Weird CPU behavior after Middleton BIOS update

[wujstefan]

Hello,

I have some problem with the CPU - T9500 in T601 frankie.

Under Lenovo BIOS my CPU stayed at idle in high 40s C, when stressed 75C
Now after Middleton upgrade it is super-snappy (mostly thanks to SATA-2 and SSD drive), but CPU idles around 60C. When stressed using CPUPrime it actually reaches 100C.
Plus, HWinfo states VMX is disabled - ever since it is acually enabled in BIOS.

FAN works perfectly; when CPUPrime is set off it takes ~5sec to get back to 60C.

Anyone faced such issue?

[brchan]

Have you tried resetting the bios to defaults? I got some weird behavior until I did that.

[wujstefan]

Yup, did that already, no effect.

[brchan]

If the laptop actually feels hotter, try reseating the heatsink. If there is no change, reflash the bios back with a non-middleton's bios and check the results.

[wujstefan]

Does it have anything to do with BIOS?
Reseating the haetsink gives no effect - actually the system cools down in 2-3 secs back to 60s. Will try the BIOS reflash and let you know about the results.

[Hans Gruber]

I have a T61 with Middleton, T9300 and Nvidia graphics. A quick question. Do your temps get toasty with or without AC or both? My T61 gets into the mid to upper 80's on AC power and stays in the mid 60's with battery power. The high temps are when gaming only. When TPfancontrol kicks the fan up to 4700RPM that knocks the temps down to mid to high 70's. This is of course when playing demanding games.

I think my temps are due to my fan not running above 3000RPM's mostly.

[ELCouz]

Does it have anything to do with BIOS?
Reseating the haetsink gives no effect - actually the system cools down in 2-3 secs back to 60s. Will try the BIOS reflash and let you know about the results.

BIOS do some thermal management such as when to engage the cooling fan and at which speed depending on the GPU/CPU temperature.

[wujstefan]

BIOS settings is another thing. I'm controlling the fan using tpfancontrol; the fan itself is from T61p unit (Furukawa) - and when on full power it does not exceed 3500rpm (fastest possible). Will also try with T60 discrete fan.

What I found out is that actually GPU is reasonably cool right now. After 1hr of burning with furmark the temp on GPU does not exceed 75C (24C ambient), which seem acceptable while GPU running at 100%. No undervolting via Middleton.

I will get a shot and try another two CPU's I have. Maybe there is something wrong with this one.

EDIT:
I tried to undervolt with ThrottleStop to see if it helps, but it's impossible to undervolt. While setting the multiplier / voltage in TS it actually doesnt change the clock speed or voltage. EIST option for example works fine.

EDIT2:
Got it to work. Also swapped the CPU to T7300 and... it never passes 72C, even after 1,5hr of prime working at full stress. T9500 easily reaches 90C and stays there. This one is "Engineering sample" - and I've heard these are actually better than the standard ones...

[ELCouz]

BIOS settings is another thing. I'm controlling the fan using tpfancontrol; the fan itself is from T61p unit (Furukawa) - and when on full power it does not exceed 3500rpm (fastest possible). Will also try with T60 discrete fan.

What I found out is that actually GPU is reasonably cool right now. After 1hr of burning with furmark the temp on GPU does not exceed 75C (24C ambient), which seem acceptable while GPU running at 100%. No undervolting via Middleton.

I will get a shot and try another two CPU's I have. Maybe there is something wrong with this one.

EDIT:
I tried to undervolt with ThrottleStop to see if it helps, but it's impossible to undervolt. While setting the multiplier / voltage in TS it actually doesnt change the clock speed or voltage. EIST option for example works fine.

EDIT2:
Got it to work. Also swapped the CPU to T7300 and... it never passes 72C, even after 1,5hr of prime working at full stress. T9500 easily reaches 90C and stays there. This one is "Engineering sample" - and I've heard these are actually better than the standard ones...

Get a P9700 ... it's a good balance between computation and TDP (longer battery life)

[wujstefan]

Get a P9700 ... it's a good balance between computation and TDP (longer battery life)

It's like "My car's alternator seems a bit noisy" - "oh you should buy a new car".

I've got a T9500, not P9700. And P9700 is 1066MHz, which will demand a deep modification into MB hardware to work, and I'd like to avoid that.

As for my further tests on T9500:
1. I managed to run it on DUAL-IDA changing multiplier to 14x (2,8GHz), with no further problems.
2. Undervolted the CPU to 1,075V; completely stable with 3hrs burning test.
3. After using a new thermal paste (Noctua NT-H1 instead of AS5), polishing the fan, reseating it I found out the system to be working on 52C CPU / 52C GPU on idle with fan OFF, and 55C/55C when doing some light work with fan on "1" in tpfc. Hardcore benchmarking on prime 95 swings it off to 80C - my fan starts working on 4500rpm (64 mode) there and kills the temp down to 75C - and it stays there.

It really looks and feels better; the CPU also turned out to be very stable with lower voltage. What are your feelings/experience with T9x00 series? I still think that undervolting actually should not be necessary to keep the system from overheating.

[Cigarguy]

I have a T9500 in my T601 Frankie and it runs without problem. 40ish deg C idle, 85-88 stable when I tested it for stability with Prime95 for approximately 24 hours. I have a few T9300 running in a regular T61 with similar result.

Can't offer any solution as to why yours is idling so high.

[ELCouz]

Get a P9700 ... it's a good balance between computation and TDP (longer battery life)

It's like "My car's alternator seems a bit noisy" - "oh you should buy a new car".

I've got a T9500, not P9700. And P9700 is 1066MHz, which will demand a deep modification into MB hardware to work, and I'd like to avoid that.

Got a P9700 for 20$ on ebay... ain't gonna break the bank... also the wire mod was not very complicated and you warranty is already voided anyway from many years

It's not like I didn't tried the higher end of the Txxxx cpu... they heat more for sure then I got the P9700!

[ELCouz]

It's like "My car's alternator seems a bit noisy" - "oh you should buy a new car".

I've got a T9500, not P9700. And P9700 is 1066MHz, which will demand a deep modification into MB hardware to work, and I'd like to avoid that.

Got a P9700 for 20$ on ebay... ain't gonna break the bank... also the wire mod was not very complicated and you warranty is already voided anyway from many years

It's not like I didn't tried the higher end of the Txxxx cpu... they heat more for sure then I got the P9700!

Disregard my previous replies.... I'd say then flash back to stock...

[wujstefan]

@ELCouz: I'm looking for a solution to make my hardware work properly. I took such swap under consideration, but since I already have T9500 I would like to use it. P9700 costs around 40USD + shipping. Same unit in Europe costs twice as much. What is the true difference between those? 10W TDP is quite much, what are your temps with P9700?

@Cigarguy: Intel or nVidia frankie? 85-88C is actually what I archieved now when under load, but my idling temps are still ~52-55C.

[ELCouz]

@ELCouz: I'm looking for a solution to make my hardware work properly. I took such swap under consideration, but since I already have T9500 I would like to use it. P9700 costs around 40USD + shipping. Same unit in Europe costs twice as much. What is the true difference between those? 10W TDP is quite much, what are your temps with P9700?

Idle (stable, Fan 0 RPM):
CPU 36C
GPU 39C

Under load Prime95 (30 minutes battery run TDP limited, Fan 2406 RPM):

CPU 47C
GPU 46C

Under load Prime95 (30 minutes AC run MAX TDP, Fan 3350 RPM max speed for my fan, quiet !):

CPU 84C
GPU 62C

Ambient temperature was 23C when testing.

NOTE: Prime95 doesn't load the GPU so I didn't test the NVIDIA gpu. (IIRC ~80-85C under full load)


BTW, if you idle at 60C... something is either wrong with the BIOS fan speed, something is working in your background or cpu/gpu need paste re-application / re-seating.
Fan can also fail, I replaced mine two years ago.

[wujstefan]

Have you undervolted your GPU?

Under heavy load (furmark test) my GPU reaches no more than 75C but idles around 50C w/ambient 24C. Any values below 40C w/ambient 20+C seems unbelievable for nVidia chip.

I can add that my MOBO is the NOS replacement unit that TuuS has kindly offered here on forum.

I wonder how important updating the system (win7) may be? Since win10 has been offered it become impossible to download all the updates in some European countries, officially due to server overloads.

EDIT: I am controlling the fan via tpfancontrol and not the BIOS.

[ELCouz]

Have you undervolted your GPU?

Under heavy load (furmark test) my GPU reaches no more than 75C but idles around 50C w/ambient 24C. Any values below 40C w/ambient 20+C seems unbelievable for nVidia chip.

I can add that my MOBO is the NOS replacement unit that TuuS has kindly offered here on forum.

I wonder how important updating the system (win7) may be? Since win10 has been offered it become impossible to download all the updates in some European countries, officially due to server overloads.

EDIT: I am controlling the fan via tpfancontrol and not the BIOS.

T61p is bone stock, except for modified ram eeprom, fsb 1066 wire mod , middleton BIOS and P9700... if you count the heatsink replacement I had (fan failure)... no undervolting


For the idle GPU temp... I can take a screenshot if you don't believe me

Lower CPU temp also help the GPU

[wujstefan]

Ah, T61p's MB may have different temps

Anyway, it,s better now.

IDLE:
CPU 47C
GPU 51C
Ambient 24,5C

LOAD:
CPU 80C -> fan turbo mode -> 71C and stays there
GPU 75C

Cooldown back to idle temps takes no longer than 3-4 minutes. Take just a couple of seconds to get lower 50s after several hours of full stress w/prime or furmark.

How?
1. Polished the fan - it's T61p's fan on T61 mobo.
2. Used high percentage alcohol to make every plate clear.
3. Dusted and greased the fan with vaseline oil in spray
4. Swapped thermal compound - removed Arctic Silver 5 and applied Noctua NT-H1
5. Changed the short screw holding the GPU "pressure plate" for a longer one.

No undervolting yet. Will try it later on