Need help with modifying a T420s system

[romeovercetti]

Hi everyone,
I was looking into Heavily modding a t420s and i need some info / Inside information.
I was planning on:
1. Soldering a 2960XM Processor
2. Modifying the cooling system.
3. "Pulling" PCI Express lanes from the system to add couple of devices that need PCI Express lanes.
4. Replacing the screen with one that is RGB-LED.
=============
1. The existing CPU is an i7-2620M and uses the same socket type as the i7-2960XM so it should be compatible. Also the bios might not support the processor so i thought i could use the bios information from a w520 and adding support via modified BIOS Reflash.
Couple of problems arise from the plan:
A: Will the laptop's motherboard be able to support the 2960xm Power Delivery wise? The 2960xm uses quite more power than the 2620m (About 30% more) and i wonder will the motherboard be able to supply such power. (Considering the fact that there are no external graphics).
B: Because the TDP is 20 watts higher than the 2620, will replacing the thermal paste (with some of the higher end ones) allow the laptop to handle the heat? (Given that it will almost never be used 100% but Burst calculations are necessary).

2. Cooling modifications are a must with such a CPU upgrade. I was wondering if putting on some of the IC Diamond on the CPU might make a difference. This compound i rated much higher than most compounds and it might help the situation. Also i was looking into replacing the fan to a high rpm one. (Some delta monster).
Couple of problems arise from the plan:
B: The power requirement s of the fan might be high (5-9 watts), im afraid this might be too much for the motherboard.

3. This a future project but it needs four PCI Express lanes.
Refer to the diagram:


It Shows that the CPU Supplies 20 PCI-Express lanes and the NB supplies 8. I was looking into using the NB lanes to add some devices that require high throughput. Also how can i Pull those lanes? Physically, where are the leads? How do i access them?

4. The screen replacement is actually very simple. I just think of using one of the dell XPS Studio 14 RGB-LED Screens, But im not sure that it will be supported by the Intel HD3000.

If there are any inconsistencies in my words please do enlighten me, i need as much information as possible before i do anything.
Thanks in advance and happy new year!

[Q-Ball]

I certainly hope you haven't already bought the T420s with the expectation that you can do this.

1.) The BIOS won't support that chip, if history proves true.
Also, why do you need a 2960XM? It's not like it's 900 dollars faster than a 2720QM. An SSD, on the other hand...
The motherboard would probably be able to supply the power but the chip still won't work.

2.) Thermal paste will drop the temperature but (hypothetically if the 2960XM worked) it's still pushing it. You're still limited to the cooling capacity of the fan and heatsink, which are small on the T420s.
I highly doubt you're going to get away with using a Delta fan and replacing the cooling system.
This is a thin-and-light laptop you're considering. Not a desktop.

3.) So... let me get this straight.
You're planning on tearing up the tracks on the motherboard to add some part?
And you can't see where this could go wrong or why that's an incredibly bad idea even if possible?

4.) RGB-LED? That sounds like every other laptop screen out there. The concern isn't that the HD3000 won't support it but the fact that it's extremely unlikely to fit. This is a thin-and-light, not a desktop.


I'm sorry to say this, but this isn't going to work.

Even if it were you'd be better off with a desktop. That's more powerful, you don't have to physically destroy your board to do it, and you're obviously not planning on moving the computer after you do the modifications anyways.

If you need this power in a laptop I suggest you look into a W520 proper, or better yet, a Sager notebook (though you'll likely have to have it imported).

[romeovercetti]

Well, I was planning on "leeching" On the tracks from the motherboard. The motherboard does have those lanes for the NVS4200 already laid out for the GPU that just isn't there.

I want that t420s because its so portable. The W520 is just a beast in terms of mobile workstation but it lacks the "mobile" part.

I cant understand why with the modified bios it wont work. The chipset sure does support the 2960, from what you are saying the motherboard will be able to supply the power. So the cooling wont be pushed very far since the actual load will be 5-20 seconds tops (with the 2960xm, the 2620 will be about 120% slower).
The difference between the 2620 and the 2960 is actual 120% increase in mathematics performance (this is based on charts from the internet). If i would be using the 2720qm then i will still have to solder it and modify the bios, so its not the best option. The upgrade from a 2620 to a 2960 will be a very serious increase in performance. An SSD is going to be a Samsung 830 and Samsung new 8 gig sticks (16 gigs of ram).

Now, about the added parts. The added parts are an actual module that has many devices inside, mostly various frequency RF transmitters and multiple USB 3.0 devices + RS232 devices. (Just goes into a custom enclosure - Already planned, sketched and ready for prototyping). The link to the motherboard will be one lane of PCI Express. (If four lanes are available then even better for Throughput). (I don't plan on utilizing the express port - only if last resort).

[jayton4]

I want that t420s because its so portable. The W520 is just a beast in terms of mobile workstation but it lacks the "mobile" part.

Now, about the added parts. The added parts are an actual module that has many devices inside, mostly various frequency RF transmitters and multiple USB 3.0 devices + RS232 devices. (Just goes into a custom enclosure - Already planned, sketched and ready for prototyping). The link to the motherboard will be one lane of PCI Express. (If four lanes are available then even better for Throughput). (I don't plan on utilizing the express port - only if last resort).

What are you going to use this system for? At one point, you talk about choosing the T420s for its portability and that it is more mobile than a W520. Then you are talking about wiring in some custom enclosure full of devices to the pci express lane on the board.

Am I missing something here? Maybe I am just reading what you said wrong, or one of us is crazy.

The difference between the 2620 and the 2960 is actual 120% increase in mathematics performance (this is based on charts from the internet). If i would be using the 2720qm then i will still have to solder it and modify the bios, so its not the best option. The upgrade from a 2620 to a 2960 will be a very serious increase in performance.

I'm going to have to disagree with you on that one, BIG TIME. A very serious increase in performance? There are companies out there that do these types of modifications, such as xoticpc.com, pro-star.com, gentechpc.com. The differences you see in performance in those machines is because they have huge, gigantic, obnoxious fans for cooling. The processors will only do the work if the cooling is sufficient. Are you sure that the types of things that you are going to be doing with the computer are the same kinds of things being measured in these charts you found online? The 2960 is a lot more similar in performance to the 2620, 2630, 2670 than you think or than you make it out to be. Various frequencies of RF transmitters and rs-232 devices do not sound like an application that will benefit. These chips are for gamers that want to have bragging rights that their PC can do 150 frames per second when their buddy's only does 120.

The highest quality thermal paste with the greatest heat conductivity in the world isn't going to anything for you in the shell of a T420s.

I'm not saying to give up on your idea. It sounds like a fun project. I'm just saying pick something better suited for this type of thing than the T420s. What you are trying to do is put a V10 engine into a Mini Cooper S, and then have it to tow a 10,000 lbs. trailer.

[romeovercetti]

Well, in light of what you people are saying, the T420s is probably going to be a stretch to work with. The mobility is very important (with the added module the weight is going to be a bit heavy), so if i go with the w520 i can scratch out the screen and the cpu. It still leaves me with the pci express lanes.

On the motherboard there is a soldering socket for the GPU, i want to tap on those lanes.
Are there any restricitons on those lanes? Are they "Reserved" in some way for the gpu other than physical?


EDIT:
I just looked into w520's and i cant find a model that can have a 2960xm and hd 300 graphics.
If i would buy an i7 2620 model with hd 3000, would it have only 2 dimms soldered?

[richk]

I suggest that you take a cool shower, lie down and wait for the feelings to go away.

[Q-Ball]

Now, about the added parts. The added parts are an actual module that has many devices inside, mostly various frequency RF transmitters and multiple USB 3.0 devices + RS232 devices. (Just goes into a custom enclosure - Already planned, sketched and ready for prototyping). The link to the motherboard will be one lane of PCI Express. (If four lanes are available then even better for Throughput). (I don't plan on utilizing the express port - only if last resort).

First off, modifications to the motherboard won't be discussed further. You're better off lighting money on fire.
Not only is it an incredibly bad idea that will void the warranty on the device, as well as being likely to render the machine completely non-functional, but this isn't the 60s anymore with high-tolerance components.
Considering the device you want to add... you really should know better, too.


It seems to me that what you're looking for is not related to the actual laptop in any way.
Since you need a PCI-Express interface (without opening the laptop, and face it: that module isn't going to fit inside it anyways) you're obviously looking at an ExpressCard solution.
This will do the trick, though you only get one lane.
That should provide you with the hookup and lanes you need (which unless I miss my guess is what you were trying to do anyways). You do need an external 16-20V source, though the product page should tell you everything you need to know.



But let's get back to discussing the ThinkPad end of things.

You can't currently have a quad-core processor in a thin-and-light machine and that won't happen for a few more years to come. Maybe once Intel Haswell/Broadwell chips are out there... but the thing is that people who buy thin-and-light machines don't look for quad-core power. I'm not aware of any thin-and-lights with quad-core processors stock, and if you find a machine that does this you should purchase it instead of a T420s.
I wouldn't bother hacking a better CPU in. It's a pain to get right, and it's already fast enough for what you can reasonably expect to do with a machine like that.

What other things are you doing with this machine? What does this "mystery module" do and how will you use it? Is it computationally expensive to run? Are there other things going on while you use the module (I'm assuming the primary task of the machine will be running that module)?

The "120% increase in mathematics performance" isn't relevant if you don't use all of it in the first place. Plus that information (without even looking at it) is just flat-out wrong. You get a bigger performance disparity if you're using applications that can use those extra threads and cores. If you can't use 8 you're not using the processor to its fullest capacity.


If I were in your situation I'd just get a W520.
I'd get it with an i7-2760QM (the 2960 is faster by a mere 300MHz and only 200MHz at full Turbo) and is not worth the 1000 dollars it takes to purchase it over the 2760) and a big SSD.
If you have GPGPU usages for the laptop I suggest you put down the cash for a Quadro 2000M model, otherwise the 1000M is fine.

You need to take a look at the programs you're going to be running, though. If the programs you're running don't get additional performance from 4 cores against 2 you don't get any additional performance just by them sitting there so you can skip them (this is the only reason you should keep the T420s in the running).

That's really all I have to say.