T23 Space Bar Problem - REPAIRED!

[BruisedQuasar]

I tried search & it came up with nothing on this. I thought I saw T23 key problems discussed before.

My space bar suddenly stopped working properly. No warning. Just stopped. I had similar problems with some keys months back. Same problem. press key and nothing happens. Press down firmly or just right and key works. Before I think it was some software issue.

I can only get the space bar to work now when I use two fingers at same time, one on each end on each end of the bar, rather hard too. Makes writing near impossible.

Anyone familiar with this problem?

--Bruised

[rkawakami]

FYI:

http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.php?t=26987

Generally speaking, it would be very hard to fix or replace any single key on the keyboard. Problems like this are usually solved by swapping out the entire keyboard.

[BruisedQuasar]

Thank you for the advice. I removed the space bar and discovered the space device under the space bar works fine.

Turns out the small rubber piece in the middle is worn out and came unattached (unglued?) from the button in the middle under the space bar. Is this a part (the rubber piece that rests under the middle of the space bar & on the space button on the key board) that can be obtained somehow?


--Bruised

[rkawakami]

I did not have a T series keyboard to rip apart but I do have one from a 600 series. I removed the space bar key and took a picture of what I believe you are describing:

http://www.rkawakami.net/ibm_600x/images/space_key.jpg

Is this what you are talking about? It appears that the key button is (most likely) a dome with a conductive elastomer inside the top surface. I am not aware of this being available to purchase from any laptop parts source. It may be possible to re-glue the button back onto the keyboard, however you must be careful not to contaminate the disc over which this button is placed. If you are able to repair your key in this manner, please post your results here. I'm sure others could benefit from this procedure.

And if you cannot get the rubber cap to work again, then I'm afraid my previous advice still applies: it's probably not worth the effort to take the entire keyboard apart in an attempt to fix this one key (assuming you can get the part which needs replacement) when complete keyboards can be had for about $15-$20 on eBay.

(edit: BTW, there are a couple of diagnostic programs which can test your keys. I would recommend PC Doctor as it is provided by IBM for the T2x series on their web site.)

(edit2: OUCH! What a pain it was to get those four plastic 'arms' in just the right position so that the space key could snap back on! I learned that the trick is to get them interleaved with the pins inside the matching holes and then slide the key back on, aligned over the plastic arms and then firmly push the space key down until it clicks.)

[BruisedQuasar]

I think it insane that a person need replace a keyboard because a tiny rubber part deteriated. I have owned many notebooks. Never had a key fail, less much an entire keyboard!

Yes, I am talking about the dome in your photo. The two components on either side are shaped different but the polymer dome is very similar.

I can use the space bar function by pressing down where the polymer dome goes. I placed a mechical pencil eraser over the button and push down on it. I looked over the many keyboards for sale on eBay. When you count the excessive postage (I always count shipping) demanded by 95% of sellers, the price is not much less than a new one ($46.50) from IBM\Lenovo.

By the way, is there some secret handshake for getting a T series TP to work with an external PS\2 keyboard? My T23 lights up my Dell full size Key Board LED lights when I plug it in but that is all. Must we have the special IBM PS\2 connector (adaptor?) part IBM\Lenovo mentions, even when we connect a PS\2?

I seached the manual at support but found little specifics on the external keyboard option. Detailed instruction on replacing the internal keyboard is easy to find!

Thanks for your help

--Bruised

[rkawakami]

I think it insane that a person need replace a keyboard because a tiny rubber part deteriated. I have owned many notebooks. Never had a key fail, less much an entire keyboard!

Such is the case nowdays when miniature electronic components costing pennies fail, they can require an entire sub-assembly or module replacement as the only "cost-effective" solution.

Yes, I am talking about the dome in your photo. The two components on either side are shaped different but the polymer dome is very similar.

The white, plastic 'arms' (for lack of a better term) are what the key cap snaps onto. Arranged like scissors, pivoting on opposite sides, they guide the key up and down.

When you count the excessive postage (I always count shipping) demanded by 95% of sellers, the price is not much less than a new one ($46.50) from IBM\Lenovo.

I've found a couple of Buy-It-Now listings for $20-$25 (includes shipping).

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 0006000776
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 0008742325

By the way, is there some secret handshake for getting a T series TP to work with an external PS\2 keyboard?

Sorry, but I have never attempted to use a PS/2 keyboard with my 600s, T21 or T23s. Hopefully somebody else can provide that answer.

[JHEM]

By the way, is there some secret handshake for getting a T series TP to work with an external PS\2 keyboard? My T23 lights up my Dell full size Key Board LED lights when I plug it in but that is all. Must we have the special IBM PS\2 connector (adaptor?) part IBM\Lenovo mentions, even when we connect a PS\2?

It's not a PS2 port, it's a mouse port.

If you want to use an external keyboard conected to this port you must use a splitter.

But it's much easier to simply use a PS2 to USB adapter which is almost always included with PS2 keyboards and mice nowadays.

Regards,

James

[BruisedQuasar]

Thank you for the advice and clarification.

I know IBM says you must use a splitter to connect an external keyboard. That did not make much sense to me. I did notice that there is no keyboard icon marked port in the back of a T2x.

A standard desktop USB keyboard should work correct?

--Bruised

[BruisedQuasar]

I've found a couple of Buy-It-Now listings for $20-$25 (includes shipping).
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 0006000776
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 0008742325

Thank you for the heads up on the two reasonable keyboards for sale. My search did not bring up either of these auctions

--Bruised

[JHEM]

A standard desktop USB keyboard should work correct?

Yep.

Regards,

James

[BruisedQuasar]

I removed the space bar key [from a 600 series) and took a picture of what I believe you are describing:

http://www.rkawakami.net/ibm_600x/images/space_key.jpg

It appears that the key button is (most likely) a dome with a conductive elastomer inside the top surface. It may be possible to re-glue the button back onto the keyboard, however you must be careful not to contaminate the disc over which this button is placed. If you are able to repair your key in this manner, please post your results here. I'm sure others could benefit from this procedure.

My wife, who makes fine jewelry, told me she has a jewelers glue that fit the bill of what I needed, a glue that is very precise in application, dries fast & can be applied and used without contaminating the metallic button. Her eyes and eye-hand control is more precise than my failing eyesight allows, so she applied the glue to just the outer edge of the bottom of the polymer ("rubber") dome. She held it with tweasers and placed it in the center of the round mettalic button in the center of the area where the space bar key goes. The total job took her under four minutes.

I waited an hour for it to be safe to test the repair. I replaced the space bar (after the hour) and tried it out, pressing only in the center. Works like a charm, sensitive as before. My wife told me to wait 24 hours before I use the key, as the maximum bond for this glue is 24 hours.

The glue is G-S Hypo Cement. "G-S Precision Applicator" "for fine detail work" The cement is used by jewellers for watch crystals, fine screw locking, optics, jewelry making. The prescision applicator allows precise amount of cement to be applied to intricate parts for exact placement. Web site is toolsGS.com. It can be ordered online.

I couldn't be more pleased as my T23 keyboard works fine, except for the sudden failure of the Space Bar.

--Bruised

[rkawakami]

Excellent report! For people who have the same type of failure (loose rubber dome) in their keyboard, this is good news. It can't hurt to try this repair because if it doesn't work, you would still need to replace the whole keyboard anyway. $4.50, plus $8 shipping (!!) for a tube of glue is probably cheaper than a used keyboard off of eBay. I would suggest trying your local arts/crafts/hobby/hardware store first to avoid the extra shipping charge.

[awdark]

neat stuff!
I think ill eventually just buy a new keyboard though...
=\ I bought my T20 used and most of the home keys are worn smooth... as in the f key (physical f button not f1 f2..) doesn't even have that nice little nub on it so I don't know what im hitting at times

That glue certainly sounds amusing...

[BruisedQuasar]

The glue I mentioned is available locally for under $4. My wife tells me you can find it at stores like Michels (craft stores) and any bead shop.

I provided the corporate Net site info so anyone interested could get more detail.

--Bruised