T410 on ebay minus the OS and HDD.

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Hans Gruber · #1 Post by **Hans Gruber** » Thu Apr 16, 2015 1:34 am

Has anybody taken a risk on a Thinkpad on ebay without a HDD and OS? I have a HDD and new copy of windows 7. My question is do these computers missing the HDD have all the cage components minus a HDD. I contacted the seller with that question. I don't want to take a risk and get a T410 without the external plastic cover or the HDD cage included with a hole in the side of the laptop. The seller has a bunch of them saying they are B grade Thinkpads that are fully functional. They come with 2GB of ram but I have 4GB of ram and a 320GB hard drive laying around somewhere.

I am planning on getting several T series Thinkpad's over the next 5 or 6 months and needed a project to keep me busy.

I included a youtube video of the guts the hard drive external plastic cover and cage. I sent a message to the seller asking this very question.

Anybody have experience with buying Thinkpad's without an OS or HDD?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oO8of1uEHiU

#2 Post by **RealBlackStuff** » Thu Apr 16, 2015 1:48 am

I've bought many ThinkPads without parts like that.
HD cover and cage/rails/screws only cost a few dollars (at least on feebay), no reason to get excited about them missing or not.
It would also be helpful if you fill out your profile (via User Control Panel) and tell us the city/country where you live.

Hans Gruber · #3 Post by **Hans Gruber** » Thu Apr 16, 2015 1:59 am

I updated my profile but its now showing Seattle, Washington. I have been here since 2005.

Hans Gruber · #4 Post by **Hans Gruber** » Thu Apr 16, 2015 2:21 am

Do you think it's worth a $100 risk? Plus $15 for shipping. The pics of the post show the plastic cover intact.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Lenovo-ThinkPad ... 234def63ac

Are the T420 HDD parts backward compatible with the T410?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-HDD-Hard-Dr ... 3a996ce9c9

#5 Post by **RealBlackStuff** » Thu Apr 16, 2015 2:37 am

Seller says: Hard Drive: NOT Included (Caddy Included)
Pictures show: HD cover included.
So what's your problem?

And no, the T420 covers won't fit on a T410.

#6 Post by **rkawakami** » Thu Apr 16, 2015 2:40 am

Hans Gruber wrote:I updated my profile but it's not showing Seattle, Washington. I have been here since 2005.

I took care of it. Early forum members were not subject to the location requirement during registration. When that was instituted many years back, a "custom" city/state/country field was added to the registration process. Unfortunately, that field is not the one which is displayed under the member's name; the default "Location" field provided by phpBB is. During new member registrations, Bill and I copy the "city/state/country" field into "location". However, members can do that on their own in the User Control Panel/Profile area. The Location field is about 2/3 the way down the page.

As to buying systems off of eBay sans hard drive, that's pretty much standard with most sellers. Corporate systems being resold typically have their hard drives removed as it's easier than taking the time to perform a DoD-style wipe on it. Some will include the caddy, screws and cover, but sometimes those are missing too. There's plenty of sources on eBay for those pieces unless you're looking for something like an HD cover for a 560Z

. Even when a system comes with a working OS installed, I wipe it anyway and put my own image on it. Who knows what stuff is lurking there? That brings up the problem of obtaining an OS for it. For newer systems there's a chance it might still be under a factory warranty. If so, then you can order a free recovery set directly from Lenovo. I've done this recently for a couple of T420 and X220 systems. If it's out of warranty, then the recovery set (if still available) is around $45. In both cases, you'll get an OS that matches the COA that shipped with the system. You could also post a WTB (Want to buy) here in the Marketplace.

edit: As to that T410... the seller has three recent negative feedbacks. I'd be wary even though a 14-day money back guarantee is offered.

Hans Gruber · #7 Post by **Hans Gruber** » Thu Apr 16, 2015 2:43 am

You think it's worth the risk?

#8 Post by **rkawakami** » Thu Apr 16, 2015 2:51 am

All of the T410 systems I've bought off eBay in the last year have averaged around $135. All came without hard drives and almost all with 4GB of memory. $115 isn't too bad of a price but it's your money and your call. If it were me? I'd look for another seller who's been around longer than one year and has a cleaner recent selling history.

edit: I should clarify... I've purchased systems from eBay sellers that has/have several recent negative strikes on them. But I've purchased from them before so I kinda know what to expect. If it's the first time dealing with a seller, check the feedback and look for any responses to negative hits from buyers. A lot can be determined by the language, the friendliness (or lack thereof), the excuses given for explaining why or what went wrong. Definitely stay away from a seller who berates the buyer, swears at them or can't compose a coherent sentence.

Hans Gruber · #9 Post by **Hans Gruber** » Thu Apr 16, 2015 3:09 am

rkawakami wrote:All of the T410 systems I've bought off eBay in the last year have averaged around $135. All came without hard drives and almost all with 4GB of memory. $115 isn't too bad of a price but it's your money and your call. If it were me? I'd look for another seller who's been around longer than one year and has a cleaner recent selling history.

I am planning on getting a couple Thinkpads. The other one I am looking at comes from a reputable seller with all the recovery disks. I went and cracked open one of my old laptops and found a 4GB of DD3 and a 320GB hard drive. I build computers as a hobby. If I didn't have the parts, I would pass on a project Thinkpad. My dad is retired and he needs some form of entertainment.

Anyway, I will keep the forum updated when I get it. Thanks for your feedback.

#10 Post by **RealBlackStuff** » Thu Apr 16, 2015 3:27 am

You'd be better off buying from our Marketforum.
It may not always be as cheap as feebay, but in 99 out of a 100 cases you get better quality.

Hans Gruber · #11 Post by **Hans Gruber** » Thu Apr 16, 2015 4:24 am

Here is a question. With a cleanly wiped HDD and a new retail version of of Windows 7 Premium 64 bit. Can I use rescue and recovery 4.52 to install a baseline of the Thinkpad drivers using the new copy of the OS? Someone mentioned recovery disks. Does Rescue and Recovery 4.52 contain the necessary drivers to install the OS and recovery discs as a baseline with all the Thinkpad drivers? I basically want to create a recovery partition that will restore the OS to factory default settings but with a new hard drive.

http://support.lenovo.com/us/en/downloads/migr-76254

On a side note, I have already received positive feedback from the seller on ebay. Perhaps a sign of good karma.

#12 Post by **rkawakami** » Thu Apr 16, 2015 2:32 pm

Hans Gruber wrote:I basically want to create a recovery partition that will restore the OS to factory default settings but with a new hard drive.

If I understand your request correctly, the only way I know of doing this is to use the factory recovery disk set to both install an OS and the recovery partition at the same time. Actually, when using the recovery set, the restore partition gets loaded first from the CDs/DVDs and then the OS installed from there; you load all of the disks in the recovery set and after the last one, the install continues by itself. I'm not sure if you could take and clone an existing recovery partition from one drive to another and then access the recovery partition on that second drive to install the OS. Something tells me that the boot and partitioning setup needs to be defined correctly but I suppose it's technically possible; I've just never done that. In fact, with most of my older systems (read: XP) , I delete the recovery partition because the factory image is so out of date (it's missing Service Packs and other system updates).

ajkula66 · #13 Post by **ajkula66** » Thu Apr 16, 2015 3:14 pm

Hans Gruber wrote:
On a side note, I have already received positive feedback from the seller on ebay. Perhaps a sign of good karma.

If you bought the laptop from the auction linked in your previous post, that's an Intel-only system and I was under the impression you wanted a nVidia one...

i5-520M(2.4GHz), 4GB RAM, 320GB 7200rpm HD, 14.1in 1440x900 LCD, Intel 5700MHD, CDRW/DVDRW, Intel 802.11agn wireless, WWAN upgradeable, Modem, 1Gb Ethernet, UltraNav, Secure chip, 6c Li-Ion, Win7 Pro 32

Nevertheless, not a bad deal whatsoever IMO...

#14 Post by **dorronto** » Thu Apr 16, 2015 3:18 pm

Agree with you George. I'm thinking about another T410 myself...

MisterB · #15 Post by **MisterB** » Thu Apr 16, 2015 4:28 pm

rkawakami wrote:
Hans Gruber wrote:I basically want to create a recovery partition that will restore the OS to factory default settings but with a new hard drive.
If I understand your request correctly, the only way I know of doing this is to use the factory recovery disk set to both install an OS and the recovery partition at the same time. Actually, when using the recovery set, the restore partition gets loaded first from the CDs/DVDs and then the OS installed from there; you load all of the disks in the recovery set and after the last one, the install continues by itself. I'm not sure if you could take and clone an existing recovery partition from one drive to another and then access the recovery partition on that second drive to install the OS. Something tells me that the boot and partitioning setup needs to be defined correctly but I suppose it's technically possible; I've just never done that. In fact, with most of my older systems (read: XP) , I delete the recovery partition because the factory image is so out of date (it's missing Service Packs and other system updates).

For newer Thinkpads with Windows 7 like the 410, just insert the recovery boot disk to use a recovery partition already on the disk. Sometimes the Lenovo MBR gets messed up and pushing F11 won't load the recovery routine but the recovery boot disk will give you the option to use a recovery partition on the disk. The XP and Vista recovery process was vastly different from the newer one but I suspect that a recovery boot disk of the right version would work too. Lenovo recovery is not very fussy compared to that of some other manufacturers. If the BIOS is right, the system will be restored even if the recovery partition is from a different model.

#16 Post by **rkawakami** » Thu Apr 16, 2015 5:18 pm

That's true but the original question concerned starting with a "cleanly wiped" drive, ergo, no recovery partition to boot or repair.

Hans Gruber · #17 Post by **Hans Gruber** » Thu Apr 16, 2015 7:10 pm

rkawakami wrote:
Hans Gruber wrote:I basically want to create a recovery partition that will restore the OS to factory default settings but with a new hard drive.
If I understand your request correctly, the only way I know of doing this is to use the factory recovery disk set to both install an OS and the recovery partition at the same time. Actually, when using the recovery set, the restore partition gets loaded first from the CDs/DVDs and then the OS installed from there; you load all of the disks in the recovery set and after the last one, the install continues by itself. I'm not sure if you could take and clone an existing recovery partition from one drive to another and then access the recovery partition on that second drive to install the OS. Something tells me that the boot and partitioning setup needs to be defined correctly but I suppose it's technically possible; I've just never done that. In fact, with most of my older systems (read: XP) , I delete the recovery partition because the factory image is so out of date (it's missing Service Packs and other system updates).

Why does this forum not have an ISO image section of the various recovery disks? Do people realize every thinkpad as a genuine Microsoft OS sticker on the bottom of each thinkpad.

ajkula66 · #18 Post by **ajkula66** » Thu Apr 16, 2015 8:36 pm

Hans Gruber wrote:
Why does this forum not have an ISO image section of the various recovery disks?

Legal/copyright/proprietary software issues...BIG TIME...from both M$ and Lenovo...

Do people realize every thinkpad as a genuine Microsoft OS sticker on the bottom of each thinkpad.

Not really, but that's beside the point.

No one wants that door opened. Seriously.

bit_twiddler · #19 Post by **bit_twiddler** » Thu Apr 16, 2015 8:43 pm

You'd be better off buying from our Marketforum.
It may not always be as cheap as feebay, but in 99 out of a 100 cases you get better quality.

One of the problems in buying corporate "B" grade equipment is that it is generally pretty beat up.
Cosmetic issues aside, you can almost always count on having to deal with the following:

1. Loose hinges, which are generally a bear to replace in a thinkpad.
2. Heat sink compound needing to be replaced because it was used 24/7.
3. Loose LCD cables
4. Marks/scratches on the LCD
5. Keyboard which is nearing the end of its life. Although, the skill of the operator is generally
more important: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_cnzuI4fsMs

If you buy from a private owner who has babied the machine, or a good reseller who can qualify it
as "A" stock, you might pay a little more up front, but you'll wind up with a more reliable machine
that you won't have to rebuild right away.

Regardless, you can count on having to replace the wifi card in any case, they tend to burn
out after 5 years or so.

I'm not saying that it is a bad idea to buy corporate "B" stock, but you should be aware of what
you're getting into.

brchan · #20 Post by **brchan** » Thu Apr 16, 2015 8:54 pm

I would avoid corporate "B" machines as well. Sellers often don't show the specific model they will send to you. More likely they will show a picture of the best one from the pile they have. I think scratches on the screen/case, and keyboard wear are most common with corporate machines. I have never had the issue of Loose LCD cables or failing network adapters, though.

#21 Post by **rkawakami** » Thu Apr 16, 2015 10:51 pm

Keep passing up those "B" machines... there will be more for me to inspect and pull off some good deals. The repeat sellers I've been dealing with on eBay do provide photos on exactly the machine that they are selling. Some eBay sellers will mask the model type and/or serial numbers so that makes it hard to know exactly what they have but sometimes a quick message will yield good information.

The only Thinkpads that I've bought off eBay that have had bad wireless adapters were on some T2x systems. Those were advertised as "doesn't boot". Removing the defective MiniPCI card fixed that problem. I don't recall any other system in the last 10 years or so where the wireless card failed after some use. That's not to say that I haven't swapped out the factory card with either a Broadcom or Intel adapter. Those were done to replace the factory "b" cards with "g" (the T23s) or for heat considerations (X60).

One T410 I have did come with an undisclosed / unknown problem with the screen. At times, depending upon how the lid is flexed, the upper half of the screen loses contrast. My guess is that it could be a bad LCD cable connection at the back of the panel, or a problem within the panel itself, but I've chosen to use this system as my online video streaming computer. It's connected via the DisplayPort to one of my HDTV's HDMI inputs so it doesn't matter to me if there are dead pixels, row or columns in the LCD as I don't really use it anyway. Likewise, the keyboard wasn't that important to me (although it's in pretty good shape) as I'm using this system with a Thinkpad Compact Bluetooth Keyboard (0B47189).

MisterB · #22 Post by **MisterB** » Thu Apr 16, 2015 11:21 pm

Some of the cleanest Thinkpads I've gotten off of eBay are ex corporate and the most beat up ones have been from private owners. The ones that were given to employees for work tend to be lightly used compared to one that was someone's personal daily driver. It's always a bit of a gamble to buy one on eBay but the good ones have been really good. Most of the resellers of ex corporate laptops are fairly professional and post lots of pictures so you know what you are buying. You can check out details like the condition of the keyboard. Some will be from users who typed a lot and that will be obvious from the shiny keys and worn trackpoint. Others will be from users who barely used the keyboard and it will be the trackpad that is worn and shiny. Other cosmetic details will be equally obvious. What isn't is internal problems. I bought a lot of two T60s recently. One was in excellent cosmetic condition and the other one was just a little more worn. When I tested them, both worked but the second one had a motherboard problem that would cause it to freeze after about 20 minutes. So I ended up with a parts machine even though it looked really nice on the outside.

Hans Gruber · #23 Post by **Hans Gruber** » Fri Apr 17, 2015 12:30 am

Here is another link with the ThinkVantage software and drivers.
http://support.lenovo.com/us/en/documents/ht080136

I am looking forward to my C note project funded by Benjamin Franklin's $100.

bit_twiddler · #24 Post by **bit_twiddler** » Fri Apr 17, 2015 12:34 am

Not all corporate returns are bad, but "A" grade is to be preferred over "B" grade.

Item 351369279625 appears to be in good shape, and the seller offers a 14 day return policy.
The seller goes through and rates everything, including the screen and hinges. The only
negative thing that I see is that it doesn't have a web cam.

It might be interesting to see what it goes for. There are tons of T410 machines on ebay,
there is absolutely no reason to rush out and buy something that isn't in pretty good shape
from a wear and tear standpoint.

#25 Post by **rkawakami** » Fri Apr 17, 2015 2:23 am

bit_twiddler wrote:Item 351369279625 appears to be in good shape, and the seller offers a 14 day return policy.

If you look closely, the model type is declared as 2537-HN2. Confirmed by the photo of the bottom. According to the MTM lookup, that particular model shipped with WinXPP. It's now being sold with W7. It looks like it has a W7 COA attached (description says it is). So it appears that somebody has upgraded the OS to make the system a bit more desirable.

Hans Gruber · #26 Post by **Hans Gruber** » Fri Apr 17, 2015 6:47 am

rkawakami wrote:
bit_twiddler wrote:Item 351369279625 appears to be in good shape, and the seller offers a 14 day return policy.
If you look closely, the model type is declared as 2537-HN2. Confirmed by the photo of the bottom. According to the MTM lookup, that particular model shipped with WinXPP. It's now being sold with W7. It looks like it has a W7 COA attached (description says it is). So it appears that somebody has upgraded the OS to make the system a bit more desirable.

If you look even closer to the front left corner of the laptop you can make out 3 stickers. Lenovo Enhanced Experience, Intel Core Inside and a Windows 7 Sticker clear as day. I would guess it came preloaded with Windows 7. Not sure if you were referring to the sticker in front of the keyboard next to the mouse pad or the sticker under the battery.

ajkula66 · #27 Post by **ajkula66** » Fri Apr 17, 2015 7:33 am

Hans Gruber wrote: Not sure if you were referring to the sticker in front of the keyboard next to the mouse pad or the sticker under the battery.

Sticker under the battery is the one that matters on these machines, since it's the actual COA.

rjwilmsi · #28 Post by **rjwilmsi** » Fri Apr 17, 2015 9:07 am

I've bought all 4 of my ThinkPad as ex-corporate second hand machines from eBay, and a fifth for a relative. No significant problems with any of them, the seller stated any faults and I understood what I was buying. A couple didn't have the HDD caddy & cover, it was not expensive to buy a cover/caddy set.

Of course as with any significant purchase, do your research. Check seller feedback, has seller handled standard issues correctly (ignore buyers who bought second hand and expected something that looked brand new...). A good seller will provide photos of the actual item and a decent description of any missing components and any issues, demonstrating they have some competence.

Personally as I use SSDs, run Linux and am perfectly happy to source my own RAM, spare disks etc. I prefer to purchase machines that have HDD/RAM/power cable/Windows sticker missing, they sell for less because most buyers want a system working out of the box, then easy for me to set up, so it's the better option for me.

Hans Gruber · #29 Post by **Hans Gruber** » Fri Apr 17, 2015 8:10 pm

rjwilmsi wrote:I've bought all 4 of my ThinkPad as ex-corporate second hand machines from eBay, and a fifth for a relative. No significant problems with any of them, the seller stated any faults and I understood what I was buying. A couple didn't have the HDD caddy & cover, it was not expensive to buy a cover/caddy set.

Of course as with any significant purchase, do your research. Check seller feedback, has seller handled standard issues correctly (ignore buyers who bought second hand and expected something that looked brand new...). A good seller will provide photos of the actual item and a decent description of any missing components and any issues, demonstrating they have some competence.

Personally as I use SSDs, run Linux and am perfectly happy to source my own RAM, spare disks etc. I prefer to purchase machines that have HDD/RAM/power cable/Windows sticker missing, they sell for less because most buyers want a system working out of the box, then easy for me to set up, so it's the better option for me.

My plan was simply to get a T410 for cheap. Fix it up and have it running so I would have a Thinkpad to play around with. Then spend several months searching for the high quality Thinkpads that need a good home. A new keyboard is really probably the gold standard when you restore a Thinkpad. I don't think 8GB of ram in necessary but I think adding an SSD is probably like a new keyboard.

On a side note item #351369279625 sold for $127.50 +$19.99 for shipping. The seller had one other T410 and the MTM number came back as having WinXP as well. The seller sells many identical items using the same MTM with a stock photo.

6SPDSER2002 · #30 Post by **6SPDSER2002** » Fri Apr 17, 2015 8:20 pm

I actually just purchased one from eBay about a week ago...NO HDD and No Battery or AC adapter but I have 3 compatible ones from other Thinkpads. Bought a battery from Amazon and had a new SSD waiting to be used....It works great...Just upgraded RAM as well running WIN 8.1

T410 on ebay minus the OS and HDD.

T410 on ebay minus the OS and HDD.

Re: T410 on ebay for $100 minus the OS and HDD.

Re: T410 on ebay for $100 minus the OS and HDD.

Re: T410 on ebay for $100 minus the OS and HDD.

Re: T410 on ebay for $100 minus the OS and HDD.

Re: T410 on ebay for $100 minus the OS and HDD.

Re: T410 on ebay for $100 minus the OS and HDD.

Re: T410 on ebay for $100 minus the OS and HDD.

Re: T410 on ebay for $100 minus the OS and HDD.

Re: T410 on ebay for $100 minus the OS and HDD.

Re: T410 on ebay for $100 minus the OS and HDD.

Re: T410 on ebay for $100 minus the OS and HDD.

Re: T410 on ebay for $100 minus the OS and HDD.

Re: T410 on ebay for $100 minus the OS and HDD.

Re: T410 on ebay for $100 minus the OS and HDD.

Re: T410 on ebay for $100 minus the OS and HDD.

Re: T410 on ebay for $100 minus the OS and HDD.

Re: T410 on ebay for $100 minus the OS and HDD.

Re: T410 on ebay for $100 minus the OS and HDD.

Re: T410 on ebay for $100 minus the OS and HDD.

Re: T410 on ebay for $100 minus the OS and HDD.

Re: T410 on ebay for $100 minus the OS and HDD.

Re: T410 on ebay for $100 minus the OS and HDD.

Re: T410 on ebay for $100 minus the OS and HDD.

Re: T410 on ebay for $100 minus the OS and HDD.

Re: T410 on ebay for $100 minus the OS and HDD.

Re: T410 on ebay for $100 minus the OS and HDD.

Re: T410 on ebay for $100 minus the OS and HDD.

Re: T410 on ebay for $100 minus the OS and HDD.

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