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Thinkpad P16 announced

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H-Atkinson
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Thinkpad P16 announced

#1 Post by H-Atkinson » Tue May 17, 2022 1:48 pm

https://news.lenovo.com/pressroom/press ... on-the-go/

Follows the current trend of removing useful ports, over-styling, and utterly bewildering material choice. Looks like my P53 will get replaced by a P1 Gen 5 instead...
Thinkpads: 2x 701C,701CS,PC110,Transnote,T21,T30,T43p,T60p (prototype),T601p (14),T601p (15),T61p,T26,T480, A485 (prototype),X390 (prototype),P1G2,P53
Docks: Dock II (3546),Dock (2631),Dock II (2877),Advanced Dock (2503),TB3 WS Dock G2 (40AN)
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mikemex
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Re: Thinkpad P16 announced

#2 Post by mikemex » Tue May 17, 2022 2:41 pm

Nothing out of line with Lenovo's commercial mindset. A red strip on the back takes priority from a wired ethernet port.

BUT EVERYTHING IS FINE WITH RECENT THINKPADS!

T61: T8300 | 8GB | 400GB S3610 | SXGA
X301: SU9600 | 8GB | 400GB S3610
T420s: 2640m | 16GB | 400GB S3610 | HD+ 4200M
W530: 2740qm | 32GB | 400GB S3610 | FHD K1000M
X1C5: 7600U | 16GB | 512GB XG6 | FHD
P14s G1 AMD: 4750U | 32GB | 1TB PC611 | PG FHD Touch
T14 G2: 1145G7 | 32GB | 256GB PC711 | FHD

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Re: Thinkpad P16 announced

#3 Post by TPFanatic » Tue May 17, 2022 6:29 pm

That keyboard looks god-awful. I sort of understood the flat Ultranav keys on the X1C, being the X1C, to further slim down the machine -
But on the opposite end of the spectrum, this apparently very thick ThinkPad is built planar for no reason other than being planar.
The lack of a palmrest bevel is quite a bother typing on my P71. All mainstream ThinkPads **30 lineup and prior had a palmrest bevel. It is much more ergonomic as on this T420 I am typing on right now.

I had a short affair recently with an HP Elitebook 8770w (comparable to W530 in 17") and I don't find the P16 styling quite as attractive as that 9 year old Elitebook.

I really hope that keyboard does not translate to the entire ThinkPad lineup going forward. But in the end it doesn't matter how I the enthusiast hopes the ThinkPad continues to present itself because I am not the market for these machines, the corporate bulk buyer is and I'd guess enough of them think the "ThinkPad" is by now again dated looking so that's why Lenovo is "refreshing" the look with more squared-off edges and colors. In that regard I hope it pays off.
lenovo T420 i5 2520m 16GB QHD w/ eGPU GTX 960
lenovos T520 i7 2720qm 8GB FHD, T420s i5 3320m 8GB QHD, T430 i5 3320m 8GB FHD, T430 i5 3320m 8GB FHD w/ Optimus, S1 Yoga i7 4600u 8GB FHD
IBM X601 Tablet L7500 8GB SXGA+
Enable 2 finger scroll on old Synaptics touchpads.

H-Atkinson
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Re: Thinkpad P16 announced

#4 Post by H-Atkinson » Wed May 18, 2022 12:42 pm

The flat ultranav keys are a mixed bag for me. I've been daily driving an X13 Gen 2 that I got for cheap (750 USD for a 1180G7, cant complain about that), and it was totally obnoxious when I first started using it, but honestly, I can live with it. The deck is certainly more rigid than my X390, and I have no doubt its due to the thicker cross brace running between the board and the trackpad. HOWEVER, there is no reason for this to happen on the P16. The P16 should have kept the roll cage. You wouldn't need anything like this then. The problem I'm seeing with the P16 is that its a design language over engineering. On top of being totally ugly (subjective, I know, but I hate it), they lost a bunch of ports, lost side radiators, switched from the roll cage architecture of the entirety of the preceding P-series models (essentially making this a glorified P1), and swapped to aluminum for the case (goodbye 30 USD replacement case parts from Chinese eBay for the next 15 years).

In short, this thing offers the following over the P1 Gen 5:
1x USB-C port
Potentially superior cooling/power limits (though we will see, the thick feet make me think the P16 is going to be a housefire)
Numpad if you want it

No thanks!
Thinkpads: 2x 701C,701CS,PC110,Transnote,T21,T30,T43p,T60p (prototype),T601p (14),T601p (15),T61p,T26,T480, A485 (prototype),X390 (prototype),P1G2,P53
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Re: Thinkpad P16 announced

#5 Post by TPFanatic » Wed May 18, 2022 6:54 pm

I really like the P1 Gen 4 styling over this. If I didn't already have a P71 I was close to ordering a brand new P1 when it was on sale a bit ago....
lenovo T420 i5 2520m 16GB QHD w/ eGPU GTX 960
lenovos T520 i7 2720qm 8GB FHD, T420s i5 3320m 8GB QHD, T430 i5 3320m 8GB FHD, T430 i5 3320m 8GB FHD w/ Optimus, S1 Yoga i7 4600u 8GB FHD
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Enable 2 finger scroll on old Synaptics touchpads.

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Re: Thinkpad P16 announced

#6 Post by RealBlackStuff » Thu May 19, 2022 12:10 am

Lovely day for a Guinness! (The Real Black Stuff)
IBM: T23 (XP/SP3) - Lenovo: X240, X250, T440p, M900 Tiny (all with W7/SP1)

Ibthink
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Re: Thinkpad P16 announced

#7 Post by Ibthink » Thu May 26, 2022 12:48 pm

H-Atkinson wrote:
Wed May 18, 2022 12:42 pm
The P16 should have kept the roll cage.
It still has the roll cage / structure frame. And it does appear like the palmrest is still plastic, it is just Grey in color
IBM ThinkPad R50e | lenovo ThinkPad X301 | lenovo ThinkPad Z61t

H-Atkinson
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Re: Thinkpad P16 announced

#8 Post by H-Atkinson » Sun Jun 05, 2022 2:10 am

The P16 is now available for sale in ConUS.

https://www.lenovo.com/us/en/p/laptops/ ... en101t0041
Thinkpads: 2x 701C,701CS,PC110,Transnote,T21,T30,T43p,T60p (prototype),T601p (14),T601p (15),T61p,T26,T480, A485 (prototype),X390 (prototype),P1G2,P53
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zemlin
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Re: Thinkpad P16 announced

#9 Post by zemlin » Sun Jun 12, 2022 5:08 pm

Decided to order the P16. The P1 Gen5 is tempting, but I need a lot of storage and I expect the thermals to be better in the P16 - plus it gets a little more CPU. I have 6TB in my P52. I'll go ahead and stock the P16 with 8TB when it arrives. Expected ship date is in September.

I'm getting the IPS 4K display, 64GB, and the RTX A4500.
Last edited by zemlin on Sun Jun 12, 2022 8:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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H-Atkinson
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Re: Thinkpad P16 announced

#10 Post by H-Atkinson » Sun Jun 12, 2022 7:35 pm

Do let us know how it is when you get it. I'm skeptical about thermals given the lack of side exhausts personally,, and have yet to see how the HX chips really stack up against the normal H chips firsthand.

Also, they usually give an absurd ship date and first, and it moves up. My P53 (bought around the launch window too) gave me a Sept. ship date in June, but I had it by early July.
Thinkpads: 2x 701C,701CS,PC110,Transnote,T21,T30,T43p,T60p (prototype),T601p (14),T601p (15),T61p,T26,T480, A485 (prototype),X390 (prototype),P1G2,P53
Docks: Dock II (3546),Dock (2631),Dock II (2877),Advanced Dock (2503),TB3 WS Dock G2 (40AN)
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zemlin
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Re: Thinkpad P16 announced

#11 Post by zemlin » Thu Jun 23, 2022 4:33 pm

oh the drama ... :P
I put W11 on my P52 the day 11 was launched. I knew it would be buggy out of the gate but figured I'd give it a little time. I've grown tired of the flakes so was planning to do a fresh W10 install on the machine this week.

Today I get an email from Lenovo about my P16 order.
We are in the last stages of processing your order for shipment. We appreciate your continued patience, please look to receive your shipping confirmation email soon.
Order status page still shows Sept 12th as the expected ship date.
I don't want to go through the hassle of a new OS install if I'm going to have a fresh rig within the next couple of weeks. I guess I'll hold off formatting the P52 for a bit.

The P16 will get a fresh W10 install before I load anything on it. From what I can find on real-world benchmarking the prosthelytized W11 advantage is minimal at best - at least for now.
Last edited by zemlin on Thu Jun 23, 2022 5:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Karl Zemlin - www.zemlinphoto.com
P52 20M9CT01WW
4K IPS, Quadro P3200
64GB 3x 2TB SSD

H-Atkinson
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Re: Thinkpad P16 announced

#12 Post by H-Atkinson » Thu Jun 23, 2022 5:01 pm

Just a heads up, but from my experience those ship dates mean nothing. My P53 was ordered around the same time, and showed up in July. They just stick those on there as a worst case.
Thinkpads: 2x 701C,701CS,PC110,Transnote,T21,T30,T43p,T60p (prototype),T601p (14),T601p (15),T61p,T26,T480, A485 (prototype),X390 (prototype),P1G2,P53
Docks: Dock II (3546),Dock (2631),Dock II (2877),Advanced Dock (2503),TB3 WS Dock G2 (40AN)
Monitors: G78,T221,L200p

zemlin
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Re: Thinkpad P16 announced

#13 Post by zemlin » Thu Jun 23, 2022 5:04 pm

H-Atkinson wrote:
Thu Jun 23, 2022 5:01 pm
Just a heads up, but from my experience those ship dates mean nothing. My P53 was ordered around the same time, and showed up in July. They just stick those on there as a worst case.
Yeah - I took note on your first reply. I'm hopeful that I'll get it sooner rather than later. Holding off on ordering a pair of 4TB SSDs until I get a shipping notification though. At this point the Firecuda 530 looks like a good option.
Karl Zemlin - www.zemlinphoto.com
P52 20M9CT01WW
4K IPS, Quadro P3200
64GB 3x 2TB SSD

H-Atkinson
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Re: Thinkpad P16 announced

#14 Post by H-Atkinson » Thu Jun 23, 2022 6:07 pm

zemlin wrote:
Thu Jun 23, 2022 5:04 pm
H-Atkinson wrote:
Thu Jun 23, 2022 5:01 pm
Just a heads up, but from my experience those ship dates mean nothing. My P53 was ordered around the same time, and showed up in July. They just stick those on there as a worst case.
Yeah - I took note on your first reply. I'm hopeful that I'll get it sooner rather than later. Holding off on ordering a pair of 4TB SSDs until I get a shipping notification though. At this point the Firecuda 530 looks like a good option.
Oops, totally forgot I'd said that already. As for SSDs, I'm currently looking at buying a P1G5, and sort of in the same boat as you. The Sabrent drives are priced too high, and the FIrecuda is the only other one with NAND that isn't garbage. However, on the Lenovo perks store, I wouldn't end up paying much more to just order it with the drives from them if I CTO the machine... so I'm not sure.
Thinkpads: 2x 701C,701CS,PC110,Transnote,T21,T30,T43p,T60p (prototype),T601p (14),T601p (15),T61p,T26,T480, A485 (prototype),X390 (prototype),P1G2,P53
Docks: Dock II (3546),Dock (2631),Dock II (2877),Advanced Dock (2503),TB3 WS Dock G2 (40AN)
Monitors: G78,T221,L200p

zemlin
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Re: Thinkpad P16 announced

#15 Post by zemlin » Sun Jun 26, 2022 10:47 am

H-Atkinson wrote:
Thu Jun 23, 2022 6:07 pm
I'm currently looking at buying a P1G5 ...
I took a closer look at the P1G5 - the specs I had seen said it was limited to 2TB storage (I thought), but I now I see it can go with a pair of 4TB drives with the RTX A2000 GPU or lower. The limited storage was the deal-breaker for me on the P1. I don't really need a whopper GPU - I use some GPU enabled software for photo and video editing, and the 3D CAD I do isn't too demanding on the GPU - but I also want a config that will have a good, long service life.

75% or more of my usage is with the machine docked in my office, and it sounds like the P16 will do better with cooling so there will be less thermal/power throttling than the P1. But the smaller size and lighter weight of the P1 would be nice when I do go mobile - and I'm not looking forward to toting that 230W brick. The 170W is bad enough. Plus the P1 RTX A2000 config would be $1K less than the P16 I have on order.

P1G5 Pros
- Thinner & Lighter than current P53 - and the carbon fiber cover would be kewl.
- 170W power brick
- $1000 less than P16 config
P1G5 Cons
- No keypad
- Power/Thermal throttling will reduce throughput (speculation)
- Cooling exhausts on sides

P16 Pros
- Faster, cooler-running (speculation)
- 8TB storage available with kick-butt GPU
- Two more cores, 4 more threads
- Keypad
- Can upgrade to 128GB if needed in the future
- Cooling exhausts out back

P16 Cons
- A bit larger and heavier than current P53, although most of the increased thickness is likely just the legs on the back to improve airflow.
- 230W power brick (as configured)
- $1000 more than P1 config

What am I forgetting on the pros/cons - cosmetic/styling opinions do not apply. It's a tool, not a fashion statement.
At this point the P16 seems to have enough going for it that I'm going to stay the course.
Karl Zemlin - www.zemlinphoto.com
P52 20M9CT01WW
4K IPS, Quadro P3200
64GB 3x 2TB SSD

H-Atkinson
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Re: Thinkpad P16 announced

#16 Post by H-Atkinson » Sun Jun 26, 2022 8:49 pm

2tb is the storage limit from the pre-configured systems. You can go up to 16tb if you buy a 2-slot model and bring your own 8tb drives (Sabrent makes some right now, I've heard good things about them but cannot personally vouch for their quality or longevity).

Personally, I need the GPU power, but I cannot honestly consider the P16 a viable option. We already know it does not have a vapor chamber, and with Lenovo's past heatpipe based coolers as a benchmark, its going to cook. Especially with those 55w HX CPUs (another thing I don't need). On top of that the IO doesn't justify the heft. You get nothing useful over a P1G5. I mean seriously no RJ45 on an almost inch-thick workstation? Whats up with that??

I'm currently deciding between a P1G5 with a 3070ti or 3080ti. For RAM I'm getting my own (Crucial has 2x32gb DDR4-4800 kits on NewEgg right now for like 300 USD shipped, which is way better than even Lenovo's perkatwork price). As for SSDs, I'd like at least 4tb, and Lenovo's prices in the CTO model is actually better than I can do with any SD OEMs myself, so I'm probably going to do that. Its probably going to bite me in the butt not having any room to improve, but what I'm banking on is that by the time I've filled up a 4tb drive (all my work files thankfully get to go on a big server long term, so its just my personal stuff on my drive) the P16G2 or G3 will come out and suck a little less.

As for your pros/cons, a few things to note. We won't really know how they stack up thermally until people have systems in-hand to test. The P16 will probably be faster (HX chips, higher GPU TGPs), but at the same time will most certainly run hotter. Marginally more ventilation, probably similar radiator surface area, etc. Storage is a huge upside as is the RAM, keypad is good for people who want one (I could go either way, and honestly). Plus it gets ECC RAM. I'm not sure what you mean by the 230w brick as a con? I'm pretty sure they get the same power bricks? And yeah, the pricing is the biggest issue, at least for me. I'm already having a hard time justifying a 3080ti config for the P1, let alone an A4500 config for the P16.

Oh and plus I think the P16 is extremely ugly. But thats a subjective matter.
Thinkpads: 2x 701C,701CS,PC110,Transnote,T21,T30,T43p,T60p (prototype),T601p (14),T601p (15),T61p,T26,T480, A485 (prototype),X390 (prototype),P1G2,P53
Docks: Dock II (3546),Dock (2631),Dock II (2877),Advanced Dock (2503),TB3 WS Dock G2 (40AN)
Monitors: G78,T221,L200p

zemlin
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Re: Thinkpad P16 announced

#17 Post by zemlin » Sun Jun 26, 2022 9:13 pm

H-Atkinson wrote:
Sun Jun 26, 2022 8:49 pm
We already know it does not have a vapor chamber, and with Lenovo's past heatpipe based coolers as a benchmark, its going to cook.
So Lenovo's claim of vapor chamber cooling has been proven false? :?
Lenovo wrote:To offer that high-end performance and maintain a smaller footprint, Lenovo’s thermodynamics engineers had to create an all new cooling solution with dual fans, heat pipes, a dual vapor chamber, keyboard air intake, and dual by-pass design to reduce skin temperatures and maintain productivity.
H-Atkinson wrote:I mean seriously no RJ45 on an almost inch-thick workstation? Whats up with that??
Yeah, that made me wrinkle my nose a bit, but I haven't plugged into an RG45 since I retired over a year ago. At home I use a thunderbolt dock to plug in (which I'm hoping will work with the new rig).
H-Atkinson wrote:I'm not sure what you mean by the 230w brick as a con? I'm pretty sure they get the same power bricks?
They do for like configurations, but If I put the RTX A2000 in the P1 to gain a drive slot, that drops it down to the 170W brick.
Karl Zemlin - www.zemlinphoto.com
P52 20M9CT01WW
4K IPS, Quadro P3200
64GB 3x 2TB SSD

H-Atkinson
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Re: Thinkpad P16 announced

#18 Post by H-Atkinson » Sun Jun 26, 2022 10:52 pm

I wasn't even aware they were claiming it had a vapor chamber, but from the teardown pics they posted during the announcement, I remember seeing a heatpipe cooler. It might change depending on config though? I don't know honestly.

For me RJ45 isn't a dealbreaker (I wouldn't be looking at either of these if it was, I use TB3 docks both at home and at work, and both pass through the MAC address, so whatever), but its still really obnoxious that they can't fit that in, especially when whats now standard on other full-fat systems is 2.5gbe.

I see what you mean now about power bricks. Nothing would stop you from running your own 230w (or even 300w now but I don't see a reason to) brick, but thats another cost that shouldn't need to be covered on a machine in this price bracket. They should honestly all come with 230w bricks.
Thinkpads: 2x 701C,701CS,PC110,Transnote,T21,T30,T43p,T60p (prototype),T601p (14),T601p (15),T61p,T26,T480, A485 (prototype),X390 (prototype),P1G2,P53
Docks: Dock II (3546),Dock (2631),Dock II (2877),Advanced Dock (2503),TB3 WS Dock G2 (40AN)
Monitors: G78,T221,L200p

Ibthink
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Re: Thinkpad P16 announced

#19 Post by Ibthink » Mon Jun 27, 2022 2:10 pm

H-Atkinson wrote:
Sun Jun 26, 2022 10:52 pm
I wasn't even aware they were claiming it had a vapor chamber, but from the teardown pics they posted during the announcement, I remember seeing a heatpipe cooler. It might change depending on config though? I don't know honestly.
It probably is like with the P1 G4 / P1 G5: Combination of heat pipes and vapor chamber, just in a thicker package.
IBM ThinkPad R50e | lenovo ThinkPad X301 | lenovo ThinkPad Z61t

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