Who is using Internet Explorer 7 ?

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#31 Post by **tomh009** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 10:33 pm

Manarius wrote:IE7 is nice, but it still loads slower than FireFox.

How often do you reload your browser? I never close the browser unless I'm restarting my X31, and I only do that a few times a week.

Manarius · #32 Post by **Manarius** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 12:49 am

tomh009 wrote:How often do you reload your browser? I never close the browser unless I'm restarting my X31, and I only do that a few times a week.

No, I mean the engine. The Firefox engine is a million times faster than the IE engine. Pages physically load faster on firefox, regardless of internet speed.

skanky · #33 Post by **skanky** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 7:25 am

Manarius wrote:Yeah, I htink I have Firefox 2.0 RC2 and the memory usage is HORRIBLE!! (Like 100mb memory for like 6 tabs, it's disgusting).
img]http://img350.imageshack.us/img350/7926 ... hothe9.jpg[/img]

IE7 is nice, but it's still loads slower than FireFox.

No to Opera 'cause its full version ain't free.

Netscape is all right, but it's bloaty.

im still using 1.5.0.7 --24 tabs open and only using about 130mb, if thats the state of 2.0 RC2, then im going to wait till its sorted out..

#34 Post by **jdhurst** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 7:47 am

Manarius wrote:<snip>No, I mean the engine. The Firefox engine is a million times faster than the IE engine. Pages physically load faster on firefox, regardless of internet speed.

Interesting - I don't see that. Firefox in my Linux machine is no faster than IE on my Windows machine. The newest versions of any browser require a fast computer to render a page quickly, and my computers seem to be fast enough for that. ... JD Hurst

K0LO · #35 Post by **K0LO** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 7:56 am

I don't see that either. I put a 500 kB web page on my desktop and opened it in both IE7 and Firefox and it took less than 0.5 sec on each. However, to open each browser is a different story. IE opens in 1 second and Firefox opens in 8 seconds.

As for feel, IE7 feels faster. I know, that's subjective. On the other hand, IE7's user interface is horrible. Firefox's is so much better and so customizable to your individual preferences.

#36 Post by **tomh009** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 8:37 am

k0lo wrote:I don't see that either. I put a 500 kB web page on my desktop and opened it in both IE7 and Firefox and it took less than 0.5 sec on each. However, to open each browser is a different story. IE opens in 1 second and Firefox opens in 8 seconds.

As for feel, IE7 feels faster. I know, that's subjective.

I think the reason IE7 feels faster is that it does a better job of rendering in-progress pages (ones where not all the images have been loaded yet), so the pages generally become readable more quickly. Although I haven't tried Firefox 2.0 yet to see whether it has improved in this regard ...

ronbo613 · #37 Post by **ronbo613** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 10:25 am

I've installed IE7 on my PC. Looks like they've just copied Firefox features they know are popular, but, if you're asking, I still think that Firefox is the overall better browser. The fact that IE7 browser add-ons cost money is almost as pitiful as the bogus minimum computer specs on the box of Microsoft's new flight simulator.
Personally, I prefer Firefox but I have to use IE to see how my company websites look because, no matter what, the vast majority of computer users will use IE.

K0LO · #38 Post by **K0LO** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 10:39 am

Have you tried the Firefox extension IE Tab? It allows you to switch to the IE rendering engine from within Firefox. You can put up your web page on two Firefox tabs side-by-side to compare how they will look using both the Gecko and the IE rendering engines. Best of both worlds.

Badger · #39 Post by **Badger** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 11:22 am

Does IE7 look blurry to anyone else?

#40 Post by **GomJabbar** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 12:03 pm

Badger wrote:Does IE7 look blurry to anyone else?

I just installed IE7 this morning. When I first launched it, there was a settings page where one box was checked to: Always use ClearType to view web pages (recommended). I unchecked the box before I saved the changes, and I don't notice any difference in clarity. I suspect you are seeing Clear Type in action.

On a second note, after installing IE7, I went to Windows Update and downloaded and installed (2) updates. The first one went fine, but the second one KB914440 failed. KB914440 is the Network Diagnostics tool. I rebooted and tried again, and it still failed to install. I went to the Microsoft forums, and another user there posted that IE7 will cause the installation of KB914440 to fail.

Deckard · #41 Post by **Deckard** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 1:23 pm

I was on the same page as GomJabbar did after installing IE7, I have that option checked, it doesn't look blurry at all.

Gomjabbar, after installing IE7, I was too prompted to install those two updates, which went just fine. Maybe there's a way to install it manually.

ronbo613 · #42 Post by **ronbo613** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 1:25 pm

Have you tried the Firefox extension IE Tab?

I'm still using IE View 1.3.1.
Firefox 2.0 Final is out, but the servers are pretty overloaded. Now we can have a real head-to-head browser shootout.

smugiri · #43 Post by **smugiri** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 1:48 pm

Manarius wrote:
tomh009 wrote:How often do you reload your browser? I never close the browser unless I'm restarting my X31, and I only do that a few times a week.
No, I mean the engine. The Firefox engine is a million times faster than the IE engine. Pages physically load faster on firefox, regardless of internet speed.

Not sure what "Pages physically load faster on firefox, regardless of internet speed" means in this context, sounds like gobbledygook to me. Correct me if I am wrong but this cannot be a discussion on performance times for data fetches from web server disk over the web to your local machine as these are the only physical processes that I can think of in this context.

Rendering on screen (which is the only task a web browser does) has no physical aspect to it.

Badger · #44 Post by **Badger** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 2:35 pm

GomJabbar wrote:
Badger wrote:Does IE7 look blurry to anyone else?
I just installed IE7 this morning. When I first launched it, there was a settings page where one box was checked to: Always use ClearType to view web pages (recommended). I unchecked the box before I saved the changes, and I don't notice any difference in clarity. I suspect you are seeing Clear Type in action.

Thank you, I had to reset my settings to get that page to show up again, but disabling ClearType makes it looks 100x times better.

Dead1nside · #45 Post by **Dead1nside** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 4:43 pm

Coming from a background of Mozilla Suite use then Firefox. Internet Explorer 7, like many have already said, seems to look visually a lot like Firefox. It is certainly a lot better than Internet Explorer 6, and it's growing support for standards will only help.

However, I remain a Firefox user.

Deckard · #46 Post by **Deckard** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 5:30 pm

ronbo613 wrote:
Have you tried the Firefox extension IE Tab?
I'm still using IE View 1.3.1.
Firefox 2.0 Final is out, but the servers are pretty overloaded. Now we can have a real head-to-head browser shootout.

Thanks for the heads up. Downloaded and installed it. Working like a charm.

christopher_wolf · #47 Post by **christopher_wolf** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 6:34 pm

That link appears to be broken; I found a mirror site where you can get FF 2.0 in *.exe format and in English; up a directory and you will find versions with other localisations.

EDIT: I am trying the final version out right now.

Manarius · #48 Post by **Manarius** » Tue Oct 24, 2006 3:44 pm

smugiri wrote:Not sure what "Pages physically load faster on firefox, regardless of internet speed" means in this context, sounds like gobbledygook to me. Correct me if I am wrong but this cannot be a discussion on performance times for data fetches from web server disk over the web to your local machine as these are the only physical processes that I can think of in this context.

Rendering on screen (which is the only task a web browser does) has no physical aspect to it.

Oh, but it does. Consider what a browser is; It's a program that reads HTML and renders it visually. The part of the browser that does this is called the 'engine.' I can tell you right now that loading a page on Firefox takes much less time than IE. The rendering engine is simply faster (Gecko vs IE).

When you're in firefox, type into the address bar about:config, and you'll see exactly what I mean. Gecko is tweakable, and it is faster.

tselling · #49 Post by **tselling** » Tue Oct 24, 2006 9:42 pm

Anyone else have problems with the USPS site and IE7? When I try to print a label it fails and IE7 closes. I have to go to another PC without IE7, request a refund for the label that never printed and reprint on the computer without IE7. Very annoying. I haven't figured out how to uninstall IE7 yet.

#50 Post by **jdhurst** » Wed Oct 25, 2006 8:18 am

I am using IE7 final, fully patched, and not having any problems (but then I don't use and so don't have access to USPS). One thing I see in IE7 is that printing defaults to a "Fit to page" setting that I am still trying to see if the default can be changed. Right now, if I don't like the printed result, I go back, pull up Print Preview, and change the scaling in there. That usually works.

I suspect this is where the problem is, but I don't yet know how to resolve it. If there is something you would like me to do, either post here, or send me a PM, and I will endeavour to assist.
... JD Hurst

3to4 · #51 Post by **3to4** » Wed Oct 25, 2006 11:49 am

It seems like all of you are using Windows XP SP2, right?
As I use Windows XP SP1, I can't use IE7 anyway, can I?

dsigma6 · #52 Post by **dsigma6** » Wed Oct 25, 2006 12:00 pm

If you want the initial rendering to be faster, Opera is your browser. I wonder if Firefox will add extensive options like Opera has in it's next revision.

This spell check deal...it seems like a good idea, but in this post I've been distracted by the red underlined words. It certainly can be useful though.

smugiri · #53 Post by **smugiri** » Wed Oct 25, 2006 12:44 pm

Manarius wrote:
smugiri wrote:Not sure what "Pages physically load faster on firefox, regardless of internet speed" means in this context, sounds like gobbledygook to me. Correct me if I am wrong but this cannot be a discussion on performance times for data fetches from web server disk over the web to your local machine as these are the only physical processes that I can think of in this context.

Rendering on screen (which is the only task a web browser does) has no physical aspect to it.
Oh, but it does. Consider what a browser is; It's a program that reads HTML and renders it visually. The part of the browser that does this is called the 'engine.' I can tell you right now that loading a page on Firefox takes much less time than IE. The rendering engine is simply faster (Gecko vs IE).

When you're in firefox, type into the address bar about:config, and you'll see exactly what I mean. Gecko is tweakable, and it is faster.

So, you would have us believe that having a browser engine render a page is a physical process?

Nope.

I am not disputing that Mozilla is faster that IE in rendering a specific page, this is a fact that has been proved by many benchmarks.

What I am arguing it that the process of having a software browser render a page received over the network or from disk to a visual software I/O subsystem (OpenGL or DirectX or whatever it is your OS is using) is NOT a "physical" process.

For example, a CRT/LCD displaying electronic signals sent to it by a GPU (from the browser engine) by converting electrons to light is a physical process. A web page sent as electrical signals over the internet from some web server somewhere to your machine is a physical process.

When comparing IE and Mozilla rendering performance, if we consider having one page served up from a web server over one network connection to a single CPU machine running a single OS connected to a single CRT/LCD all in an attempt to create controlled environment in which to compare the performance of the browsers AND NOTHING ELSE, making the assertion that with Mozilla, "Pages physically load faster on firefox, regardless of internet speed" seem very very odd.

Who is using Internet Explorer 7 ?

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