Very annoying whine/noise from ethernet area on new T60

Message

novaraz · #1 Post by **novaraz** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 10:48 am

Hi everyone,
I've been lurking here for a while. I finally got my first new Thinkpad last week after using a T21, T43, and T60 in the past. I configured a 14.1" T60 with a T7200 and X1400 from Lenovo direct. I am having a few problems, and I would like another opinion on whether I should call Lenovo support.
First, the fan is always on, and the GPU idles around 75C. After doing some research this appears 'normal'

Second, a Very Annoying high pitched whine is emitted from the ethernet area, most noticeable when running on battery. The noise appears when dragging windows, using the middle Trackpoint key, and when ethernet utilization is around 100%. It occurs in Windows or Linux.

Is this normal? I feel the ethernet noise is far more annoying than the fan, which is very quiet, albeit always running. I tried disabling various hardware/power management options, all to no or little avail.

Thanks, Chris

newbie1983 · #2 Post by **newbie1983** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 11:09 am

you can turn off CPU power management in the BIOS by pressing F1 when starting computer. Then you definitely won't have the noise. Guaranteed...

novaraz · #3 Post by **novaraz** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 11:31 am

My current BIOS Settings (different than factory):
SpeedStep: OFF
CPU Power Management: OFF
PCI Power Management: OFF
Performance Power and Battery: MAX
IR Port: Disabled
Serial Port: Disabled

Noise is still present. I should clarify; Running on battery in Linux there is a constant high pitched whine with power management on. BUT, even with the above settings, there is a 'crackling' type noise from the ethernet port area, whenever a Firefox window is scrolled up or down. This noise persists with or without power settings, on AC or DC, etc, etc.

ThinkMore · #4 Post by **ThinkMore** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 12:40 pm

Hi novaraz,

terrible, terrible and terrible. I have a T60, and as I have posted, I get some "ping" noises plus some kind of high-frequential noises, but they are difficult to describe.

Regarding your noises... I got the same noises at the beginning: when you plug an USB mouse, when you move the trackpoint/trackpad or because the LAN.

They disappear if you disable the Auto Powermanagement option. Set all to maximum Performance. The Ping does not disappear, but the other noises do (if they are "scratches" produced by this option).

Good luck

------ SINCE YOUR NEW REPLY (my computer collapsed...)
Have you tried with the newest BIOS?

marlinspike · #5 Post by **marlinspike** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 1:08 pm

novaraz wrote:Second, a Very Annoying high pitched whine is emitted from the ethernet area, most noticeable when running on battery. The noise appears when dragging windows, using the middle Trackpoint key, and when ethernet utilization is around 100%. It occurs in Windows or Linux.

I mentioned this once and someone told me it's a Centrino thing. At first I was just like whatever, then I realized that every Centrino computer I had ever seen did the same thing. It grows on you after a while...in fact I'm starting to like it.

agarza · #6 Post by **agarza** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 1:15 pm

I don't have that type of problem on my T42p branded as Centrino. Could be something with the power brick voltage?

ronan_zj · #7 Post by **ronan_zj** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 1:17 pm

novaraz wrote:My current BIOS Settings (different than factory):
SpeedStep: OFF
CPU Power Management: OFF
PCI Power Management: OFF
Performance Power and Battery: MAX
IR Port: Disabled
Serial Port: Disabled
.

I am not sure what CPU/PCI power Management for, but I know you need turn on Speedstep, otherwise ur CPU will always run at hight speed producing more heat.

novaraz · #8 Post by **novaraz** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 2:21 pm

ronan_zj wrote: I am not sure what CPU/PCI power Management for, but I know you need turn on Speedstep, otherwise ur CPU will always run at hight speed producing more heat.

Thats the strange thing- the CPU still scales with SS disable, but only in Windows. If I open up cpu-z without tpfan or notebook hardware control open, it still shows CPU0 at 1GHz. Even with NHC set on Max Performance, the CPU jumps to 1GHz every so often.
But in Linux, scaling is disabled and its stuck at 2GHz.

Thanks for the tips, I'll give them a whirl and post back.

My T60 shipped with the 11-20-06 BIOS.

ronan_zj · #9 Post by **ronan_zj** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 2:46 pm

novaraz wrote:
ronan_zj wrote: I am not sure what CPU/PCI power Management for, but I know you need turn on Speedstep, otherwise ur CPU will always run at hight speed producing more heat.
Thats the strange thing- the CPU still scales with SS disable, but only in Windows. If I open up cpu-z without tpfan or notebook hardware control open, it still shows CPU0 at 1GHz. Even with NHC set on Max Performance, the CPU jumps to 1GHz every so often.
But in Linux, scaling is disabled and its stuck at 2GHz.

Thanks for the tips, I'll give them a whirl and post back.

My T60 shipped with the 11-20-6 BIOS.

In this manner, I think the power manager in ur XP does this job, maybe ur IBM power managerment software is in adaptive, so when ur system is idle, it will lower speed.

fbrdphreak · #10 Post by **fbrdphreak** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 8:43 am

novaraz, is this noise only present when you use Linux?

I would try several things to maybe help isolate problems:

*Test with AC adapter plugged in & not
*Test with battery out, AC adapter in
*Go through one by one and disable different components like ethernet, IR, ports, etc using "ThinkPad Configuration" utility; only leave one disabled at a time, then re-enable it before you disable the next item

Generally noise like that is electrical noise from within the circuits I do believe, maybe we can narrow it down.

iatacs19 · #11 Post by **iatacs19** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 10:41 am

you should enable all those power management features you disabled or the cpu and northbridge will run at the max voltage and speed making it hotter thus making the stay on.

With all the power management settings enabled the CPU will be able to clock down and the northbridge will be able to drop its voltage which help to generate less heat and the fan will come on much less. It is not noticeable to the user during normal use since the change is dynamic.

novaraz · #12 Post by **novaraz** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 12:55 pm

My power settings are back to default. I only disabled them to test the sound difference. After much more testings, this is what I've learned:

Sound (intermittent whine and/or crackling emitted from ethernet port area) occurs in Windows and Linux.
NOTE: This is NOT the CPU in in powersave mode. That happens too (but only in Linux).
The crackling occurs something is being drawn on the screen. Scrolling internet pages, resizing windows, or the DirectDraw tests causes. Whining is more intermittent, may be CPU related. High ethernet activity also causes whine.
Disabling hardware (wireless, IR, Power Management, sound, serial) has little or no effect. Sound hardware acceleration, no effect. Disabling graphics acceleration makes the crackling noise noticeably quieter.

As for the sound itself, I am fairly certain it is not coming from the speaker, but it is in the area and its tough to pinpoint. The sound is loud enough to be heard in a large room with several quiet conversions going on.

So in total, there are 4 annoying sounds associated with this system:
Always on fan (quiet enough I can deal)
CPU hiss/whine (only in Linux, and there is software workarounds)
Ethernet whine (very intermittent, I can deal too)
Screen drawing crackle from ethernet area (annoying since I read many documents and am constantly scrolling)

I am soon upgrading my RAM, maybe there will be some clues inside. I think I will try some other 3d party video drivers since it is definitely associated with screen drawing. Finally, I'll bite the bullet and submit a ticket to Lenovo (not expecting much there).

Ford5of5 · #13 Post by **Ford5of5** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 9:02 pm

well i just got my t60p on 12/6. I too have the whine sound but only when i use my trackpad/stick or the keyboard. The sound is most definitely the speaker. its interferance of some kind. I was planning to try and disable the speaker but im not jsure if i can do it with software or do i need to open the machine. I'm fairly sure the noise is eminating from the speaker. I used the accurate method of holding the speaker to my ear and thats where the wine is the loudest. Of course I could be wrong but I doubrt it.

novaraz · #14 Post by **novaraz** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 9:20 pm

I hope its from the speaker. That *could* mean there is a fix somewhere. Disabling sound through software does not help. I tried muting each and every volume, disabling the hardware in Device Manager, and disabling sound hardware acceleration in dxdiag did not help.

Disabling video acceleration in dxdiag did make a noticeable improvement, but that's frankly not an option.

pinesol · #15 Post by **pinesol** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 10:31 pm

I've just received a T60 with T7200 and 15" flexview screen.

I am sorry to say I don't hear any noise whatsoever.

novaraz · #16 Post by **novaraz** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 10:54 pm

I should have got the Flexview. I am not impressed with the 14.1" SXGA+.

Do you have X1400?? If this isn't 'normal' I should complain to lenovo and try to get an exchange...

This is really bumming me out.

newbie1983 · #17 Post by **newbie1983** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 11:21 pm

I doubt calling for an exchange will help. I have found that disabling CPU power management in the BIOS completely eliminated the sound and it also has no effect on heat or fan level. I am fairly confident about this.

Though I am no expert on this, I don't agree with the abovementioned post that disabling CPU power management will increase heat since if you monitor it at all times, you will hardly notice any difference. The only difference is that with CPU power management on, when on battery, the microprocessor clock is stopped occasionally to conserve power. However, there is really no difference in batt life.

Also VOLTAGE remains constant throughout as long as speedstep is working. I think it's 1V and 1.3V if I am not wrong for T2400 and T2300.

Personally, I have two different models of T60 and both have the same sound when on battery. Both problems are solved with disabling the CPU power management.

pinesol · #18 Post by **pinesol** » Thu Dec 07, 2006 4:10 am

novaraz wrote:I should have got the Flexview. I am not impressed with the 14.1" SXGA+.

Do you have X1400?? If this isn't 'normal' I should complain to lenovo and try to get an exchange...

This is really bumming me out.

Display: 15" TFT active matrix 1400 x 1050 ( SXGA+ ) - 24-bit (16.7 million colors)
Graphics Controller: ATI Mobility Radeon X1400 - 128 MB

novaraz · #19 Post by **novaraz** » Wed Dec 20, 2006 2:19 pm

So the problem gets weirder. Weirder than hearing the electrostaticy noise through my headphones.

I switched my linux distro to Ubuntu Edgy x86. MOST of the x64 distro have a kernel error than will not let you boot with APCI enabled. I went with Fedora Core 6 because it was the only one I tried that booted. However, I found it so buggy (esp. regarding the ATI drivers) that it was unusable. The all noises remained in FC6, some worse (e.g. low-power CPU whine)

So I finally gave up running x64. I loaded up x86 Edgy, and lo and behold, everything works. Wifi, sound, ATI drivers installed without a hitch. I got some serious eye-candy with XGL+Beryl, which runs as smooth as butter. And best of all, somehow, someway, the annoying scrolling buzzing sound is practically gone!!

I know I can't believe it either! Maybe it has to with the fact the desktop is 3D accelerated? If thats the case, we'll have hope with Vista too.

It is still there, but you have to stick your ear right next to the computer to make it out. The CPU whine is gone too. I did not test the ethernet whine (on Wifi now). Ubuntu has excellent compatiblity with the Thinkpad's features. There is an OSD of volume and screen brightness, as well as all the ibm apci drivers installed by default.

The only noise now is the always-on fan, but I can deal with that!

own6volvos · #20 Post by **own6volvos** » Thu Dec 21, 2006 1:57 am

Can you check to see what sort of wattage that system is pulling without the noise? Previously with the least loud and smallest watt value, the noise was the loudest. I hope no noise doesn't mean like 25-30 watts or something

nxman · #21 Post by **nxman** » Fri Dec 22, 2006 6:23 am

please try to update your bios to the latest

Very annoying whine/noise from ethernet area on new T60

Very annoying whine/noise from ethernet area on new T60

Re: Very annoying whine/noise from ethernet area on new T60

odd update on high frequency noise

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