Confused that THINKPADS.COM is really IBM??

Message

#1 Post by **BillMorrow** » Mon Aug 08, 2005 12:05 pm

In my dealings with Lenovo (or IBM) they say that THINKPADS.COM can confuse visitors into thinking that they are dealing with IBM or (now) Lenovo rather than Bill Morrow.
Or that my email address of bill at thinkpads dot com is also misleading and can confuse and is too much like IBM or (now) Lenovo..!

Torque · #2 Post by **Torque** » Mon Aug 08, 2005 12:09 pm

Since day one, I took thinkpads.com for a non-official dealer/community.

No confusion here

#3 Post by **AlphaKilo470** » Mon Aug 08, 2005 12:25 pm

The acutal site iteself and both incarnations of the messageboard really don't look at all like IBM but I can see how someone who's never heard of the site before can be confused by the name but I really don't think it should be the centerpoint of a big issue.

#4 Post by **jdhurst** » Mon Aug 08, 2005 5:40 pm

I try to be reasonable as much as possible, but this takes the cake.

We know IBM failed at running a forum, and we know that Lenovo doesn't have one, so their only possible motive in this issue is to make trouble for you (Bill) because of their own ineptness, failure and general incompetence in this particular area.

... JD Hurst

Ground Loop · #5 Post by **Ground Loop** » Mon Aug 08, 2005 5:54 pm

I confess I once mistaked thinkpad.org with thinkpads.com. I'm not sure what that site is about, but with only three posts in the forum, something seemed odd.

I wonder how many people have accidentally logged in there, and left their password in the logs.

JHEM · #6 Post by **JHEM** » Mon Aug 08, 2005 6:16 pm

jdhurst wrote:I try to be reasonable as much as possible, but this takes the cake.

We know IBM failed at running a forum, and we know that Lenovo doesn't have one, so their only possible motive in this issue is to make trouble for you (Bill) because of their own ineptness, failure and general incompetence in this particular area.

We've been down this road before and Bill has been able to keep the barbarians from the gate.

I just fear that Lenovo is going to attempt to muscle Bill now that they're re-directing www.thinkpad.com to their website.

If worse comes to worst, Bill should sell them the URL, but hold out for $5Mil!

Any forum denizens want to do a bit of pro-bono work?

Regards,

James

#7 Post by **K. Eng** » Mon Aug 08, 2005 10:10 pm

I knew from the first day I visited the old forums that Bill was in no way an official representative of IBM. The site is pretty clear about Bill being an IBM VAR, and not IBM itself.

There are no IBM logos, and the site itself looks nothing like IBM/Lenovo's site.

I could see how the URL *might* confuse some people, but realistically, this site has been around for years, and even if IBM didn't like it, they never did anything about it. I don't think it would be fair for IBM/Lenovo to just swoop in and take over the URL.

#8 Post by **BillMorrow** » Mon Aug 08, 2005 11:12 pm

that thinkpads.com could possibly confuse someone into thinking they were on the Lenovo web site was one of two reasons used to deny me a business partner account..
my initial thoughts were if anyone could be confused about that they probably are too confused to use a computer and thus be here (or there) by mistake anyway..

JHEM wrote:We've been down this road before and Bill has been able to keep the barbarians from the gate.

I just fear that Lenovo is going to attempt to muscle Bill now that they're re-directing www.thinkpad.com to their website.

If worse comes to worst, Bill should sell them the URL, but hold out for $5Mil!

Any forum denizens want to do a bit of pro-bono work?

Regards,

James

$5Mil..?? i'll take it..!!

but, if lenovo wants to swoop in with cash ($250k sounds nice) i could be pursuaded to sell out..

meantime i plan to persist and stick around for as long as i am able..

IRT the last time IBM sent me a lawyer letter, they threatened and requested a few concessions..
so i did as asked and the matter was put to rest..
this was about 7 or 8 years ago..

i should add that since business has been very slow lately i have learned that i DO have a wife and a life outside this office..

so when business picks up i think it will be different from before..
fewer hours in the office and more hours actually seeing what the local flora and fauna look like..

JHEM · #9 Post by **JHEM** » Mon Aug 08, 2005 11:35 pm

K. Eng wrote:I could see how the URL *might* confuse some people, but realistically, this site has been around for years, and even if IBM didn't like it, they never did anything about it.

Not from lack of trying!

We've been down this road before in fearing that our "home" would disappear without prior notice.

Fortunately for all of us who abuse Bill's hospitality here, he's an irascible old coot who's not about to knuckle under readily to a few suits.

Personally, the death of Thinkpads.com would be sufficient impetus for me to question my devotion to the marque!

Perhaps we need to start a letter writing campaign addressed to IBM/Lenovo informing them that:

A) Bullies aren't well received by discerning people, the very market they seek to address and;

B) Bill has certainly paid his dues in selflessly supporting the Thinkpad community for all these years.

What say you all? Alice's Restaurant Massacre 2005??

Now where'd I put Arlo's phone number.............

Regards,

James

Henry · #10 Post by **Henry** » Mon Aug 08, 2005 11:46 pm

There is no way I could have confused this site with an official Lenovo site. No offense to anyone, but the front page does not look like one that a huge professional company would use.

Of course, this actually helps to clear out confusion.

Navck · #11 Post by **Navck** » Tue Aug 09, 2005 12:03 am

Hey guys, check poll.

bhtooefr · #12 Post by **bhtooefr** » Tue Aug 09, 2005 7:02 pm

Henry's got a point

It kinda makes me sick that you're screwed over by your domain name, though... Almost makes me want to buy a Latitude over the mythical X32 Sonoma that doesn't really exist, but rumors say that it does...

farmer kev · #13 Post by **farmer kev** » Tue Aug 09, 2005 8:03 pm

Looks nothing like it, this place is far easier to navigate.
Spose they would settle for the url and you just pick another one?
Sure would screw up a lotta peoples bookmarks tho.

verktyg · #14 Post by **verktyg** » Wed Aug 10, 2005 12:18 am

JHEM wrote: We've been down this road before and Bill has been able to keep the barbarians from the gate.

I just fear that Lenovo is going to attempt to muscle Bill now that they're re-directing www.thinkpad.com to their website.

If worse comes to worst, Bill should sell them the URL, but hold out for $5Mil! James

Sell something to a nation with the greatest amount of IP piracy, patent and copyright infringement (theft) ???

verktyg · #15 Post by **verktyg** » Wed Aug 10, 2005 12:25 am

I've seen sites that have blatant disclaimers all over their web pages stating that they were not involved in any way with a certain product.

Compromise is not a concept in PRC culture. There are winners and losers only so I wouldn't expect Lenovo to make any exceptions.

Navck · #16 Post by **Navck** » Wed Aug 10, 2005 1:33 am

Hey guys, type this in
www.radeon.com
They say "We are not ATI"
Bill, just say "We are not part of Lenovo/IBM" on your page and I think they will quit nagging

DavidNZ · #17 Post by **DavidNZ** » Wed Aug 10, 2005 1:36 am

A classic: http://www.untied.com vs http://www.united.com. Then google "United Airlines" and see where each is in relation to the other.

On topic: was never confused. have always been grateful. If they ever try to force you off the domain (and I'm not even sure how/why this is allowed), make them work for it and publicise it as much as you can.

bhtooefr · #18 Post by **bhtooefr** » Wed Aug 10, 2005 1:50 am

If they try to force Bill off the domain, I am buying an HP.

No kidding here.

See, with HP, I can STILL get the pointing stick. Granted, I'll get a royal POS, but it'll have a pointing stick.

#19 Post by **K. Eng** » Wed Aug 10, 2005 8:29 am

This may be more or less true of the Chinese Communist Party, but remember that Lenovo's top managment now consists of largely Americans who were part of IBM's personal computer division. I think that they would be more flexible unless this site threatened their business interests (unlikely, given that this site contributes to the popularity of ThinkPads).

I'm sure that even if we lost the URL, the forum would continue at another site... I don't know how things would work out, but I doubt this community is going to simply dissapear just because of a lost URL.

verktyg wrote:Compromise is not a concept in PRC culture. There are winners and losers only so I wouldn't expect Lenovo to make any exceptions.

bhtooefr · #20 Post by **bhtooefr** » Wed Aug 10, 2005 8:37 am

You see, I'll stay in the COMMUNITY, but if we lose the URL, this X21 will be my last ThinkPad.

FrankK-F · #21 Post by **FrankK-F** » Wed Aug 10, 2005 8:32 pm

Interesting that Lenovo is trying to screw over Bill ... in my view a self defeating excercise, considering that Bill has been a very positive resource and support for the TP community.

No doubt, I speak for more then just myself when I say that the IBM sale is ushering in a new era for this ThinkPad devotee.

After all these years as a TP owner (have three hi-end units in use now) my next upgrade may well be from a supplier located in CONUS.

Frank K-F

#22 Post by **BillMorrow** » Thu Aug 11, 2005 2:04 am

FrankK-F wrote:Interesting that Lenovo is trying to screw over Bill ... in my view a self defeating excercise, considering that Bill has been a very positive resource and support for the TP community.
Frank K-F

(thanks frank

)

i would not say that lenovo is trying to screw me over..
more like using this as an excuse to kill my sales business by denying me a business partner designation..

had more to say but i think this is enough..

Toe · #23 Post by **Toe** » Thu Aug 11, 2005 10:08 am

had more to say but i think this is enough..

Agreed. For me this does not make alot of sense, killing you sales business is much like shooting one's self in the foot.

I hate politics.

-Toe

snife · #24 Post by **snife** » Thu Aug 11, 2005 8:41 pm

I think the main confusing part is the domain name - thinkpad.com is the official domain name for all thinkpad info, support and sales now; thinkpads.com is very, very similar to this. They made me take down tpdrivers.com forwarders so I think you have done well to keep it this far.

I think that this forum is an valuable resource for ThinkPad owners but as a frequent answerer on the official forums, I miss those too.

I think the problem with many manufacturer forums is the users - many people use it as a forum to vent their frustrations or influence others into not buying the product as they have had a bad experience; this is the reason why I think IBM and many other manufacturers have shut down their support forums. As a company, why would you want to run something which does not fully reflect the product you are trying to sell.

The forum looks quite professional so i could see why people may think that is official but the main thinkpads.com site to link here looks like it was designed by a program called 'My First WebPage' so I doubt anyone would think that it is official

Just my 2p

bhtooefr · #25 Post by **bhtooefr** » Thu Aug 11, 2005 9:02 pm

FWIW, has anyone looked at the beta site? It's about as professional as these forums... (however, it looks NOTHING like a corporate site...)

#26 Post by **BillMorrow** » Fri Aug 12, 2005 2:46 am

interesting that 53 people have voted out of 369 people who have read this thread..

and

>>I think the main confusing part is the domain name - thinkpad.com is the official domain name for all thinkpad info, support and sales now; thinkpads.com is very, very similar to this. They made me take down tpdrivers.com forwarders so I think you have done well to keep it this far. <<

in the beginning, thinkpad.com was taken by ibm and not used..
for many years.. (don't ask me how many years because i never thought it might become a fact i would want to retain)

while i have been using thinkpads.com since i first set thinkpads.com up..

and shortly after (about 7 or so years ago) ibm wrote me a lawyer letter..

a friend in sacramento (an intellecutal properties lawyer) engaged the ibm lawyers and the end result, after several letters to and fro, the result was that i removed a few things from the websiote and made a few other changes and we (ibm and i) have been co-existing since that time..

also, FWIW, ibm copied my open forum (webboard) for their support forum, after they killed the compuserve thinkpad forum..
(later ibm let their forum die off)

and i (we) are still here..

i only ask this poll question because lenovo used it to deny an application i had made to them..

so far, no further lawyer letters, for the last 7 years..

though thery might make me an offer of some sort, nothing has been forthcoming and i do not expect such..

<sigh>
time for bed..

lophiomys · #27 Post by **lophiomys** » Sat Aug 13, 2005 6:26 am

IMHO it's very difficult to mix up thinkpads.com with thinkpad.com,
especially as the contents on these two sites are completetly different.

Moreover Bill's site and forum never have shown anything
"officially" looking.

As forum.thinkpads.com always was and continues to be
a useful resource for Thinkpad users, where enthusiastic
people party do useful support work, it would be a sensible thing
to do for IBM/Lenovo to support Bill and his forum morally,
and finacially too.

If IBM/Lenovo really keeps on pushing matters against Bill and his forum,
I will rethink my opinion about IBM/Lenovo and about buying their
products. I guess the broader computing community will also be
interested in these kind of business practices...

IMHO:
Thinkpad Users = IBM/Lenovo customers want to have this forum.

Bill keep your heads up!

redsb3 · #28 Post by **redsb3** » Sat Aug 13, 2005 7:57 am

Oh yes, I was totally confused (he says tongue in cheek). I thought that Bill "Levono" Morrow is the builder of Thinkpads. He hand builds each one as they are ordered which is why it takes months to get it after you place your order. It's only logical that this, then, is his "support" site for what he builds. (NOT, just kidding guys)

I would have to question as to why Levono is even worried about it?? Must be some kind of hidden agenda at work here.

verktyg · #29 Post by **verktyg** » Sat Aug 13, 2005 8:31 am

redsb3 wrote: I would have to question as to why Levono is even worried about it?? Must be some kind of hidden agenda at work here.

Penetration, however slight, is sufficient to complete the offense."!

In a totalitarian system NO deviance from the prescribed norm is tolerated!

#30 Post by **GomJabbar** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 12:24 am

I guess I'm the slow one in this august group.

I had used IBM's forum in the past, but that was maybe 2 or 3 years ago. I was looking for some information regarding my ThinkPad, and I tried finding IBM's forum again, but was coming up dry. I finally ran across Google Group ibm.ibmpc.thinkpad. After a couple of weeks or so I saw a posting directing someone else to Bill's forum - forum.thinkpads.com. This posting was to one of the threads here.

My first time here, I looked around a bit, and I thought this was IBM's forum taken over by Lenovo. I posted on the Google Group ibm.ibmpc.thinkpad, thanking the poster for helping me find the IBM forum again.

And ahem, JHEM was quick to correct my misconceptions.

Backpeddling now ............. I must say that with the new banner, I really don't see how I could make the same mistake again. However, to me this site has always seemed professionally done.

I hope my vote didn't blackball me.

Confused that THINKPADS.COM is really IBM??

Are you confused that Bill and thinkpads.com is really IBM?

Confused that THINKPADS.COM is really IBM??

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