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T60/T61 series specific matters only
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cxls
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#61 Post by cxls » Thu Aug 02, 2007 7:02 am

Check to see if your battery was recalled. The 9-cell on my 2623-DDU was.
IBM ThinkPad T60p 2623-DDU | Intel Core Duo 2.0 GHz T2500 | 2 GB RAM | 256 MB ATI FireGL V5200 | 100 GB 7200 RPM SATA HDD | 15" UXGA BOE-Hydis (1600x1200) | NMB Keyboard | 9 Cell Battery x2

kkong
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#62 Post by kkong » Thu Aug 02, 2007 7:16 am

where you buy the Atheros a/b/g/n Mini-PCI-Express card ?

Troels
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#63 Post by Troels » Thu Aug 02, 2007 1:41 pm

cxls wrote:Check to see if your battery was recalled. The 9-cell on my 2623-DDU was.
The current 2623-DDU batch made in April 2007 was not hit by this recall as it was already known by Lenovo at that point. AFAIK, all of them from April came with a Sanyo battery, though.
And, coming from a QXGA R50p, the T61p will actually be a downgrade in resolution. However, the improved brightness, and faster response time (no IPS motion blur!) will more than make up for it. Obviously, everyones needs are different.
Last friday i saw the T61 for the first time during a vacation actually, and after seeing it, i can't accept your point of view in this post, or any of your previous posts as more than troll material. Sorry.
All laptop displays ghosts, IPS does more - but the screens they offer with T61 are not special at all - more horrible than what HP uses in a few of their consumer laptops.
I have never tried using a laptop on a plane, but in that regard i wouldn't use a wide screen either way i think - nothing more than 12" 4:3 - and much rather a PDA if it enough.

You want a gaming laptop - buy a Dell XPS. They don't last anywhere near as well as a thinkpad people say, but the graphics will be outdated when it breaks/gets defects any way. And it wouldn't cost you an arm and a leg by each upgrade. Some even have upgradeable graphics.

wearetheborg
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#64 Post by wearetheborg » Thu Aug 02, 2007 4:27 pm

I say Dell XPS can outlast a thinkpad.
HP NC8000 UXGA; Dell Precision M90 WUXGA; R50P UXGA
Please PM me if you've had experience with SquareTrade warranties

draco2527
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#65 Post by draco2527 » Thu Aug 02, 2007 11:48 pm

wearetheborg wrote:I say Dell XPS can outlast a thinkpad.
If they sit on a desk maybe..try running a Dell against a ThinkPad in a CORPORATE setting side by side...AND THEN...tell me who wins!!!Work uses Dell's (D series), Sony's (VGN-BX series) and ThinkPad laptops (T42's, T43's and T60's)...I also manage IS/IT Help Desk...so I see what comes in and what goes out...

Anyways...this week I got a T60p 8744-C9U... AWESOME MACHINE!!! Congrats on yours...

FWIW: The Vaios are $300 cheaper than the Dell and the Thinkpads are about $150 more than Dell-apples to apples-so I don't think the prices are THAT BAD!!! HOWEVER when you purchase 300 machines it can make a nice DING in the pocket!!
X220T Multi-touch
T410
X61T (pen)
X61T X2 (pen/touch) 1-WIN7 1-WIN8
T61

NathanA
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#66 Post by NathanA » Sat Aug 04, 2007 2:47 am

cxls wrote:Check to see if your battery was recalled. The 9-cell on my 2623-DDU was.
Checked. I'm clean, for both battery recall programs (the Sony and the Sanyo).
Troels wrote:The current 2623-DDU batch made in April 2007 was not hit by this recall as it was already known by Lenovo at that point. AFAIK, all of them from April came with a Sanyo battery, though.
Yeah, that's what I also assumed, as well. However, mine did come with a Sanyo (as you mentioned), and the Sanyo battery was the one on the last recall...however, the P/N on my battery isn't even remotely close to the one mentioned for the Sanyo recall.
Troels wrote:i can't accept your point of view in this post, or any of your previous posts as more than troll material. Sorry.
That's a bit harsh, no?
kkong wrote:where you buy the Atheros a/b/g/n Mini-PCI-Express card ?
eBay, and actually from a seller in the UK (even though I'm in the States). It was at about the same price point as others that I found both in and out of eBay (even after shipping), and comes with the antenna to boot, so I decided to go for it.

I wonder if there is a good way to shoehorn both the 11n antenna and the WWAN antenna into the LCD housing. The two are mutually exclusive options from Lenovo when you try to configure a T6x with them, right? So this would have to be a semi-custom job. That or I just take the WWAN out...I'm not planning on using it anytime soon.

-- Nathan

NathanA
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#67 Post by NathanA » Sat Aug 04, 2007 4:31 am

Oh, and I had a chance to play with my friend's T60p (a CTO model from December, Core2Duo w/ V5250 and 15" FlexView...lucky!) a little this evening, and set his and mine side-by-side.

He does have the LG SXGA+ FlexView panel. It did seem to have a slightly "dirtier" look to it than my IDTech. At the time, I just took it as it needed a good cleaning, but the screen also didn't look terribly dirty/dusty when I had the screen off and looked at the light reflecting off of it, so maybe what I was noticing is indeed the "sparkle" effect everyone's talking about? It's not really "sparkle," it looks more to me like it's just plain dirty all the time. (That would definitely annoy me. I'm pretty anal about my LCD cleanliness.) (Although I have to say that even both of my IDTechs have a similar issue, but to a lesser degree.)

Other observations about the LG SXGA+ FlexView that he had: it didn't seem to have the same "ghosting" problem that IDTech IPS panels have in high-contrast environments (see here), or if it did it was less obvious. Also, I noticed, comparing the two screens with each other side-by-side, that my screen's "white" is truly white, while the LG's is more yellow-ish. As I was typing this, I did a quick forum search, and actually discovered that this seems to be a common trait with the LG FlexViews; white is yellow-er on this display vs. others (maybe not noticeably, if you didn't have an IDTech sitting right beside it), but color reproduction is still superb. Oh, and while his LG FlexView didn't seem to have the weird dark patch on the right side that most IDTechs seem to have, I did notice that the lower-right corner of the display was darker. Hmm.

Oh, I also checked the status of my rebate today on OnSale.com, and the site at least clams that they haven't received anything from me yet. LOL. I give 'em 2-3 weeks and then I will be contacting them.

-- Nathan

NathanA
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#68 Post by NathanA » Fri Aug 10, 2007 3:24 am

UPDATES: OnSale and PCMall have lowered the price again by $100 to $1,899, which I believe is the same price that Lenovo had them for on the Outlet site back in April, except this time it is tax-free (unless you live in CA). They still seem to have them in stock. No further rebates seem to be forthcoming (unless you count that HP thing).

I still love the machine.

OnSale's rebate center on their web site still claims not to have received my rebate. Hahaha! If that doesn't change in a couple of weeks, the joke's on them, because I have the proof from the USPS that they DID receive it. :)

-- Nathan

EDIT: Okay, wow...I check 2 minutes after posting this, and find that OnSale.com just posted a new rebate there that expires Aug. 31st. $50 off "select ThinkPads" including the 2623DDU and some X60 model (G72459?? doesn't seem like a standard ThinkPad model #).

Speaking of the Lenovo Outlet, there hasn't been any offers posted there for quite some time...

NathanA
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#69 Post by NathanA » Thu Aug 16, 2007 12:53 am

Alright! I just checked today, and the status of my OnSale rebates have been changed to read thusly: "We have processed your rebate claim for this order."

Not sure exactly how to take this; I'm hoping that it simply means I can expect to see two checks in my mailbox within the next few days. :)

Also, my Atheros a/b/g/n card came today. I will be installing it shortly. The one I bought actually came with the actual third antenna as well, but I don't feel like taking my screen assembly apart at this point, so I will put it in storage and wait to install it until I actually manage to acquire an access point I can use the card with properly. :) For now it will just continue to talk to my 11a AP, and I will install the card with the two existing antennas connected to TR0 and TR1 and leave the R0 antenna port unpopulated for the time being. Should work just fine for non-11n applications, and be future-proof to boot. (R0 I think is simply a receiving port, where TRx are transmit and receive...)

OnSale still appears to be stocking the DDU (!!) with the price currently at $1,849 after $50 rebate (not the HP one).

-- Nathan

kkong
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#70 Post by kkong » Thu Aug 16, 2007 12:03 pm

Are you getting this GIGABYTE WI01GT miniPCI EXPRESS Wireless card from Oxfordtec?

NathanA
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#71 Post by NathanA » Thu Aug 16, 2007 2:33 pm

kkong wrote:Are you getting this GIGABYTE WI01GT miniPCI EXPRESS Wireless card from Oxfordtec?
Um, no. That looks like a b/g only card. I got an a/b/g/n card, genuine IBM/Lenovo part, FRU 42T0825.

Installed it last night, so far so good. Even works under MacOS X. :)

-- Nathan

xaveon
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#72 Post by xaveon » Thu Aug 16, 2007 5:36 pm

I'm thinking of selling mine to get a T61p. Anyone interested?

T60p
- Mobile Broadband
- V5200 256MB
- 4GB Ram (DELL)
- IPS Screen
- 15" 1600x1200
- 2.0 Ghz
T60p - 4GB RAM, 260GB HD, 15" FlexView, Advanced Dock with 3x Sony X93/b

NathanA
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#73 Post by NathanA » Thu Aug 16, 2007 6:22 pm

xaveon wrote:I'm thinking of selling mine to get a T61p. Anyone interested?
This is probably best served by the Marketplace forum. :) Out of curiousity, though, what's the model #, or is it a CTO?

-- Nathan

NathanA
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#74 Post by NathanA » Tue Aug 21, 2007 4:57 am

My OnSale rebate checks came today! I just finished cashing them (I love USAA Deposit@Home), and thus the story has a happy ending after all. :) (Assuming I don't get called in a few days by my bank telling me that the checks didn't go through after all.)

Thanks for your patience and forbearance, everyone!

-- Nathan

NathanA
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#75 Post by NathanA » Fri Aug 24, 2007 4:22 pm

Here's an update (and also a kind of question) about the IDTech display(s):

I commented before on how dark and yellow-ish my old T42p IDTech seemed when set side-by-side next to the new T60p one. The T42p display also seemed to take longer to "warm up" to its maximum brightness than the new T60p display did (< 10 seconds for T60p, maybe a good 30s or more for the T42p?). Also, one thing I never really mentioned about the old T42p display is that relatively shortly after I got it (my first replacement one...see this old thread for details on why) it developed this "problem" where the backlight took longer than I remember it taking before to warm up, and before it would warm up all the way, both sides of the screen would be way darker than the center, and then they would gradually warm up as well. The sides of the screen would also do this if I lowered the screen brightness and would stay "dark" until I upped it all the way again and it had time to warm up.

I just had my T42p display finally replaced under warranty a couple of days ago (waited over two weeks for them to stock it! seems like even supply for warranty purposes is short!). I did this because it had developed another problem where some dirt or something had managed to work its way in between some of the layers of the screen (it was obviously "in" the screen 'cause I couldn't wash it off and with the screen turned off there was nothing to be seen on the surface). Now the T42p screen is just as bright and just as white as my T60p screen is. It looks beautiful. In fact, it's actually brighter. I have to turn the new T42p panel down one notch in brightness for the T42p and T60p brightness to look equal, and with both turned down ALL the way, the difference in brightness is quite obvious.

This is kinda strange, because just before I had the T42p panel replaced, I had been thinking that the T60p didn't seem to be achieving as much brightness as when I first got it. My T60p display's white color is still as "white" as it was before (in terms of color temperature), so it hasn't "yellowed" like my old T42p panel did (and why it "yellowed" I can't explain unless it had to do just with an aging backlight, because I was very careful with what materials I used to clean the surface of the T42p's LCD...no ammonia ever!), but the brightness does seem to be a tad lower than before.

Also, after having owned it a month, the T60p's panel is starting to behave like my old T42p's panel did in terms of warm-up time and the initial "darkness" on both sides of the display when warming up. The warm-up pattern with the center being much brighter than the sides for several seconds makes me think of the way that some aged fluorescent bulbs act, where parts of the bulb are brighter than others until it is completely warmed up. The T42p's new display definitely does not have this problem...it's at maximum brightness within about 5-10 seconds, and with the screen brightness lowered all the way, the dark streaks on the side are not present like they were on the old T42p panel and like they are now on the T60p panel.

So, the question is, is this a backlight issue, and do the backlights in these panels maybe just work the "best" they ever will within the first, say, month of use? And has anyone else experienced this with the IDTech displays? It seems like a rather stark and sharp decline for the T60p display, but in retrospect, my old T42p display followed roughly the same trajectory, so I'm wondering if these backlights are super-duper-bright for their first couple-three weeks of use and then after that are "broken in" and settle into a less-intense brightness after that?

Based on this experience, I am beginning to suspect that there really is no difference, as others have suggested, between the T42p-era IDTech panels and the ones that have been installed in recent T60p models, other than the fact that any T42p panel that one is likely to see in person these days has been in use for a good 2 years or more by now, so the backlight will definitely have lost some of its oomph compared to a nearly-brand-new one in a recently-built T60p. This hypothesis, I think, is bolstered by the fact that my recent T42p panel replacement still claims, according the PC Wizard, to have been manufactured in 2004. It could be a refurb panel, but if it is, it has been refurbished to look and act like new.

With the replacement of the T42p panel, I think I'm now ready to sell it...keep your eyes peeled at the Marketplace if you're interested. :)

-- Nathan

Troels
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#76 Post by Troels » Sat Aug 25, 2007 5:04 am

Yep, it's pretty common that they are best when they are brand new. They all lose some luninosity after some times unfortunately, but this is an aspect of CCFLs wether we are talking energy saving replacement bulbs or large fluorescent lights.
I also feel that my T60p has become slightly dimmer now eventhough it's on max brightness, but i haven't much to compare with.

On the backside of the IDtech LCDs there a lot number and serial number for the CCFL/backlight which is installed in the display. I have not checked to compare the T60p IDtech with the T42, but i imagine that they are different.
Also my T42 idtech displays is from week 28 in 2005, while the T60p idtech is from week 1 in 2006. The one in the T60p has had more runtime by now than the T42 screen (almost new when i recieved it) and the colors are still vastly different.
That leads me to think that the backlights are different.

barrywohl
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#77 Post by barrywohl » Sat Aug 25, 2007 8:06 am

Definitely true. I had an R50p with a three year old 1600 x 1200 UXGA IPS screen that saw heavy use. I compared it to my brand new WUXGA screen (not IPS) on a Z61p and the Z61p with brighter and whiter. The R50p was dimmer and pinker.

Then, I got a new screen on the R50p after the first screen failed. Much better! The new 1600 x 1200 IPS screen was brighter and whiter too.
First Thinkpad 755CX in 1995. First IBM: PC 1982 8088 w 64K RAM, dual floppy. Currently in use:
X230T with Win8Pro x64, i7, 500gb ssd; W700 WUXGA RAID 1 Blu-Ray W7Pro x64, occasionally a T61p with Win7Pro x64

NathanA
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#78 Post by NathanA » Tue Aug 28, 2007 3:41 pm

I wonder if someone will come up with a way that will allow me to retrofit LED backlighting to my already awesome pixel-defect-free FlexView panel. :P

Also, sorry for dragging this thread up again, but I just thought that there might be some people interested in knowing that if you missed out on the OnSale deal last time, it looks like they just replaced their $50 rebate with a $250 rebate on the DDU (valid 08/24 through 08/31, so only a few days left). This also again looks like an OnSale.com exclusive deal (doesn't show on PCMall). Total price after rebate this time around comes to $1,639.00. I can't believe they still have these in stock. :!:

Both mikek5117 and myself have now received and cashed in our rebate checks from OnSale; mine took about a month to get to me.

-- Nathan

Troels
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#79 Post by Troels » Tue Aug 28, 2007 4:24 pm

I had the same thoughs about LED backlights, but it will naturally mean to do a "frankenstein" modification of the inverter board which also houses the LEDs for the outer and inner clearplate.

As it's extremely easy to screw up, i'd recommend to contact http://fpdgroup.com/pages/services/display-repair.php or similar and hear their oppinion. :D

NathanA
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#80 Post by NathanA » Tue Aug 28, 2007 5:11 pm

Actually, the inverter board might not need to be modified at all if an LED backlight matrix could be engineered with the same power requirements as the CCFL tube that is current in the display, or if further power regulation could be squeezed into the chassis and done downstream of the inverter between the inverter and the LCD panel (which might be somewhat inefficient...).

As far as LCDs being extremely easy to screw up, trust me, I know this. :) I've taken apart old/cracked LCDs before, and that in and of itself was enough to dissuade me from ever thinking about even doing my own backlight repacement. Also, I'm not sure that the panel as currently engineered/constructed would be easily able to accommodate the LED backlighting without some rearranging inside...I'm sure that the light spreader would probably have to be eliminated or replaced with something different.

Trust me, I have no dillusions about such an undertaking being anything but time-consuming and expensive. In fact, I'd rather someone else figure out how to do it first and I'd then just as soon pay him/her/them to do mine. :)

It was more of a "what if..." thought experiement than anything else...

-- Nathan

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#81 Post by NathanA » Wed Sep 26, 2007 4:35 am

Oh, my! I told myself I wasn't going to go check, but...a couple of days ago, I couldn't help but go back to the OnSale/PCMall web site to see if they still had these in stock, and they did, but this time with a $400 rebate instead of $300! Aargh!

Oh well, I still feel like I got a good deal, I'm happy with my laptop, and got my upgrade and data transfer done over the summer, so the timing was right as well.

So anyway, this rebate was good until the end of September. I hadn't had an opportunity to let people here know about the new rebate offer yet, but I checked the website again tonight, and just as I was beginning to get the impression that PCMall has an infinite supply of these machines, I find tonight that they are now completely out of stock! Even the single open-box one they had listed is now sold. The April '07 run of DDUs is now finally a dry well.

Congrats to all those who purchased one; I hope you are as happy with your machine(s) as I still am with mine.

-- Nathan

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