X61 4 GB Ram and Vista

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rog1039 · #1 Post by **rog1039** » Sun Jun 03, 2007 7:51 pm

So I just ordered my X61T after speaking with a rep who told me they ship Vista 64 bit with the machine. However, according to the status of my order, the vista to be installed is 32 bit.

I am wondering if it is possible to have 4GB RAM on the Santa Rosa chipset with 32 bit Vista. Will only 3.x GB show up since I'm running 32-bit, or will I have access to all 4 gb?

In case it matters, I only ordered 1 gb of RAM to come with my machine, since I save about $500 by ordering 4GB from Newegg rather than through Lenovo. Perhaps if I ordered 4GB through Lenovo they would have then installed 64-bit Vista?

Anyone know what the deal is with this?

Thanks, Paul

pianowizard · #2 Post by **pianowizard** » Sun Jun 03, 2007 7:53 pm

rog1039 wrote:Will only 3.x GB show up since I'm running 32-bit

Correct, you need the 64-bit version.

#3 Post by **tomh009** » Sun Jun 03, 2007 8:12 pm

To elucidate further on PW's comment, 32-bit Vista will only be able to access 3 GB. To use the full 4 GB, you need a 64-bit OS, whether Vista, XP, Linux, FreeBSD or Windows Server 2003.

rog1039 · #4 Post by **rog1039** » Sun Jun 03, 2007 8:21 pm

Thanks guys.

I guess I will call Lenovo tomorrow and ask them to install 64-bit Vista instead. Hopefully they will acquiesce to my request.

In case others are wondering if Lenovo will change the OS version, I will post an update tomorrow after speaking with a rep.

Paul

#5 Post by **ryengineer** » Sun Jun 03, 2007 8:34 pm

rog1039 wrote:I guess I will call Lenovo tomorrow and ask them to install 64-bit Vista instead. Hopefully they will acquiesce to my request.

Sorry to disappoint you but lenovo won't accommodate your request. If they do somehow, I'll be very astonished.

rog1039 · #6 Post by **rog1039** » Sun Jun 03, 2007 9:49 pm

So my options are to either order 4 GB RAM from Lenovo so that I get 64-bit Vista installed (which, I'm not even sure they do. I would assume they would install 64-bit Vista, otherwise, you would think they would have some [censored] customers when they only have 3.2 GB of RAM available after buying 4GB), or buy 64-bit Vista from a third party and install myself?

If that is the case, I am disappointed in Lenovo. It seems like a rather simple request.

#7 Post by **tomh009** » Sun Jun 03, 2007 10:01 pm

At this point in time, I fear you have to buy your Vista (upgrade?) at retail ...

rog1039 · #8 Post by **rog1039** » Sun Jun 03, 2007 10:04 pm

Alright, well thanks for the responses everyone. I will let you guys know how my (pointless?) phone call goes tomorrow.

SFWrtr · #9 Post by **SFWrtr** » Mon Jun 04, 2007 12:32 am

I am buying 4GB for my machine, also, meaning I wanted the 64-bit OS and was denied, too. BTW, I ordered 512MB and saved US$55 (not too late to make the change...). I can get the 4GB (2x2GB) from Crucial for $369.99.

Theoretically, you can go to the Microsoft site(*) and request a free 64-bit disk for the same level of Vista once you know your 25 digit product key (you know, the dreaded xxxxx-xxxxx-xxxxx-xxxxx-xxxxx) for your Vista 32-bit edition. The product key, I presume, will be stuck to the bottom on your unit or to part of the supporting documentation. You will need it on initial startup of your system.

That you can do this for free is one thing. Whether you can download all the appropriate Lenovo 64-bit programs and drivers before you do the conversion is another thing altogether. I suspect that Lenovo has run into issues with getting the 64-bit Vista to work properly and this is why they don't offer the option, yet. I'd say keep your system lean and mean, then, in the next weeks or months, upgrade when the path is absolutely clear.

Possible problem: The site talks about "retail" editions. Do we get our Vista DVD disk? Hopefully we do, esp. with the ultimate as it isn't available as a 64-bit DVD (you're supposed to have gotten your DVD in the box). Following the link to do the order just asks for the 25 digit code, so it may be all right. Anybody out there upgrade to 64-bit this way?

(*) http://www.microsoft.com/windows/produc ... 64bit.mspx

#10 Post by **tomh009** » Mon Jun 04, 2007 4:37 am

SFWrtr wrote:Possible problem: The site talks about "retail" editions. Do we get our Vista DVD disk? Hopefully we do, esp. with the ultimate as it isn't available as a 64-bit DVD (you're supposed to have gotten your DVD in the box). Following the link to do the order just asks for the 25 digit code, so it may be all right. Anybody out there upgrade to 64-bit this way?

(*) http://www.microsoft.com/windows/produc ... 64bit.mspx

Based on the language on the Microsoft page, I think that's indeed only for retail versions, not for OEM licences. But it would be worth a try if someone has a Vista COA they can request a 64-bit DVD for.

DavidE · #11 Post by **DavidE** » Mon Jun 04, 2007 10:02 am

SFWrtr wrote:Possible problem: The site talks about "retail" editions. Do we get our Vista DVD disk? Hopefully we do, esp. with the ultimate as it isn't available as a 64-bit DVD (you're supposed to have gotten your DVD in the box). Following the link to do the order just asks for the 25 digit code, so it may be all right. Anybody out there upgrade to 64-bit this way?

Not sure about the other retail editions, but the Ultimate retail edition I have includes one product key and two discs: a 32-bit disc and a 64-bit disc. You can use the product key with either disc.

DavidE
www.davidenglish.com
www.beepzoid.com

proaudioguy · #12 Post by **proaudioguy** » Mon Jun 04, 2007 11:11 am

SFWrtr wrote: Theoretically, you can go to the Microsoft site(*) and request a free 64-bit disk for the same level of Vista once you know your 25 digit product key (you know, the dreaded xxxxx-xxxxx-xxxxx-xxxxx-xxxxx) for your Vista 32-bit edition. The product key, I presume, will be stuck to the bottom on your unit or to part of the supporting documentation. You will need it on initial startup of your system.

This business about needing to enter a Key the first time you start your system has never been true for me on any of my thinkpads. The COA is there for compliance. You shouldn't have to even activate.
The OEM COA gets you no support from Microsoft. If you call them they direct you back to the OEM.

SFWrtr · #13 Post by **SFWrtr** » Mon Jun 04, 2007 11:54 am

proaudioguy wrote:
This business about needing to enter a Key the first time you start your system has never been true for me on any of my thinkpads. The COA is there for compliance.

Thank you, this is good to know. I seem to remember entering it on a Toshiba for a friend, but the again I've installed Vista on a number of machines recent and I possible got that part wrong. Still, it would be worth a try to enter the DOA into the MS site and see if you get the disk...

proaudioguy · #14 Post by **proaudioguy** » Mon Jun 04, 2007 10:00 pm

SFWrtr wrote:
proaudioguy wrote:
This business about needing to enter a Key the first time you start your system has never been true for me on any of my thinkpads. The COA is there for compliance.
Thank you, this is good to know. I seem to remember entering it on a Toshiba for a friend, but the again I've installed Vista on a number of machines recent and I possible got that part wrong. Still, it would be worth a try to enter the DOA into the MS site and see if you get the disk...

Yea, you may have had to enter it on a Toshiba. I'm just saying you don't have to do it on a Thinkpad unless you did a clean install. A RESTORE using IBM media doesn't require any of that, assuming you follow all the instructions and let it do it's thing.

You do have to enter your personal info for log in, registration etc. at first boot.

rog1039 · #15 Post by **rog1039** » Mon Jun 04, 2007 10:35 pm

Update: As expected, the lenovo rep couldn't accommodate my request. He did tell me however, that there are some workarounds that will allow 4 GB of RAM in 32-bit Vista, but he said he did not have a technical background and told me my best bet is to google for "drivers to enable 4 GB in vista 32 bit".

However, I'm pretty sure from what you guys have said, and from what I've read on MS' website about Vista 32-bit, that it is definitely, 100% not possible, to run 4 GB in 32-bit.

Anyway, so that's unfortunate. I guess I will follow SFWrtr's post and attempt to obtain a 64-bit copy of the Vista that comes pre-installed with my X61t. Hopefully, our "oem" versions won't cause any problem with that deal on MS' web site.

SFWrtr: In case you're interested, you can also buy 4 GB of RAM from newegg for about $260. It's Patriot though, not Corsair if that matters.

poky · #16 Post by **poky** » Tue Jun 05, 2007 1:34 am

rog1039 wrote: SFWrtr: In case you're interested, you can also buy 4 GB of RAM from newegg for about $260. It's Patriot though, not Corsair if that matters.

Frys.com is now selling it for $99 shipped.
http://shop3.outpost.com/product/5200767
I just grabbed 2, upgrade to 4GB ram for under $200, what a great buy!
Can't wait for my X61s to come!

mattleff · #17 Post by **mattleff** » Tue Jun 05, 2007 11:30 am

rog1039 wrote:Update: As expected, the lenovo rep couldn't accommodate my request. He did tell me however, that there are some workarounds that will allow 4 GB of RAM in 32-bit Vista, but he said he did not have a technical background and told me my best bet is to google for "drivers to enable 4 GB in vista 32 bit".

However, I'm pretty sure from what you guys have said, and from what I've read on MS' website about Vista 32-bit, that it is definitely, 100% not possible, to run 4 GB in 32-bit.

Maybe this is what he was talking about...

#18 Post by **tomh009** » Tue Jun 05, 2007 11:45 am

Using Physical Address Extension (PAE) requires that the application software utilize Address Windowing Extensions (AWE) for memory access -- goodbye linear memory address space. In reality, only a handful of applications do this.

Intel never really pushed this as they were trying to move people to the Itanic architecture. Fortunately AMD created the AMD64 architecture extension, and Intel eventually followed suit, so now we get to do real 64-bit computing.

mattleff · #19 Post by **mattleff** » Tue Jun 05, 2007 11:52 am

tomh009 wrote:Using Physical Address Extension (PAE) requires that the application software utilize Address Windowing Extensions (AWE) for memory access -- goodbye linear memory address space. In reality, only a handful of applications do this.

Intel never really pushed this as they were trying to move people to the Itanic architecture. Fortunately AMD created the AMD64 architecture extension, and Intel eventually followed suit, so now we get to do real 64-bit computing.

So would there be any performance benefit for those certain apps, or really no benefit?

#20 Post by **tomh009** » Tue Jun 05, 2007 11:56 am

If they need to manipulate datasets > 4 GB, then, yes, it would be faster than paging data on and off disk. These would be primarily heavy-duty modeling, statistical and scientific applications.

But then those types of applications would run far faster yet with 64-bit.

X61 4 GB Ram and Vista

X61 4 GB Ram and Vista

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