Regrets on my T60.

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Bobdare · #1 Post by **Bobdare** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 1:27 am

I've always been a fan of Thinkpads. I'm also a mac user, the only thing that brought me back was IBM's build quality. I just bought this new T60, 14", c2d 2.0, 1gb ram, 100gb hdd, x1400. Now I regret not getting something else. I should of got a 15" with flexview and a better graphics card. Or get an X60s at least it would of been ultra portable. This is neither this or that. Someone give me some advice since I spent a lot of money that I worked hard for. I don't want to sell this and lose a lot, I just want some people that are loving there 14s and tell me why this is better.

Thank You

iMav · #2 Post by **iMav** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 1:42 am

Hey Bobdare.

I'm new to this forum and do not own a T60. I am, however, an avid Mac user and do the majority of my computing on a 13" MacBook (CD, 1.83GHz). (have a user T23 on the way though...which is why my sorry butt is hanging around here)

My question to you is, why did you select the T60 in the first place? Were you well aware of the specs/features/etc? How do you use your laptop and what is it about the T60 that is inadequate for your usage?

You say you just bought it. Is there no return policy that you can take advantage of?

-------------------

Ha! Just noticed that you are in Kuwait City!! I'm up in southern Iraq myself. Are you a native of Kuwait or are you over here in the service of the US as I am?

Bobdare · #3 Post by **Bobdare** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 2:05 am

iMav, good to see someone else has the same thoughts. I feel that I just dumped a supermodel (Mac) for the ugliest machine around. It is still the best laptop out there, it's just too ugly. I really don't mind the looks, I just wish I went for a better screen or lighter machine. I use the laptop on the internet all the time. Some light gaming, nothing too serious. The X1400 is perfect for me, good enough and doesn't take a lot of battery life. The 14" is not too big and not too small but I would of rather went with a 15" with flex view. I'm trying to convince myself why I'm better of with my 14, because there is no return policy.

Yes, I am in Kuwait. I am a Kuwaiti citizen. How's life in Iraq, don't you guys take breaks and come to Kuwait? Or is it straight to Dubai or Bahrain (where you can find bars)?

kai · #4 Post by **kai** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 2:06 am

Well, I currently use a X40 (so similarish to a X60/s), I've also had a T42 15" with flexview. Now I've got hold of a T60 14".

I could have gotten a 15" T60, but decided against it because the 15" machine really is massive in my opinion - well it was on the T42 anyway and I didn't want to go back there again. I also use and still use the X40 as my primary machine (the T60 is for someone else, but I've got use of it for a while) and while the portaility of the X40 is fantastic - I really really wish for a higher resolution as 1024x768 really doesn't cut it anymore. (Also I wish for a faster hard drive - but this is remedied in the X60).

So there you go - the 14" T60 is a step up in terms of size and portability over the 15" and the flexview screen isn't that brilliant from what I've seen. It also offers me the higher resolution that I've been craving over the X40 (or X60) and is fast. It's also got pretty decent battery life and the keyboard on the T60 was a pleasant surprise - it's much more like the keyboard on the X40 than the one on the T42, which I hated.

Hope this makes you feel better! Remember, the grass is always greener on the other side!

Bobdare · #5 Post by **Bobdare** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 2:32 am

Thank you Kai. That is exactly what I needed to here!!

brikeh · #6 Post by **brikeh** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 8:02 am

I am seriously loving my T60 14 incher....best machine ever. I returned my Macbook Pro to get it. Apples buildquality has gone way down lately IMO. I DO miss OSX though and Im thinking about picking up a mini in the near future but for now the T60 is my baby

Chrispy · #7 Post by **Chrispy** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 10:40 am

brikeh wrote:I am seriously loving my T60 14 incher....best machine ever. I returned my Macbook Pro to get it. Apples buildquality has gone way down lately IMO. I DO miss OSX though and Im thinking about picking up a mini in the near future but for now the T60 is my baby

I hear ya on the build quality issue. After having multiple bad MacBook Pros (screen issues and bad casing) I ordered myself a T60 14". I'm still waiting for it to ship but I have had thinkpads in the past and find them to be of much higher quality than Apple products lately. I, too, miss OSX but I will get by with Windows.

agarza · #8 Post by **agarza** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 1:17 pm

You should not regret your purchase: Usually 14.1" machines are more portable than a 15" monster. What counts here is the resolution (1400x1050 pixels) your best bet.

pianowizard · #9 Post by **pianowizard** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 3:58 pm

Bobdare wrote:I feel that I just dumped a supermodel (Mac) for the ugliest machine around. It is still the best laptop out there, it's just too ugly.

The 15" T60 is definitely uglier than the 14.1" version. What's the screen resolution? I hope it's 1400x1050.

vision33r · #10 Post by **vision33r** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 4:05 pm

Bobdare wrote:I've always been a fan of Thinkpads. I'm also a mac user, the only thing that brought me back was IBM's build quality. I just bought this new T60, 14", c2d 2.0, 1gb ram, 100gb hdd, x1400. Now I regret not getting something else. I should of got a 15" with flexview and a better graphics card. Or get an X60s at least it would of been ultra portable. This is neither this or that. Someone give me some advice since I spent a lot of money that I worked hard for. I don't want to sell this and lose a lot, I just want some people that are loving there 14s and tell me why this is better.

Thank You

Apple MB certainly looks pretty but they consumers PCs and Thinkpads are corporate PCs. You're comparing a VW to a Mercedes, sure the VW looks better these days.

If you ever taken apart either product and just look through at the assembly and design of the internals, you get what you paid for.

Thinkpads are designed to take much more abuse than MB. The case of the MB gets dull, yellows, and scratches easily over time while the Thinkpad is much more durable.

I have to say there are some pretty good choices out there today, you could look at Toshiba, Asus, high end Dell, and even Sony they all have a model thats pretty high is quality.

You get what you paid for.

#11 Post by **tomh009** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 4:25 pm

vision33r wrote:I have to say there are some pretty good choices out there today, you could look at Toshiba, Asus, high end Dell, and even Sony they all have a model thats pretty high is quality.

There really is no "high end" Dell -- only "high price" Dell.

The Spirit of X21 · #12 Post by **The Spirit of X21** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 4:38 pm

It's interesting that there isn't any kind of return policy in Kuwait. Here in the States if you buy through IBM there is a 7 day return period in which you can bring it back and they will take it - no questions asked.

perry_78 · #13 Post by **perry_78** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 6:04 pm

I regret partially not getting a X60s instead of my T60 - but at the end of the day, the T60 is bloody amazing, and a far better bargain than a MB or MBP in my opinion.

When a SXGA+ screen comes out on a X series, I will likely get that. Until then, the 14" T60 is the way to go

Despite having funky hinges resulting in a funky closed state fit, the machine is amazing, and I'm very happy to have chosen it over the Apple offerings.

crisper · #14 Post by **crisper** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 9:32 pm

If it helps at all, I have essentially the same system in 15" FlexView and wish I had chosen the 14.1". It's taken me two laptops to figure it out, but I won't go bigger than 14.1" again.

I have grown to appreciate the LG FlexView though, but it took me a while.

Stevesoura · #15 Post by **Stevesoura** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 11:05 pm

I Love my T60. I Love everything about it, kinda like a BMW. Nice, sporty and all around luxury. It is very important to have a professional and sleek look if you do business. It depends on the person also, the ones that has done there research that grow into loving these beauties. If you kind of shotgun your choice and picked the t60, you got lucky. You can sell it at a high value on ebay, sometimes. So im saying to try it out for a month or sell it.

Rovers3 · #16 Post by **Rovers3** » Tue Feb 06, 2007 1:16 pm

So i have just about the exact laptop you have, with the exception i have the WWAN installed.
I personal think this is one of the worst T series i have owned. My T43 was for superior than this laptop in build quality and general feel.
Examples.
Everyday i have 1-5 stuck pixels on my screen, UDPixel always resolves them. I am running it right now to fix one.
1 have 1 dead pixel.....had that 3 days after it arrived unfortunately i was out of town for 3 weeks so i could not return it.
My wireless for some reason out of the box and with the default drivers crash my wireless router. (driver update fixed this)

They were original designed as business laptops so they do not look all shinny or slick. That i can live with.

I am about to call tech support to get this in for repair as i cannot handle the stuck pixels any more.

This is not my first T series or my first laptop (have had about 6-8 over the years), but by far one of the worst i have used.

I to have looked at the MacBook and like them, but for work i will have to stick with the IBM as it is company provided.

For the 14" screen, I travel a lot so it is much better than a 15, and easier to use on the airplane. at 1400x1050 the resolution is great.

Someone mentions the X60. Only problem i have with them is the resolution is only 1024x768 and for me that is just not good enough now a days. However it is a better build machine than the T60.

efrant · #17 Post by **efrant** » Tue Feb 06, 2007 5:48 pm

I too just recently bought a 15" Flexview (1600x1200), and am starting to regret it a bit. Don't get me wrong, I love the Flexview screen--it is a HUGE improvement over the standard 14" screen, and I love the the UXGA resolution. The problem is just that for me personally, the huge improvement in the screen is not worth the HUGE increase in weight and size--it may not seem that much bigger and heavier on paper, but it certainly is. Let's face it, I want my notebook to be portable...

Without a doubt, my next one will definitely be a 14". Now Lenovo just needs to find a manufaturer to make a 14" Flexview!

pianowizard · #18 Post by **pianowizard** » Tue Feb 06, 2007 5:54 pm

efrant wrote: the huge improvement in the screen is not worth the HUGE increase in weight and size

Are you using a 9-cell battery? Switching to 6-cell will help quite a bit.

BTW, was this your first laptop purchase? Many people, including me, make the same mistake the first time they buy a laptop. When shopping around for my first laptop, I wanted to get the most bang for the buck, so I bought a Dell Inspiron 8200 which weighed over 8 lbs!

efrant · #19 Post by **efrant** » Tue Feb 06, 2007 5:57 pm

pianowizard wrote:
efrant wrote: the huge improvement in the screen is not worth the HUGE increase in weight and size
Are you using a 9-cell battery? Switching to 6-cell will help quite a bit.

Yeah, I have both batteries. I would still choose the 14" in the future (with the 6-cell)--very nice package.

nxman · #20 Post by **nxman** » Tue Feb 06, 2007 5:58 pm

Hi Bobdare another Kuwaiti here!

I think you should’ve gone for the X60 however the 14 inch T60 is the best ThinkPad money can buy so enjoy it!

Bobdare · #21 Post by **Bobdare** » Wed Feb 07, 2007 12:28 am

Thank you all for your great replies. I feel a lot better. I also called the dealer here in Kuwait and he said he will call up his "manager" to consider returning the T60 for an x60 tablet.

Bobdare · #22 Post by **Bobdare** » Wed Feb 07, 2007 12:29 am

nxman wrote:Hi Bobdare another Kuwaiti here!

I think you should’ve gone for the X60 however the 14 inch T60 is the best ThinkPad money can buy so enjoy it!

Thanks, what do you have? Do you also buy your gear from Al Yousifi?

Bobdare · #23 Post by **Bobdare** » Wed Feb 07, 2007 12:34 am

Chrispy wrote:
brikeh wrote:I am seriously loving my T60 14 incher....best machine ever. I returned my Macbook Pro to get it. Apples buildquality has gone way down lately IMO. I DO miss OSX though and Im thinking about picking up a mini in the near future but for now the T60 is my baby
I hear ya on the build quality issue. After having multiple bad MacBook Pros (screen issues and bad casing) I ordered myself a T60 14". I'm still waiting for it to ship but I have had thinkpads in the past and find them to be of much higher quality than Apple products lately. I, too, miss OSX but I will get by with Windows.

I'm in the same boat

My previous lappy was a MacBook Pro, I only miss OS X and am too shopping for a mini. I will wait for leopord though.

Rovers3 · #24 Post by **Rovers3** » Wed Feb 07, 2007 9:30 am

Bobdare wrote:Thank you all for your great replies. I feel a lot better. I also called the dealer here in Kuwait and he said he will call up his "manager" to consider returning the T60 for an x60 tablet.

X60 tablet.
After using a x41 for 6 months and my bosses x60 tablet for 3 months i would never get an IBM/ Lenovo tablet again. Problem is in the hard drive. the 1.8 4200 rpm hard drive is just not up to the task. For some reason it runs extremely slow and even with 1.5 gigs of ram it is a slug compared to other tablets i have used.
read some of the post here and on other tablet forums....forget the reviews, you need real world experience for this. I dumped my Tablet after 6 months as i could not handle the speed issues. Don't believe me. no problem borrow one for a week, start to use it and then try the right click....bet it lags out terribly.

If you want an X series then get the X60 (non tablet) these are very good and the speed is there. I just set one up for the CEO of our company and he commented on how much faster it was from his X60T

Remember none of the IBM tablets have an optical drive. so you will be carrying around a external drive.

kf_man · #25 Post by **kf_man** » Wed Feb 07, 2007 10:14 am

Just thought I'd add my two cents on the issue. Like others here, my first laptop wasn't my ideal. After a long debate I settled on a HP zt3000 (now discontinued and a faint memory) and I was exceedingly happy with it. Despite the 15.4" widescreen display and fairly high specs for the time, it was very small for its class. Compared with similar offerings in the consumer market, it was much smaller and very well built. After almost three years with it, I had a hard time letting it go.

When searching for a new laptop, I looked at ALL available options and I mean all of them. It took me a few months to decide on the one I wanted. Since I'm not really into the whole tablet/ultra-portable thing right now, I decided that the Lenovo T-series was the perfect form factor for me. Even when compared to models with similar sized screens and specifications, the T60 is downright tiny. The consumer models are much thicker and more bulky overall. On top of that, battery life on almost all other models is seriously lacking (Even the Dell Latitude D620 with extended battery can't touch it). In terms of specs and physical attributes, you really can't beat the T60 for this class of machine.

As far as build quality, every company is lacking these days and the phenomenon of it is that there is always an inaccurate ratio of satisfied to unsatisfied customers in a forum environment. It's just more common for someone who has a problem to come to a forum like this than someone who has no problems at all. Luckily in the case of this forum, there are a ton of happy and helpful owners, but this is not always the case. From what I've read online there is a higher probability of manufacturing problems with current models (maybe Lenovo is still working out some logistical problems), but the quality of a good machine has not really suffered. Although I haven't owned a ThinkPad in the past myself, I have used them before and I feel the quality of my T60 is right on par.

Both the T60 and X60 are very good machines and you can't go wrong choosing either. It really comes down to what the user wants and that's where careful planning is key. In my case I just couldn't see myself going with a tablet at this time, but in a few years that will probably change. In any case, good luck with your decision and I hope that you are satisfied with the outcome.

steveg47 · #26 Post by **steveg47** » Wed Feb 07, 2007 10:26 am

Rover3,

I setup and used an x60 tablet for a short while a few months ago and found the performance very similar to a non tablet x60.

The x60 uses a 2.5 drive not a 1.8 like the x41 and you can ramp it up to a 7200rpm hitachi for excellent performance.

No X series laptops come with a built in cd/dvd drive so you must carry a media slice with you for non tablet models or a portable external dvd. The IBM (lenovo) portable is expensive but very compact and fully usb powered so no extra ac adapter is necessary and would be my choice over the media slice unless you need the extra connectivity the media slice provides.

nxman · #27 Post by **nxman** » Wed Feb 07, 2007 10:30 am

Bobdare wrote:
nxman wrote:Hi Bobdare another Kuwaiti here!

I think you should’ve gone for the X60 however the 14 inch T60 is the best ThinkPad money can buy so enjoy it!
Thanks, what do you have? Do you also buy your gear from Al Yousifi?

Hello yes I'm an old customer of Al Yousifi currently i have 2 T60's 15 & 14 inch the 14 inch is way better than 15 imho

pianowizard · #28 Post by **pianowizard** » Thu Feb 08, 2007 12:45 am

kf_man wrote:From what I've read online there is a higher probability of manufacturing problems with current models (maybe Lenovo is still working out some logistical problems)

Possibly, but there are at least two more plausible reasons that I've never seen people mention. First, as machines get increasingly complicated, it becomes easier to screw something up during the manufacturing process. Second, part of the reason there seem to be more well-built older Thinkpads is that the defective ones have long been eliminated from the market (discarded, returned to IBM/Lenovo, repaired, etc.). So, there is a higher chance of getting a problem-free used T42 (for instance) than a problem-free brand new T60.

seattle911 · #29 Post by **seattle911** » Thu Feb 08, 2007 1:49 am

I have a configuration similar to yours and can only say that I very much love my T60. It has traveled with me on several cross country trips and I use it every day, from home to coffee shops to the car and it has been great. I have had it since September 2006.
I use an I Mac as a desktop but it sees very little use these days.
My T60 does everything I need it to do at this point. But, like any computer, especially a laptop, people have different needs and tastes.

iMav · #30 Post by **iMav** » Thu Feb 08, 2007 7:30 am

Bobdare wrote:I'm in the same boat My previous lappy was a MacBook Pro, I only miss OS X and am too shopping for a mini. I will wait for leopord though.

I never really liked the MBP's (and I am a BIG Apple fan). However, I fell in love with the 13" MacBooks. I have a first gen (1.83GHz CD) and couldn't be happier with it. The keyboard is excellent and overall it has been trouble-free.

While in Iraq, I decided to get a cheap second machine...hence my recent purchase of a T23 off of Ebay. I have never used the nasty on personally-owned computer...so I will most definitely be installing Linux.

Regrets on my T60.

Regrets on my T60.

Re: Regrets on my T60.

Re: Regrets on my T60.

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