Power increase on T500?

[CASPER]

Hello,

I have been using my T500 for 5 years. I like it very much, battery still holds good charge, it`s very tough and has good build qulity, keyboard is superior and I love to type on it. But it is 9 years old now, and I sometimes struggle to do simple tasks as web browsing due to lack of power.
My configuration is:
Intel Core2Duo P8400 2,26 GHz,
Intel GMA 4500MHD graphics,
8 GB dual channel DDR3 memory,
320 GB HDD,
WIN 7 x64.

My typical use is:
- about 30-60 firefox tabs open (some with flash based content),
- e-mail client in background,
- music player,
- gimp software,
- office software,
All of that is open at the same time. Sometimes I use 3D cad software.
The problem is that I cannot even scroll through web pages smoothly enough.

Processor usage is high so I was wondering if replacing CPU would increase singificantly speed of my laptop? Or there is no other way, than switch to newer Thnikpad model?
I currently run without SWAP file, with custom power settings, have optimalized services and applications running in background, no file indexing, so at the software level everything I could, I have done.

I think CPU upgrade could be an easy choice, but I want to have good battery life and low power consumption overall, because I use it very often, combined with greater speed. Is it possible with this machine?

[RealBlackStuff]

Best option is an SSD, followed by taking it a bit easier on your number of browser tabs, 30-60 is ridiculous IMHO.

Replace Firefox with the 32-bit BlueMoon, combined with Firemin, which should bring down memory consumption considerably.

[CASPER]

Actually RAM consumption is OK, but responsiveness isn`t good enough. There are problems when using heavy java script websites, it is just getting laggy sometimes.
I like using firefox, but I will try this browser, maybe this will help a bit.

SSD is on to do list, but I don`t know when this will happen.

Does this setup (P8400 + 4500MHD) is capable of playing 1080p 60 fps videos from youtube, or only my specimen cannot do it?

[axur-delmeria]

A CPU upgrade to a P9600 (2.8GHz, 25 watts TDP) might help, for the browser tabs, but running all the other software? Get something with a decent quad-core.

El-sahef did a quad-core mod for the T500 at the German thinkpads forum: original page and Google-translated

But it requires a few hardware modifications, as well as flashing Coreboot instead of the stock BIOS.

In the end, he stopped working on it. IMO it's more like a "proof of concept" rather than a fully-tested, properly-working mod.

[CASPER]

Yeah, too much to mess up. Although I am capable of board modification, but I don`t have tools to flash Coreboot. Also 45W TDP is too much for me, I`m travelling with computer quite often so I need best performance per watt. I think P9600 is the fastest Core2 chip with 25 W TDP, am I correct?

[axur-delmeria]

There's the P9700 with 28w TDP, running at 2.8GHz. The 25w TDP P9600 ran at 2.667GHz (my mistake, I said 2.8 GHz earlier)

[Hans Gruber]

I have the T9600 (2.8Ghz) in a a couple of T500's and a T9900 (3.06Ghz) in a couple of W500's. The T9600 is a good upgrade option for your T500. The biggest difference would be putting in a SSD as suggested by several members in this thread. I would suggest considering a T410 or T510 for a little extra power but you would lose the 16:10 ratio with the T510 but the T410 is still 16:10 ratio.

[bob_brisket]

If you want a fairly cheap upgrade that might give you 5-10% (maybe a bit more) performance, get yourself an Intel/Apple OEM processor.

You can read about my T500 here https://mattcree.github.io/technology/2 ... -t500.html

I bought a E8335 SLAQB(C0) -- you can find the full list of Apple OEM chips here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_I ... C_45_nm.29

Obviously it would be inadvisable to go for the higher TDP chips, but the 35W chips are probably safe enough. I got mine for peanuts -- ended up selling the T9400 the laptop came with for more than the Apple CPU. By contrast, the T9600 and up are pretty [censored] expensive. It's literally cheaper to buy a first gen i5 ThinkPad than one of those a lot of the time.

[jaspen-meyer]

In firefox:
1. disable 'smooth scrolling'
2. put a check mark beside 'Don’t load tabs until selected'
3. go to 'about:config' and add:
dom.ipc.processCount 2
4. install https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefo ... /noscript/
only allow javascript which are needed to load the page (do not allow wasteful javascript from advertising and other unneeded javascript)
5. set up a 'ram disk' and then, in 'about:config' add a 'string' named 'browser.cache.disk.parent_directory' with a value of: e:\path\to\ramdisk

In my T400 I use a P9600.

[CASPER]

WOW, didn`t expect so many answers

@jaspen-meyer - I followed all steps, it did help a little. I put also windows temp files on a ramdisk, will see if this help. Currently not using NoScript because I was furious every time I opened new website and had to activate some scprits to make it just working.

@bob_brisket - I have seen this apple core2 series, but they aren`t currently available at my country. How are the temps on yours T500 with this 35 W TDP cpu? I have seen that your model has ATI gpu, so the heatsink is bigger, which should result in slightly better cooling when using integrated intel gpu - I think How is battery life with this cpu? Also I think that 5-10 % gain isn`t worth trouble, especially when cpu cost ~20 % price of a computer.

I have been watching indy 500 through youtube tonight (480p) and cpu usage was somewhere around 60-100 %. Ram looked very stable, hdd too. Also temps were very high considering type of usage, 150-160 F degrees. I think my thermal paste is rubbish after 9 years.

@ Hans-Gruber @axur-delmeria - those cpu`s are even more expensive than e8335, so it looks like it isn`t worth trouble too much also. I think that the best option could be buying newer model, i5 based. Also, no matter how many magic tricks I will do with software, this will not easily overcome hardware limits.

Thank you very much for help, any kind of help is highly appreciated.

[jaspen-meyer]

Also, no matter how many magic tricks I will do with software, this will not easily overcome hardware limits.

NoScript, or a similar tool to limit the amount of javascript, would easily overcome the problem. Simiarlly, hardware doesn't overcome wasteful useage of cpu cycles.

[CASPER]

That is true, I have to admit. Generally software nowadays isn`t as good in terms of optimalization like it was 10-15 years ago. Now we have very fast computers and code writing is expensive so everybody try to cut costs.
Another thing - JavaScript is very resource-hungry language.

[TonyJZX]

I applaud the OP's persistence... IMO the P8400/8700 is borderline these days.

If you're running a sub 1,600 x 900 screen on a cpu like this you should be ok w/ Intel gfx.

The top spec P9700/P9800 is a tad better... I have a laptop with this and its not bad on an fhd screen.

I suspect that the OP is an edge case... I mean 1,200p on Intel gfx on a C2D? Hmmm.

I'll give you an example, I ran a 1st gen i5 2.5 w/ Intel gfx dual 1,920 x 1,200 LCD screens external and it was *just* ok at this level but you could feel that a dedicated gpu would be smoother.

I seem to recall Lenovo did this a fair bit... custom (CTO?) builds with Intel gpu and 1,200p screens wasnt recommended although they would sell them if you wanted them.

[CASPER]

I replaced stock screen with 1920x1200 panel about 1,5 year ago. You may be right about this, if gpu cannot handle task then system will use more CPU. But it should run HD fine, it's meant to do that.

Mine isn't cto machine, I just put different things in it, because I don't bother having it in original state.
It's already kinda used and beaten up a bit, because I use it every single day for many hours.

[Pokrzept]

Imho we are missing the point. Since OP needs to increase computing power of his machine significantly, T500 should be off the table. Casper no matter how much money you'd put in it, improvement in a matter of raw CPU performance (which seems to be an bottleneck in your case) will be marginal. If you want to keep your expenses as low as possible please consider replacing your beloved machine with - at least - T520 (FHD display, Optimus graphics and extended battery would be an best option in your case). There's dirt cheap unit for sale at allegro atm for less than 200$, not that much for a machine twice as fast as your current configuration (basically in every aspect).

[CASPER]

Thanks for your reply. I`ve been looking at x20 and x30 series for some time, basically 2nd generation core i5 2520m is almost twice as fast as mine P8400. And probably much more efficient. I also think that this is the way to go. But if replacing I would like to have a little bit less weight to carry around now with charger it`s 3,5 kg, with some stuff it is more tha 5 kg...

Shame is really, that almost every thinkpad at price around 200-300 $ has nearly dead battery. Mine came 5 years ago with extended battery in excellent condition, and now it is only 30 % of wear on it, although I put 900 charge/discharge cycles. But well, that is the price to pay

I heard that screens on x20 and x30 series aren`t good. Is that true?

[axur-delmeria]

I heard that screens on x20 and x30 series aren`t good. Is that true?

Here's a screen comparison of two T430's: https://imgur.com/a/HPvAq

On the right is the stock 1600x900 (HD+) TN screen, while the left one was replaced with an AUO B140RTN02.1, a glossy LCD panel usually found in the Alienware M14X. Take note that while it's not an IPS panel, the viewing angles are still quite good.

[CASPER]

The left one looks good, even though it`s glossy. Colours seem to be more vivid. Do they came with matte finish? I think this stock one is still better than my samsung full hd TN I currently use.

[axur-delmeria]

The left one looks good, even though it`s glossy. Colours seem to be more vivid. Do they came with matte finish? I think this stock one is still better than my samsung full hd TN I currently use.

You seem to be misunderstanding things: The screen on the left is not stock -- it was replaced with a screen from an Alienware M14X.

The worse-looking one at the right is the stock Lenovo screen.

[bob_brisket]

@bob_brisket - I have seen this apple core2 series, but they aren`t currently available at my country. How are the temps on yours T500 with this 35 W TDP cpu? I have seen that your model has ATI gpu, so the heatsink is bigger, which should result in slightly better cooling when using integrated intel gpu - I think How is battery life with this cpu? Also I think that 5-10 % gain isn`t worth trouble, especially when cpu cost ~20 % price of a computer.

I haven't used it actively for a while, but my girlfriend was using it until just 2 days ago. I would say that they weren't unusually high temperatures even with the HD3650 (it was fairly hot anyway) but I did have the Intel GPU as the primary, and switched off the discrete GPU.

The battery is only the smaller one (I think it's a 6-cell -- it doesn't stick out) and it only ever got around 2 hours of usage even with the T9400. I think it probably didn't affect it much -- it's not good compared to any modern computer lets say.

Like others, I'd agree that upgrading a laptop like this is more a labour of love than something that will result in a substantial practical benefit. Get yourself a T420 or T520 -- they appear to be pretty good bang for buck at the moment, and the keyboard is as good as the T500 as far as I'm concerned (probably better, since I was using a T60 keyboard and I remember switching it because the included keyboard felt a bit less 'nice').

People have suggested browsers -- Opera has a nice power saving feature that disables unnecessary JavaScript and generally decreases power consumption. I thought it made some difference when I used it with my first gen i7 X201s

Also, as the others have suggested, an SSD is probably going to be the biggest and most measurable performance improvement. All IO intensive work will be feel a lot faster. With the T500 you could always get a 64GB SSD and have a boot drive in an Ultrabay caddy.

[jaspen-meyer]

Shame is really, that almost every thinkpad at price around 200-300 $ has nearly dead battery.

The German thinkpad forum has much better machines than what you'd buy for the same price in Poland.
https://thinkpad-forum.de/forums/16-Bie ... beh%C3%B6r

[Sweater Fish Deluxe]

I recently upgraded from a Z61t with a T7200 C2D CPU (so a generation behind yours) to a T420s with i7 2620M plus discrete graphics and I have to say the difference in performance is not very large. My usage tends to be pretty conservative, though, and I never really ran into raw horsepower limits on my Z61t. Maybe it'd be more dramatic for you.

The advantages of the T420s for me are more memory (T60/Z61t is hardware capped at 3GB), better battery life, and a better screen. The GPUs are better, too, and I do notice that, though I honestly can't tell any difference between the integrated graphics and NVidia GPU. Even in GPUtest benchmarks they perform nearly the same.

I think your best bets as previous posters have suggested are going to be changing your browser/browsing habits and getting an SSD.

[TonyJZX]

I dont have any super powerful laptops... not interested in investing past the 420 but I do have a few very very high performance desktops (ie. 8 core Xeons w/ 32gb) and I feel that my laptop experience which is pretty much exclusively WIn7 in classic mode on hardware from the T9300 to the dual core 2nd gen i5 isnt a big deal...

I can just about feel how things are smoother with an i5 as it has AES and the newer mod cons but a T9300 w/4gb ssd and Win7 still does everything I want on the internet inc. FHD video just fine,

Its just that I get decent hardware for either not much or free and you may as well use the i5 - i also feel that for people who arent super IT folks then maybe spend up a little bit more and buy for extra capacity.

An 8Gb i5 ssd laptop in the 2nd 3rd even 4th gen isnt too big a deal. I have a Dell 4th gen FHD that really wasnt much money at all given these are already 3 gens old.

I expect in the great nation of the US and other western nations, ex business lease laptops should be easily obtainable.

[CASPER]

The left one looks good, even though it`s glossy. Colours seem to be more vivid. Do they came with matte finish? I think this stock one is still better than my samsung full hd TN I currently use.

You seem to be misunderstanding things: The screen on the left is not stock -- it was replaced with a screen from an Alienware M14X.

The worse-looking one at the right is the stock Lenovo screen.

I haven`t. I mean, this stock one on the right looks still better than panel in my T500. And this on the left looks superior, but I am wondering whether they came in matte finish also?

@bob_briskett - 2 hours isnt`t bad at all with 35 TDP CPU and discrete graphics. x20 series is in very good price range, I have to admit, will consider buying. I replaced keyboard also, because well, I destroyed previous one in a dumb way. I think the old one was better, T500 came with 3 types of keyboard I think. SSD is on a list, but don`t know what to buy at the moment, most of producers swith to TLC nand which I don`t want. Also 64 GB SSD isn`t enough for system drive, 120 is minimum, 240 optimal. I worry the most about HDD geting destroyed while carrying laptop, even though I do backups.

@jespen-mayer - it looks like they sell very nice machines for great price, although I wanted to cry when I saw a T500 in good condition for about 50 euros

@Sweater Fish Deluxe - I thought discrete graphics is far better than integrated, that dissapoints me a lot since I do CAD work and 3D modelling from time to time.

@TonyJZX - 2nd gen i5 it`s looking very good based performance / price indicator. Ex lease laptops are easily available, though their condition is mostly questionable. I bought mine after lease and this was a lucky hit

So next hit is SSD, even if I upgrade laptop, SSD will come with me. Thanks for help

[Thinkpad4by3]

Try desktop replacment apps like say for javascript sites like facebook

Sent from my SM-G550T using Tapatalk

[Hans Gruber]

The T500 has the 16X10 screen going for it. That is the selling point or should I say buying point. As far as CPU goes. I have the both the T9600 for T500 and T9900 for W500. At this stage of the T500 lifecycle, there really isn't much of a difference between the two CPU's considering it's 2017 and CPU's today are much more powerful in comparison. With an SSD you can't really tell the difference. With regard to display the 1920x1200 makes sense for bragging rights but the 1680x1050 is just as good if you are blind like me.

[axur-delmeria]

I haven`t. I mean, this stock one on the right looks still better than panel in my T500. And this on the left looks superior, but I am wondering whether they came in matte finish also?

I apologize then. Seems that I was the one who misunderstood.

Dunno about the matte finish, though I doubt it.

[Hans Gruber]

My guess is the one on the left is an IPS panel vs a TN panel on the right.

[CASPER]

Well, it looks like an IPS, but actually panelook says it`s a TN. Nice.

[Thinkpad4by3]

Well not all TN is bad. Compare the X301 to the x220 and be blown away.

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