Rescue and Recovery (v2.02) on X32...questions.

[magnusansky]

Hi.

I'm in the process of swapping out my old HDD for a new 7K100 on my optical drive-less X32 and the method I was going to try seems to have a couple issues that I don't know the answer for.

The method:
Make a copy of my current hard drive with R&R and save it to a network drive.
Then connect up my new hard drive to the desktop computer that contains the network drive and install the copy of R&R onto the via USB to the new HDD.

The problems:
1) After I save, I cannot see the file in the desktop. The folder I created to hold the backup copy has properties indicating it is 17GB large, but inside the folder, I cannot see any files (I have show hidden files turned on). Perhaps only R&R can see it?
2) Since my desktop is not an IBM machine, there is no R&R on it. How do I get the copy to install onto the new HDD? Or do I just connect my new HDD via USB straight to my laptop?

Thanks for any help.

The other thread that I have been following is Ken Fox's http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.php?t=35159 (I also see the other thread that he created.

PS. I am using R&R 2.0, cause that's all I have. =/

[Ken Fox]

Hi.

I'm in the process of swapping out my old HDD for a new 7K100 on my optical drive-less X32 and the method I was going to try seems to have a couple issues that I don't know the answer for.

The method:
Make a copy of my current hard drive with R&R and save it to a network drive.
Then connect up my new hard drive to the desktop computer that contains the network drive and install the copy of R&R onto the via USB to the new HDD.

The problems:
1) After I save, I cannot see the file in the desktop. The folder I created to hold the backup copy has properties indicating it is 17GB large, but inside the folder, I cannot see any files (I have show hidden files turned on). Perhaps only R&R can see it?
2) Since my desktop is not an IBM machine, there is no R&R on it. How do I get the copy to install onto the new HDD? Or do I just connect my new HDD via USB straight to my laptop?

Thanks for any help.

The other thread that I have been following is Ken Fox's http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.php?t=35159 (I also see the other thread that he created.

PS. I am using R&R 2.0, cause that's all I have. =/

Howdy,

I'm not too keen on R&R as a way of disk "cloning." I think it is "possible" to do this although my own experience with this does not inspire confidence. I have similarly tried to save R&R disk images to other hard drives and then found the image files to be "invisible" on those other drives (although I did this with earlier versions of R&R and not 3.1).

The closest I've come to successfully cloning a HD with R&R was by using optical disks on a freestanding USB2 DVD burner, although if your laptop has a burner (hopefully a DVD burner as with CDs this going to take FOREVER) you could try making an R&R backup set with it. Then, you can swap drives, and boot up the laptop with the first R&R disk of the set, the boot disk, and see if you can accomplish this task.

I think that other cloning/imaging software is going to be more reliable, such as Ghost 2003 or Acronis. I have no experience using R&R across a network and the program is so buggy that I have my doubts that anyone other than a Lenovo software engineer could accomplish it

Hope this helps!

[magnusansky]

Thanks Ken.

Hmmm, I may try the Norton Ghost route.

However, I wonder if it's compatible with the hardware setup that I have. (X32 with no optical drive...new hard drive connectible through USB external case).

Norton Ghost's Copy Disk utility doesn't seem to be able to copy to a network drive nor to removable media. That would seem counterproductive to the above setup.

And here's a novice question regarding Norton Ghost (10.0 in this case...if that matters). Reading through the Ghost manual, I don't see any mention of creating "images". Perhaps it's a semantics thing and they like to use the word, "backup"? Anyway, I was wondering about the whole, create an image, then "expand" that image into the new drive methodology. I see from the manual that you can create a backup, and then choose where to "recover" it to. Is this the same as creating an image and then installing/expanding it to the new HDD?

That's the long/I'm trying to understand the whole flow version. The quick version of my question is, given my hardware setup, how would I use Norton Ghost to clone my drive.

Thanks to Ken and anyone else brave enough to rescue me from my own ignorance. =)

[Ken Fox]

Thanks Ken.

Hmmm, I may try the Norton Ghost route.

However, I wonder if it's compatible with the hardware setup that I have. (X32 with no optical drive...new hard drive connectible through USB external case).

Thanks to Ken and anyone else brave enough to rescue me from my own ignorance. =)

Ghost 2003, a USB Floppy, and a USB2 hard drive are exactly the equipment I've used 15 or more times to image my X32, and at least 3 times to clone the disk. You don't need anything else.

I don't trust Ghost beyond the level of ghost 2003, but then I can't prove it is a bad product, either. I bought Ghost 9 before I decided to go back to 2003, which didn't hurt too much because I got it on one of those deals that was free after a couple of rebates.

Your copy of ghost 10 PROBABLY came with a separate CD for Ghost 2003 (my copy of v. 9 did); this is because some systems are not going to be compatible with levels above 2003 so they throw that disk in too. If you install ghost 2003 on a computer (doesn't have to be your X32, just any windows computer with Win 98 or above, methinks), you can upgrade it online which is essential because the USB 2 drivers that initially shipped with it don't work well. THEN, you can get Ghost 2003 to make a bootable ghost floppy with USB2 drivers on it, or even a CD with those drivers on it. THEN you can boot up with the floppy (or CD) and make a ghost file on a USB2 hard drive (preferably attached to the rear USB 2 port as the side port is not powered). Before you image the drive, click on "options," go a couple of tabs over and check the box for "-1b" which will tell ghost to image the IBM MBR as well. Otherwise, you will not be able to boot into the service partition and maybe won't be able to boot, period (although this is easily fixed).

Then, swap the drive in the machine with the new one, and use the floppy and file you have obtained to write onto the new hard drive inside of the machine. It is fairly easy but the program is very simple minded and can be confusing.

If you screw up you will still have the original hard drive available so you could put it back in and re-image it.

Don't use docking stations or USB hubs when you do this as ghost generally will not have the drivers for them and you will probably end up very frustrated and not able to do the cloning.

[magnusansky]

Thanks for the quick reply!

Looks like I may be needing to get some new hardware.

[magnusansky]

Hmmm, looks like this thread: http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.php?t=27721 would be useful to my education on this matter. =)

I looked into Acronis True Image and it seems like the trial version may have a disk cloning tool that I can use.

[Ken Fox]

Hmmm, looks like this thread: http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.php?t=27721 would be useful to my education on this matter. =)

I looked into Acronis True Image and it seems like the trial version may have a disk cloning tool that I can use.

Acronis, like Norton Ghost, used to be good programs before Symantec ruined them

I think you can accomplish your goal with either the trial version of Acronis referenced in that thread, Norton Ghost, (maybe) Rescue and Recovery, and possibly some other programs floating around the net that I'm not aware of.

In the end, you are not asking much of this software and as long as you can understand the arcane instructions these programs give while you are executing them, you should be home free and have a working cloned drive in no time!

[magnusansky]

I'm not sure if I should ask the question in this thread or in a new one, but I'll try this one anyway (even though the title is off).

Using Acronis now...I'm trying the Disk Cloning Utility. It allows me to do either proportional or manual mapping of the partitions...in terms of disk allocation. Since I'm going from a 40GB drive to a 100GB drive, everything will be 2.5x'ed if I choose proportional. Since I don't want to waste the extra 6GB that the hidden partition would expand with, I figure I'd choose manual.

So in manual mode, I changed the destination hidden partition back to 4.578GB. And then had 6GB extra. I tried to give that to the main partition, but True Image will only let me decrement from 81.72GB. I can't seem to add 6GB to that partition.

Is there some Thinkpad or OS (XP) limitation to the size of a partition? 81.72 seems random.

Or is it an Acronis limitation?

Nevermind, user error. Didn't realize I had to/could move the partitions around.

[Ken Fox]

I'm not sure if I should ask the question in this thread or in a new one, but I'll try this one anyway (even though the title is off).

Using Acronis now...I'm trying the Disk Cloning Utility. It allows me to do either proportional or manual mapping of the partitions...in terms of disk allocation. Since I'm going from a 40GB drive to a 100GB drive, everything will be 2.5x'ed if I choose proportional. Since I don't want to waste the extra 6GB that the hidden partition would expand with, I figure I'd choose manual.

So in manual mode, I changed the destination hidden partition back to 4.578GB. And then had 6GB extra. I tried to give that to the main partition, but True Image will only let me decrement from 81.72GB. I can't seem to add 6GB to that partition.

Is there some Thinkpad or OS (XP) limitation to the size of a partition? 81.72 seems random.

Or is it an Acronis limitation?

Thanks

I have no experience with Acronis. What I can tell you is twice in the last week I went from a 60gb. hard drive to a 100gb 7K100 (I have two of them now, 1 in an X32 and the other destined for my new T43 when it arrives). In both instances Norton Ghost 2003 offered me and made a 590mb service partition for the <500mb contents of that partition, with the remainder of the disk (save about 10mb) going to the Windows NTFS partition. I tried to reduce the size of the service partition closer to the size of its contents, but Ghost would not allow me to do so. Since we are talking about at most 100mb, I regarded this as trivial and maybe being needed "headroom" in the partition.

Whatever the cause of your difficulties, it is not due to any sort of limitation placed by a 7K100 hard disk or by an X31/32 or T4x series laptop.

[magnusansky]

Hi Ken.

Thanks for the experience info.

Looks like it was user error (didn't realize I could/had to move the partitions around so that the unused space would be adjacent to the expanding partition.)

[magnusansky]

Final followup:

Acronis True Image worked like a charm.

Once I got past my own ineptitude, things went sailing.

Thanks Ken for all the support and help.

[Ken Fox]

Final followup:

Acronis True Image worked like a charm.

Once I got past my own ineptitude, things went sailing.

Thanks Ken for all the support and help.

does it boot and work? I hope so!

[magnusansky]

It boots and works!

The only thing is...it's not as quiet as I had hoped. Oh well.
It's not the idle hum noise (or perhaps the default fan noise...these are pretty close to silent), but the random access noise that pops up every couple seconds. Even when I don't have any apps open, I'll hear the grating noise characteristic to a hard drive access.

A reenactment:
t=0: quiet/white noise
t=3s: <grate grate>
t=4s: quiet/white noise
t=9s: <grate>
t=10s: <grate grate grate>
etc.

Not sure if this is characteristic with the 7K100 (100GB) or not. When the unformatted in my USB case, there was no random grating sounds. Just the white noise of an electronic item being on. Of course, if it was unformatted, I guess there would have been no accesses possible (in case the current noise is related to real accesses by the computer).

But, I guess I'll have to live with it and an extra 60GB isn't too shabby neither. =)

(So in the end, I didn't need any floppy drives or optical drives. Just a USB external case for the new hard drive, and the Acronis tool. Much easier than whatever I was originally planning with R&R. =))

[Ken Fox]

It boots and works!

The only thing is...it's not as quiet as I had hoped. Oh well.
It's not the idle hum noise (or perhaps the default fan noise...these are pretty close to silent), but the random access noise that pops up every couple seconds. Even when I don't have any apps open, I'll hear the grating noise characteristic to a hard drive access.

A reenactment:
t=0: quiet/white noise
t=3s: <grate grate>
t=4s: quiet/white noise
t=9s: <grate>
t=10s: <grate grate grate>
etc.

Not sure if this is characteristic with the 7K100 (100GB) or not. When the unformatted in my USB case, there was no random grating sounds. Just the white noise of an electronic item being on. Of course, if it was unformatted, I guess there would have been no accesses possible (in case the current noise is related to real accesses by the computer).

But, I guess I'll have to live with it and an extra 60GB isn't too shabby neither. =)

(So in the end, I didn't need any floppy drives or optical drives. Just a USB external case for the new hard drive, and the Acronis tool. Much easier than whatever I was originally planning with R&R. =))

I don't really hear the accesses of the 7K100 in my T32; the only noise I find annoying from that laptop is the fan noise, which pulses.

Glad it worked out!