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T42 9000/9600 Gfx

T4x series specific matters only
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seskanda
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T42 9000/9600 Gfx

#1 Post by seskanda » Sat Jun 27, 2020 10:28 am

Hello

What is product ID of the Thinkpad T42 that has the ATi Mobility Radeon 9000 and 9600 graphics card? Looking for a Windows 98 laptop and hear 9000 works the best.

Thanks in advance

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Re: T42 9000/9600 Gfx

#2 Post by ajkula66 » Sat Jun 27, 2020 11:08 am

Welcome to the forum!

A lot of T42 units sported the 9600, while some early ones had 9000. There are way too many models and applicable configurations for them to be listed here.

Ask the seller for the 7-character code on the bottom of the laptop - it should look something like 2373-14U - and then run that number against the "MTM" link above.

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Re: T42 9000/9600 Gfx

#3 Post by seskanda » Sat Jun 27, 2020 11:45 am

I appreciate the welcome!

Had no idea so many T42 were made but thought maybe it was known which ones had Mobility Radeon 9000 vs. 9600. Or a way to tell if T42 had a 9000 or 9600 graphics card besides looking in Device Manager of Windows.

Yes I think that it is also called Product ID, but what if it is missing from bottom of laptop? What does "MTM" mean? I just started using it and how does that work?

Thanks in advance

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Re: T42 9000/9600 Gfx

#4 Post by ajkula66 » Sat Jun 27, 2020 11:54 am

You can look in the BIOS and the serial will begin with 237314Ublablahblah

No need for an OS or even a hard drive, the answer will be right there, just run it against the link.

MTM has been around forever, almost every sub-model has one assigned. The link provides you with the specs that the machine originally shipped with, really very simple.

Good luck.
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Re: T42 9000/9600 Gfx

#5 Post by kfzhu1229 » Sat Jun 27, 2020 12:01 pm

https://www.ebay.ca/itm/IBM-ThinkPad-T4 ... %7Ciid%3A1
This for example has a code of 2378-fvu, which if you use the MTM link above you get the original spec with a Radeon 9600 and a SXGA+ display.
That said though if you are getting machines in this kind of disrepair shape you will have to take a risk as it might come with a desoldering graphics chip or a broken backlight and such.
Don't think Radeon 9600's driver support under Windows 98 is all that great though due to its DX9 support, I know Radeon 9000 works just fine in Win98
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Re: T42 9000/9600 Gfx

#6 Post by seskanda » Sat Jun 27, 2020 12:26 pm

Very good that the BIOS also gives the Product ID, let's hope the screen is working of course.

Yes that is very convenient just need that Product ID, and it comes up pretty fast I just tried now!

But does MTM stand for something? How does the MTM pull up the original specs using the Product ID? And how accurate is that, or has it been wrong ever before?

Yes this was one of the Thinkpad T42 I was interested in. What is a desoldering graphics chip? Do you mean the screen backlight or keyboard backlight is broken? I doubt the T42 even has a keyboard backlight. What exactly are the issues Radeon 9600 has with Windows 98? Will most likely be going for Radeon 9000 then. I had a Dell Inspiron 600m with Radeon 9000 and Windows 98 worked great. What about the Ati FireGL T2? I saw one before how well does FireGL T2 work with DOS games and software?

Thanks in advance
Last edited by seskanda on Sat Jun 27, 2020 12:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: T42 9000/9600 Gfx

#7 Post by ajkula66 » Sat Jun 27, 2020 12:44 pm

seskanda wrote:
Sat Jun 27, 2020 12:26 pm
How does the MTM pull up the original specs using the Product ID? And how accurate is that, or has it been wrong ever before?
It's very accurate, having been complied from the old IBM/Lenovo database. Nothing in this world comes with a 100% accuracy guarantee, but MTM link is as good as it gets.
What is a desoldering graphics chip? Do you mean the screen backlight or keyboard backlight is broken?
Neither. The graphic chip desolders itself from the motherboard, causing system failure. Do a little research on GPU issues that T4x series suffer from. It was a very common problem back in the day.
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Re: T42 9000/9600 Gfx

#8 Post by seskanda » Sat Jun 27, 2020 1:16 pm

ajkula66 wrote:
Sat Jun 27, 2020 12:44 pm

It's very accurate, having been complied from the old IBM/Lenovo database. Nothing in this world comes with a 100% accuracy guarantee, but MTM link is as good as it gets.
Great that's all I need to know. I assumed it pulled the information from some kind of database. Yes I just learned that the hard way like most, that more than good enough for me.
Neither. The graphic chip desolders itself from the motherboard, causing system failure. Do a little research on GPU issues that T4x series suffer from. It was a very common problem back in the day.
Wow, that is pretty bad, but could you solder a Radeon 9000/9600 on a T42 that has a Radeon 7500? Still waiting on the verdict of FireGL T2. And how well that works on Windows 98 with DOS games and software

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Re: T42 9000/9600 Gfx

#9 Post by ajkula66 » Sat Jun 27, 2020 1:47 pm

seskanda wrote:
Sat Jun 27, 2020 1:16 pm

Wow, that is pretty bad, but could you solder a Radeon 9000/9600 on a T42 that has a Radeon 7500?
You'd need a re-balling station to begin with. Most of us don't have access to one.
Still waiting on the verdict of FireGL T2. And how well that works on Windows 98 with DOS games and software
No clue on the W98/DOS part.

Honestly, you can pick any T40/41/42 with 7500 or 9000 and they'll behave the same for your needs.
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Re: T42 9000/9600 Gfx

#10 Post by kfzhu1229 » Sat Jun 27, 2020 4:08 pm

seskanda wrote:
Sat Jun 27, 2020 12:26 pm
Yes this was one of the Thinkpad T42 I was interested in. What is a desoldering graphics chip? Do you mean the screen backlight or keyboard backlight is broken? I doubt the T42 even has a keyboard backlight. What exactly are the issues Radeon 9600 has with Windows 98? Will most likely be going for Radeon 9000 then. I had a Dell Inspiron 600m with Radeon 9000 and Windows 98 worked great. What about the Ati FireGL T2? I saw one before how well does FireGL T2 work with DOS games and software?
The backlight problem is a separate problem that I am talking about and that CCFL panels of this age are inevitable for that failure. That said though the 14.1" T4x units aren't exactly as prone to this sort of issues as many other models, Inspiron 600m/Latitude D600 included.
The Radeon 9600 is one generation newer than Radeon 9000 and if it is any similar to the driver support of the Radeon X300, you have to use Radeon 9000 drivers to get Radeon 9600 working in Win98. FireGL T2 is really a more powerful version of the 9600 and is from the same generation.
I did try Win98 on a Latitude D600 that I have and yeah it seemed to work just fine. AFAIK DOS gaming is kinda out of the question with these machines though as their sound cards provide zero SoundBlaster compatibility.
I have a couple of T41's lying around eating dust atm with a Radeon 7500 graphics chip though if you are interested in that.
As for the desoldering graphics chip problem, it mainly come from the chassis flex problem of T4x machines and that the graphics chip is also conveniently placed right in the bottom centre of the bottom chassis, where the chassis flexes the most. Combine that with the first generations of lead free solder they used, you get a recipe for a lottery ticket of failing graphics. Your best bet is to gently handle the machine with two hands and leave it stationary as much as possible, and hope for the best, if not going back for the 600m/D600 (but that model has a load of other problems instead).
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Re: T42 9000/9600 Gfx

#11 Post by seskanda » Sat Jun 27, 2020 8:02 pm

ajkula66 wrote:
Sat Jun 27, 2020 1:47 pm
You'd need a re-balling station to begin with. Most of us don't have access to one.
That sounds interesting yet difficult to use. At least it is good to know it is possible to do this.

Honestly, you can pick any T40/41/42 with 7500 or 9000 and they'll behave the same for your needs.
I will look into all three of those to find out what the difference really is between them.
kfzhu1229 wrote:
Sat Jun 27, 2020 4:08 pm
FireGL T2 is really a more powerful version of the 9600 and is from the same generation.
So does that mean it has same issues Radeon 9600 does on Windows 98? And do you recommend Radeon 9000 over FireGL T2 for Windows 98?
I did try Win98 on a Latitude D600 that I have and yeah it seemed to work just fine. AFAIK DOS gaming is kinda out of the question with these machines though as their sound cards provide zero SoundBlaster compatibility.
Im thinking of using the PCMCIA slot for an Audigy 2 ZS Notebook as that should take care of any sound issues in a DOS game
I have a couple of T41's lying around eating dust atm with a Radeon 7500 graphics chip though if you are interested in that.
Not sure, I guess it depends on how much you want for just one of them?
if not going back for the 600m/D600 (but that model has a load of other problems instead).
The Inspiron 600m had the infamous DC Jack goes dead problem. Other than that, I do not recall more problems with it at all.

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Re: T42 9000/9600 Gfx

#12 Post by kfzhu1229 » Sat Jun 27, 2020 10:50 pm

seskanda wrote:
Sat Jun 27, 2020 8:02 pm
I will look into all three of those to find out what the difference really is between them.
There really isn't a whole lot of differences between them. The T40 is a little different than the T41 and T42 in terms of configuration options, and the T41 and T42 seemingly only differ by the T42 having better power management system after a BIOS update on both (and they use very similar BIOS). The T42 also comes in 15" form factor while the T40 and T41 don't. This is why competitors like Dell only released one generation instead of 3 minor generations (being the Latitude D800, D600/Inspiron 600m)
seskanda wrote:
Sat Jun 27, 2020 8:02 pm
The Inspiron 600m had the infamous DC Jack goes dead problem. Other than that, I do not recall more problems with it at all.
Heard of that problem but never had that problem on my Inspiron 600m and Latitude D600
Since they only differ by the lid and palmrest plastics and that the Inspiron keyboard has no pointing stick, Inspiron 600m is some of the last Inspirons for a very long time with a build quality that can even be considered as solid. Not that the D600's build quality is anywhere close to the T4x series if not for the chassis flex flaw, but you are paying half the price for the Inspiron 600m.
That said though the Dell has a much beefier cooler because they thought they will be dealing with heaty boys like the Pentium 4-M's and toasty Radeons but obviously that didn't happen.
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Re: T42 9000/9600 Gfx

#13 Post by RealBlackStuff » Sun Jun 28, 2020 1:37 am

MTM = Machine Type Model.
The T40/T41/T42 had a few MTM series, starting with 2373, 2374, 2378 or 2379.
Type just one of those 4-digit numbers in the MTM-link above, and you'll find a huge list of each series.
Keep paging down until you see T42 models, then check/see what GPU they have.
Looooong lists!
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Re: T42 9000/9600 Gfx

#14 Post by seskanda » Sun Jun 28, 2020 8:28 pm

kfzhu1229 wrote:
Sat Jun 27, 2020 10:50 pm
There really isn't a whole lot of differences between them. The T40 is a little different than the T41 and T42 in terms of configuration options, and the T41 and T42 seemingly only differ by the T42 having better power management system after a BIOS update on both (and they use very similar BIOS). The T42 also comes in 15" form factor while the T40 and T41 don't. This is why competitors like Dell only released one generation instead of 3 minor generations (being the Latitude D800, D600/Inspiron 600m)
The T40, T41,and T42 are nearly identical to me. I noticed the T40 and T41 have less graphic card options, but they both offer Radeon 9000 so that means a better chance to find a T40 or T41 with that than the T42. But the T42 having a "15 probably sets it apart from the T40 and T41. As such, I'd choose T42 over the T41 or T40 if it was my choice. The Latitude D800 is a bulky and quite big laptop, but it does sport a firewire port but not really worth all the weight at least to me.
Heard of that problem but never had that problem on my Inspiron 600m and Latitude D600
Since they only differ by the lid and palmrest plastics and that the Inspiron keyboard has no pointing stick, Inspiron 600m is some of the last Inspirons for a very long time with a build quality that can even be considered as solid. Not that the D600's build quality is anywhere close to the T4x series if not for the chassis flex flaw, but you are paying half the price for the Inspiron 600m.
That said though the Dell has a much beefier cooler because they thought they will be dealing with heaty boys like the Pentium 4-M's and toasty Radeons but obviously that didn't happen.
Wow you were one of the lucky ones. And you must have bought yours after me since I think Dell eventually fixed this major issue on the later batch of D800's and D600's. I'd say the palmrest between the Inspiron 600m and Latitude D600 are quite different but they are likely the same size. I'd pick the D600 over the 600m as the D600 had less problems than the 600m. It could just be me, but the D600 seems a bit thicker than the 600m. Hope I'm wrong about that. From the looks of it, the T42 has more issues than the 600m or D600. If I had to pick from the three, I'd go with the Latitude D600 especially since it has more ports than the T42.

Ah so MTM = Machine Type Model that is much more helpful.
Yea I just found out the T40/41/42 all have product ID's starting with 2373 up to 2379.
Nice I get a huge list of Thinkpads with the 2373 number, most T40 and T41 have Radeon 9000
Yikes this is a really long list The T42 mostly has the Radeon 7500 not too many have Radeon 9000

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Re: T42 9000/9600 Gfx

#15 Post by ajkula66 » Sun Jun 28, 2020 8:53 pm

seskanda wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 8:28 pm
Nice I get a huge list of Thinkpads with the 2373 number, most T40 and T41 have Radeon 9000
Yikes this is a really long list The T42 mostly has the Radeon 7500 not too many have Radeon 9000
Only the earliest hi-end T42s were shipped with 9000, most of them - as well as T40 and T41 - had 7500.

I don't see that any of that will make a difference for your needs. Just find a working machine and call it a day.
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Re: T42 9000/9600 Gfx

#16 Post by kfzhu1229 » Sun Jun 28, 2020 10:21 pm

seskanda wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 8:28 pm
The T40, T41,and T42 are nearly identical to me. I noticed the T40 and T41 have less graphic card options, but they both offer Radeon 9000 so that means a better chance to find a T40 or T41 with that than the T42. But the T42 having a "15 probably sets it apart from the T40 and T41. As such, I'd choose T42 over the T41 or T40 if it was my choice. The Latitude D800 is a bulky and quite big laptop, but it does sport a firewire port but not really worth all the weight at least to me.
I have the D800 as well and the extra weight and size (yes this thing has the footprint of a Precision M6xxx or a W70x) gives you a DX9 compatible GeForce FX graphics (although the DX9 support is poor), A3x quality speakers, and even the lowest end WXGA option is one of the premium looking panels that you typically see for WSXGA+ and WUXGA ones.
I happen to find it locally at the price of junk and it was in good condition complete with all the accessories that you can dream of when this thing was new, otherwise I would've not bothered with it.
seskanda wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 8:28 pm
Wow you were one of the lucky ones. And you must have bought yours after me since I think Dell eventually fixed this major issue on the later batch of D800's and D600's. I'd say the palmrest between the Inspiron 600m and Latitude D600 are quite different but they are likely the same size. I'd pick the D600 over the 600m as the D600 had less problems than the 600m. It could just be me, but the D600 seems a bit thicker than the 600m. Hope I'm wrong about that. From the looks of it, the T42 has more issues than the 600m or D600. If I had to pick from the three, I'd go with the Latitude D600 especially since it has more ports than the T42.
Again, the D600 only has a different palmrest, keyboard and lid than the 600m. The lid is of a much lower quality on the 600m, while the D600 has magnesium lid like the rest of the D6xx/D8xx lineup, but the hinges on these things go all the way to the top so that's not a problem. The motherboard IS the same between both just with a different BIOS to disable D-dock support on the 600m (but you can still use D-port, the port replicator as well as all the D-bay accessories).
Again while the D600 doesn't have all the graphics problems and such, it simply doesn't have the build quality or the elegance of the T4x devices, while also being thicker, thanks to the design choice of using full thickness drives instead of the thin propietrary ones. Mine also came with a red backlight, warped lid and exploded left hinge. The D600 also use Varta Ni-MH CMOS battery instead of the standard CR2032 and can be a pain in the a*se to find a replacement (it's only compatible with 600m/D600, not D800 nor D610 nor C series). Thankfully mine still holds a charge.
Also I DM'd you with the details as I literally have all of the machines that you were talking about minus that Inspiron lol.
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Re: T42 9000/9600 Gfx

#17 Post by seskanda » Mon Jun 29, 2020 3:14 pm

ajkula66 wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 8:53 pm
Only the earliest hi-end T42s were shipped with 9000, most of them - as well as T40 and T41 - had 7500.

I don't see that any of that will make a difference for your needs. Just find a working machine and call it a day.
But it looks like to me the T40 and T41 had more Radeon 9000 than T42 since they did not have any with the FireGL T2 on them

It makes a difference for sure since Radeon 7500 only works with DirectX 7 but Radeon 9000 has DirectX 9 support.

kfzhu1229 wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 10:21 pm
I have the D800 as well and the extra weight and size (yes this thing has the footprint of a Precision M6xxx or a W70x) gives you a DX9 compatible GeForce FX graphics (although the DX9 support is poor), A3x quality speakers, and even the lowest end WXGA option is one of the premium looking panels that you typically see for WSXGA+ and WUXGA ones.
I happen to find it locally at the price of junk and it was in good condition complete with all the accessories that you can dream of when this thing was new, otherwise I would've not bothered with it.
I picked up a D800 too it has 2.0 GHz Pentium M and WSXGA+ screen with Geforce FX 5200 32 MB graphics card. If you consider it as a desktop replacement for old software then it does the job. But do not expect it to be a portable laptop to carry around all the time. For that, I'm thinking the T40,41,42 fits the bill.
I got a good deal on eBay for it was like 50 bucks I do not remember exactly did not come with a working battery or charger but I have a charger so have no need for yet another one.
Again, the D600 only has a different palmrest, keyboard and lid than the 600m. The lid is of a much lower quality on the 600m, while the D600 has magnesium lid like the rest of the D6xx/D8xx lineup, but the hinges on these things go all the way to the top so that's not a problem. The motherboard IS the same between both just with a different BIOS to disable D-dock support on the 600m (but you can still use D-port, the port replicator as well as all the D-bay accessories).
Again while the D600 doesn't have all the graphics problems and such, it simply doesn't have the build quality or the elegance of the T4x devices, while also being thicker, thanks to the design choice of using full thickness drives instead of the thin propietrary ones. Mine also came with a red backlight, warped lid and exploded left hinge. The D600 also use Varta Ni-MH CMOS battery instead of the standard CR2032 and can be a pain in the a*se to find a replacement (it's only compatible with 600m/D600, not D800 nor D610 nor C series). Thankfully mine still holds a charge.
Also I DM'd you with the details as I literally have all of the machines that you were talking about minus that Inspiron lol.
Yes, and all three of those on the 600m were of a low quality, especially the lid if I recall. It for sure was flimsy and always felt like plastic glad I did not keep that. And it had a plain XGA screen that did not last either. The hard drive, optical drive, and motherboard all eventually failed on me, but still have the CPU Pentium M 1.4 Ghz and the PCMCIA card too. What is D-dock support? If the 600m can use port replicator and the D-bay accessories what good is D-dock for then? Would definitely choose the D600 over the 600m any day of the week now.
If the D600 is the same thickness of the 600m than I would take that over the T42 since it has the desoldering graphics problem. By the way, do the T40 and T41 also have the desoldering graphics issue? If so, then really the only thing T4x has going for it is thinness, but not sure what you mean by 'build quality'? Yes the D800 also uses a Varta Ni-MH CMOS battery and a completely different one than the D600. Not sure why Dell could not use the same battery in the D600 and D800. Even a CR2025 would have been a better choice than the Varta. Yes i'm taking a look at your DM about the laptops and will get back to you soon here.

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Re: T42 9000/9600 Gfx

#18 Post by dr_st » Mon Jun 29, 2020 3:32 pm

seskanda wrote:
Mon Jun 29, 2020 3:14 pm
By the way, do the T40 and T41 also have the desoldering graphics issue?
Yep. Late T42 and T43 models suffer less from that. 15" models suffer less from that for whatever reason.
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Re: T42 9000/9600 Gfx

#19 Post by kfzhu1229 » Mon Jun 29, 2020 3:36 pm

seskanda wrote:
Mon Jun 29, 2020 3:14 pm
But it looks like to me the T40 and T41 had more Radeon 9000 than T42 since they did not have any with the FireGL T2 on them

It makes a difference for sure since Radeon 7500 only works with DirectX 7 but Radeon 9000 has DirectX 9 support.
The Radeon 9000 only has DX8.1 support, the 9500 and 9600 are the first ones to have DX9 support.
But the Radeon 9000 is a country mile faster than the 7500 in 3D benchmarks such as 3DMark.
The T41p came with 9600, T42p came with FireGL T2. But good luck finding any of those boards that still work.
seskanda wrote:
Mon Jun 29, 2020 3:14 pm
Yes, and all three of those on the 600m were of a low quality, especially the lid if I recall. It for sure was flimsy and always felt like plastic glad I did not keep that. And it had a plain XGA screen that did not last either. The hard drive, optical drive, and motherboard all eventually failed on me, but still have the CPU Pentium M 1.4 Ghz and the PCMCIA card too. What is D-dock support? If the 600m can use port replicator and the D-bay accessories what good is D-dock for then? Would definitely choose the D600 over the 600m any day of the week now.
If the D600 is the same thickness of the 600m than I would take that over the T42 since it has the desoldering graphics problem. By the way, do the T40 and T41 also have the desoldering graphics issue? If so, then really the only thing T4x has going for it is thinness, but not sure what you mean by 'build quality'? Yes the D800 also uses a Varta Ni-MH CMOS battery and a completely different one than the D600. Not sure why Dell could not use the same battery in the D600 and D800. Even a CR2025 would have been a better choice than the Varta. Yes i'm taking a look at your DM about the laptops and will get back to you soon here.
D-dock is Dell's name for the full docking station with a low profile PCI slot, Internal D-bay built inside the dock as well as a powered USB connector for an external D-bay enclosure (but seems like at only USB1.1 speeds). The D-port is just a port replicator.
If anything the lid of the D600 is thinner than the 600m because using a slab of Magnesium means you don't need as thick to give usable structural support.
Yes all of T40-T42 series have the graphics desoldering issue, T43 has the Southbridge desoldering issue. Again due to the chassis being too thin and doesn't have any magnesium frame support in the front of the bottom chassis, unlike the D600 or even the Inspiron 600m.
By build quality I mean how the plastics feel and such. The D600, 610, 800, 810 all have bottom chassis completely made of soft plastic on the exterior. It's the flexible type of plastic that doesn't crack as easily as one might think, but it feels extremely cheap on the hands. The D600 also have some really undersized hinges that gets overstressed and breaks when dust comes in and jams the hinge. The look of these also didn't age nearly as well as their successors and the ThinkPads. Moreover the paint job on the plastics don't age well either. Both of my D600 and D610 have the palmrest worn from the silver colour to some shade of dark grey colour with the lighter shade of grey completely worn off. The D620/D820 fixed that by moving the magnesium chassis on the outside and replaced the palmrest plastics with something that's twice as thick, giving you the feel of rugged metal instead, but at the cost of being heavier than the T6x. The black paint job on these also aged much better as my D830 and D630 doesn't even show any wear on the palmrest aside from some scratches by somebody typing with his/her watch on the left hand, despite each of them being abused by workers for minimum one decade. The feel of the Dx00/Dx10 vs Dx20/Dx30 in comparison is kinda like the old Samsung Galaxy phones compared to the Galaxy S6 and S7.
Dell Lat CP MMX-233 64mb 40gb W2k
600 PII-266 416mb 40gb WXP
T23 PIII 1.13ghz 1gb W7
Lat D830 X9000 8gb 128gb WSXGA+ Ultrasharp fp W10
T530i 15.6" i7 16gb fp W10
UXGA:
A30p PIII 1.2 1gb W7 (IDTech)
T43p 2.26 2gb fp W10 (Sharp)
Lat C840 P4-2.5 2gb 60gb W7 (Ultrasharp)

dr_st
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Re: T42 9000/9600 Gfx

#20 Post by dr_st » Mon Jun 29, 2020 11:14 pm

kfzhu1229 wrote:
Mon Jun 29, 2020 3:36 pm
The T41p came with 9600, T42p came with FireGL T2. But good luck finding any of those boards that still work.
Both came with T2 actually, but the only difference between that and the plain 9600 in the regular T42 is an extra 64MB of RAM.
Thinkpad 25 (20K7), X1 Carbon (20HQ), Yoga 14 (20FY), T430s (IPS FHD + Classic Keyboard), X220 4291-4BG
X61 7673-V2V, T60 2007-QPG, T42 2373-F7G, X32 (IPS Screen), A31p w/ Ultrabay Numpad, A21m 2628-GXU

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Re: T42 9000/9600 Gfx

#21 Post by kfzhu1229 » Tue Jun 30, 2020 12:10 am

dr_st wrote:
Mon Jun 29, 2020 11:14 pm
kfzhu1229 wrote:
Mon Jun 29, 2020 3:36 pm
The T41p came with 9600, T42p came with FireGL T2. But good luck finding any of those boards that still work.
Both came with T2 actually, but the only difference between that and the plain 9600 in the regular T42 is an extra 64MB of RAM.
Hmm interesting because I think mine came with a 9600. I had salvaged a broken T41p with the legs on the Toshiba power management chip literally gone from liquid damage and keyboard is missing along with all the palmrest screws. It has the graphics chip bare surrounded by 4 RAM chips and no IHS, and also the heatsink has that IHS glued onto it with thick thermal sponge. The lid assembly is complete and never touched and that certainly has T41p written onto it. Or is this just a case of T41p and T42 mashed together?
Dell Lat CP MMX-233 64mb 40gb W2k
600 PII-266 416mb 40gb WXP
T23 PIII 1.13ghz 1gb W7
Lat D830 X9000 8gb 128gb WSXGA+ Ultrasharp fp W10
T530i 15.6" i7 16gb fp W10
UXGA:
A30p PIII 1.2 1gb W7 (IDTech)
T43p 2.26 2gb fp W10 (Sharp)
Lat C840 P4-2.5 2gb 60gb W7 (Ultrasharp)

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Re: T42 9000/9600 Gfx

#22 Post by dr_st » Tue Jun 30, 2020 1:52 am

It can certainly be a T42 motherboard in a T41p. The chassis is the same across the line, so the boards are freely interchangeable. Or it can be that the VBIOS was modded or maybe simply a driver install that detects the FireGL T2 as a 9600. As I said, it's basically the same GPU, only the T2 on the T41p/T42p came with double the RAM.
Thinkpad 25 (20K7), X1 Carbon (20HQ), Yoga 14 (20FY), T430s (IPS FHD + Classic Keyboard), X220 4291-4BG
X61 7673-V2V, T60 2007-QPG, T42 2373-F7G, X32 (IPS Screen), A31p w/ Ultrabay Numpad, A21m 2628-GXU

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Re: T42 9000/9600 Gfx

#23 Post by seskanda » Tue Jun 30, 2020 4:05 pm

kfzhu1229 wrote:
Mon Jun 29, 2020 3:36 pm
The Radeon 9000 only has DX8.1 support, the 9500 and 9600 are the first ones to have DX9 support.
But the Radeon 9000 is a country mile faster than the 7500 in 3D benchmarks such as 3DMark.
Yes my bad it is DirectX 8.1 on Radeon 9000 but that is still much better than DirectX 7 and is pretty old.
Exactly that is why I'd rather go for Radeon 9000 over 7500 it can support games and software with 3D graphics better.

D-dock is Dell's name for the full docking station with a low profile PCI slot, Internal D-bay built inside the dock as well as a powered USB connector for an external D-bay enclosure (but seems like at only USB1.1 speeds). The D-port is just a port replicator.
If anything the lid of the D600 is thinner than the 600m because using a slab of Magnesium means you don't need as thick to give usable structural support.
I see not sure If I need a D-dock seems like a port replicator is enough for me, but good to know the D600 has that option too. Does a port replicator have a D-bay too? That is another plus of the D600 over the 600m a thinner lid and still better quality.
Yes all of T40-T42 series have the graphics desoldering issue, T43 has the Southbridge desoldering issue. Again due to the chassis being too thin and doesn't have any magnesium frame support in the front of the bottom chassis, unlike the D600 or even the Inspiron 600m.
By build quality I mean how the plastics feel and such. The D600, 610, 800, 810 all have bottom chassis completely made of soft plastic on the exterior. It's the flexible type of plastic that doesn't crack as easily as one might think, but it feels extremely cheap on the hands.
Well that is a lot of laptops that have a graphics desoldering issue then. I have a T43 but have not seen the Southbridge desoldering thankfully. But chassis needs to be thin or else the laptop itself will be thicker, right? Or maybe it needs a magnesium frame in the bottom chassis as you mention. I noticed the T4x has a harder plastic than the D600/D800. But the D600/D800 have a lot more cracks in it than the T4x not sure is that because the plastic is cheaper or is it too thick on the D600/D800?

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