Thinkpad A31 Questions - EDIT - its an A30.

[aptivaboy]

Hi all,

Awhile back, I came into possession of an A31 2652 machine with a PIII according to the sticker on the machine, and Win 2000. It turns on and boots but is in need of a new battery as the old one is pretty much done, and it will only work plugged in which is why I haven't done much with it 'til now. That, and the replacement charger I bought tends to spark so that is a no go. I have to say, its pretty nice with the two ultrabays. The plan is to use one as an extra battery space, and the other as a CD/DVD drive to watch movies and such. I already have a Superdisk ultrabay so I'll finally be able to see what's on those Superdisks collecting dust from 15 years ago. It will be used for typing (LOVE THAT KEYBOARD!) short stories and such using my old copy of Lotus Smartsuite that came with my first I-Series Thinkpad, and VERY light web surfing using the wireless card that also came with it.

Okay, so here's the meat of it.
- Can it run Win XP reasonably well? I'd like to upgrade the OS, if possible.
- Is there a reliable battery vendor out there from whom I could obtain a replacement battery? I've been burned on the Bay of Evil in the past (see above about replacement charger).
- Anything I should know about this model? Any known issues?
- Any thoughts on upgrades? There probably isn't much more that the machine can handle but I thought I'd ask.

Many thanks!

Bob

[TPFanatic]

Congratulations on your A(wesome)31 acquisition.

If it says PIII it's likely an A30 with an A31 lid, or an A31 with an A30 palmrest, since A30 had the PIII and A31 had the P4-M.

Replacement chargers aren't nice... they'll work, but the OEM ones only spark minimally, they're heavier, don't feel cheap, and don't feel like they'll break in a fall. According to Thinkwiki you'd want a 72W 4.5 Amps power adapter. Think the original A series adapters had skinny wires... someone in the forum Marketplace should have some to sell, and they'd know the correct type if you want to get a better one. Apparently the feebay has them for under $10? I dunno how to tell the genuines from counterfeits.

I have a Hitachi Visiondesk with a 200mhz Pentium 2, and I think it runs XP okay. Some people run Win7 on their A31s. XP should be fine.

The A3x series is known for GPU failure caused by simply opening and closing the lid. no

Wireless is also limited to what it was before WPA without modded drivers, and even then it'll be slow, so an Ethernet cable will be the fastest for networking.

[Kasm279]

Apparently the feebay has them for under $10? I dunno how to tell the genuines from counterfeits.

Generally if you put "Genuine" in your search you'll get only genuine IBM power supplies. It also helps with fraud; if the listing said genuine IBM and it isn't, ebay will step in.

[ajkula66]

Hi all,

Awhile back, I came into possession of an A31 2652 machine with a PIII according to the sticker on the machine, and Win 2000.

What's the full model number found on the same sticker that holds the serial number and the production date on the bottom of the laptop? Should look something like 2652-P3U or so.Knowing this info would help us help you better.

There are no new genuine batteries for A3x series on feebay. Do bear the age of these machines in mind...

The A3x series is known for GPU failure caused by simply opening and closing the lid.

Where have you come up with this line of nonsense?

Wireless is also limited to what it was before WPA without modded drivers, and even then it'll be slow, so an Ethernet cable will be the fastest for networking.

The wireless card - presuming that the system is equipped with one in the first place - can be upgraded up to "N" speeds using the "no 1802" hack.

More to follow once we find out what the system actually is...

[aptivaboy]

Good call on the model. It turns out that it is an A30. I guess the seller didn't know either since he listed it as an A31. No worries, I'm happy either way.

Its a 2652-34U.

http://i231.photobucket.com/albums/ee11 ... 43uucc.jpg

http://i231.photobucket.com/albums/ee11 ... 4fn8q1.jpg

I'm very concerned about the charger issue. The one I bought was listed a genuine IBM charger but was instead a cheap aftermarket one was delivered. The seller didn't care when I complained. When I first plugged it in, it short circuited half of my condo. Thankfully, I have GFI switches and just reset the outlets and I was back in business. Ebay was no help.

Bob

[TPFanatic]

The A3x series is known for GPU failure caused by simply opening and closing the lid.

Where have you come up with this line of nonsense?

I'm sorry. I read the Thinkwiki.de page on A31 where it suggested that thermal issues causes weakening (thermal expanding and contracting) of the solder holding components to the board, of course in conjunction with the age of the machine. The A31 hinges are so strong that manipulating the lid wrongly can flex the plastic of the case, and the board with it, and break the components.

"Im ungünstigsten Fall genügt dann schon das Auf- und Zuklappen des Displaydeckels zum Bruch dieser Komponenten, was sich meistens in massiven Bildstörungen und schließlich Ausfall des Boards bemerkbar macht."

You're the expert, you know these computers better than anyone, so I do retract my statement. Open and close the laptop as much as you want.

[olex126]

but is in need of a new battery as the old one is pretty much done, and it will only work plugged in which is why I haven't done much with it 'til now.

I am in possession of several NOS (New Old Stock) batteries and NOS A/C adapters for the A3x series, all still closed with the original IBM sealing tape. The batteries are part of a lot that were purchased from our very own Ajkula66 (Hi George!) several years back. I would be happy to sell you either just a battery or both the battery and A/C adapter. We're contemplating a Canada Post strike here shortly, so if you're interested, let me know by PM and I'll take it from there.

Alternatively, check with Ajkula66 and see if he has any remaining spare NOS batteries. The domestic shipping would certainly be cheaper!

Regards. Dave

[ajkula66]

Good call on the model. It turns out that it is an A30. I guess the seller didn't know either since he listed it as an A31. No worries, I'm happy either way.

Its a 2652-34U.

An interesting system, should have a SXGA+ (1400x1050) LCD...

Code: Select all

PIII-M 1.0GHz (512KB), 128MB RAM, 30.0GB HDD, 15.0 SXGA+(1400x1050) TFT LCD, 8x-2.3x DVD, Modem (CDC), Ethernet (CDC), TV out, Li-Ion battery, Win2000

I'm very concerned about the charger issue.

You should be able to find a genuine one here on the forum for $10-12 or thereabouts...

You'll need to max the RAM to 1GB in order to run XP anywhere close to properly. A 7200rpm HDD - or a Samsung HM160HC which is 5400rpm but faster than most 7200rpm IDE drives - would be in order.

FWIW, I've got a *ton* of A3x plastics in good shape that I'm giving away for the shipping cost if you need anything. Have a good A30/p heatsink to throw in as well.

I'm sorry. I read the Thinkwiki.de page on A31 where it suggested that thermal issues causes weakening (thermal expanding and contracting) of the solder holding components to the board, of course in conjunction with the age of the machine. The A31 hinges are so strong that manipulating the lid wrongly can flex the plastic of the case, and the board with it, and break the components.

"Im ungünstigsten Fall genügt dann schon das Auf- und Zuklappen des Displaydeckels zum Bruch dieser Komponenten, was sich meistens in massiven Bildstörungen und schließlich Ausfall des Boards bemerkbar macht."

You're the expert, you know these computers better than anyone, so I do retract my statement. Open and close the laptop as much as you want.

Thank you for the kind words. I was completely unaware of that quote from German wiki. I need to take some time and do some editing on ThinkWiki, although I've only done it on the English side of the fence, since my written German is schlecht...

[aptivaboy]

PS. It appears to be a PIII at 1 Ghz with 1 GB of RAM, as per the Control Panel. Can the RAM be upgraded? I think its probably as far as it can go. Oh, and it already has Win 7 on it. I forgot that. But, I may have to replace it. The prior owner was apparently a Selena Gomez stalker, as her photo appears in any number of places, including within the Control Panel, of all places. Talk about weird...

It will also needs a new CMOS battery, so any pointers there would be greatly appreciated. I can tear down and upgrade desktops just fine, but fiddling with laptops are new to me.

Bob

[ajkula66]

PS. It appears to be a PIII at 1 Ghz with 1 GB of RAM, as per the Control Panel. Can the RAM be upgraded?

No, 1GB is max for A30/p.

It will also needs a new CMOS battery, so any pointers there would be greatly appreciated.

Most ThinPads use the same CMOS battery, anywhere from PII era into Sandy Bridge, apart from 600 series and R40. You should be able to find one on feebay for $6-7 or so...

[danikayser84]

As far as I know, the only A3x which had GPU failure issues was the A31p and that was due to inadequate cooling of the ATI FireGL GPU chip (which IIRC is on the underside of the board), neither my A30p nor A31 (non-p with 32MB VRAM) have had any issues with their GPU

Appears that your A31 (or actually A30 rather) might have been a FrankenPad of sorts, assembled from random parts? (kinda like my A22p IPS and R52 UXGA)

[rkawakami]

Oh, and it already has Win 7 on it. I forgot that. But, I may have to replace it.

I would firmly suggest doing so. To me it's not worth using an OS (and any programs that has been installed on the system) that came "used". Who knows what was done with the system beforehand and the potential, even if slight, of having keyloggers or trojans on it, outweighs the small time and cost that is spent installing an OS from scratch.

I am currently running Windows XP SP3 on my three A31p systems. Even with the maximum 2GB of memory, they are considerably slow when it comes to viewing web sites with embedded videos. I'm curious to know how an A30 running W7 with only 1GB does with web browsing.

As far as pointers for tearing down an A30 laptop, you best resource is found at the top of any of the forum pages. There's a link named HMM. Click it and you'll get an index of Hardware Maintenance Manuals in PDF format for Thinkpads going all the way back to the beginning. The one for your system is the A30, A30p, A31, A31p. In it are instructions for removing every piece of hardware. You may have to pay particular attention to A30-specific instructions as they can differ from the A31/p.

You will also have a Private Message (PM) from me in a few minutes...

[thinkpadcollection]

PS: GPU for any A3x are partially under the heatsink fan housing so there's some cooling air drawn under. There is no opening thru motherboard for fan's intake. Square ATI logo are the revised GPU that does not fail. Oval were the known ones to have problems.

HMM is very implicit on making sure there are original thermal pad sandwiched between bottom of motherboard where GPU location is and the passive heatsink plates for A31p.

Cheers, thinkpadcollection

[ajkula66]

Square ATI logo are the revised GPU that does not fail.

They ALL fail. Period. End of story. An absolutely lousy design on IBM's part.

HMM is very implicit on making sure there are original thermal pad sandwiched between bottom of motherboard where GPU location is and the passive heatsink plates for A31p.

Thermal sponges are supposed to be replaced every now and again, but good luck finding a set *anywhere* under $100...

[brchan]

I am curious why IBM and Lenovo chose to use thermal pads on some of their gpus and NB chipsets, especially considering the P4-M equipped A and T series ran very hot. They don't perform nearly as good as thermal paste and is it really that much cheaper?

[ajkula66]

I am curious why IBM and Lenovo chose to use thermal pads on some of their gpus and NB chipsets, especially considering the P4-M equipped A and T series ran very hot. They don't perform nearly as good as thermal paste and is it really that much cheaper?

Some of us here have been asking the same question for well over a decade. When it comes to the concept of GPU cooling on A3x systems one can only shake their head in disbelief. It is simply atrocious, above and beyond inadequate - especially on A31p with its FireGL GPU - and can't even be defined as "half-baked" which is the term that I'd use to describe cooling on some of the R5x/T4x machines...

[TPFanatic]

No need to put your A31 motherboard in the oven to reflow the GPU, when it's already an oven, eh?

[ajkula66]

No need to put your A31 motherboard in the oven to reflow the GPU, when it's already an oven, eh?

Sounds about right. At least if the GPU were positioned differently one could fry an egg on it...

[kfzhu1229]

Hi all,

Awhile back, I came into possession of an A31 2652 machine with a PIII according to the sticker on the machine, and Win 2000. It turns on and boots but is in need of a new battery as the old one is pretty much done, and it will only work plugged in which is why I haven't done much with it 'til now. That, and the replacement charger I bought tends to spark so that is a no go. I have to say, its pretty nice with the two ultrabays. The plan is to use one as an extra battery space, and the other as a CD/DVD drive to watch movies and such. I already have a Superdisk ultrabay so I'll finally be able to see what's on those Superdisks collecting dust from 15 years ago. It will be used for typing (LOVE THAT KEYBOARD!) short stories and such using my old copy of Lotus Smartsuite that came with my first I-Series Thinkpad, and VERY light web surfing using the wireless card that also came with it.

Okay, so here's the meat of it.
- Can it run Win XP reasonably well? I'd like to upgrade the OS, if possible.
- Is there a reliable battery vendor out there from whom I could obtain a replacement battery? I've been burned on the Bay of Evil in the past (see above about replacement charger).
- Anything I should know about this model? Any known issues?
- Any thoughts on upgrades? There probably isn't much more that the machine can handle but I thought I'd ask.

Many thanks!

Bob

Well yes it is a A30 if it has Pentium III Tualatin - M instead of Pentium 4. Their actual speed is actually similar but PIII runs cooler and P4 supports SSE2 which is required on some modern apps. Either way take care of your GPU and make sure either do not put GPU intensive stuff or turn your main fan to fan 7 or 64. Windows XP works just fine but if you max out the RAM Windows 7 also works fine with a Radeon 9000 driver installed for 7000 or 7500

[ajkula66]

Windows XP works just fine but if you max out the RAM Windows 7 also works fine with a Radeon 9000 driver installed for 7000 or 7500

I guess that it all depends on how one defines "working fine"...

To me personally, anything below T42/p (or R50p/T41p) with ATi 9600/Fire GL T2 and 2GB of RAM has absolutely no business running W7 even in the most tweaked of forms...

If I owned an A30/p, W2K would be my OS of choice.

To each their own.

[aptivaboy]

It has Win 7 and so far (typing, file transfer, simple stuff) no issues. It moves along quite quickly, but then there's minimal stuff memory resident so that's probably a goodly part of it. I may go back down to XP, my all time favorite OS depending upon costs for this and a few other projects currently on the front burner.

[kfzhu1229]

Well if u are using a A31 and u want to use newest apps like brosers (other than Firefox which still supports XP) you may want to go for 7... Just if u r using A31, watch for temperature in Windows 7...

[aptivaboy]

Just curious, what is the heat issue with the A30 or A31? I've heard of a heat issue with the R family, but not with the As.

This may be a dumb question, but I keep seeing OEM copies of Windows on a certain evil auction site that were meant originally for Dell, HP, Compaq, etc., computers from back in the day. Will these work for my A30? Will they replace the Thinkpad splash screen with one from another maker, for example? That, I would want.

Thank you again,

Bob

[rkawakami]

I'm not an expert on the A3x cooling issues so I'll leaving that to others to explain.

Don't have any temperature data on an A30 but the heat coming out from an idling A31p (which is left on 24/7) directly at the side exhaust port is 46C/114F. CPU temperature utility reports 55C/131F.

As far as the "splash screen" goes, that image data comes out of the BIOS. Attempting to load an OS from a disk set that's not from IBM will not alter the splash screen. Also, it's probable that not everything will work correctly as the drivers for the hardware on the A3x motherboard may not match what came on Dell, HP, Compaq systems. Best case is you're left with a system that uses a generic VGA driver and is mostly usable; enough to get online and download the proper drivers. Worst case is a system that will always throw a "blue screen" on booting, which may or may not allow running in Safe Mode. My advice is to get a IBM factory restore set from somebody here on the forum.

P.S. Here's information on how to change the splash screen:

http://www.thinkwiki.org/wiki/How_to_ch ... ash_screen

[kfzhu1229]

Just curious, what is the heat issue with the A30 or A31? I've heard of a heat issue with the R family, but not with the As.

This may be a dumb question, but I keep seeing OEM copies of Windows on a certain evil auction site that were meant originally for Dell, HP, Compaq, etc., computers from back in the day. Will these work for my A30? Will they replace the Thinkpad splash screen with one from another maker, for example? That, I would want.

Thank you again,

Bob

You say "EDIT - its an A30"... Assuming it is an A30, the CPU runs pretty cool under idle - the cooler is really effective with stock 1ghz. I have unofficial upgrade of 1.2ghz CPU. It is less effective because the TDP is higher but still good. Well, that is, unless you throw heavy stuff on it though. This Tualatin Pentium III is much better than A/T22's Coppermine Pentium IIIs. My T22's fan stays on all the time with Windows 7 and it is really hot - twice as hot as my T23 and A30 and twice slower at the same time!! BE CAREFUL WITH ITS GPU!! IT IS PRONE TO BURN IF NOT TREATED PROPERLY!! The littlest thing you can do is to use TPControl and turn on FAN 7 while you play games such as the original PVZ which works just fine. I tried it for at least half a year with the FAN 7 on and the GPU is still flawless... The IBM keyboards feels amazing, much better than today's keyboard, and A30 does not have the T43's southbridge, PCI, GPU, HDD heating issue which warms up the keyboard and palmrest and especially trackpad which I seldom use and it is without any wear after 10 years of torture... So man, just be careful with its GPU and it is an amazing laptop if functional!! If you want to browse, upgrade your RAM to its max 1GB and use Win7 x86 SP1 + Firefox + adblocker and it works fine with pretty much all non-flash non-youtube websites (Google Chrome's latest browser only works on T30/A31 and later because Pentium III is not supported). For Spotify please use 0.9.11.27 which is the latest version for PIII and minimize it when you are not controlling it because whenever the Spotify Window is up, the CPU is always 100.
Also this is not UEFI, so the splash screen won't change (UEFI isn't introduced until 2010-2011 and it only works on x64 systems while this CPU does not support x64 at all). It works with all Windows from 4.0-7 SP1 x86 (Of course with at least 512mb of RAM) and Win98/me (Of course with limit of 512mb of RAM set in msconfig if 768mb or 1gb is installed).

[aptivaboy]

Thanks for the info, all.

No worries, kfzhu1229, I won't be playing games with it. It'll be a typing/short story machine. I agree, the Tpads' keyboards were the best. This may be sacrilege, but I like the I-Series keyboards the best of all of the pads I've tried, but the A is a very close second.

The plan is to go Win XP more than likely. As per the Microsoft tech spec page, the A30's specs are literally the lowest recommended for Win 7. While it can run it, and currently is, I'd feel better with XP not taxing the resources.

Bob

[ajkula66]

The plan is to go Win XP more than likely.

Sheer curiosity on my end: what exactly don't you like about W2K? I'd argue that it's a much better fit for these systems.

[kfzhu1229]

Well I personally think Windows 7 interface looks much better even without Aero. I have 1.2ghz PIII with 1gb RAM and Windows XP and 7 does make no difference in terms of speed. Windows 2000 does get faster but you are stuck with Office 2003 if you have SP3 or SP4 and slower startup... While the official specs say it is at the lowest spec, Windows 7's real lowest spec is 512mb of RAM and you can still use it at 384mb (until you open apps)... Not until Windows 8 that really requires 1gb at lowest, 1.5gb recommended. For 1ghz PIII it is equivalent to a 1.7ghz P4 and if you think like that, you think it runs just fine and it is the truth, Windows 7 on A30 runs much better than its sibling T23 due to ATI graphics. I am using a driver designed for 9000 to avoid bluescreen problems but other than that it works fine. Also if you want to play video, use MPC or VLC and you are able to play 360p mp4 or 480p uncompressed or standard DVD. (Don't think about 720p, even a T42 (non-p, 1.8ghz, 7500) struggles with it) For Microsoft Office, the latest version that would work on the machine is Office 2010 (2013 requires SSE2 enabled CPU which is Pentium 4), the latest Adobe reader that works on that machine is XI which is still more than good enough for normal use. You really should try Spotify 0.9.11.27 on the machine since its speaker is the very best of all ThinkPads ever produced (tie with 770 and 600)

[ajkula66]

I have 1.2ghz PIII with 1gb RAM and Windows XP and 7 does make no difference in terms of speed.

I'd argue that both of these are an overkill for an A30/p. A fully updated XP Pro SP3 requires more than 1GB of RAM to run properly IMO.

Windows 2000 does get faster but you are stuck with Office 2003 if you have SP3 or SP4 and slower startup...

On this type of architecture startup is slow, period...

Windows 7 on A30 runs much better than its sibling T23 due to ATI graphics. I am using a driver designed for 9000 to avoid bluescreen problems but other than that it works fine.

I can't tolerate W7 on an A31p which is leaps and bounds more powerful in the graphics department than an A30 and would probably end up smashing the system to pieces if I ever tried to run W7 on an A30...so our definitions of "working fine" are likely extremely different.

[kfzhu1229]

I have 1.2ghz PIII with 1gb RAM and Windows XP and 7 does make no difference in terms of speed.

I'd argue that both of these are an overkill for an A30/p. A fully updated XP Pro SP3 requires more than 1GB of RAM to run properly IMO.

Well, a fresh install of both works just fine. However, if you upgraded from OEM the speed is unbearable (I have a copy of IBM OEM T41p MODERATELY USED Windows XP SP3 in my T43 and it takes 2 minutes to start and unresponsive all the time (not because of different systems, I tried T43 one as well, Pentium M sonoma does not suit Windows XP at all (Pentium 4 650 in XP runs 3 times faster), Windows 7 is much more responsive than that, in Windows 10 Pentium M 780 works better than Pentium 4 650 3.4ghz of my dell GX520 but starts up slower at all times in all cases because of 5400rpm IDE vs. 7500rpm SATA))

I can't tolerate W7 on an A31p which is leaps and bounds more powerful in the graphics department than an A30 and would probably end up smashing the system to pieces if I ever tried to run W7 on an A30...so our definitions of "working fine" are likely extremely different.

I have a T42 with 7500 which is LESS powerful than A31p and Windows 7 works fine. Plus if you use A31 you can have 2gb of RAM.
And yes, my definition of "working fine" may be very extreme to others.
I use my T23 with Windows 7 and 1gb of RAM for printer connection purpose.
I use A30 with Windows 7 and 1gb of RAM for speakers.
I use 2 T43s one 14.1" SXGA+ one 15" UXGA & Pentium M 780 with 2gb of RAM, fp, and 160gb IDE for both as daily computer running in Windows 10. It seems very extreme as I am fully pushing the boundary of the capabilities of the laptops... I really have the patience unless it fully screws up in extreme cases such as demonstrating something to my girl and it lags all over the place while it shouldn't be...
When I first discovered T43 can hold Windows 8, 8.1 and 10 (I thought T43 is no different than T42), I was so shocked and proud that it is the first ThinkPad to run Windows 10 without major problems ever (The GMA version of T43 and X41 will have display driver issues).
For Windows 7, however, unlike Windows 8 and up which needs NX enabled Pentiums, there is not a clear yes or no if the computer can run it, it is only the speed that suits individuals. I have seen people running Windows 7 on 570E with PII 226mhz and 512mb of RAM and still use it...