T23 Battery Issues

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Temetka · #1 Post by **Temetka** » Sun Jan 08, 2006 1:03 am

I think I might be having a power issue with my T23. I am using a battery froma a T30 and also have an Ultrabay2000 Battery installed. Currently the total power is 70% with an estimated amount of 2.:25 Hours.

I do have the battery maximizer software installed. I have a created a good plan which changes the CPU speed to variable, lowers the LCD brightness and puts the HD to sleep.

This still seems a little low to me. When I first had this T30 battery and the 2nd battery it seemed like I was getting 5+ hours. Now I am lucky to pull 3:30. I am thinking for some reason my machine is not either fully charging or discharging the batteries.

Is there some piece of software I can get from IBM that will check my batteries for me?

Thanks in advance.

stevech · #2 Post by **stevech** » Sun Jan 08, 2006 3:00 am

If you have the latest Battery Maximizer, you can SINGLE left click the taskbar icon, then choose the battery information, then on the display, choose Battery Health, that should do the trick.
I have a T2x and a Ultrabay battery, but don't think I've ever gotten 3 hours, then agian, I ALWAYS run at MAX performance. Your T30 battery is higher cap then the run of the mill T2x so should give you more time.

LtTPfan · #3 Post by **LtTPfan** » Sun Jan 08, 2006 6:25 am

batteryuniversity.com wrote:
Batteries with fuel gauge (laptops) should be calibrated by applying a deliberate full discharge once every 30 charges. Running the pack down in the equipment does this. If ignored, the fuel gauge will become increasingly less accurate and in some cases cut off the device prematurely.

Cuda · #4 Post by **Cuda** » Sun Jan 08, 2006 8:16 am

Is the T30 battery a direct swap? If so how does it get a higher capacity?

LtTPfan · #5 Post by **LtTPfan** » Sun Jan 08, 2006 11:23 am

The T30 battery will fit right into a T23 and has about a 20% higher capacity. (The opposite is not true without some modifications due to protrusions but then who would want to use a lower capacity battery anyway.) Reports indicate however, that a 72 watt AC adapter (i.e. 4.5 amp) is required for proper charging, just make sure yours is 72w, not 56w.

dsvochak · #6 Post by **dsvochak** » Sun Jan 08, 2006 11:50 am

I've never had this problem, but http://www-307.ibm.com/pc/support/site. ... MIGR-40506 indicates that, at times, "The Battery MaxiMiser gauge is incorrect when a second battery is installed. Only the time remaining on the battery being used is displayed.". You might want to check that.

My experience has been that the difference between "Design Capacity" and "Full Charge Capacity" can drop dramatically really quickly as the number of charge cycles increases. That is, it doesn't take many cycles to go from a health status of "green" to "red" after a lot of cycles.

Also, while there are differing opinions on "reconditioning" Li-Ion batteries (see http://www-307.ibm.com/pc/support/site. ... MIGR-51038 for example), I've never had problems related to using the suggestion about "recalibrating" above.

You may want to go through the process outlined in the MIGR-51038 link for troubleshooting battery issues to see if you can narrow down the problem.

stevech · #7 Post by **stevech** » Sun Jan 08, 2006 1:38 pm

>>Reports indicate however, that a 72 watt AC adapter (i.e. 4.5 amp) is required for proper charging, just make sure yours is 72w, not 56w.<<

My personal experience has been the 72 watt vs 56 watt is a crucial factor. I have a bunch of TPs and AC adaptors (15??), and found that when I mistakenly used the 56 when 72 was called for, the battery run time can be degraded by as much as 50%. (fully charged).

On charge cycles, my experience has been that cycles per se may not be as important as age, as I have batteries that've only been charged a few time have turned to "red", whereas newer ones (3-4 years old) that's been through 200 cycles still give me about 1 hour on MAX performance (vs 2 hours when new).

Temetka · #8 Post by **Temetka** » Sun Jan 08, 2006 2:07 pm

Where can I get the better AC adapter?

stevech · #9 Post by **stevech** » Sun Jan 08, 2006 3:07 pm

Don't think the 72W is "better", but it's "correct" for (at least) the T2x series. There are tons of TP AC adapters on Ebay (or craigslist.org), just make sure you look for the 72W ones, and they are not expensive ($15-$25).

dsvochak · #10 Post by **dsvochak** » Sun Jan 08, 2006 4:34 pm

A comment from jdhurst in this thread http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.ph ... hlight=56w

Using an under-powered adapter will surely overheat the adapter, likely damage it, and possibly cause a fire. If the adapter's power rating is exceeded, the output voltage could drop, and that could damage your laptop. This is not a good thing to do. ... JD Hurst

One from JHEM in the same thread:

You MUST match the voltage as closely as possible between the power brick and the laptop, while amperage is a bit more forgiving.

BUT, you should never rely too greatly on an under-powered adaptor to both run the unit and charge the battery while on AC. Best in this instance is to do one or the other, i.e. charge the battery while the unit isn't being used.

Yes, a low amperage adaptor can cause long term damage to the laptop's internal charging circuitry as well as the laptop's internal power supply. You should do your best to get the correct adaptor.

Regards,

James

There are similar threads if you search for "56w". While a 72w may not be "better", I wouldn't take the chance.

Temetka · #11 Post by **Temetka** » Mon Jan 09, 2006 2:45 am

So how do I know which model of AC adapter I currently have. Until I have this solved I guess I'll turn off the machine when charging it.

LtTPfan · #12 Post by **LtTPfan** » Mon Jan 09, 2006 5:47 am

Look at your power supply. If it says the output is 16V - 4.5A, you have a 72 watt. If it says 16V - 3.6A, you have a 56 watt. BTW, watts equal Volts times Amps, i.e. 16 x 4.5 = 72.

Temetka · #13 Post by **Temetka** » Mon Jan 09, 2006 10:29 pm

Ok, I have the 72W charger. Cool. Out of curiosity what software cna I use to do the following:

1. Check # of times each battery has been cycled.
2. "Refresh" or "Recalibrate" the controller in the battery.

Also is there an external charger available? On my powerbook I bought a unit that plugs into the wall and let's me put 2 batteries in it to charge. These are NOT charging in the laptop. Did IBM make anything like that? I still ahve the brand new battery that shipped with my T23 and I would like to use it when the T30 battery is dead and I am running on the Ulrabay battery.

I sincerely hope the above made sense. I messed up my kneee using a ditch witch today and the vicodin has kicked in.

Again, thanks in advance.

Website · #14 Post by **tfflivemb2** » Tue Jan 10, 2006 12:08 am

The Battery Maximizer/Power Management Utility from IBM will give you the information on the battery. Just left click on the green battery icon in the lower right side of your screen, and choose "Battery Information" Then choose the "Battery Health" button. It won't let you calibrate the battery or refresh it. I think that that is a function of the newer T4x series laptops.

dsvochak · #15 Post by **dsvochak** » Tue Jan 10, 2006 9:55 am

1. If you click "Battery Tips" on the battery health page, you can get tips on how to "recondition" the battery.

2. There are (were) at least 3 external chargers for T series. For some reason I'm getting 404 errors with the links, so I'll post them when they are working again.
There's even one (with another FRU/Part #) for sale on eBay
http://cgi.ebay.com/IBM-ThinkPad-Dual-B ... dZViewItem

dsvochak · #16 Post by **dsvochak** » Tue Jan 10, 2006 10:27 am

Links to chargers seem to be working now:
http://www-307.ibm.com/pc/support/site. ... IGR-4JTSX6
http://www-307.ibm.com/pc/support/site. ... MIGR-46518
http://www-307.ibm.com/pc/support/site. ... IGR-4PBKB7

Temetka · #17 Post by **Temetka** » Tue Jan 17, 2006 2:42 am

Thanks, I'll check them out.

Nolonemo · #18 Post by **Nolonemo** » Wed Jan 18, 2006 7:12 pm

[quote="stevech"]>>Reports indicate however, that a 72 watt AC adapter (i.e. 4.5 amp) is required for proper charging, just make sure yours is 72w, not 56w.<<

My personal experience has been the 72 watt vs 56 watt is a crucial factor. I have a bunch of TPs and AC adaptors (15??), and found that when I mistakenly used the 56 when 72 was called for, the battery run time can be degraded by as much as 50%. (fully charged).
quote]

Can you clarify the above - when you charged with the 56 watt adaptor, did it just reduce the run time for that charge, or did it permanently degrade battery run time, even when subsequently charged with the 72 watt adaptor?

Thanks,

Nolo

skygodtj · #19 Post by **skygodtj** » Wed Jan 18, 2006 10:42 pm

Using the wrong charger will not allow the batt to reach 100%. It will degrade the batt over a very -short- time. If it is allowd to run off the 56w charger, it will take multiple cycles with a 72w to get back to a proper charge level/capacity. In short, just dont do it (run an under-current charger).

TJ

Can you clarify(the above - snipped) - when you charged with the 56 watt adaptor, did it just reduce the run time for that charge, or did it permanently degrade battery run time, even when subsequently charged with the 72 watt adaptor?

Thanks,

Nolo[/quote]

dsvochak · #20 Post by **dsvochak** » Fri Jan 20, 2006 10:11 am

Just a reminder as an addition to skygodtj's reply to Nolonemo. See this post, for example, regarding the possibility of underpowered adapter's damaging the laptop:
http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.php?t=6589

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