on the bottom. That means you must account for about an 1.25" on the bottom for the driver. People dont want 5/16" LCDs anymore.
Welcome to the jungle, we have FrankenPads
If you want it you're going to bleed, but that is the price to pay
And you're a very rare mobo, very hard to get
You can see the blinky lights, but you won't get them for free.

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Re: Thinkpadders, do NOT Rejoice, WEEP and/or DESPAIR!

#1775 Post by Ibthink » Mon Oct 09, 2017 6:58 pm

Thinkpad4by3 wrote:
Mon Oct 09, 2017 6:45 pm
99% of screens produces now have the driver on the bottom. That means you must account for about an 1.25" on the bottom for the driver. People dont want 5/16" LCDs anymore.
Not only that, there is also portion of the chassis that unusable as screen surface-area because of the hinges.
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Re: Thinkpadders, do NOT Rejoice, WEEP and/or DESPAIR!

#1776 Post by Thinkpad4by3 » Mon Oct 09, 2017 7:10 pm

Ibthink wrote:
Mon Oct 09, 2017 6:58 pm
Thinkpad4by3 wrote:
Mon Oct 09, 2017 6:45 pm
99% of screens produces now have the driver on the bottom. That means you must account for about an 1.25" on the bottom for the driver. People dont want 5/16" LCDs anymore.
Not only that, there is also portion of the chassis that unusable as screen surface-area because of the hinges.
@exTPfan. Almost all the space in the LCD assembly is used up.

This is the T460s LCD assembly

RED: LCD Mounting
YELLOW: WiFi/WWAN Antennas
GREEN: LCD
CYAN: Webcam
BLUE: Hinges
PURPLE: LCD Driver board

Image

I don't see any usable wasted space. They could in theory remove the webcam and place it somewhere else, but it is a business machine. You need to be able to make Skype calls and be presentable.
Welcome to the jungle, we have FrankenPads
If you want it you're going to bleed, but that is the price to pay
And you're a very rare mobo, very hard to get
You can see the blinky lights, but you won't get them for free.

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Re: Thinkpadders, do NOT Rejoice, WEEP and/or DESPAIR!

#1777 Post by Edward Mendelson » Mon Oct 09, 2017 8:22 pm

EDIT: I spoke too soon - it seems to be available again...

Well, I wasn't especially tempted to buy it, but I was curious about the options, so I clicked on the Add to Cart button and Lenovo responded:

No Stock for the Product 20K70004US

So it's gone from the US site (also Canada, I think). It doesn't seem to be available in Europe, and Japan says it will be available on November 7.

It's just as well I've already got Too Many ThinkPads™.

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Re: Thinkpadders, do NOT Rejoice, WEEP and/or DESPAIR!

#1778 Post by Thinkpad4by3 » Mon Oct 09, 2017 9:05 pm

I think this sums up the last two weeks pretty well.

Image
Welcome to the jungle, we have FrankenPads
If you want it you're going to bleed, but that is the price to pay
And you're a very rare mobo, very hard to get
You can see the blinky lights, but you won't get them for free.

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Re: Thinkpadders, do NOT Rejoice, WEEP and/or DESPAIR!

#1779 Post by Saucey » Mon Oct 09, 2017 9:41 pm

Thanks for the laugh Thinkpad4by3 :D

After watching Google's announcement of their new PixelBook, it looks like I'm going to bite the bullet and get it.

I've been considering the Pixel 2 (laptop) for awhile, because it can run android apps and my original Pixel (laptop) cannot.
The screen is great on that thing, but seeing google is making the PixelBook run head on with the Microsoft Surface, not just having an ultrabook like the original two Pixels.

Yeah android and chrome botnet, but I'm perfectly fine with that. I'd wonder how well that 2400 x 1600 display looks like, I think it's a 4:3 aspect ratio.
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Re: Thinkpadders, do NOT Rejoice, WEEP and/or DESPAIR!

#1780 Post by Thinkpad4by3 » Mon Oct 09, 2017 9:47 pm

2400/1600 = 6/4 =3/2.

1.25 vs 1.33 isnt that big of a difference.
Welcome to the jungle, we have FrankenPads
If you want it you're going to bleed, but that is the price to pay
And you're a very rare mobo, very hard to get
You can see the blinky lights, but you won't get them for free.

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Re: Thinkpadders, do NOT Rejoice, WEEP and/or DESPAIR!

#1781 Post by Saucey » Mon Oct 09, 2017 10:07 pm

Thinkpad4by3 wrote:
Mon Oct 09, 2017 9:47 pm
2400/1600 = 6/4 =3/2.

1.25 vs 1.33 isnt that big of a difference.
Oh nice, even better. So it's properly aligned with the Pixel laptops then.
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Re: Thinkpadders, do NOT Rejoice, WEEP and/or DESPAIR!

#1782 Post by dr_st » Tue Oct 10, 2017 12:24 am

Thinkpad4by3 wrote:
Mon Oct 09, 2017 4:20 pm
Intel knows how to make a GPU. No matter how much faster the nVidia is, we all know it will have some issue from drivers to internal stress fractures. It's nVidia.
For certain activities (not just games) - it really does matter.

Intel's drivers can also be a pain in the neck sometimes.
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Re: Thinkpadders, do NOT Rejoice, WEEP and/or DESPAIR!

#1783 Post by Utwig » Tue Oct 10, 2017 2:10 am

Well, it's not worse than T420s I'm typing this on though I was expecting more from them in terms of screen and overall classic look. I'll probably still get one.
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Re: Thinkpadders, do NOT Rejoice, WEEP and/or DESPAIR!

#1784 Post by Summilux » Tue Oct 10, 2017 7:02 am

Ibthink wrote:
Mon Oct 09, 2017 6:28 pm
Thinkpad4by3 wrote:
Mon Oct 09, 2017 6:21 pm
Nobody complained too much when LG did this
How come everyone complains about this with Dells XPS 13? Literally one of the biggest complaints about that machine.
Yeah, I've seen these complaints in the reviews. That's pathetic. It's just a freaking webcam. What has the world come to.
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Re: Thinkpadders, do NOT Rejoice, WEEP and/or DESPAIR!

#1785 Post by Thinkpad4by3 » Tue Oct 10, 2017 7:05 am

dr_st wrote:
Thinkpad4by3 wrote:
Mon Oct 09, 2017 4:20 pm
Intel knows how to make a GPU. No matter how much faster the nVidia is, we all know it will have some issue from drivers to internal stress fractures. It's nVidia.
For certain activities (not just games) - it really does matter.

Intel's drivers can also be a pain in the neck sometimes.
I never said NOT to use nVidia. I said that it will have more problems. I currently use an nVidia GTX 980 and it blows HD graphics out of the water and to pluto and back. Its fast. Ive also had more graphics issues on that one card than every Intel Graphics macgine I have, combined.
Welcome to the jungle, we have FrankenPads
If you want it you're going to bleed, but that is the price to pay
And you're a very rare mobo, very hard to get
You can see the blinky lights, but you won't get them for free.

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Re: Thinkpadders, do NOT Rejoice, WEEP and/or DESPAIR!

#1786 Post by jdrou » Tue Oct 10, 2017 6:12 pm

Ibthink wrote:
Mon Oct 09, 2017 6:28 pm
Thinkpad4by3 wrote:
Mon Oct 09, 2017 6:21 pm
Nobody complained too much when LG did this
How come everyone complains about this with Dells XPS 13? Literally one of the biggest complaints about that machine.
I thought the complaint about XPS 13 was that the webcam is way over on the left side less than an inch from the edge.
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Re: Thinkpadders, do NOT Rejoice, WEEP and/or DESPAIR!

#1787 Post by pianowizard » Wed Oct 11, 2017 7:57 am

dr_st wrote:
Sat Oct 07, 2017 11:19 pm
Lenovo itself calls it "T25" in some places...
https://pcsupport.lenovo.com/jp/th/prod ... s/pd500006
Someday someone might update the T23 with modern innards and call it "T24". Things would get extremely confusing if the Thinkpad 25 is called T25. "TP25" is a much more future-proof name. If "WQHD" bothers you (because it should be "QHD"), "T25" should bother you more.

Many people at Lenovo probably no longer remember the existence of the T20/21/22/23. If they did, they wouldn't refer to the Thinkpad 25 as T25.
Thinkpad4by3 wrote:
Mon Oct 09, 2017 6:21 pm
Nobody complained too much when LG did this:
Because no one buys LG laptops?
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Re: Thinkpadders, do NOT Rejoice, WEEP and/or DESPAIR!

#1788 Post by dr_st » Wed Oct 11, 2017 8:08 am

pianowizard wrote:
Wed Oct 11, 2017 7:57 am
Someday someone might update the T23 with modern innards and call it "T24". Things would get extremely confusing if the Thinkpad 25 is called T25. "TP25" is a much more future-proof name. If "WQHD" bothers you (because it should be "QHD"), "T25" should bother you more.

Many people at Lenovo probably no longer remember the existence of the T20/21/22/23. If they did, they wouldn't refer to the Thinkpad 25 as T25.
It doesn't matter what bothers me and what should bother me. For instance, I stopped arguing with people about the resolution names; you cannot correct everyone or even 50% of the people. And if enough people adopt something, even if it's originally wrong, it eventually becomes accepted. Think of the original pronunciation of "either/neither" and many more such examples.

In the case of the Thinkpad, Lenovo's name for it carries additional weight, because it's their product. Ultimately, whatever they choose - will stick. I don't really care enough or find it important enough to argue about it.
Last edited by dr_st on Wed Oct 11, 2017 8:10 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Thinkpadders, do NOT Rejoice, WEEP and/or DESPAIR!

#1789 Post by lophiomys » Wed Oct 11, 2017 8:10 am

lets call it MP25 ... for MarketingPad 25 .
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Re: Thinkpadders, do NOT Rejoice, WEEP and/or DESPAIR!

#1790 Post by RealBlackStuff » Wed Oct 11, 2017 8:32 am

FlopTop or T25-Retard would probably me more appropriate

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Re: Thinkpadders, do NOT Rejoice, WEEP and/or DESPAIR!

#1791 Post by lophiomys » Wed Oct 11, 2017 8:42 am

I think T25-Retard is very appropriate.
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Re: Thinkpadders, do NOT Rejoice, WEEP and/or DESPAIR!

#1792 Post by oeuvre » Wed Oct 11, 2017 11:59 am

I've seen a couple unboxing videos... it comes with chocolate?
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Re: Thinkpadders, do NOT Rejoice, WEEP and/or DESPAIR!

#1793 Post by Thinkpad4by3 » Wed Oct 11, 2017 12:01 pm

DuncePad?
Welcome to the jungle, we have FrankenPads
If you want it you're going to bleed, but that is the price to pay
And you're a very rare mobo, very hard to get
You can see the blinky lights, but you won't get them for free.

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Re: Thinkpadders, do NOT Rejoice, WEEP and/or DESPAIR!

#1794 Post by theterminator93 » Wed Oct 11, 2017 4:10 pm

oeuvre wrote:
Wed Oct 11, 2017 11:59 am
I've seen a couple unboxing videos... it comes with chocolate?
What? No...

It comes with a small booklet, three extra TrackPoint caps, and the AC adapter and battery inside the box.
Daily: T25 | W520 i7-2860QM·Quadro 2000m·IPS FHD | T420 i7-2640M·NVS 4200m·IPS FHD | X220 i7-2640M | T601F T9900·NVS 140M·IPS UXGA
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Re: Thinkpadders, do NOT Rejoice, WEEP and/or DESPAIR!

#1795 Post by oeuvre » Wed Oct 11, 2017 7:07 pm

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Re: Thinkpadders, do NOT Rejoice, WEEP and/or DESPAIR!

#1796 Post by Thinkpad4by3 » Wed Oct 11, 2017 7:13 pm

Lenovo executive: How should we split the design costs for TP25?

Lenovo Employee #1: How about we just put a new motherboard in a T420s. It should be about 20 mil.

Lenovo executive: Any cheaper ideas?

Lenovo (Idiot) Employee #2: How about we release the T470 with a chicony cheap keyboard. It can be done in 3 mil. Then we can spend another 10 mil redesigning the box.

Lenovo executive: Why do we have to redesign the box?

Lenovo Idiot: So that we can distract the customer from how bad the machine really is.

Lenovo executive: Perfect plan!
Welcome to the jungle, we have FrankenPads
If you want it you're going to bleed, but that is the price to pay
And you're a very rare mobo, very hard to get
You can see the blinky lights, but you won't get them for free.

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Re: Thinkpadders, do NOT Rejoice, WEEP and/or DESPAIR!

#1797 Post by theterminator93 » Wed Oct 11, 2017 8:03 pm

No idea what #1 is. #2 shows what I got but there's an extra thing in there that wasn't a part of the package I received. Opening the box and lifting the lid, there's a small booklet in the center of a cardboard setting sleeve (what you see at 4 seconds in video 2); removing that, the laptop was in a cellulose slip cover (12 seconds) - and under that was the battery and AC adapter.

No idea what that second giant box comes from. Maybe it was a special gift given to advance reviewers.
Daily: T25 | W520 i7-2860QM·Quadro 2000m·IPS FHD | T420 i7-2640M·NVS 4200m·IPS FHD | X220 i7-2640M | T601F T9900·NVS 140M·IPS UXGA
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Re: Thinkpadders, do NOT Rejoice, WEEP and/or DESPAIR!

#1798 Post by shawross » Wed Oct 11, 2017 9:55 pm

I have seen worse presented products for what the presentation is worth to each customer YMMV.
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