Alternative products to the T60p

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Mr Blek · #1 Post by **Mr Blek** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 9:57 am

As my order has now been delayed by another month, can anyone recommend any alternatives to the T60p (and not exclusive to the IBM/Lenovo range) with similar specs?

The main purpose I'll be using the machine is for development, dual partioned between Windows and Linux. I've thought about the Macbook Pro so far, don't want a Dell as I've had too many problems with them in the past and would ideally like a machine as robust as an IBM.

Any info would be gratefully appreciated.

RUSH2112 · #2 Post by **RUSH2112** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 1:16 pm

Thats like asking for an alternative to a Porsche 911.

Uh, dare I say, "Thinkpad, there is no substitute."

If you must though, I'd say the next best bet is a Business HP, but even they are far inferior. I've owed many laptops, and I've got to say, noting matches a Thinkpad.

Mr Blek · #3 Post by **Mr Blek** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 7:03 pm

The reason I was coming back to Thinkpads was because I remember the quality of the machines. Unfortunately, the customer service by Lenovo leaves a lot to be desired. I've already waited patiently for one month but two months is pushing it, hence why I am now looking at alternatives.

I've just been informed in another thread that I have no chance of getting my T60p with the 15" flexview screen, but I'm still hoping that Lenovo realise its a business they are running and will deliver. You just expect a bit more professionalism.

RUSH2112 · #4 Post by **RUSH2112** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 7:37 pm

Mr Blek wrote:The reason I was coming back to Thinkpads was because I remember the quality of the machines. Unfortunately, the customer service by Lenovo leaves a lot to be desired. I've already waited patiently for one month but two months is pushing it, hence why I am now looking at alternatives.

I've just been informed in another thread that I have no chance of getting my T60p with the 15" flexview screen, but I'm still hoping that Lenovo realise its a business they are running and will deliver. You just expect a bit more professionalism.

The slow shipping aside, I have had no problems with their service. I ordered mine 7/29/06. It originally said "Ships in 8-10 Business Days," but they told me "Estimated Ship Date: 8/21." Okay, not too bad. I was a little worried when I read posts here about them bumping the ship date by several weeks, but it actually shipped 8/21 on the dot. Moreso, it shipped Express - from China to Boston in 2 days, when I only paid for reg. shipping.

They do need to work on building an inventory though, because pre-configured systems (like mine) should ship in no more than 48 hours, and no more than a week or so for CTO systems.

I called them up a few weeks ago after I screwed up my Rescue and Recovery parition. After about a one minute wait, I was connected to some english-speaking guy in Georgia (not India like Dell), and after I explained my situation, he overnighted me some rescue cd's, free of charge and no questions asked. I should mention that this was IBM support though, not Lenovo's (apparently IBM is still offering service for some Lenovo products).

So, they can use some improvment, but theyre pretty good overall.

tselling · #5 Post by **tselling** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 9:06 pm

Why not just purchase from a reseller instead of direct? With the change to their return policy I don't see a good reason to buy direct anymore unless its a super sale.

#6 Post by **K. Eng** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 9:24 pm

tselling wrote:Why not just purchase from a reseller instead of direct? With the change to their return policy I don't see a good reason to buy direct anymore unless its a super sale.

How did the return policy change?

Edit: ok I found it:

link

Products returned may be subject to a restocking fee equal to 15% of the price paid. You agree to pay the restocking fee as Lenovo specifies. Products purchased through the Lenovo Employee Purchase Program are not eligible for return.

The return policy really has gone to hell. 15% restocking fee at their discretion? No return whatsoever on EPP even if the item is a lemon? I guess there's not much advantage to buying direct anymore.

Website · #7 Post by **tfflivemb2** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 9:26 pm

K. Eng wrote:How did the return policy change?

There is no longer a 30 day no questions asked return. They now only accept UNOPENED returns within 21 days.

EDIT: Here is the policy.

#8 Post by **K. Eng** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 9:34 pm

Great... so if a user buys a ThinkPad and gets a rare lemon machine, they can't return it, and are stuck dealing with EZServ repair service on a brand new ThinkPad.

mattbiernat · #9 Post by **mattbiernat** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 10:42 pm

K. Eng wrote:Great... so if a user buys a ThinkPad and gets a rare lemon machine, they can't return it, and are stuck dealing with EZServ repair service on a brand new ThinkPad.

and in addition you need 6 system failures within 6 months to get machine replacement. lol. I new guess Dell management really does make a difference!

MobileGuru · #10 Post by **MobileGuru** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 11:05 pm

Well it makes a fair bit of business sense, seeing as how once the unit has a seal broken, it becomes open box and drops a ton of value upon return to Lenovo. It can no longer be sold as new, so it gets refurbed and sold as used.

Also, I don't know where someone heard "and in addition you need 6 system failures within 6 months to get machine replacement. lol. I new guess Dell management really does make a difference!" but thats totally nowhere near the policy.

MG.

AssPenny · #11 Post by **AssPenny** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 11:33 pm

From experiencing both, and even a long term Thinkpad user, the Dell Latitude D620 beats it.
It can be spec'd the same and is cheaper. The keyboard feels nicer and the screen is also very good.
Beyond that model, the thinkpad is a close second to it.

If the next gen (t61 or whatever) doesnt improve, i think i will switch for the time being.

tselling · #12 Post by **tselling** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 10:20 am

Is the Lattitude D620 that much better than the D600? I have a work provided D600 and I don't particularly like it. Dell's implementation of the trackpoint isn't as good (one of my main concerns) and the keyboard isn't as good. And of course bluetooth doesn't work... periodically an error pops up about usb not working due to a bad connection between the bluetooth card and systemboard. Left palmrest gets pretty warm. Noisy fan. If I could, I would work on one of my own Thinkpads but can't due to company policy.

AssPenny wrote:From experiencing both, and even a long term Thinkpad user, the Dell Latitude D620 beats it.
It can be spec'd the same and is cheaper. The keyboard feels nicer and the screen is also very good.
Beyond that model, the thinkpad is a close second to it.

If the next gen (t61 or whatever) doesnt improve, i think i will switch for the time being.

christopher_wolf · #13 Post by **christopher_wolf** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 12:00 pm

tselling wrote:Is the Lattitude D620 that much better than the D600? I have a work provided D600 and I don't particularly like it. Dell's implementation of the trackpoint isn't as good (one of my main concerns) and the keyboard isn't as good. And of course bluetooth doesn't work... periodically an error pops up about usb not working due to a bad connection between the bluetooth card and systemboard. Left palmrest gets pretty warm. Noisy fan. If I could, I would work on one of my own Thinkpads but can't due to company policy.

What a coincidence, that sounds *alot* like what happens with my M60 Precision (it wasn't my idea to get it). Bluetooth didn't work, the firewire was just a port with no connection to the mobo, the left palmrest got hot enough to discolor the plastic, etc. The last 620 I tried felt like a hotter version of my M60, and I had enough of that crap to last several lifetimes.

IRT to the T60; waiting for the shipment is a better idea than getting a replacement now, and comprimising what you paid for to begin with, and then dealing with that when you wanted a T60 to begin with. If you want, you can cancel the shipment, then go with a T60 shipped to you from a reseller such as euclidcomputers.

mattbiernat · #14 Post by **mattbiernat** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 12:17 pm

MobileGuru wrote: Also, I don't know where someone heard "and in addition you need 6 system failures within 6 months to get machine replacement. lol. I new guess Dell management really does make a difference!" but thats totally nowhere near the policy.
MG.

yeah i was wrong in a way, it was 3 *major* system failures within 6 months according to this guy: http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.ph ... ice+lenovo.

rockefella wrote: "When dealing with Lenovo customer service, I noticed that at the level just below the Lenovo Office of the President, it was still an IBM guy. He told me that he had new guidelines issued by Lenovo that he now had to follow. Basically, he couldn't give me a new replacement T42 unless I reported what he called 3 major system failures in a 6 month period. Well I've had my mobo replaced 2x and my monitor replaced 1x. So what the hell qualifies as a major system failure?"

#15 Post by **BillMorrow** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 12:25 pm

which thinkpad model is it that you want..??

i'll see if i can get one..

reply by email or PM otherwise i might miss it..

#16 Post by **K. Eng** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 9:05 pm

I've had the opportunity to examine 2 models of D620, one with integrated graphics, and one with an nVidia Quadro. My final evaluation is that the D620 is superior in almost every aspect to the D600.

The chasis and keyboard are sturdier. Trackpoint is vastly improved, although not as good as the ThinkPad trackpoint and still lacks scroll key. Display is brighter than standard ThinkPad display.

In terms of design, the D620 feels less elegant than a T or Z series. The plastic parts don't fit quite as nicely on the D620 as on the T and Z series. However, the machine feels as durable as either.

My conclusion is that the D620 is a good value relative to the ThinkPad, and that Lenovo better keep innovating if they want the ThinkPad to stay on top.

tselling wrote:Is the Lattitude D620 that much better than the D600? I have a work provided D600 and I don't particularly like it. Dell's implementation of the trackpoint isn't as good (one of my main concerns) and the keyboard isn't as good.

AssPenny wrote:From experiencing both, and even a long term Thinkpad user, the Dell Latitude D620 beats it.

Alternative products to the T60p

Alternative products to the T60p

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