Thinkpads, Dual-Link DVI and WQXGA

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sb37 · #1 Post by **sb37** » Sat Apr 21, 2007 10:49 pm

Hi there --

I have a t60p with the FireGL 5250 card. According to ATI's website, the card itself it supports dual link DVI. I have the advanced mini dock. What are the chances of a WQXGA 30-inch screen working with my dock?

WPWoodJr · #2 Post by **WPWoodJr** » Sun Apr 22, 2007 10:28 am

Good question! I'd like to know too.

perry_78 · #3 Post by **perry_78** » Sun Apr 22, 2007 2:48 pm

Just because a chip supports it doesn't mean the notebook/dock has the required output. What dock are you using?

seeplus · #4 Post by **seeplus** » Sun Apr 22, 2007 3:00 pm

This link:
http://www-307.ibm.com/pc/support/site. ... 2#graphics

shows max resolutions for Thinkpad video cards (for all ATI discrete cards the max resolution on an external display is 2048x1536.)

Unfortunately, this means no 30-inch WQXGA (2560×1600) in native resolution without an Advanced Dock and an additional video card.

(I was looking pretty hard at that Dell 30" until I found this out..)

sb37 · #5 Post by **sb37** » Sun Apr 22, 2007 7:58 pm

Found this post, which seems to say that it's possible with a t60p and an advanced mini dock (scroll down a bit):

http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.ph ... 1a75fe58f4

anyone with a firegl 5250, a mini dock, and a 30" monitor want to give it a try? or do y'all want to chip in and buy a 30 incher for me - i'd be happy to test it out!

#6 Post by **RonS** » Sun Apr 22, 2007 11:20 pm

Some people claim that you can drive 2560x1600 (dual-link DVI) from the Advanced Dock. (see this thread: http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.ph ... hlight=dvi ) I tried it with a 5250 but it didn't work for me.

gt5l · #7 Post by **gt5l** » Mon Apr 23, 2007 9:45 am

sb37 wrote:Found this post, which seems to say that it's possible with a t60p and an advanced mini dock (scroll down a bit):

http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.ph ... 1a75fe58f4

anyone with a firegl 5250, a mini dock, and a 30" monitor want to give it a try? or do y'all want to chip in and buy a 30 incher for me - i'd be happy to test it out!

I would gladly test it out, however all i have is a 19" monitor, donations are accepted for the 30"

seeplus · #8 Post by **seeplus** » Mon Apr 23, 2007 2:19 pm

Ive got a mini dock, a v5250, and a wuxga 24" lcd.. which scrolls the desktop at higher resolutions than 1920x1200. I'll try and force WQXGA on it and report back.

snife · #9 Post by **snife** » Tue May 15, 2007 6:37 pm

RonS wrote:Some people claim that you can drive 2560x1600 (dual-link DVI) from the Advanced Dock. (see this thread: http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.ph ... hlight=dvi ) I tried it with a 5250 but it didn't work for me.

I have tried it with the Dell 30" Beast, a dock and both a T60p with 5200 and a T60p with 5250, it works with the 5200 card but not with the 5250 - its either the video BIOS or an internal connection thats at fault but Lenovo will only support upto 2048 resolution so will not look into the issue, dispite it working on the earlier chipset. I'll try it on a T61 as soon as I can - with NVidia graphics it could go either way.

snife · #10 Post by **snife** » Thu May 17, 2007 5:50 am

I don't have a T61p yet but I have tested with a standard T61 with the 128MB NVidia card and interestingly it can support the 2560x1600 resolution without any troubles.

#11 Post by **RonS** » Wed Jul 25, 2007 11:05 am

snife - this is excellent information. Thanks for your work!

NathanA · #12 Post by **NathanA** » Wed Jul 25, 2007 2:32 pm

snife wrote:it works with the 5200 card but not with the 5250

This is conjuring a strange sense of deja vu within me...anybody remember the issue with the old ATI FireGL T2/Radeon 9600 in the T4x machines not being able to do more than 1280x1024 through the DVI port on the dock, and IBM saying that anything higher than that was not supported?

Eventually someone found a version of the ATI Catalyst driver that made higher resolutions work. Perhaps it is also just a driver problem here? Were you running the exact same driver version on both the V5200 and V5250 machines?

-- Nathan

lovebeta · #13 Post by **lovebeta** » Thu Jul 26, 2007 9:51 am

i agree that it definitely looks strange. I am wondering if anyone has any updated experience about v5250 since Lenovo released a new driver for FireGL earlier this month.

NathanA wrote:
snife wrote:it works with the 5200 card but not with the 5250
This is conjuring a strange sense of deja vu within me...anybody remember the issue with the old ATI FireGL T2/Radeon 9600 in the T4x machines not being able to do more than 1280x1024 through the DVI port on the dock, and IBM saying that anything higher than that was not supported?

Eventually someone found a version of the ATI Catalyst driver that made higher resolutions work. Perhaps it is also just a driver problem here? Were you running the exact same driver version on both the V5200 and V5250 machines?

-- Nathan

kengetz · #14 Post by **kengetz** » Thu Jul 26, 2007 11:21 am

snife:

Are you saying that you put a T61 into an Advanced Dock, hooked up the DVI cable to a 30" monitor (that normally requires a Dual-Link DVI port) and you saw 2560x1600 resolution? That would be a miracle, as far as I can tell, since that DVI port isn't a dual-link DVI port. But please confirm! This would make me VERY happy (assuming it works with the T61P once it arrives...) -- Ken

snife · #15 Post by **snife** » Thu Jul 26, 2007 3:37 pm

kengetz wrote:snife:

Are you saying that you put a T61 into an Advanced Dock, hooked up the DVI cable to a 30" monitor (that normally requires a Dual-Link DVI port) and you saw 2560x1600 resolution? That would be a miracle, as far as I can tell, since that DVI port isn't a dual-link DVI port. But please confirm! This would make me VERY happy (assuming it works with the T61P once it arrives...) -- Ken

It's a miracle! Thank you Jebus.

Lenovo only officially support single link DVI resolutions at the moment, however, the port on the dock is dual link capable so if the machine can support it then it will work and the T60p with 5200 chipset displays that resolution fine on a 30" Dell Monitor (something which even the latest Dell laptops cant), however, as this resolution is not officially supported there is no commitment from Lenovo to ensure it works, so it does not work on later T60p models with the 5250 chipset, i cannot tell whether this is due to internal interconnections or the video BIOS but it wont be resolved. I too am still waiting on a T61p to arrive to test this on it.

famman · #16 Post by **famman** » Thu Jul 26, 2007 6:09 pm

snife wrote:the port on the dock is dual link capable

Does that go for the Advanced Mini Dock too?

snife · #17 Post by **snife** » Thu Jul 26, 2007 7:30 pm

famman wrote:
snife wrote:the port on the dock is dual link capable
Does that go for the Advanced Mini Dock too?

Yes it does

kengetz · #18 Post by **kengetz** » Thu Jul 26, 2007 7:37 pm

So this may be pushing it, but:

Can you hook up a second monitor to the thinkpad's VGA port and get that to work AT THE SAME TIME as the 30" monitor? I'm trying to emulate my current desktop, which has two monitors side by side, and would like not to use the Thinkpad's monitor at the same time (or if I get crazy, have it as a third monitor). Am I dreaming again?

Just trying to plan -- if I can't get this to work, I'll need to go back to the "find a graphics card that fits into the docking station" mode. Thanks -- Ken

lovebeta · #19 Post by **lovebeta** » Thu Jul 26, 2007 8:23 pm

snife wrote: It's a miracle! Thank you Jebus.

Lenovo only officially support single link DVI resolutions at the moment, however, the port on the dock is dual link capable so if the machine can support it then it will work and the T60p with 5200 chipset displays that resolution fine on a 30" Dell Monitor (something which even the latest Dell laptops cant), however, as this resolution is not officially supported there is no commitment from Lenovo to ensure it works, so it does not work on later T60p models with the 5250 chipset, i cannot tell whether this is due to internal interconnections or the video BIOS but it wont be resolved. I too am still waiting on a T61p to arrive to test this on it.

snife, did you try the v5250 with the July 12 driver? Or some other third party driver, like the omega? Thanks!

snife · #20 Post by **snife** » Thu Jul 26, 2007 8:53 pm

kengetz wrote:So this may be pushing it, but:

Can you hook up a second monitor to the thinkpad's VGA port and get that to work AT THE SAME TIME as the 30" monitor? I'm trying to emulate my current desktop, which has two monitors side by side, and would like not to use the Thinkpad's monitor at the same time (or if I get crazy, have it as a third monitor). Am I dreaming again?

Just trying to plan -- if I can't get this to work, I'll need to go back to the "find a graphics card that fits into the docking station" mode. Thanks -- Ken

The ThinkPad VGA port wont work but, in theory the one on the dock should, i'll give it a try on monday.

Lovebeta, I did try the Omega drivers i think to no avail, i've not tried the latest driver but I know all the changes of it so it wont make a difference, i dont think its a driver thing.

NathanA · #21 Post by **NathanA** » Thu Jul 26, 2007 8:58 pm

snife wrote:I did try the Omega drivers i think to no avail, i've not tried the latest driver but I know all the changes of it so it wont make a difference, i dont think its a driver thing.

Well, the only way to be sure it is not a driver thing is to try and use the exact same drivers on both chipsets and compare the results. If you use the very same Catalyst driver set on two computers, one with V5200 and one with V5250, and they behave differently (V5200 can do WQXGA on DVI, V5250 cannot), then we know it is not the drivers. But until somebody tries this, I don't see how we can conclusively rule it out.

(An even better test, really, would be to use the exact same drive image, and swap the drive between computers, although there are probably sufficient differences between early T60p boards and later T60p boards which would cause Windows device detection to go ballistic, heh.)

-- Nathan

lovebeta · #22 Post by **lovebeta** » Thu Jul 26, 2007 9:49 pm

snife wrote:
kengetz wrote:So this may be pushing it, but:

Can you hook up a second monitor to the thinkpad's VGA port and get that to work AT THE SAME TIME as the 30" monitor? I'm trying to emulate my current desktop, which has two monitors side by side, and would like not to use the Thinkpad's monitor at the same time (or if I get crazy, have it as a third monitor). Am I dreaming again?

Just trying to plan -- if I can't get this to work, I'll need to go back to the "find a graphics card that fits into the docking station" mode. Thanks -- Ken
The ThinkPad VGA port wont work but, in theory the one on the dock should, i'll give it a try on monday.

Lovebeta, I did try the Omega drivers i think to no avail, i've not tried the latest driver but I know all the changes of it so it wont make a difference, i dont think its a driver thing.

Hmm... good to know. Maybe it is a system board issue. One thing we know from the tabook is that v5200 is always coupled with Core Duo, while v5250 is always with Core 2 Duo. So maybe there're still some difference in the construct. I did notice that nothing related was mentioned in the driver update. However the new driver has a huge leap in the build number (293->362), I would certainly expect more than what they stated in the readme file.

Another thing one may try is to use some third party twisting tool to manually set the resolution. How about PowerStrip?

snife · #23 Post by **snife** » Fri Jul 27, 2007 12:44 pm

NathanA wrote: Well, the only way to be sure it is not a driver thing is to try and use the exact same drivers on both chipsets and compare the results. If you use the very same Catalyst driver set on two computers, one with V5200 and one with V5250, and they behave differently (V5200 can do WQXGA on DVI, V5250 cannot), then we know it is not the drivers. But until somebody tries this, I don't see how we can conclusively rule it out.

(An even better test, really, would be to use the exact same drive image, and swap the drive between computers, although there are probably sufficient differences between early T60p boards and later T60p boards which would cause Windows device detection to go ballistic, heh.)

-- Nathan

I have done exactly this, that is how I originally came to the conclusion it was hardware or video BIOS, the only thing hardware wise I believe it could be is if the interconnect from the chip to the dock is only single link capable internally on the 5250 systems.

snife · #24 Post by **snife** » Sat Jul 28, 2007 9:43 am

Interestingly, I just tested a normal T61 with Nvidia 140M graphics and it can display 2560x1600 on my monitor, it looks a bit grainy (not sure if the others I tested did or not) but it definitely works so its looking good for the 570M I would think.

#25 Post by **RonS** » Sat Jul 28, 2007 10:23 pm

snife wrote:Interestingly, I just tested a normal T61 with Nvidia 140M graphics and it can display 2560x1600 on my monitor, it looks a bit grainy (not sure if the others I tested did or not) but it definitely works so its looking good for the 570M I would think.

It is possible that you were seeing the 2560x1600 displayed as "virtual resolution?" That is, the display has a limited resolution that scrolls into view the larger, 2560x1600 frame as your mouse hits the sides of the screen?

snife · #26 Post by **snife** » Sun Jul 29, 2007 5:18 am

RonS wrote:
snife wrote:Interestingly, I just tested a normal T61 with Nvidia 140M graphics and it can display 2560x1600 on my monitor, it looks a bit grainy (not sure if the others I tested did or not) but it definitely works so its looking good for the 570M I would think.
It is possible that you were seeing the 2560x1600 displayed as "virtual resolution?" That is, the display has a limited resolution that scrolls into view the larger, 2560x1600 frame as your mouse hits the sides of the screen?

No it is not possible - believe it or not, i'm not an idiot. Anyway virtual resolutions like that are normally a case of the graphics chipset supporting it but the monitor not.

#27 Post by **erik** » Fri Aug 31, 2007 9:47 am

hey snife - any updates on this? now that my T61p is finally here i need to get an advanced dock or advanced mini dock to drive my dell 30". have you received your T61p and been able to test this setup?

dbertoni5000 · #28 Post by **dbertoni5000** » Fri Aug 31, 2007 10:09 am

I have a T60p and an advanced mini-dock, along with a 30" HP monitor. My T60p happily runs the monitor at 2560x1600 through the DVI port.

The only caveat is you'll need to upgrade to the latest ATI drivers, because the earlier ones I originally had didn't work.

I was really surprised to find this works, but it does.

#29 Post by **erik** » Fri Aug 31, 2007 10:18 am

if the drivers are the only hangup then this should work. i'd be surprised if nvidea didn't support WQXGA through the quadro FX 570M.

crashnburn · #30 Post by **crashnburn** » Fri May 02, 2008 2:27 am

I found it

Thinkpads, Dual-Link DVI and WQXGA

Thinkpads, Dual-Link DVI and WQXGA

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