WinXP with SP2, should I upgrade to SP3?

[flamenco]

Calling All Gurus,
I'm one of those funny people who are really slow to upgrade. I ordered WinXP with my new R61i and it's running quite well with service pack 2. I had also used service pack 2 with my old desktop very comfortably.

I've thought that it may be good to upgrade to SP3 due to security concerns and the like, but have read many random posts about various problems that this caused. What say you, operating system experts, should I go ahead and upgrade to SP3?

If so, should I get it via the Lenovo update/upgrade route, as opposed to getting it from the Microsoft site?

Your thoughts are appreciated!
Thanks.

[jdhurst]

What has worked for me on all IBM computers I have worked on is to:
1. Do all available updates prior to SP3 before applying SP3.
2. Update the R61 drivers from the Lenovo website. I do mine manually, but the newest version of SU seems to work as well.
3. Then apply SP3.

That should work. .... JDH

[neenee]

If everything is working for you now, there's no need to upgrade

[basketb]

Never change a running system. Security-wise SP3 is no better than SP2.

[Stargate199]

I would recommend the SP3 upgrade. All new security patches will be for SP3 so you will have to upgrade anyway. While there are no new features in SP3, you will at least have all of the update since SP2. SP3 also tweaks a couple of things to make XP run just little better on newer hardware (HD audio support for one).

[GomJabbar]

I do, and I did.

[basketb]

I would recommend the SP3 upgrade. All new security patches will be for SP3 so you will have to upgrade anyway. ...

The end of support for Win XP SP2 is not until 13-Jul-2010 (see here http://support.microsoft.com/gp/lifesupsps). So, a statement like the above is just wrong (at this point in time).

[Marin85]

@basketb: Sorry, ignore this I was looking to a different post...

[basketb]

well, he says all new security patches will be for SP3, which is not the case. All new security patches will also be available for SP2. Hence no need to upgrade (at this point in time).

[flamenco]

Thanks, friends, very interesting posts. As expected, a big variety of opinions, and arguments with merit on both sides. (also interesting that all though I clicked "subscribe to thread", I didn't get any notifications)

Is my machine running? Yes. And previously on my old desktop, I had XP SP2 for years, and it was rock-solid, no BSOD's, almost never a Windows crash, even individual app crashes were very rare. The best operating system experience I had had.

My laptop experience is also mostly good. In fact, the minor problems I'm having seem to relate to bootup and wireless activity. My desktop had never moved, and was behind a hardware firewall, so I never bothered with any firewall software. But I carry my laptop around, so I decided to be more cautious and use firewall software. I started with Comodo.

Things cruised along pretty well, but after some time my Power Manager would not start w/Windows, and sometimes other systray TSR's wouldn't start. Though Comodo is pretty decent, if you've ever tried their forum, it's basically dead, and sometimes won't even load. So I went "shopping", and decided on Online Armor instead. Some really nice features, some superior to Comodo.

But eventually I started to get the Power Manager missing thing again (other TSR's seem fine now), and even a BSOD or two. Unlike Comodo, Online Armor is doing bugfixes all the time, and the latest build is working better today w/Power Manager, and no more BSOD's. Who knows what will happen later? I'm also using Avast antivirus, and things may not be playing well together, but it's very hard to tell, and hard to pin this down.

I'm considering getting a boot manager to re-time things, although this seems like a pain. And of the replies here, jdhurst's one looks the most convincing. So I'm considering several routes. And though I'm very slow to upgrade usually, I still am leaning towards SP3 just for general stability.

A couple options:
- jdhurst's update all R61 files, then do SP3, keep updating Online Armor.
- if things get bad again, dump the nice but fussy firewall, use Windows firewall, which runs nice (yes, I know it doesn't have outbound protection), and keep SP2 and Avast.

Thanks again, everybody!

[flamenco]

I seem to have found a compromise solution to this, and who knows, maybe someone will find this helpful.

I finally got around to doing software updates from Lenovo. Previously, I had looked at the list of proposed updates, and I had read that the updates listed weren't for my machine, so I tended to skip them, but this time in the fine print I noticed that I had missed many version updates of each driver, so I just went for it. This worked fine.

No more BSOD's, but I was still having some trouble with various software loading upon boot. I finally kicked Online Armor to the curb and installed PC Tools Firewall instead. Then I noticed that PC Tools offered some antivirus capability too, so I enabled that and uninstalled Avast. So now one program is doing the job of two.

The PC Tools firewall seems smoother than Online Armor (which I know works well for others). All my TSR programs load nicely now. Now and then something loads slightly slower, possibly due to the firewall "thinking", but generally things are great. I also like this firewall's prompt screens about program activity better than Online Armor's ones.

Since all is smooth now, I've gone back to procrastinating on getting SP3.

[GomJabbar]

I stumbled across the following article while looking for something else. It describes a couple of problems that sometimes occur with the SP3 update, and their solution.

http://www.windowssecrets.com/comp/080911#story1

[flamenco]

Very interesting article, thanks!

I'm still non-SP3 so far. Most of my troubles seem to relate to having tried to use several different fancy firewalls. I threw in the towel, and am using the XP firewall in spite of its lack of outbound protection, and am just trying to use good safety practices. This has made my system run smoothly, and I don't have to keep wondering if the next firewall "upgrade" botches something in my system.

I imagine having added the Lenovo suggested updates has been helpful - to me this seems like a more surgical strike, and thus safer, than the great big SP3 update.

Cheers

[l2karl]

I stumbled across the following article while looking for something else. It describes a couple of problems that sometimes occur with the SP3 update, and their solution.

http://www.windowssecrets.com/comp/080911#story1

Thanks for the link... worth reading, but I have to say that I have stuck with SP2 after 3 failed attempts at updating (2 in normal mode and 1 in safe mode). All bombed out with variations on the same message: unable to read/copy a file.... missing file. Gave up and did incremental updates to stay at the latest version and wonder about other ways to go about this.

T40
XP PRO SP2

[jdhurst]

Follow my post 2nd from the top. If that doesn't work, your machine has a problem. A T4x will run SP3 without problems. SP3 does need at least 1Gb of memory. ... JDH

[archer6]

Upgrade to SP3?
Bored?
Tired of a smooth running ThinkPad?
Want something to burn up your time?
Feel like a good puzzle?
Nothing to do?
.
My new W500 came with XP SP2. It ran great for 4 weeks until I violated my own rule: if it's running fine, leave it alone. But no, I just has to mess with it and what a mistake that was. And yes, I had all the latest updates in SP2 before "downgrading" to SP3. For one thing SP3, hereafter know as "it" put a strange folder entitled "re89t21ut2ut4" in the list of folders under documents and settings. It also thoroughly trashed my OSD drivers, and in general really mucked things up. What is particularly telling is that I "upgraded" my T60 & T60p to "it" without a problem. In fact since I have most my ThinkPads centered on similar if not identical XP setups, I thought why not install "it" on my W500. Long story short, I wiped the drive and started fresh with a clean install of SP2 and its back to running stable, fast & cool. So much for a consistent experience. Was it a fluke? I think not....and why....true confessions, my OCD tendencies kicked in, so I decided to do it again to see if "it" acted the same the second time around, and yes "it" did. No wonder I love Linux and OS X. Ha...ha...ha
One things for certain, there's nothing predictable or boring about Windows. And finally that said, I'm not anti- windows at all. I haven't met an OS yet that I don't find interesting ha...ha!
.

Cheers...
posted via BlackBerry Bold

[l2karl]

Follow my post 2nd from the top. If that doesn't work, your machine has a problem. A T4x will run SP3 without problems. SP3 does need at least 1Gb of memory. ... JDH

jdhurst,

Well then I have a problem. My machine is up-to-date with all fixes for the T40.. XP SP2 plus all the tuesdays bugfixes from MS except for their online SP3 install, which I do recall trying and it bombed also.

I just got done downloading the ISO file (recommended above) and burning it to a CDR. I'll try that tonight when I get home.

The 1GB thing? Is that for real? (Only have 768megs)

[jdhurst]

<snip>
The 1GB thing? Is that for real? (Only have 768megs)

My T41 had 768 Mb and after I applied SP3 it slowed down (not death, mind you). It is now out of service as I now have a T61p with 3 Gb of memory.

My NetVista A30 had 768 Mb and I found that I needed to upgrade to 2 Gb to run SP3 well, and it was worth the effort.

Now, in addition, two client machines had software problems that we could not put our finger on. Upgrading them to 2 Gb made the problems completely disappear. So, yes, the 1 Gb thing is very much for real. .... JDH

[archer6]

If ram is an issue, I wonder why my T60's with 3GB each run SP3 well, whereas my W500 with 4GB did not?

[jdhurst]

XP does not support 4 Gb and that may be why (but I do not know for sure). My T61p with 3Gb is running Vista 64-bit (and it will support more). My NetVista A30 is running XP Pro, is now at 2 Gb and I don't think any more in this box will assist. ... JDH

[archer6]

XP does not support 4 Gb and that may be why (but I do not know for sure)

Being aware that 3G is the max for 32-bit XP as I'm running, the reason I have 4GB in my W500, is for 64-bit Win7 which I plan to install upon release of the RC.
One thing I did wonder about, is if there might be any adverse affects of having 4GB of ram while running my usual 32-bit version of XP Pro, and yet it runs just fine. So I'm a bit puzzled.

[GomJabbar]

...I have stuck with SP2 after 3 failed attempts at updating (2 in normal mode and 1 in safe mode). All bombed out with variations on the same message: unable to read/copy a file.... missing file.

When/If you try it again, write down all the error messages you get, and the names of any files unable to copy or missing. That might help to determine where the problem lies.

[l2karl]

[
When/If you try it again, write down all the error messages you get, and the names of any files unable to copy or missing. That might help to determine where the problem lies.

gomjabbar,

thanks for the advice... just finished trying with the ISO file burned to a CDR. Install failed on a file called (I think) Beethovan something. Geez. A go*dam*n wav FILE caused SP3 to fail? I hate MR BILL.

(and of course I have the sneaking thought that this is just the first file that croaked the install and there are probably others.)

SIGH

[GomJabbar]

Install failed on a file called (I think) Beethovan something.

Turns out you are not alone with that error. Apparently it is a permissions issue. See the following thread. I Googled: xp sp3 Beethovan. You can find more threads on that with the same search string. Note that the proper spelling is Beethoven, but Beethovan seemed to pull up better hits. You can try both if the following 2 threads are not enough.

http://www.vistaheads.com/forums/micros ... pdate.html

http://groups.google.com/group/microsof ... 7f372924ae

[vanaya]

My M50 Desktop didn't like SP3 either. I have 1.25gb RAM and after install and reboot, I had the never ending reboot syndrome. I had to format and stick with SP2. I don't want to try my luck with R40 or R32.

[GomJabbar]

When you get continuous reboots, do the following to begin troubleshooting the error.

Method 3: Disable automatic restart on system failure
If the system is continuously restarting, follow these steps:

1. Restart the computer.
2. As the computer is restarting, press the F8 key repeatedly until you see the Windows Advanced Options screen.
3. Use the arrow keys to select Disable automatic restart on system failure, and then press ENTER.
4. If you receive an error message, follow these steps to search the Microsoft Knowledge Base for useful information about the error message:
--a. Copy the text of the error message.
--b. Visit the following Microsoft Web site:
----- http://support.microsoft.com
--c. Type the text of the error message in the Search box, and type the name of the product that you are using, such as "Windows XP."
--d. Click Search, and try to find an article that will help you resolve your problem.

If this method worked, you have resolved the issue of your computer continually restarting. However, you may want to continue to troubleshoot driver issues. Review the "Symptoms" section again, and determine which method to use to resolve the issue.

A couple more links that may be helpful.
Steps to take before you install Windows XP Service Pack 3

Error message after you upgrade a computer that uses a processor other than an Intel processor to Windows XP Service Pack 2 or to Windows XP Service Pack 3: "STOP: 0x0000007E"

[vanaya]

I didn't mean to hijack thread, but thanks GomJabber. I will give it a try as soon as the w/e gets here.

[robert213]

Just another piece of info...

I reinstalled Windows XP Pro using my IBM Product Recovery ver 5.7 discs.

I skipped installling SP2, using MS Windows XP Service Pack 2 disc.

I attempted to install SP3, using MS Windows XP Service Pack 3 disc...

A. Welcome to Windows XP Service Pack 3
1. Microsoft Windows XP Service Pack 3 with Advanced Security Technologies
2. Service Pack 3 introduces enhanced security features
3. Extracting files...
i386\...

B. Service Pack 3 Setup Error
1. Setup has detected that the version of the Service Pack installed on your system
is lower than what is necessary to apply this hotfix.
2. At minimum, you must have Service Pack 1 installed.
3. [OK]

[jdhurst]

SP3 is very picky. I just rebuilt a client machine today from a Ghost image. It came out with SP2 installed and Office 2003 SP1. I did every patch *except* for SP3, and then updated Office to SP3 plus all patches. I updated the wired NIC (IBM Desktop). When I was all done, I executed SP3 and it came out perfect and trouble-free. ... JDH