My X61s and Windows server 2003

X60/X61 series specific matters only.
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cosmos
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My X61s and Windows server 2003

#1 Post by cosmos » Sat Mar 15, 2008 6:27 pm

i've got a new x61s days ago,7668-cto,L7500 1.6,i install 4 gig memory on it,i'd like to install server 2003 on it,but i have some issues with it,,
A) if i install the video driver downloaded from lenovo,the resolution will change into 640*480 and 4bit color only and i can't change it,if i don't install 2003 sp1 or sp2,the resolution and color is ok, i search the net and found a solution,to use the older video driver,its version is 6.14.10.4785,but it seems a driver for intel 945,not for intel 965,i installed the older one,it seems to work ok,but when i used the dxdiag,i found directdraw,direct3d and agp testure accelerate are all not available,,,,
B) the other issue is i found i cant hibernate my pc,there is no tab on control panel/power options,i use powercfg to watch the power settings,,,

C:\Documents and Settings\Administrator>powercfg /q

Field Description Value
----------------- -----
Name Portable/Laptop
Numerical ID 1
Turn off monitor (AC) After 15 mins
Turn off monitor (DC) After 5 mins
Turn off hard disks (AC) After 30 mins
Turn off hard disks (DC) After 5 mins
System standby (AC) After 20 mins
System standby (DC) After 5 mins
System hibernates (AC) Not Supported
System hibernates (DC) Not Supported
Processor Throttle (AC) ADAPTIVE
Processor Throttle (DC) ADAPTIVE
the hibernate is not supported reported by os!
i thought maybe there is something wrong with power managent driver,i tried different verion power management driver,but the issue is as ever,,,

anyone can help me out?i fell so blue with it,,thanks in advance and sorry for my poor english,

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#2 Post by monkey243 » Sat Mar 15, 2008 7:20 pm

I install server 2003 on X31. All drivers work very good just as XP.
Make sure you download the right drivers for XP/win2003.
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cosmos
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#3 Post by cosmos » Sat Mar 15, 2008 8:13 pm

monkey243 wrote:I install server 2003 on X31. All drivers work very good just as XP.
Make sure you download the right drivers for XP/win2003.
thanks for concern/are you from 51nb/LOL :lol:
i think x61s is different,,,the problem is there is no correct driver for 2003

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#4 Post by bill bolton » Sat Mar 15, 2008 10:00 pm

cosmos wrote:the problem is there is no correct driver for 2003
Windows Sever 2003 is not a supported OS for the X6x models, so you are own your own of you choose to install and use it.

Cheers,

Bill B.

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#5 Post by mfbernstein » Sun Mar 16, 2008 10:40 am

cosmos wrote: thanks for concern/are you from 51nb/LOL :lol:
i think x61s is different,,,the problem is there is no correct driver for 2003
Something strange is going on. I had 2003 (SP2) installed on my X61 without incident. Which version of the Lenovo power management and graphics drivers are you using?

One of the admins here (erik I believe) also has some experience with 2003 server on the X61.
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#6 Post by Tr0n » Sun Mar 16, 2008 12:19 pm

You need a driver from Intel website. I'm using the driver for windows vista

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#7 Post by cosmos » Tue Mar 18, 2008 3:43 am

mfbernstein wrote:
cosmos wrote: thanks for concern/are you from 51nb/LOL :lol:
i think x61s is different,,,the problem is there is no correct driver for 2003
Something strange is going on. I had 2003 (SP2) installed on my X61 without incident. Which version of the Lenovo power management and graphics drivers are you using?

One of the admins here (erik I believe) also has some experience with 2003 server on the X61.
thanks for your comments/now i use a newer chipset driver and have video driver installed/it does work well now/but i can't hibernate my x61s yet,,,i tried a few power manager drivers,including the latest one,v1.44,,they all doesn't work,,so bad,,

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#8 Post by thibouille27 » Tue Apr 29, 2008 11:45 am

Do any of the Thinkvantage utilities work under Win2003?
TP X23 +UBX2 +cdrw
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#9 Post by erik » Tue Apr 29, 2008 1:08 pm

i've installed both server 2003 R2 and 2008 on my X61 and am currently running 2008 EE x86 on my X300 as my daily-use OS.   it's fast as heck. :)

i can't recall the exact video driver package that i installed in 2003 but i believe it was the one supplied by lenovo.   you have to install the driver package then search for the driver manually from within device manager.   make sure your chipset support is installed first.

regarding system update, it will not work under 2003 or 2003 R2 x86 or x64.   system update will work under server 2008 x86 but not x64.  

all current thinkvantage utilities work under both 2003 and 2008.

hope that helps.
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#10 Post by jketzetera » Wed Apr 30, 2008 6:41 am

Erik,

I would be very interested in hearing more about your experience of running Server 2008 on your machine. I am assuming that you are using your machine more for workstation work than server work. If so, can you compare Server 2008 in desktop "mode" to Vista?

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#11 Post by erik » Wed Apr 30, 2008 8:40 am

i am using it as a workstation.   i used to use 2003 to host multiple websites locally and reaped the benefit of having a more stable OS compared to XP.   vista now includes a robust version of IIS7 but i grew tired of its random issues both in the x86 and x64 versions.   now i'm running 2008 with the full version of IIS7 and won't go back to vista on my production machine.

2008 and vista w/ SP1 are the exact same kernel core -- version 6001.   the difference is that 2008 comes with barely anything enabled and it's up to the installer to turn on features like wireless networking, superfetch, desktop features, etc.   because many of the heavy features like indexing and auto-defrag are disabled out of the box, 2008 feels very quick compared to vista.   vista can be made to be quick but my fastest vista x64 installation was still slower than my current 2008 enterprise x86 installation.

that brings up another point... i moved back to the x86 version when going to 2008 because of application support.   i've read a few tests where 2008 x86 is slightly quicker than x64 and i'd believe it.   since the enterprise version supports 32GB system memory, it'll last me a long time on both my X300 and eventually a thinkstation D10 when i re-place my order after moving.

2008 is a hassle in terms of drivers.   it took me a solid day to get all of my drivers installed correctly but i finally have bluetooth, WUSB, and WWAN drivers installed, all of the thinkvantage software i use including GPS and fingerprint reader, and a full desktop experience including aero and windows sidebar.   unless you checked winver.exe or saw the login screen, you'd have no idea i wasn't running vista. ;)   there are many tricks necessary to get some of the drivers installed and all i could do was experiment.   one good thing about the x86 version of 2008 is that thinkvantage software update recognizes the system as "vista" and installed many of the drivers automatically.   from what i've read this isn't the case with the x64 version and all drivers must be installed manually.

for anyone interested in going the 2008 route on their thinkpad, this site is a huge resource.

with that said, vista isn't all that bad if you know how to tweak the system-loading features.   as of yesterday i'm back to using vista on my X61 and am quite happy with the installation.   most of the problems i had with vista in the past were due to using SP1 RTM instead of the public version of SP1.   i will keep 2008 on my X300 and use the X61 as a backup in the event i need a second system to use.
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#12 Post by crashnburn » Wed Apr 30, 2008 12:12 pm

Erik - Great work :)

I can remember how rock solid, clean & fast the following machines used to be:

Win95 OSR2
Windows NT 4 SP6
Windows 2000 Server

I havent gone the Server route since 2000 since XP has been decently stable and I dont even use XP Look & Feel.

All my visual stuff is as Old School Windows as possible.

Do you think its possible to use an X61 Tablet with Ultrabase to drive the 30" Screens at 2560 x 1600?
T61 8892-02U: 14.1"SXGA+/2.2C2D/4G/XP|Adv Mini Dock|30" Gateway XHD3000 WQXGA via Dual-link DVI
X61T 7767-96U: 12.1"SXGA+/1.6C2D/3G/Vista|Ultrabase
W510 4319-2PU: 15.6"FHD/i7-720QM/4G/Win7Pro64 (for dad)
T43 1875-DLU: 14.1"XGA/1.7PM-740/1G/XP (Old)

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#13 Post by erik » Wed Apr 30, 2008 12:54 pm

none of the current X-series support DVI output via the ultrabase.   there might be third-party solutions but i think it's better to use a T-series and advanced/advanced-mini dock.
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#14 Post by jketzetera » Wed Apr 30, 2008 8:56 pm

Erik, thank you very much for your detailed report.

I am currently using Windows XP Pro x86 and have been a bit hesitant to switch to Vista if it would result in a slower performing system. In your opinon, does the "bare bones" version of Server 2008 match Windows XP in general responsiveness, in workstation usage?

Also, if I am not mistaken Server 2003 x86 was actually 36bits so you could use all of your 4GB RAM as opposed to e.g. XP x86. Is it the same with Server 2008?

The possibility to use my "lost" gigabyte of RAM in a environment that is not 64bit and performs on par with XP in workstation usage might sway my to upgrade my machine.

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#15 Post by erik » Wed Apr 30, 2008 9:20 pm

i would confidently say that server 2008 is faster in every respect than 2003 and that 2003 is faster in every respect than XP.   therefore, 2008 is markedly faster than XP. :D   one caveat to this... there are a few registry tweaks that i would recommend making to help speed things along in both 2003 and 2008.   they are listed below:

Code: Select all

[HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Control Panel\Desktop]
"AutoEndTasks"="1"
"HungAppTimeout"="1000"
"WaitToKillAppTimeout"="1000"

[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Control]
"WaitToKillServiceTimeout"="1000"

[HKEY_USERS\.DEFAULT\Control Panel\Desktop]
"HungAppTimeout"="1000"
"WaitToKillAppTimeout"="1000"
with the above tweaks, shutdown times are less than 5 seconds and sleep times are under 3 seconds on my X300.   that's not an exaggeration.   it's so fast it's almost silly.

also search the registry for all "MenuShowDelay" entries and change them to a lower value.   i use "0" with vista/2008 and "500" with XP/2003.


server 2003 standard and server 2008 standard are indeed 36-bit OSes and support memory hoisting, allowing up to 4GB (and all 4GB of it) to be addressed by the system.   all other versions of server x86 support up to 32GB physical memory.   the 64-bit versions support up to 2TB.
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#16 Post by jketzetera » Wed Apr 30, 2008 11:27 pm

Many thanks for the info.

I think I will be downloading the 180-day trial of Windows 2008 Server Standard x86 to test the set-up on my X61.

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#17 Post by qviri » Wed Apr 30, 2008 11:59 pm

erik wrote:i would confidently say that server 2008 is faster in every respect than 2003 and that 2003 is faster in every respect than XP.   therefore, 2008 is markedly faster than XP. :D
Very interesting, especially considering the recent Microsoft program of giving Server 2008 away to students...
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#18 Post by smvp6459 » Thu May 01, 2008 12:56 am

Does Server 2008 have Tablet features built-in that you can turn on?

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#19 Post by erik » Thu May 01, 2008 1:57 am

qviri wrote:Very interesting, especially considering the recent Microsoft program of giving Server 2008 away to students...
that's how i got mine -- well, through a friend of mine, that is, since i'm no longer a student. ;)
smvp6459 wrote:Does Server 2008 have Tablet features built-in that you can turn on?
yes, it does.   i believe it installs with the desktop experience snap-in as i had to disable the tablet stuff shortly thereafter.


on a side note, for the bluetooth stack to work under the x86 version you have to install the XP/2000 driver instead of the vista one.   the vista driver will install the bus enumerator but for some reason won't install the chipset driver.   the XP/2000 driver, however, installs everything just fine.   to get rid of the annoying desktop/explorer icons, remove the bluetooth shortcut from the startup folder.

normally i would have left bluetooth out of the equation but have a lenovo thinkpad bluetooth mouse that i wanted to have working with the X300 since it frees up a USB port.   i just have to be diligent about turning off BT when away from home or the office.
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#20 Post by domi » Thu May 01, 2008 3:14 pm

erik wrote:there are a few registry tweaks that i would recommend making to help speed things along in both 2003 and 2008. they are listed below:
Most interesting. Do these tweaks ("HungAppTimeout"="1000", "WaitToKillAppTimeout"="1000" etc.) also work with standard Win XP Pro?
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#21 Post by erik » Thu May 01, 2008 3:46 pm

domi wrote:Most interesting. Do these tweaks ("HungAppTimeout"="1000", "WaitToKillAppTimeout"="1000" etc.) also work with standard Win XP Pro?
yes, in fact they do. :)

btw, "1000" = 1 full second so i wouldn't recommend setting these any lower.
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#22 Post by helmet4000 » Fri May 02, 2008 8:21 pm

i am running XP X64 on my X61 and it is very very fast, rock solid stable

XP X64 is based on server 2003...but I am considering giving server 2008 a shot


i am a student, where is the offer where MS is giving it away to students?

my univ. bookstore said they could get me an OEM copy for $500 of server 2008 standard, but that is too much

i got xp x64 for $60
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#23 Post by qviri » Fri May 02, 2008 9:04 pm

I looked again where I remembered this (channel8.msdn.com), and it appears the Server version is 2003, not 2008... Erik, where did you get your Server 2008?
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#24 Post by erik » Fri May 02, 2008 10:05 pm

i got it from a friend of mine who is an engineering student.


the only major issues i'm having are with power management.

standby (mode S1) isn't working correctly on my X300.   on a fresh boot, when i invoke sleep either by Fn+F4 or shutting the lid, it will go into standby for 2 seconds and wake back up.   if i invoke standby any time after that, it will stay asleep without issue.   rebooting resets it and i have to go through the same hassle again.

hibernation (mode S3) is manually disabled (via powercfg -h off) but Fn+F12 still allows it to hibernate.   it will physically hibernate, then give me the "windows was not shut down properly" screen on power up.   i can't get Fn+F12 to disable completely.

outside of these two issues, everything seems to be ok.   given the fact that this is a server OS, i'm not expecting power management to work correctly on a notebook.   if anyone has any ideas on the above then i'm all ears.
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#25 Post by jketzetera » Thu May 08, 2008 5:15 am

I have two questions for you Windows Server 2003 / 2008 guys.

1. Does the thinkpad fancontrol utility work with Server 2003 / 2008? I know that the author recently modified (a few months ago) the utility to ensure much wider compatibility than before.

2. Is there any utility like SpeedSwitchXP available, that functions under Server 2003 / 2008?

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#26 Post by jketzetera » Thu May 22, 2008 11:59 am

I can now answer my own questions.

1. The new Thinkpad Fan Control utility works with Windows Server 2003.

2. SpeedSwitchXP also works. The utility itself and Windows is unable to correctly report that downclocking is happening (it works properly in XP). However, running SuperPI confirms that the utility works as calculations take twice the time when setting the utility to Max Battery, compared to Performance.

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#27 Post by crashnburn » Fri Jul 11, 2008 4:47 am

qviri wrote:
erik wrote:i would confidently say that server 2008 is faster in every respect than 2003 and that 2003 is faster in every respect than XP. therefore, 2008 is markedly faster than XP. :D
Very interesting, especially considering the recent Microsoft program of giving Server 2008 away to students...
I guess thats why I want to go for 2008 just like you - Erik
erik wrote:
domi wrote:Most interesting. Do these tweaks ("HungAppTimeout"="1000", "WaitToKillAppTimeout"="1000" etc.) also work with standard Win XP Pro?
yes, in fact they do. :)

btw, "1000" = 1 full second so i wouldn't recommend setting these any lower.
Is this the only reason why your 2008 is faster? Seriously, should I go for 2003 or 2008? What should be my criteria if 2003 has something over 2008 in any fashion?

erik wrote:
qviri wrote:Very interesting, especially considering the recent Microsoft program of giving Server 2008 away to students...
that's how i got mine -- well, through a friend of mine, that is, since i'm no longer a student. ;)

// I have some friends in undergrad UT & in some other MBA-schools. What does it cost ? I'll ask one of them to get it.

smvp6459 wrote:Does Server 2008 have Tablet features built-in that you can turn on?
yes, it does.   i believe it installs with the desktop experience snap-in as i had to disable the tablet stuff shortly thereafter.

// I guess Server 2008 on my T61 and X61T sometime soon. Why did you go for EE edition. What would be better for me? How do I determine that? Is EE going to be heavier with some EXTRA Server Features..?

I remember back when I was more active with hands-on code & Dev Teams Windows 2000 Server was good enough. The Enterprise or higher edition was more.. so for Clustering and other thingies.. Extra Shtuff


on a side note, for the bluetooth stack to work under the x86 version you have to install the XP/2000 driver instead of the vista one.   the vista driver will install the bus enumerator but for some reason won't install the chipset driver.   the XP/2000 driver, however, installs everything just fine.   to get rid of the annoying desktop/explorer icons, remove the bluetooth shortcut from the startup folder.

// I believe you are talking about the fully functional BT and not the MS crippled BT.
BTW - Is Widcomm better or Blue Soleil. If at all you or someone knows.. the recent on that one.


normally i would have left bluetooth out of the equation but have a lenovo thinkpad bluetooth mouse that i wanted to have working with the X300 since it frees up a USB port.   i just have to be diligent about turning off BT when away from home or the office.
T61 8892-02U: 14.1"SXGA+/2.2C2D/4G/XP|Adv Mini Dock|30" Gateway XHD3000 WQXGA via Dual-link DVI
X61T 7767-96U: 12.1"SXGA+/1.6C2D/3G/Vista|Ultrabase
W510 4319-2PU: 15.6"FHD/i7-720QM/4G/Win7Pro64 (for dad)
T43 1875-DLU: 14.1"XGA/1.7PM-740/1G/XP (Old)

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#28 Post by crashnburn » Fri Jul 11, 2008 4:50 am

erik wrote:i would confidently say that server 2008 is faster in every respect than 2003 and that 2003 is faster in every respect than XP.   therefore, 2008 is markedly faster than XP. :D   one caveat to this... there are a few registry tweaks that i would recommend making to help speed things along in both 2003 and 2008.   they are listed below:

Code: Select all

[HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Control Panel\Desktop]
"AutoEndTasks"="1"
"HungAppTimeout"="1000"
"WaitToKillAppTimeout"="1000"

[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Control]
"WaitToKillServiceTimeout"="1000"

[HKEY_USERS\.DEFAULT\Control Panel\Desktop]
"HungAppTimeout"="1000"
"WaitToKillAppTimeout"="1000"
with the above tweaks, shutdown times are less than 5 seconds and sleep times are under 3 seconds on my X300.   that's not an exaggeration.   it's so fast it's almost silly.

also search the registry for all "MenuShowDelay" entries and change them to a lower value.   i use "0" with vista/2008 and "500" with XP/2003.

// What could / would be possible disadvantages to using these settings? If any? At all?

server 2003 standard and server 2008 standard are indeed 36-bit OSes and support memory hoisting, allowing up to 4GB (and all 4GB of it) to be addressed by the system.   all other versions of server x86 support up to 32GB physical memory.   the 64-bit versions support up to 2TB.
Would you say the EE handles / would handle the 4G better than the Standard Edition?
T61 8892-02U: 14.1"SXGA+/2.2C2D/4G/XP|Adv Mini Dock|30" Gateway XHD3000 WQXGA via Dual-link DVI
X61T 7767-96U: 12.1"SXGA+/1.6C2D/3G/Vista|Ultrabase
W510 4319-2PU: 15.6"FHD/i7-720QM/4G/Win7Pro64 (for dad)
T43 1875-DLU: 14.1"XGA/1.7PM-740/1G/XP (Old)

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#29 Post by crashnburn » Tue Jul 15, 2008 2:30 am

Thoughts Erik?
T61 8892-02U: 14.1"SXGA+/2.2C2D/4G/XP|Adv Mini Dock|30" Gateway XHD3000 WQXGA via Dual-link DVI
X61T 7767-96U: 12.1"SXGA+/1.6C2D/3G/Vista|Ultrabase
W510 4319-2PU: 15.6"FHD/i7-720QM/4G/Win7Pro64 (for dad)
T43 1875-DLU: 14.1"XGA/1.7PM-740/1G/XP (Old)

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#30 Post by jketzetera » Wed Oct 08, 2008 7:48 pm

Microsoft's DreamSpark program has now been updated to offer Windows Server 2008 Standard to students for free!

.... guess I have to call my little sister (still a student) and harass her :wink:

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