After Win XP SP2 Upgrade, T41 USB 2 port runs at slow speed

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pcsmart24 · #31 Post by **pcsmart24** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 12:06 pm

its noticeably fast matey, just copy across a big file (50mb or something similar) i copied a 21mb file on 1.1 and took 3 mins, doing my trick did it in under 20 seconds

pcsmart24 · #32 Post by **pcsmart24** » Sun Oct 08, 2006 2:33 pm

Well my usb has decided to jump back to 1.1 again

this is so irritating! Why on earth is it doing it? :S

Raphoroni · #33 Post by **Raphoroni** » Sun Oct 08, 2006 7:12 pm

My T43 did this for a couple days but then it magically dissapeared. Now my ports are back to 2.0, i dunno what i did but it seemed to work

coreman · #34 Post by **coreman** » Wed Oct 11, 2006 12:39 am

pcsmart24 wrote:Well my usb has decided to jump back to 1.1 again this is so irritating! Why on earth is it doing it? :S

This is now a near daily experience for me...install the unsigned driver followed by installation of signed driver and system seems to run at USB 2 for a while. Then all of a sudden it changes speed even while still hooked to USB device...it really is frustrating for me as well...

I should add that now I am also experiencing WiFi connection problems that I never had before...intermittent connection to Internet that locks up while the connection is showing "Excellent"

Wonder if these are connected somehow???

pcsmart24 · #35 Post by **pcsmart24** » Wed Oct 11, 2006 5:03 pm

Could be, as the Bluetooth at least when you first switch it on, it reads new hardware found "USB Device" then switches to IBM Intergrated Bluetooth II after a split second

Should the Wifi could be the same?

ajo · #36 Post by **ajo** » Mon Oct 16, 2006 2:38 pm

this slow usb is painful. I am off warranty.

Does anyone know which pcmcia card with usb 2.0 works well with the T series? Also do you know if there is a pcmcia card with usb 2.0 that will fit so that the end of the card sits flush with the side of the thinkpad rather than sticking out past the end of the pcmcia card slot in a ridiculous way?

thanks,

AJO

T40p bought used from IBM website

#37 Post by **GomJabbar** » Mon Oct 16, 2006 6:10 pm

ajo wrote:Also do you know if there is a pcmcia card with usb 2.0 that will fit so that the end of the card sits flush with the side of the thinkpad rather than sticking out past the end of the pcmcia card slot in a ridiculous way?

How about an IBM ThinkPad USB 2.0 CardBus Adapter?

boatz · #38 Post by **boatz** » Wed Oct 25, 2006 10:57 pm

I have the same problem with my T41. Even worse, changing the driver back and forth doesn't work for me.

Is this a dead end?

coreman · #39 Post by **coreman** » Thu Oct 26, 2006 5:44 am

boatz wrote: I have the same problem with my T41. Even worse, changing the driver back and forth doesn't work for me.

Is this a dead end?

I haven't found a solution yet...changing drivers has worked most of the time but not all the time. However this week I was getting the "This Device could run faster..." and didn't have time to change drivers. Today I rebooted and I have USB 2.0 again...but I doubt for long...

cmarti · #40 Post by **cmarti** » Thu Oct 26, 2006 6:13 am

coreman wrote:
boatz wrote: I have the same problem with my T41. Even worse, changing the driver back and forth doesn't work for me.

Is this a dead end?
I haven't found a solution yet...changing drivers has worked most of the time but not all the time. However this week I was getting the "This Device could run faster..." and didn't have time to change drivers. Today I rebooted and I have USB 2.0 again...but I doubt for long...

I think your next thing to do is finaly replace your faulty motherboard, it's your problem since the begining.

boatz · #41 Post by **boatz** » Thu Oct 26, 2006 9:31 pm

are you sure that it's the motherboard problem?

I spoke with IBM support, they didn't mention a word about hardward problem because it seems to be working -- just slower.

coreman · #42 Post by **coreman** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 4:05 am

cmarti wrote:
coreman wrote:I haven't found a solution yet...changing drivers has worked most of the time but not all the time. However this week I was getting the "This Device could run faster..." and didn't have time to change drivers. Today I rebooted and I have USB 2.0 again...but I doubt for long...
I think your next thing to do is finaly replace your faulty motherboard, it's your problem since the begining.

What is your theory that the hardware is defective? I can change drivers and it will revert to USB2 for a while. The problem happened immediately upon my upgrading to SP2...personally I don't see this as being a hardware issue...ports still work but vary between 1.1 and 2.0...

boatz · #43 Post by **boatz** » Sat Oct 28, 2006 11:32 pm

Ok ... I'm a little more convinced that it is a hardware problem now.

I have Linux installed on my machine, haven't used it for a while. I booted it today, and both USB ports don't work at all.

I'm still on warranty, will speak to IBM support to get it replaced. And let you guys know how it goes.

Fozzie · #44 Post by **Fozzie** » Sun Oct 29, 2006 6:19 am

I have an almost 3 year old T40. Had the planar board (mobo)replaced in Feb this year to fix USB issue with it only running at USB 1. IBM will not tell you it is a issue, and will not pay any regard to the issue as identified in forums. Anyway a new mobo fixed it. Sadly the problem returned again this month, same as before.

I had been extra careful as I thought it may have fried before with unpowered external hardware. After the first mobo change I was very wary what I plugged in, only mouse, usb thumb drive and an external powered hard disk. It did not seem to matter as the USB's had fried again.

Can only say in both cases IBM service in Australia were great. Both times it was fixed and returned in 3-4 business days. Still excellent service from IBM!

My advice to anyone who experiences this problem is to give up trying to trouble shoot it and send it in for repair if you lappy is still under warranty.

Regards,

Mark.

cmarti · #45 Post by **cmarti** » Sun Oct 29, 2006 9:30 am

coreman wrote:
cmarti wrote: I think your next thing to do is finaly replace your faulty motherboard, it's your problem since the begining.
What is your theory that the hardware is defective? I can change drivers and it will revert to USB2 for a while. The problem happened immediately upon my upgrading to SP2...personally I don't see this as being a hardware issue...ports still work but vary between 1.1 and 2.0...

coreman/boatz,

It is indeed a motherboard failure i been there don't waste more of your time have it replaced.

NathanA · #46 Post by **NathanA** » Sun Oct 29, 2006 8:52 pm

All,

Found this:

http://mailman.linux-thinkpad.org/piper ... 26884.html

(linked to from thinkwiki.org)

Make of it what you will...

-- Nathan

coreman · #47 Post by **coreman** » Tue Oct 31, 2006 7:47 am

I understand that motherboard replacement can "fix" the problem however my problem happened immediately after I upgraded to SP2...and I mean immediately...about (5) minutes after SP2 upgrade/reboot, I went to transfer file from USB and Bingo...up popped the "This Device could run faster...." error message.

Additionally, I can still "fix" the problem by doing the Driver Dance and in fact just did so.

To me this is clearly a software problem...my symptoms don't look/act like hardware failure and i've been down that road. Motherboard in T30 was replaced because of intermittent USB port.

I appreciate the comments and may eventually replace the motherboard because it is still under warranty...however I really think this is a software issue...I regret that MS forced me to upgrade, I was perfectly happy with SP1 and updates...

NathanA · #48 Post by **NathanA** » Wed Nov 01, 2006 3:34 am

I think that more solid proof that it is a software issue would consist in you (perhaps with a spare hard drive, if you didn't want to mess with your production software load) reverting back to a reinstall/restore of pre-SP2 WinXP, and/or loading an alternative OS on there that uses entirely different USB chipset drivers based on entirely different code (such as Linux), and then demonstrate that the problem is or is not occurring on these OS installations.

Most people who have experienced this problem and were wondering whether it was a hardware issue or a software issue were able to convince themselves that it was hardware when they went into Linux and found that suddenly none of their USB 2.0 devices would even run *at all*, much less at USB 1.1 speeds. Since this development on the Linux side of things always correlated (time-wise) to when Windows developed its idiosyncratic and schizophrenic "You've plugged a high-speed USB device into a low-speed port! No you didn't! Wait, yes you did!" behavior, it stands to reason that the problem is software-independent and simply manifests itself in different ways depending on the platform being used.

Heck, you could even download a Live CD distribution of Linux such as Knoppix, boot off of that without touching your hard drive, and try some high-speed USB devices on for size.

At least a test like this would help to eliminate any remaining doubt.

-- Nathan

taz42zero · #49 Post by **taz42zero** » Mon Nov 06, 2006 5:11 pm

i had this same issue and had tried all the ideas mentioned before i called ibm. i told them what i had tried, they told me right away that it is a hardware issue, and set a service call to replace the mobo. the guy i talked to said it was not that uncommon....

frankie66 · #50 Post by **frankie66** » Mon Dec 11, 2006 8:13 am

I have read a lot on this thread and am amazed at the lack of 'official' clarification. If there is a 'static electricity' problem with this chipset where is the official INTEL statement that says this? If there is a common fault with the IBM/LENOVO system board where is the recall statement? There a lot of these machines out there! Maybe in corporate world they never connect the USB device or even notice the message but if it really is a motherboard problem this is going to cost IBM/INTEL a lot of money. Does anyone have a link where IBM or INTEL confirm any of this conjecture?

lautamas · #51 Post by **lautamas** » Sat Dec 30, 2006 7:58 am

I was bubbling around with this issue. Any software related issues, I have tried...
Finally, a Motherboard replacement was done on monday. It all solved the problem. So, in conclusion, this was all about motherboard problem from the beginning...

UPDATE: 3 days after having the MB replaced....the darn message popped up again..now I am back to 1.1....darn it! what can I do now? MB just got replaced 3 days ago. So, I dont know if my statement above is still valid since maybe it's the software problem anyhow.

taz42zero · #52 Post by **taz42zero** » Sat Dec 30, 2006 1:26 pm

yeah, i'm about to be on my third motherboard since i got this piece of crap about 2 months ago. i never should have left dell.......

#53 Post by **GomJabbar** » Sat Dec 30, 2006 8:55 pm

I think there may be a problem if a user plugs in a USB device that draws too much power. This could be an ipod, pda, external drive, digital camera, etc. If the USB device is trying to charge itself via USB, that would be a likely culprit. This seems to be a weak point in at least the earlier T4x series. I come to this conclusion from reading similar posts on this issue - but this is just my guess. I have a T42 and have not had this problem. Also I do not plug in any USB devices that draw much power.

taz42zero · #54 Post by **taz42zero** » Sat Dec 30, 2006 9:14 pm

GomJabbar wrote: Also I do not plug in any USB devices that draw much power.

me neither.... the only thing i ever use with usb is my usb flash drive.....

Temetka · #55 Post by **Temetka** » Mon Jan 01, 2007 3:50 pm

I have a USB2.0 hard drive. It's one of those enclosures to stick a laptop hd into. It has 2 USB plugs on one end and a mini plug which goes to the enclosure. So on my tower when I hook it up I plug one usb plug into the tower and the mini one into the drive and it powers up just fine. Will this work on my soon to arrive T41P? Should I use both USB plugs? The manufacturer of my enclosure states that there are two plugs for a simple reason. 1 is for power, the other is for data. On some machines it it necessary to use both plugs. On some machines it is not.

Or should I pick up one of those IBM USB 2.0 HD enclosures for 2.5" HD's and use that? Have all IBM hardware all the way around in order to avoid any potential issues?

I ask because I intend to run both linux and xp on my laptop and would really like to sidestep the entire issue if possible. Thanks.

coreman · #56 Post by **coreman** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 11:06 pm

lautamas wrote:I was bubbling around with this issue. Any software related issues, I have tried...
Finally, a Motherboard replacement was done on monday. It all solved the problem. So, in conclusion, this was all about motherboard problem from the beginning...

UPDATE: 3 days after having the MB replaced....the darn message popped up again..now I am back to 1.1....darn it! what can I do now? MB just got replaced 3 days ago. So, I dont know if my statement above is still valid since maybe it's the software problem anyhow.

Guys, this is exactly the reason that I've suspected there may be at least (2) sources of problem; 1)actual bad MBs but those should constitute a very, very small percentage of failures and 2) poorly written drivers that don't play nicely with Win XP SP2, which I think is the vast majority of the problems here.

I never had a problem with my ports until I updated to SP2 and then I had the problem immediately. I am still doing the "Driver Dance" when I actually must have USB2 speeds, such as large file transfers, or when backing up to external HDD.

In my mind, this is primarily a MS/Intel driver problem and not a hardware issue although it is certainly possible that hardware contributes to the problem. From the Intel website, it seems that Microsoft is responsible for writing the drivers...maybe Lenovo needs to get more involved in this problem.

I am not a hardware engineer so I can't explain why new MBs seem to fix the problem for some even though I don't believe the actual USB controller chips failed. Is it possible that there are several different manufacturers of these motherboards and they are using different Southbridge setups? If so, maybe the drivers work well with one MB configuration and not others...my set up is Intel 82801DBM ICH4-M...

taz42zero · #57 Post by **taz42zero** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 11:10 pm

^^^^ who knows, cuz my usb ports worked fine with xp sp2 and then just took a crap all of a sudden.... same thing with vista that i'm running now, were working for a while, then all of a sudden, nope, back to 1.1 speeds.....

coreman · #58 Post by **coreman** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 11:16 pm

Temetka wrote:I have a USB2.0 hard drive. It's one of those enclosures to stick a laptop hd into. It has 2 USB plugs on one end and a mini plug which goes to the enclosure. So on my tower when I hook it up I plug one usb plug into the tower and the mini one into the drive and it powers up just fine. Will this work on my soon to arrive T41P? Should I use both USB plugs? The manufacturer of my enclosure states that there are two plugs for a simple reason. 1 is for power, the other is for data. On some machines it it necessary to use both plugs. On some machines it is not.

Or should I pick up one of those IBM USB 2.0 HD enclosures for 2.5" HD's and use that? Have all IBM hardware all the way around in order to avoid any potential issues?

I ask because I intend to run both linux and xp on my laptop and would really like to sidestep the entire issue if possible. Thanks.

I use external 2.5" drive in USB enclosure and always use both USB plugs, even though HDD fires up fine on (1) plug.

USB ports are set up to a max current draw of 500ma, attempts to draw more will shut the port down. The HDD can draw more than 500ma when under heavy duty so the purpose of the twin USB plugs is to split the current load and prevent the 500ma limit from being reached.

If your use of the external HDD doesn't require it to seek more than 500ma of current, then it will run fine on one plug...but I would recommend that you always plug in both just to be certain not to shut down your USB port at a critical data transfer time...not sure what would happen but Windows has never liked it when the USB device is abruptly disconnected when passing data back/forth.

#59 Post by **GomJabbar** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 11:22 pm

You guys have me wondering...

Could this be the same sort of issue as the DMA to PIO fallback "feature" in Windows?
http://users.bigpond.net.au/ninjaduck/i ... /udma_fix/

coreman · #60 Post by **coreman** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 11:24 pm

taz42zero wrote:^^^^ who knows, cuz my usb ports worked fine with xp sp2 and then just took a crap all of a sudden.... same thing with vista that i'm running now, were working for a while, then all of a sudden, nope, back to 1.1 speeds.....

Sort of follows my belief...SP2 (and now Vista) drivers may not play well with older hardware, what Southbridge chipset are you running?

There are many, many people today running SP2 on Thinkpads without USB issues so it doesn't surprise me that you ran well for a while as well.

However I believe there is something in the driver that makes the chipset unstable for USB2.0 and when certain sequences of events occur, the chipset throttles back to 1.1 speed.

To me it is clearly a software issue otherwise I wouldn't be able to recover USB 2.0 speed with the "Driver Dance"...

After Win XP SP2 Upgrade, T41 USB 2 port runs at slow speed

usb operating at slow speeds

Re: usb operating at slow speeds

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