Thinkpad T43p heating

[dandreye]

shawross:

Thank you,

- I suppose DH Mobility Modder is ATI Mobility Modder Tool mentioned at Xenomorph's page:
http://www.hardwareheaven.com/modtool.php/
Do I get it right that it must used for W7 in particular, or only for higher versions like W8.1, W10? Looks like it converts desktop version of the driver(s) to mobility version, hence applicable to any OS.

- I found drivers and software package here as the link at his page is broken:
http://support.amd.com/en-us/download/d ... ws%20Vista

Will probably give it a try at some point.


On Windows installation, I'm now reading a whole lot of stuff on how to disable CPU check for all those features like PAE and NX during W8.1 installation and that will hopefully answer my 2nd question eventually: it's an off topic here anyway.

[shawross]

Yes that is the Modder and I wasn't sure the links from Xenomorph still work.

Driver Package

http://www.amd-drivers.com/download-Rad ... 32bit.html


The Modder won't work in Windows 10 so you can Mod the driver in Windows 7 and then copy to Windows 10 and then run setup.

This will work reportedly for 7 / 8.1 / 10 and I am pretty sure I installed in compatibility mode for Vista. I have personally only tried the driver in Windows 7 and 10.

[dandreye]

Just installed it as you instructed, works fine - perfect: thank you!




Btw are those INF files on the left of green Download Driver button at your link of any use/benefit at all?
- 32bit INF file (CL_95951.inf) for driver v10.2 / 8.593.100.000 [178 KB]
- 64bit INF file (CH_95951.inf) for driver v10.2 / 8.593.100.000 [187 KB]

Also I noticed several forum members report their GPU temperature here... which application do I use to check mine? Tried several ones like NHC, CPU-Z, HWiNFO but could only find CPU temperature reported.

[shawross]

I didn't use those INF files so I am not sure.

After install you can use the Catalyst Control Manager for performance or quality settings. I always went for performance which would lower temps of the GPU.
I had NHC for a while and then went to RMclock but I monitored the GPU with Thinkpad Fan Control.

http://tpfancontrol.com/

[dandreye]

Just tried TPFC, getting ~60-65C average. Same figures with GPU-Z by TechPowerUp. Hope these temperature readings are normal.

One more question if I may: at "my" driver & software links above pointing at the AMD site there are also 10-2_legacy_vista32-64_wdm.exe files. Are they WDDM drivers? Any idea what they're for?

[shawross]

I think they are WDDM drivers which I think are just drivers designed for Vista or above. But I don't know what those drivers are for and if they would work with the X300 ATI GPU.

[kfzhu1229]

I didn't use those INF files so I am not sure.

After install you can use the Catalyst Control Manager for performance or quality settings. I always went for performance which would lower temps of the GPU.

In case you don't know, it is highly UNLIKELY for you to get that manager working under newer OS while the driver itself works just fine. I am using that GPU under Windows 10 and while the driver still technically works, the app keeps restarting and turns your T43 from Pentium M 780 into Pentium II 266 as of a ThinkPad 600

[shawross]

I never had a problem under Windows 7 and Windows 10 getting the Catalyst Control Center working.

You must be using a corrupt driver package if you can't get the Catalyst Control Center working.

I liked the settings the Control Center gives you.

[shawross]

Is that the sound of a penny dropping?

[kfzhu1229]

I never had a problem under Windows 7 and Windows 10 getting the Catalyst Control Center working.

You must be using a corrupt driver package if you can't get the Catalyst Control Center working.

I liked the settings the Control Center gives you.

No I used the driver provided by Lenovo on their website. Also do you have the screen blanking problem (the screen will only display the mouse cursor until you somehow order the system to turn off your LCD) if you use fast startup option in Windows 8.1 and up?

[kfzhu1229]

As for heating, I realized that I forgot to use the little thermal pad that rests on the copper above the CPU area which transfers heat from the copper to the keyboard to achieve better cooling. After adding that piece of thermal pad and undervolting the CPU, the result is on idle the power chip and the 2200BG card end up getting higher temp reading than the CPU therefore the fan 1 mode still kicks in

[shawross]

I have only ever installed Windows 7 and 10 and I had the blanking problem in Windows 10. I wouldn't recommend installing any higher than Windows 7 on a T43 but that is my personal preference only.
Really for how long it has been usable the single core T43 has been one of the better Thinkpads IMO YMMV

[kfzhu1229]

Well if you spend some time at first to debloat Windows 10 and disable Windows Update service (but remember to let it do updates once a month or two or else your computer becomes vulnerable), you are fine. In Windows 10, the boot time is faster but the GPU seems to struggle a little bit more; also look out for Windows Defender as it may think older IBM software as viruses

[dandreye]

Apologies for the off-topic... could anyone please clarify: if I get it right, the way to install anything above W7 on T43 is by means of masking the lack of PAE/NX/SSE2 support at it in one or another way. What happens once W8.1 or W10 actually tries using any of those features, apparently assuming they're supported? And if it never needs any of them what's the point in checking their support during installation?

[kfzhu1229]

Apologies for the off-topic... could anyone please clarify: if I get it right, the way to install anything above W7 on T43 is by means of masking the lack of PAE/NX/SSE2 support at it in one or another way. What happens once W8.1 or W10 actually tries using any of those features, apparently assuming they're supported? And if it never needs any of them what's the point in checking their support during installation?

What you said is only right to machines BEFORE T43!! T43 comes with SSE2, PAE and NX and works with all recent x86 versions of Windows out of the box (If you have ATI graphics of course)!!
If you want to install 8.1 or 10 on T43 you just insert the media and install. Models before T43 will throw you a bluescreen/blackscreen if you try to boot 8.x/10 media
Also if you want to mask and stuff, do it on a T41p or T42/p with 9600 or FireGL. Otherwise you will also end up with the GPU compatibility problem as Windows 8 and up requires DX9 compatible GPU (Radeon 9500 or later)

[dandreye]

kfzhu1229:

Thank you: that explains why what turned out to be PAE versions of Parted Magic and CloneZilla Live tools on my USB sticks won't run on T42 while they never had any problems running on T43.

Previously, after reading the following I thought even 533MHz FSB CPUs like 750 in my T43 still need some tweaking in any T4x platform incl T43 to install anything above W7: http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.ph ... 16#p719716

Looks like the platform a 533MHz FSB CPU is in also matters somehow... BIOS maybe? The following (at the end), however, suggests only the CPU (i.e. PAE/NX/SSE2 support at it) should matter: http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.ph ... 89#p698889

Just curious really, as my T42 (non-p) has ATI Mobility RADEON 7500 graphics, hence DX6 only.

[kfzhu1229]

CPU and the BIOS have to support PAE and NX. Non-Sonoma (400mhz) Dothan Pentium M should have PAE support but their motherboard don't. T43 has no problem with these things. You can put Windows 10 on a T43/p with Radeon X300 or FireGL but not on a T42/p.

[thinkpadcollection]

CPU and the BIOS have to support PAE and NX. Non-Sonoma (400mhz) Dothan Pentium M should have PAE support but their motherboard don't. T43 has no problem with these things. You can put Windows 10 on a T43/p with Radeon X300 or FireGL but not on a T42/p.

Not true statement. All Banias and Dothan processors that runs 400fsb is non-PAE. Only 533 fsb does. Not motherboard either.

Cheers, thinkpadcollection

[dandreye]

thinkpadcollection:

> All Banias and Dothan processors that runs 400fsb is non-PAE.

What about 400MHz FSB 765 SL7V3, which reportedly supports PAE/NX/SSE2 as long as Coreinfo output can be trusted?
http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.ph ... 01#p721301

[Johan]

What about 400MHz FSB 765 SL7V3, which reportedly supports PAE/NX/SSE2 as long as Coreinfo output can be trusted? http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.ph ... 01#p721301

@ dandreye: You quoted my post but in addition to that you may perhaps want to see how the PAE/NX/SSE2 "requirement" can be circumvented; read the thread Windows 8 on a T42 - anyone? and the links pointed therein, especially --> Windows 8 installed on a T42!

However, in the thread Solved: Thinkpad t42 Windows 10 upgrade Drivers there's a chap who claim having installed Windows 10 on a T42p

Johan

[dandreye]

Johan:

Thank you: I had gone through them already except for this W10 one, which I've just read. What I don't quite get is how the following statement by Atli Jarl in it:

> The 2Ghz CPU in a T42 is a Dothan one, so you should have no problems installing Windows 10

can coexist with kfzhu1229's statement above, referring to T42 in particular:

> CPU and the BIOS have to support PAE and NX. Non-Sonoma (400mhz) Dothan Pentium M should have PAE support but their motherboard don't.

Based on everything learnt so far I'm inclined to consider masking the lack of one or more of PAE/NX/SSE2 support by T42 platform (e.g. using Jan1's method) the only way to enable W8/W10 installation.

[ajkula66]

What about 400MHz FSB 765 SL7V3, which reportedly supports PAE/NX/SSE2 as long as Coreinfo output can be trusted?

Nope. Even with a PM765 W8 won't install OOTB. Tried it a couple of years ago on a 2373-C96 just for fun. Can't say anything about W10, though.

I've never gone into hacks mentioned in other threads and would presume that one could fool the OS into believing that CPU supports all the required functions. Having said that, I see absolutely zero purpose - apart from "why not" approach - in running anything newer than W7 on a T4x of any kind, and even that OS leaves a lot to be desired on the given hardware IMO...

[kfzhu1229]

As for the hacks, it will work for Windows 8 and some versions of 8.1. Not sure if the hack is modified to work in Windows 10 though. There is no need for you to do these hacks if you have Radeon 7500 or 9000 as your GPU. These GPUs are guaranteed to be unsupported by Windows 8 and up and I DON'T think there is a hack to that.

[dandreye]

ajkula66:

> even that OS leaves a lot to be desired on the given hardware IMO...

Well true, can't really compare it even with X6x HW even though my SATA modded T43 feels like it's not that far away, at least it's almost equally fast at opening the websites I attend. Also my T4x's are still great aid when I need to stay ssh'ed into several devices at the same time w/o switching between the windows on a single screen although I certainly wouldn't use either of them as my primary laptop.

kfzhu1229:

> There is no need for you to do these hacks if you have Radeon 7500 or 9000 as your GPU. These GPUs are guaranteed to be unsupported by Windows 8 and up and I DON'T think there is a hack to that.

Indeed: that looks like a deficiency (probably the only one) of such T4x models vs those with Intel graphics, which I suppose is less unfriendly.

[kfzhu1229]

I would stay away from these models even if you run Windows 7 as Windows Aero isn't supported either. However the 9600 and FireGL seem to also suffer from the GPU desoldering that can take place in A3x. As for Intel GMA models, it is actually a pity. While something like X41 can run Windows 8-10, you couldn't install the GPU driver because the GMA in X41 isn't DX9 compatible. X60 is the first X series laptop that can run Windows 8-10 without trouble instead.