Windows Licensing

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#1 Post by **Kyocera** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 6:31 pm

Windows Licensing

OEM COAs
Each computer that came with Windows 98 Second Edition or higher comes with what is called a Certificate of Authenticity (COA). Theses COA contain a product key that is specific to the machine that it was installed on by the Original Equipment Manufacturer (OEM). These keys live and die with the computer. THEY ARE NOT TRANSFERABLE TO ANY OTHER COMPUTER.
Recent Thinkpads come with a Rescue and Recovery program on a hidden partition on the hard drive. You can use this, or create a set of backup CD’s to use if you want to choose to reinstall Windows. If you are upgrading your hard drive, It is recommended to create the CD’s. They should be able to put the recovery partition on the new hard drive. If you do not have either, you can request a set of Recovery CD’s from Lenovo.
For other computers, or for Thinkpads with out the recovery partition, if you have a COA that was originally for that specific machine, you can obtain a OEM Windows install CD to install or reinstall Windows. NOTE: YOU MUST USE A OEM INSTALL CD. USING ANY OTHER INSTALL VERSION WILL RESULT IN AN INVALID KEY ERROR. If you build a bunch of computers, or need to get Windows for a few computers, you can buy OEM versions of Windows XP from Newegg.com. They are available in 1 or 3 pack licenses and cost less than retail versions. The same rules stated above still apply.

Retail COAs
Unlike OEM COA’s, Retail COA’s are transferable to other machines, but you can only install it on one machine at a time. You cannot install the same copy of Windows on multiple machines at the same time unless otherwise stated in documentation. The same goes for upgrade versions of Windows. You cannot reinstall Windows with an upgrade disk, you must have a full retail version to do a clean install.

Volume Licensing.
With Windows 2000/XP, there is a so called corporate version. It may be possible to obtain this from your workplace depending on their policy. Depending on your work, you may be entitled to a free copy of Windows from your company. Ask your IT department if this is available. I am not sure if you get the corporate key, or just get a retail version. With Windows Vista, volume licensing is no longer available due to the misuse of these keys. It is these corporate versions of Windows that are pirated the most on the internet.

Activation.
Microsoft allows for 1 activation of Windows per year. If you computer has to have Windows installed a second time or more in a year. You will have to call Microsoft for an activation code. This is fairly common, and Microsoft should provide you the code with out any trouble. You will need to have your Product key handy. The product key can be found on the COA, or in the install CD sleeve that came with windows. Windows XP and higher require activation. All other versions of Windows do not. Corporate versions of Windows XP are exempt form activation since they are already activated from install. If you are using the Rescue and Recovery program from IBM/Lenovo it should not need to be activated, but this is not always the case. As long as you used the proper key, call Microsoft to obtain the activation code.

Versions of Windows that will have COA’s: Windows 98 Second Edition, Windows Millennium Edition, Windows 2000, Windows XP, Server 2003, Windows Vista.

Windows 95 and above will have CD keys for retail and upgrade versions.

Big thanks to Stargate199 for putting this together!

#2 Post by **bill bolton** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 8:01 pm

Recent Thinkpads come with a Rescue and Recovery program on a hidden partition on the hard drive.

Note: If your ThinPad has been supplied by your workplace, it may have a corporate Standard Operating Environment (SOE) installed. In this case any hidden partitions will probably have been erased during the installtion of the SOE.

If you have a corporate SOE installed, it is generally not a good idea to reinstall Windows yourself for any reason. Corporate desktop support people generally react strongly when they find non-SOE environments installed on corporate ThinkPads.

Cheers,

Bill

ashleys · #3 Post by **ashleys** » Tue Jan 16, 2007 6:10 am

Microsoft allows for 1 activation of Windows per year.

Are you sure that's correct ?
I thought there was no limit on activations as long as that version of the software was being installed on the same hardware. The hash key sent as part of the activation process is partially derived from the hardware details.

Judging by the rate of re-installs mentioned on this forum, once a year for many people people would be optimistic

Stargate199 · #4 Post by **Stargate199** » Tue Jan 16, 2007 12:11 pm

I should of rephrased it. You can activate Windows as many times as you need, but you can only do it once or twice within Windows without having to call Microsoft. After you pass that magic number, Windows will tell you that you cannot activate Windows and you must call Microsoft for the activation code. It's kind of dumb for them to do that because it does not slow down the pirates and just gives them more work to do for their customers.

ashleys · #5 Post by **ashleys** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 3:42 am

Thanks for the clarification.

ashleys · #6 Post by **ashleys** » Wed Jan 17, 2007 10:03 am

According to the latest information I could find, you can activate over the Internet a maximum of 4 times per year, even on different hardware.

See here,
http://www.microsoft.com/technet/prodte ... activ.mspx

It's mentioned in the paragraph immediately above the Conclusions section.

jjesusfreak01 · #7 Post by **jjesusfreak01** » Sat Jan 20, 2007 1:36 pm

bill bolton wrote:
Recent Thinkpads come with a Rescue and Recovery program on a hidden partition on the hard drive.
Note: If your ThinPad has been supplied by your workplace, it may have a corporate Standard Operating Environment (SOE) installed. In this case any hidden partitions will probably have been erased during the installtion of the SOE.

If you have a corporate SOE installed, it is generally not a good idea to reinstall Windows yourself for any reason. Corporate desktop support people generally react strongly when they find non-SOE environments installed on corporate ThinkPads.

Cheers,

Bill

Hah, my school gave us laptops with something like that (custom image) installed. I didnt like it at all. When my laptop died, I had to have them re-image it (and it took them 3 tries to get it right). Anyways, to reinstall Windows myself, I had to ask Lenovo for the disks (which they quickly provided when I explained to them that the laptop didnt let me create my own recovery disks, a symptom of the custom image, probably on purpose). Turns out that they had also installed a customized version of the recovery environment, so to use the Lenovo disks, I had to completely wipe out the recovery partition, and then try to re-install windows, which I was finally able to do, and now it runs great, and I have full control of my laptop (Which I like...).

#8 Post by **Kyocera** » Sat Jan 20, 2007 1:57 pm

jjesusfreak01 , that's the good thing about "knowing what you are doing" the others have to suffer with what they are given

Looks like we're in for some more wintery weather our way, I was up your way thursday and there was actually quite a bit of snow around the Garner/Fuquay area.

jjesusfreak01 · #9 Post by **jjesusfreak01** » Sat Jan 20, 2007 5:34 pm

Kyocera wrote:jjesusfreak01 , that's the good thing about "knowing what you are doing" the others have to suffer with what they are given

Looks like we're in for some more wintery weather our way, I was up your way thursday and there was actually quite a bit of snow around the Garner/Fuquay area.

Well, I only had one class on Thursday...so I essentially had a snow day. Its funny what people here do when it snows. I saw snow writing in the fields, mini snowmen all over campus, etc. Back when I lived in VA, it was, "snow again, looks nice", and then we proceeded with our lives. Anyways, not everyone here is technically incompetent, but living in a world where most people are to a degree (and tech support assumes you are) is hard...luckily IBM/Lenovo customer service is very good, and doesn't always assume you are stupid (I even got one of their reps to look at the forum as evidence of a problem I was having at one time).

Sgt Raven · #10 Post by **Sgt Raven** » Thu Feb 01, 2007 11:40 am

Kyocera wrote:Windows Licensing

Retail COAs
Unlike OEM COA’s, Retail COA’s are transferable to other machines, but you can only install it on one machine at a time. You cannot install the same copy of Windows on multiple machines at the same time unless otherwise stated in documentation. The same goes for upgrade versions of Windows. You cannot reinstall Windows with an upgrade disk, you must have a full retail version to do a clean install.

Windows 95 and above will have CD keys for retail and upgrade versions.

Big thanks to Stargate199 for putting this together!

The last time I used a upgrade disc was from Win 95 to 98SE. I installed a new hard drive in the machine, put the upgrade disc in, it asked for the orginal disc. I put the retail 95 disc in and it verified that I had it without copying the whole disc and let me install from the upgrade set.

Can you still install from a upgrade disc set this way?

Stargate199 · #11 Post by **Stargate199** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 8:36 pm

Sgt Raven wrote: The last time I used a upgrade disc was from Win 95 to 98SE. I installed a new hard drive in the machine, put the upgrade disc in, it asked for the orginal disc. I put the retail 95 disc in and it verified that I had it without copying the whole disc and let me install from the upgrade set.

Can you still install from a upgrade disc set this way?

Yes you can as long as that version of Win 95 and Win98SE upgrade are not being used on another computer.

Sgt Raven · #12 Post by **Sgt Raven** » Tue Feb 06, 2007 5:06 pm

Stargate199 wrote:
Sgt Raven wrote: The last time I used a upgrade disc was from Win 95 to 98SE. I installed a new hard drive in the machine, put the upgrade disc in, it asked for the orginal disc. I put the retail 95 disc in and it verified that I had it without copying the whole disc and let me install from the upgrade set.

Can you still install from a upgrade disc set this way?
Yes you can as long as that version of Win 95 and Win98SE upgrade are not being used on another computer.

What I meant to ask is, can you do the same with XP Pro? use a upgrade disc set and just show the program that you have the standard XP Home disc without loading XP Home 1st.

pianowizard · #13 Post by **pianowizard** » Tue Feb 06, 2007 5:13 pm

Stargate199 wrote:Yes you can as long as that version of Win 95 and Win98SE upgrade are not being used on another computer.

BTW, how long do these copyrights last? I learned from another forum that they last 15 years. If that's true, pretty soon we can copy and install win95 freely!

Stargate199 · #14 Post by **Stargate199** » Wed Feb 07, 2007 5:08 pm

Sgt Raven wrote: What I meant to ask is, can you do the same with XP Pro? use a upgrade disc set and just show the program that you have the standard XP Home disc without loading XP Home 1st.

As long as you upgrading a valid copy of XP home to valid copy of XP pro, you are fine.

popjoe · #15 Post by **popjoe** » Tue Mar 20, 2007 7:26 pm

Hi

For other computers, or for Thinkpads with out the recovery partition, if you have a COA that was originally for that specific machine, you can obtain a OEM Windows install CD to install or reinstall Windows.

If my ThinkPad came with a foreign language version of Windows XP (OEM, COA on bottom) but I don't speak that language, am I allowed to reinstall from an English Windows XP OEM disc, using the license key from the CoA? (as long as both are pro or home, not different?)

Thanks

Stargate199 · #16 Post by **Stargate199** » Thu Mar 22, 2007 8:25 pm

Sorry for not see this earlier, been caught up with school. Yes, you can install a different language version of XP. A few copies I have seen do have multiple languages on them. Just make sure it is the OEM CD of the version of XP that is on your COA. The COA does not dictate what language the version of Windows had to be in.

popjoe · #17 Post by **popjoe** » Fri Mar 23, 2007 8:54 am

Thank you.

ryan · #18 Post by **ryan** » Sun Apr 08, 2007 6:43 pm

Op, thanks for compiling this information.

Will an XP Pro OEM key from pre-SP2 work with a newer XP disk that already contains SP2?

Thanks,
Ryan

pianowizard · #19 Post by **pianowizard** » Sun Apr 08, 2007 6:53 pm

ryan wrote:Will an XP Pro OEM key from pre-SP2 work with a newer XP disk that already contains SP2?

Yes.

nandaiyo · #20 Post by **nandaiyo** » Wed Apr 11, 2007 3:48 pm

Very strange. I received my new ThinkPad T60p today, and did a fresh install of Vista Business using the only supplied disc that came in the package (Windows Anytime Upgrade Disc).

When it came time to activate Windows, I used the product key from the bottom of the computer. However, it came up invalid.

I'm currently on the phone with Microsoft to activate it. Anybody else had this problem with their Thinkpads + included OS'es? I've heard of systems getting their product keys "stolen" while in transit, but this doesn't seem likely, considering my thinkpad didn't get stalled in customs while coming over from HK.

bshanner · #21 Post by **bshanner** » Wed Apr 18, 2007 8:33 am

I have a Thinkpad R40 with an XP Pro COA on the bottom.

It's loaded with the XP Pro with the pesky HPA hidden recovery partition. I'd like to do a clean Windows XP Pro load on the laptop turning the HPA off in BIOS.

What OEM disk with XP Pro will work with the COA on the bottom of the R40. How do I identify the right an OEM disk, are they specific to model or manufacturers?

As far as I'm able to determine Lenovo will only issue recovery disks. How do I get an OEM CD that will work with the COA?

I'm willing to pay for it but I'd like to avoid buying another COA

Stargate199 · #22 Post by **Stargate199** » Wed Apr 18, 2007 8:54 am

Any OEM Windows CD will work. Make sure it is the same version of Windows that you have the COA for (Home, Professional, Media Center Edition). You can use (and I recommend) a OEM CD with Service Pack 2 integrated.

bshanner · #23 Post by **bshanner** » Thu Apr 19, 2007 1:17 pm

Any OEM CD will not work.

From experience as I have HP, Compaq, Gateway, Avertec, Toshiba, Dell OEM CDs. They work with their own equipment and no other.

Never even seen an IBM OEM CD.

Stargate199 · #24 Post by **Stargate199** » Thu Apr 19, 2007 1:40 pm

bshanner wrote:Any OEM CD will not work.

From experience as I have HP, Compaq, Gateway, Avertec, Toshiba, Dell OEM CDs. They work with their own equipment and no other.

Never even seen an IBM OEM CD.

That is because they are recovery CDs and check to see if the computer has the OEMs BIOS before continuing. A generic OEM XP CD will work (you can find copies at Newegg.com). I have a set if Windows 2000 Recovery CDs for my T21 and they perform a BIOS check.

bshanner · #25 Post by **bshanner** » Thu Apr 19, 2007 2:32 pm

When I see the term "recovery" I think of a image that was taken from a disk. The image is specific to a model and usually a specific configuration within a model range. That image can be restored to a disk but it does not "install" software the way an application is installed.

The term "OEM" followed by a volume manufacturers name is compatible with the COA found on the bottom of most laptops and only COAs and OEM diskes from the same volume manufacturer work with each other. If you bother to read the license the COA is unique to a specific laptop and is not transferable, it will on my experience work with another unit running the same bios. The OEM disks will work with the COA from any model that the manufacturer makes.

The "OEM" disks that are widely available on the WEB are the OS sold by microsoft to non volume manufacturers and any OEM disk will work with any hardware as long as you use the COA that came with the OS. The COA on the bottom of the laptop will not work with the generic OEM disk.

A retail version of Windows will work on anything but only with it's own COA.

If you want to use the COA that you paid for on the bottom of a Thinkpad you need an IBM OEM disk. If you want to spend more money then you might as well by a retail COA, stay legal and pay Microsoft twice.

Recovery disks for what they do are extremely overpriced. The first thing I do when I get a preinstalled laptop is make disk image of the HD. I do this even before I power it up for the first time. This disk image is, in my opinion, better than any factory recovery disk.

The reason I want to install a clean copy of Windows is that my laptops always are dual and sometimes tripal boot. The images that manufacturers use always have junk in the boot sector, think root kits, that the dual boot messes with.

I appreciate your reply but the only thing that I belive will work with the COA on the bottom of a Thinkpad is an IBM OEM disk set.

If I wanted to buy a second copy of windows then yes a generic OEM with its accompanying COA will work.

If you know something different I'd appreciate you sharing it with the group.

Stargate199 · #26 Post by **Stargate199** » Thu Apr 19, 2007 4:40 pm

bshanner wrote:The "OEM" disks that are widely available on the WEB are the OS sold by microsoft to non volume manufacturers and any OEM disk will work with any hardware as long as you use the COA that came with the OS. The COA on the bottom of the laptop will not work with the generic OEM disk.

I do agree with you that you should use OEM disks that came with or is from the manufacturer of your computer. However, any OEM COA WILL work with a OEM copy of Windows. It just so happens that the companies name is printed on the COA that is on each computer. If you do some searching on the internet, you will find that a OEM COA will work with an OEM copy of Windows (as long as its the same version). Microsoft does not create different OEM versions of Windows for manufacturer. Each Manufacturer get the bare bones (like we all like to install, no bloatware) and then puts all of their drivers, software, shareware, spyware, adware, etc. onto that disk. Then they take that and make it into a custom disk that has its own installer (non-Microsoft) so it can only be used with their computers.

COA are not transferable as you said, but any generic OEM copy of Windows will work, look on the internet for proof. If you find anything, let me know, but everything I have read tells me otherwise.

bshanner · #27 Post by **bshanner** » Fri Apr 20, 2007 10:10 am

I have an OEM copy of XP Pro (generic). I have a Thinkpad with an OEM XP Pro (COA). The generic XP Pro will not accept the IBM COA.

I agree that some OEM COA will work with a generic copy of windows provided they are both of the same type.

I have not been able to do this with a Thinkpad which is why I asked in the Thankpad forum.

#28 Post by **jdhurst** » Fri Apr 20, 2007 10:22 am

You need the COA that came with the generic XP CD. The ThinkPad COA is only for the preload install. ... JDH

Andersonjoe711 · #29 Post by **Andersonjoe711** » Fri May 04, 2007 7:49 pm

This has probably been answered already, and I'm sure I know the answer, and I'm sure I'll get the boot for asking..........

I got my T23 my freshman year of High School (2001.... I think) When i first got it, it had a Win 2000 Sticker on the bottom of it, and Win2000 installed. After my first hard drive crashed, I got it back with a new hard drive, and XP Pro. The WIN 2k sticker was still there though. Well, in 2002, my friend accidentally stepped on the screen, and cracked it. I told him that if he ever wanted to see the light of day again, he's have it fixed. So he had it sent out, I can't remember where, and they told him that they wouldn't fix it because there wasn't a valid version of windows on it.......so they sent it back. I told the guy who i got if from about it and he said he'd have it fixed. It got fixed, and when I got it back, all the stickers on the bottom were removed, including the OEM Win2000 sticker. I ran it like that untill I left High School cause I didn't know jack at the time.

Last year, I went to Staples and purchased an upgrade CD for WinXP Pro. I have a Win98 CD from my dad's Gateway, and i used that to get the upgrade to work. Fortunately, that has the key with it, because it's attached to the folder the CD came in.

Well, to compile my fun copyright infringes, I got....lets say....non-original Recovery Cd's for it. I installed them, and It didn't ask for a key. I discussed it in another forum, and got the facts straightened out for it. It has a pretty IBM logo in the system properties, and the recovery partiton. I then used my XP upgrade CD because the recovery cd was SP1. So, I have my T23 running with the Key from the Upgrade disc.

With all that said, I'm getting another computer and I'd like to use my upgrade disc for that one, but I still want my T23 to be legit.
I know that buying a standalone COA is now Illegal, but I don't want to have to pay up the yingyang for some OEM version, just so i can put the sticker back on the bottom of my T23.

What can I do, if anything?
and

Is there a legal way to buy another sticker?

my apologies for the lenght of this post, but I just ant to get it all out there to minimize confusion, and to better aid anyone willing to give help.

Stargate199 · #30 Post by **Stargate199** » Fri May 04, 2007 9:09 pm

OEM licenses live and die with the computer they came with. You can not pull off a COA from one computer and put it on another. You cannot install a copy of Windows if you are not legally able to use the product key. So using that 98 CD from the Gateway was illegal. Your upgrade disk is legit, so you can use that CD on any computer that already has a legal copy of Windows installed. Since you no longer have the Win2k COA on your computer, you can no longer use any recovery CDs. You can only use your XP CD for one computer only. If you install it on the new one you are getting, you will have to remove Windows from your T23. In order to get legal again, you will have to buy new copies of Windows. They can be found cheaply on Newegg.com

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Thinkpad XP Pro with COA - what OEM disk works?

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